Transgender teen leaves note on tumblr blaming Christian parents for suicide - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Dark RaveN;46850551]Its actually frightening that people like you actually garner support in the eyes of others. Just wow. You remind me a lot of those moronic SJWs anti-gamergaters who just spew bullshit and project their personalities on others in order to close them up, bravo hexpunK, what else are you capable of? EDIT: You know what, I just noticed that I am losing my temper from such ignorance, so I will refrain from replying further, but all in all if you cannot explain something to a person who flat out states that he would like some clarification on the topic and attack him instead you should really fuck off.[/QUOTE] Sweet, another "last post". How many more posts are we going to get here folks? 2? 5? As for "we never interact", I've seen you post regularly enough to have built a relatively strong profile on you, I don't need to reply to you when there are other people beating me to it. Also "SJW" is the shittiest insult known to mankind, holy fuck. It's become literally meaningless (it never had much in the first place) because everybody keeps throwing it around the second anyone with a remotely progressive view turns up.

^ this is why I didn't bother continuing that argument in this thread. because this is what happens no matter what get's posted. I make a couple very brief posts highlighting the fact that a user is being flamed when they're being respectful and at least attempting to be constructive and open minded, and the response I get is [B]5[/B] people responding to me with "AGH UR NOT CONTRIBUTING TO THE THREAD BRAINDEAD MORON MANCHILD".

[QUOTE=st_nick5;46850581]Not in this case it hasn't.[/QUOTE] Well, it did a little bit in the first few pages. But that blew over quickly somehow. Religious belief does have some role to play in this, so it showing up isn't all that surprising.

[QUOTE=Bruhmis;46850590]^ this is why I didn't bother continuing that argument in this thread. because this is what happens no matter what get's posted. I make a couple very brief posts highlighting the fact that a user is being flamed when they're being respectful and at least attempting to be constructive and open minded, and the response I get is [B]5[/B] people responding to me with "AGH UR NOT CONTRIBUTING TO THE THREAD BRAINDEAD MORON MANCHILD".[/QUOTE] You've been given every chance to argue the post that deals with the medical reasons you're wrong. What are you doing instead of debating that? Telling us WHY you can't debate it, and telling us we're bad people for even insisting that what you're doing is a bit ludicrious and childish when you are being GIVEN THE OPTION TO ARGUE MEDICAL FACT AND ARE DECLINING IT. You do not have any moral high ground here when you yourself are the only reason you aren't arguing with a post that has the most relevancy to your line of argumentation. Don't even pretend it's anything else.

hey bruhmis, maybe you shouldn't pick the moment you have your argument logically and thoroughly torn to pieces to start complaining about ideological discrimination against your views if you want to convince people that your views are correct, maybe a better vector of attack would be to respond to the criticisms levied against them

[QUOTE=Ownederd;46850406]you need to provide for your own argument and provide sources. academic sources on trans people has been around for for a long time. invading trans people's spaces with stuff like "IT'S A RETARDED DISCUSSION" does nothing[/QUOTE] *sigh* I never said that it's a retarded discussion. Just how the fuck do you manage to get most of information from my posts which I never ever implied? EDIT: Must breach my own promise, but FYI [quote]Sweet, another "last post". How many more posts are we going to get here folks? 2? 5?[/quote] my "last reply" was directed to your posts, not to the thread, but it seems you fail to see even that. It's about you this time, snowflake.

[QUOTE=Dark RaveN;46850551] EDIT: You know what, I just noticed that I am losing my temper from such[B] ignorance,[/B] so I will refrain from replying further, but all in all if you cannot explain something to a person who flat out states that he would like some clarification on the topic and attack him instead you should really fuck off.[/QUOTE] Ok, it's pretty rich you're complaining about ignorance, considering you've said: [QUOTE=Dark RaveN;46849252]If you identify as a dolphin and you're not, then there are issues, son.[/QUOTE] and: [QUOTE=Dark RaveN;46849299]How can you claim that this isnt a mental condition, like depression or schizophrenia? And if you think it is, why dont we heal it with medication then. Serious question.[/QUOTE] Both of which are mainstay arguments by transphobic people who show no will to learn about transgender people and just want some "sick-hype zingers" by comparing them to otherkin or believing them to be mentally ill. Feel free to complain about ignorance when you've alleviated your own ignorance about the topic.

[QUOTE=Dark RaveN;46850551] You remind me a lot of those moronic SJWs anti-gamergaters.[/QUOTE] I wish i had a way to make my PC play a comedic sad trumpet sound every time a poster pulled the SJW card.

