[QUOTE=U.S.S.R;40589438]One count of attempted murder for each shot he fired.
Basically it's just a tool for the prosecution to use so even if they drop some of the charges he still gets a very harsh punishment.
[editline]10th May 2013[/editline]
Like a bargaining chip almost.[/QUOTE]
We call it "throwing the book at them"
or in other terms
"Lets throw all the shit at the wall and see what sticks"
[QUOTE=FreakyMe;40588220]You have every right to feel that way and are perfectly okay in expressing those feelings, but I don't think we should prosecute based on the terms of those victimized. If he really is mentally ill and gets into a care facility, you can rest assured that he will in all likelihood die there, after the drugs they throw at him rot him from the inside out.
No matter where he goes, chances are he is not getting out. He won't see freedom, and he won't ever have the chance to do what he did again. He'd be going into the absolutely abysmal American Psychological and Psychiatric system, which I assume you can take some schadenfreudian comfort from. Whether or not he dies, he is going to spend a long time poorly looked after and alone, in which he might figure out and eventually regret his actions.
I would say the odds of him coming to terms and emotionally suffering for his actions (which would tear any near sane person apart, generally) are better in the medical system, where in prison he would simply become harder and more distant from his remorse and actions.
If we simply kill him, he will never get to feel the moral wrongness of his actions, which I think is a far greater punishment to give someone. If we can get him there, he will still be too ill to leave the hospital and will spend the rest of his days wallowing in depression and terror for what he's done. He'll never be 'cured' or released in all likelihood, and he will be studied and understood for when we come across similar circumstances down the line.[/QUOTE]
Why should we have to pay for the drugs, housing, and staff for him to simply "come to terms" with what he has done. I really believe he doesn't even deserve to think about what he has done. I don't understand how somebody who kills 12 people (in attempt to kill hundreds) can play the insane card far into the trial just to get a more relaxed environment. It really does sicken me. I'm fairly liberal myself, but if there's one thing I agree with is the death penalty. Somebody like this doesn't deserve the air we breath. This man should be slain.
[QUOTE=areolop;40585736]charged with more than 160 counts of murder and attempted murder in the July 20 attack in Aurora that killed 12 people and left 70 wounded or injured.[/QUOTE]
How does this work out? Shouldn't it be 12 counts of murder and another 70 for attempted murder or is there something else that's not so obvious?
[QUOTE=Alice3173;40590909]How does this work out? Shouldn't it be 12 counts of murder and another 70 for attempted murder or is there something else that's not so obvious?[/QUOTE]
Like Areolop and I both said. Shitty U.S court system where prosecutors can almost make up charges to use as a bargaining chip.
He fired 160 shots apparently, so that's how many times he's being charged with attempted murder.
[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;40590829]Why should we have to pay for the drugs, housing, and staff for him to simply "come to terms" with what he has done. I really believe he doesn't even deserve to think about what he has done. I don't understand how somebody who kills 12 people (in attempt to kill hundreds) can play the insane card far into the trial just to get a more relaxed environment. It really does sicken me. I'm fairly liberal myself, but if there's one thing I agree with is the death penalty. Somebody like this doesn't deserve the air we breath. This man should be slain.[/QUOTE]
You simply don't understand.
[QUOTE=SgtCr4zyGunz;40589404]Ignorant people need to realize the insanity plea isn't getting you out of anything.[/QUOTE]
What? Please explain why people do it then.
[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;40590829]Why should we have to pay for the drugs, housing, and staff for him to simply "come to terms" with what he has done. I really believe he doesn't even deserve to think about what he has done. I don't understand how somebody who kills 12 people (in attempt to kill hundreds) can play the insane card far into the trial just to get a more relaxed environment. It really does sicken me. I'm fairly liberal myself, but if there's one thing I agree with is the death penalty. Somebody like this doesn't deserve the air we breath. This man should be slain.[/QUOTE]
How come people don't realize how fucking crazy they sound when they say "Somebody like this doesn't deserve the air we [sic] breath."?
[editline]9th May 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;40591402]What? Please explain why people do it then.[/QUOTE]
Here it is in short: You can't murder somebody for murdering someone else. Nobody deserves death, nobody at all. Somebody like Mr. Holmes may have murdered 12 people, but that doesn't mean we can just shoot the guy in the face. Put him away, revoke his "normal life" privileges, and make him spend the rest of his life in a detention center.
No, we can't throw him into a fucking iron maiden, into a pit with snakes, or into Guantanamo, it just ain't right. What's the point of being human if we're not going to be humane?
[QUOTE=milkandcooki;40591431]How come people don't realize how fucking crazy they sound when they say "Somebody like this doesn't deserve the air we [sic] breath."?
[editline]9th May 2013[/editline]
Here it is in short: You can't murder somebody for murdering someone else. Nobody deserves death, nobody at all. Somebody like Mr. Holmes may have murdered 12 people, but that doesn't mean we can just shoot the guy in the face. Put him away, revoke his "normal life" privileges, and make him spend the rest of his life in a detention center.
No, we can't throw him into a fucking iron maiden, into a pit with snakes, or into Guantanamo, it just ain't right. What's the point of being human if we're not going to be humane?[/QUOTE]
That didn't answer my question. Why do people plea insanity if apparently they get nothing out of it?