[QUOTE=Mr. Scorpio;46850606]hey bruhmis, maybe you shouldn't pick the moment you have your argument logically and thoroughly torn to pieces to start complaining about ideological discrimination against your views if you want to convince people that your views are correct, maybe a better vector of attack would be to respond to the criticisms levied against them[/QUOTE] and that's why I invited people to PM if they were actually interested in hearing what I have to say, because in a PM I don't have a bandwagon flaming me for the purpose of circle-jerking ratings out of eachother. if I say something and I get that much vitriol back right away, it's just not constructive to try to make a case for what I originally said. that doesn't mean that I shouldn't be allowed to point out that someone is being a child with their argument and using personal attacks in place of logic.

[QUOTE=Bruhmis;46850590]^ this is why I didn't bother continuing that argument in this thread. because this is what happens no matter what get's posted. I make a couple very brief posts highlighting the fact that a user is being flamed when they're being respectful and at least attempting to be constructive and open minded, and the response I get is [B]5[/B] people responding to me with "AGH UR NOT CONTRIBUTING TO THE THREAD BRAINDEAD MORON MANCHILD".[/QUOTE] who cares if you're posting reasonable stuff and other people aren't then just fucking ignore them and respond to the people who are you can't complain about "SJWs enforcing political correctness!!!" and then complain about "mean words hurt my feelings, stop :("

[QUOTE=Mr. Scorpio;46850641] you can't complain about "SJWs enforcing political correctness!!!" and then complain about "mean words hurt my feelings, stop :("[/QUOTE] I think you're confusing someone else's posts with mine. it was dark raven that was talking about SJWs if that's what you're referring to.

[QUOTE=Bruhmis;46850639]and that's why I invited people to PM if they were actually interested in hearing what I have to say, because in a PM I don't have a bandwagon flaming me for the purpose of circle-jerking ratings out of eachother. if I say something and I get that much vitriol back right away, it's just not constructive to try to make a case for what I originally said. that doesn't mean that I shouldn't be allowed to point out that someone is being a child with their argument and using personal attacks in place of logic.[/QUOTE] if someone was willing to make a rational and cogent response to your first argument, then I don't think it's too far a leap to assume someone would be willing to make a rational and cogent response to your second if you refuse to make a second argument despite that, I can only assume you don't have a second one to make.

[QUOTE=Bruhmis;46850639]and that's why I invited people to PM if they were actually interested in hearing what I have to say, because in a PM I don't have a bandwagon flaming me for the purpose of circle-jerking ratings out of eachother. if I say something and I get that much vitriol back right away, it's just not constructive to try to make a case for what I originally said. that doesn't mean that I shouldn't be allowed to point out that someone is being a child with their argument and using personal attacks in place of logic.[/QUOTE] If you'd check, you can see most of us actually don't give a rat fuck about ratings. Myself and Hexpunk at least, are not doing this for ratings, and I'm 99% sure Last and First isn't doing it for ratings, but here you are, again, not arguing with that awesome post and telling us how you can't even attempt it. You have this thread as your witness that people don't want you banned for arguing medical fact, but for being stubborn as shit about not being able to argue medical fact. I'll personally PM whatever mod bans you if you're banned for giving a strong medical argument and do my best to explain that you don't deserve a ban for arguing medical facts calmly and rationally. You have every chance to do this and everyone but you see's this.

[quote]Both of which are mainstay arguments by transphobic people who show no will to learn about transgender people and just want some "sick-hype zingers" by comparing them to otherkin or believing them to be mentally ill.[/quote] Since we begin on calling me transphobic, I'm not, because I do not even fucking care about what people do to their bodies. Most I can say is whether I like the appeal/appearance or not, beyond that trying to convince a person he did a wrong tattoo or dick or hair color for himself is retarded. I see a lot of people took really big offence from my comparison, which is still making me giggle, but IMO from you "pro-trans-actually-trans" guys' side you're just trying to overkill anyone who looks wrong at you, which is stupid. The only thing I'm partially ignorant of on this topic is whether it is actually a treatable medical condition or not, because as I see most of you people claim that jumping the ship for another gender if you identify so is the correct resolution, but why not use medication to put everything back on its places like Mother Nature wanted it to be?