[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;40590829]This man should be slain.[/QUOTE]
hey pal i gotta ask what exactly this plan brings to the table. like yeah i get all that eye for an eye shit but what exactly does that give us? i want to give the victims closure as much as the next guy, but i don't see why closure should come before justice in a system ostensibly meant to [I]be just[/I]. and i seriously doubt, with all the other taxes everyone pays and the comparatively small amount of money spent on keeping one dude alive, fed and clothed, is his living cost going to have even the slightest effect on the amount of taxes anyone pays. i mean it's not like you'd be sharing rent with him is it
[editline]10th May 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;40591462]That didn't answer my question. Why do people plea insanity if apparently they get nothing out of it?[/QUOTE]
because they're insane and they want to be seen properly in the eyes of the law? it really isn't a difficult concept
[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;40591462]That didn't answer my question. Why do people plea insanity if apparently they get nothing out of it?[/QUOTE]
so they aren't executed probably.
[editline]10th May 2013[/editline]
is holmes facing potential execution?
[QUOTE=Cone;40591520]hey pal i gotta ask what exactly this plan brings to the table. like yeah i get all that eye for an eye shit but what exactly does that give us? i want to give the victims closure as much as the next guy, but i don't see why closure should come before justice in a system ostensibly meant to [I]be just[/I]. and i seriously doubt, with all the other taxes everyone pays and the comparatively small amount of money spent on keeping one dude alive, fed and clothed, is his living cost going to have even the slightest effect on the amount of taxes anyone pays. i mean it's not like you'd be sharing rent with him is it
[editline]10th May 2013[/editline]
because they're insane and they want to be seen properly in the eyes of the law? it really isn't a difficult concept[/QUOTE]
It could be money put somewhere else, such as education or healthcare. When you look at how much each taxpayer is paying it is insignificant. But put it all together and you can pay for a teacher at a school for every year he is alive. His useless existence can actually be thought to be potentially taking the success and lives of others the longer he is alive.
[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;40591617]It could be money put somewhere else, such as education or healthcare. When you look at how much each taxpayer is paying it is insignificant. But put it all together and you can pay for a teacher at a school for every year he is alive. His useless existence can actually be thought to be potentially taking the success and lives of others the longer he is alive.[/QUOTE]
yeah but fyi you don't have to prove that you're worth keeping alive just to save a few bucks. and if we're talking about who is and isn't valuable to society i think you'd probably have to kill off about two thirds of FP, since they're not directly contributing and thus as you say are ruining other people's livelihoods.
[editline]10th May 2013[/editline]
every post you've ever made killed a baby and threw a potential Nobel Prize winner into the gutter!! i hope youre pleased with yourself
actually according to the report of the jail he's at, he's only being held on two counts of "murder in the first degree"
[QUOTE=Cone;40591667]yeah but fyi you don't have to prove that you're worth keeping alive just to save a few bucks. and if we're talking about who is and isn't valuable to society i think you'd probably have to kill off about two thirds of FP, since they're not directly contributing and thus as you say are ruining other people's livelihoods.
[editline]10th May 2013[/editline]
every post you've ever made killed a baby and threw a potential Nobel Prize winner into the gutter!! i hope youre pleased with yourself[/QUOTE]
Why are you comparing a person who massacres 12 people to users who lurk on Facepunch?
[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;40591752]Why are you comparing a person who massacres 12 people to users who lurk on Facepunch?[/QUOTE]
because you said that anyone who's useless is ruining other people's livelihoods - put it all together and you can pay for a teacher at a school for every year they're being useless.
[QUOTE=Cone;40591800]because you said that anyone who's useless is ruining other people's livelihoods - put it all together and you can pay for a teacher at a school for every year they're being useless.[/QUOTE]
Are taxpayers paying for these lurkers? I'm pretty sure they aren't paying for their medication and housing. You're not making sense.
[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;40591617]It could be money put somewhere else, such as education or healthcare. When you look at how much each taxpayer is paying it is insignificant. But put it all together and you can pay for a teacher at a school for every year he is alive. His useless existence can actually be thought to be potentially taking the success and lives of others the longer he is alive.[/QUOTE]
the alternative is release him from prison.
[editline]10th May 2013[/editline]
would you rather have him in prison using taxpayer money or not in prison not using taxpayer money?
[QUOTE=yawmwen;40591903]the alternative is release him from prison.
[editline]10th May 2013[/editline]
would you rather have him in prison using taxpayer money or not in prison not using taxpayer money?[/QUOTE]
[url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Armed_Forces]I can think of a greater burden on Taxpayer money.[/url]
I think he's just pure evil and should rot in prison
[QUOTE=yawmwen;40591530]so they aren't executed probably.
[editline]10th May 2013[/editline]
is holmes facing potential execution?[/QUOTE]
Yea, the prosecution is seeking the death penalty.
Although I feel that anyone who kills someone is insane, he went above and beyond to fuck things up. All the explosives he planted in his room, and turning on the radio really loud so someone would walk in... ect.
no matter what he is at LEAST getting life in prison, so whatever
[QUOTE=Coffee;40586115]You have to be insane to shoot up a cinema full of people and think it's a good idea.[/QUOTE]
Keep in mind that criminal insanity is something different. To be criminally insane you must have issues with actually being able to see the impact of your actions on others, or the fact they are are criminal acts.
Essentially to be considered criminally insane, you are being aproached as small child in a sense that you knew no better. Or that you could not control your actions at all.
It's fairly tough to prove, with premediation. Though it's possible, just fairly tough to prove in front of a court. Essentially a good thing to argue is a sort of compulsory insanity.
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