[QUOTE=Dark RaveN;46850608]*sigh* I never said that it's a retarded discussion. Just how the fuck do you manage to get most of information from my posts which I never ever implied? EDIT: Must breach my own promise, but FYI my "last reply" was directed to your posts, not to the thread, but it seems you fail to see even that. It's about you this time, snowflake.[/QUOTE] no but you did enter the thread(one of many trans threads you've been in, so you know the deal around pronouns) and you disregarded the correct ones to insist your own view. That may not be an explicit way to state your opinion but it shows what level of respect you show to the trans community. AKA, none. If you're not even respecting their status as people, what are the odds you give two shits about the medical facts that show that this is the case? Obviously, you don't care because those medical facts have been posted and you've just fucking ignored them.

[QUOTE=Dark RaveN;46850665]The only thing I'm partially ignorant of on this topic is whether it is actually a treatable medical condition or not, because as I see most of you people claim that jumping the ship for another gender if you identify so is the correct resolution, but why not use medication to put everything back on its places like Mother Nature wanted it to be?[/QUOTE] Already been explained earlier in the thread I believe.

[QUOTE=Dark RaveN;46850665]Since we begin on calling me transphobic, I'm not, because I do not even fucking care about what people do to their bodies. Most I can say is whether I like the appeal/appearance or not, beyond that trying to convince a person he did a wrong tattoo or dick or hair color for himself is retarded. I see a lot of people took really big offence from my comparison, which is still making me giggle, but IMO from you "pro-trans-actually-trans" guys' side you're just trying to overkill anyone who looks wrong at you, which is stupid. The only thing I'm partially ignorant of on this topic is whether it is actually a treatable medical condition or not, because as I see most of you people claim that jumping the ship for another gender if you identify so is the correct resolution, but why not use medication to put everything back on its places like Mother Nature wanted it to be?[/QUOTE] Because you cannot alter already set brain chemistry. When I previously said this to you, you ignored it. If you cared about this issue, you would have some capability of compromise and understanding.

[QUOTE=Dark RaveN;46850665]Since we begin on calling me transphobic, I'm not, because I do not even fucking care about what people do to their bodies. Most I can say is whether I like the appeal/appearance or not, beyond that trying to convince a person he did a wrong tattoo or dick or hair color for himself is retarded. I see a lot of people took really big offence from my comparison, which is still making me giggle, but IMO from you "pro-trans-actually-trans" guys' side you're just trying to overkill anyone who looks wrong at you, which is stupid. The only thing I'm partially ignorant of on this topic is whether it is actually a treatable medical condition or not, because as I see most of you people claim that jumping the ship for another gender if you identify so is the correct resolution, but why not use medication to put everything back on its places like Mother Nature wanted it to be?[/QUOTE] ok then dude if you're not bigoted towards trans people then why are you making a completely stupid appeal to nature argument, or putting out completely random remarks like "hey SNOWFLAKE...." ,or making fun of what people identify as

[QUOTE=Dark RaveN;46850665]Since we begin on calling me transphobic, I'm not, because I do not even fucking care about what people do to their bodies. Most I can say is whether I like the appeal/appearance or not, beyond that trying to convince a person he did a wrong tattoo or dick or hair color for himself is retarded. I see a lot of people took really big offence from my comparison, which is still making me giggle, but IMO from you "pro-trans-actually-trans" guys' side you're just trying to overkill anyone who looks wrong at you, which is stupid. The only thing I'm partially ignorant of on this topic is whether it is actually a treatable medical condition or not, because as I see most of you people claim that jumping the ship for another gender if you identify so is the correct resolution, but why not use medication to put everything back on its places like Mother Nature wanted it to be?[/QUOTE] If you genuinely cared about getting answers to those questions you should *[i]Read the thread[/i]* as many posters have already explained how the condition works and why its not possible for a transgender person to just pop some pills and suddenly be thrilled to have the body of a boy/girl.

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;46850694]Because you cannot alter already set brain chemistry. When I previously said this to you, you ignored it. If you cared about this issue, you would have some capability of compromise and understanding.[/QUOTE] listen and believe... why do you care? transfolk are going to get their way at this rate anyway. why crusade against every irrelevant person with a dissenting opinion?

[QUOTE=SeamanStains;46850722]listen and believe... why do you care? transfolk are going to get their way at this rate anyway. why crusade against every irrelevant person with a dissenting opinion?[/QUOTE] because opinions like dark raven's continue to harm people

[QUOTE=SeamanStains;46850722]listen and believe... why do you care? transfolk are going to get their way at this rate anyway. why crusade against every irrelevant person with a dissenting opinion?[/QUOTE] idk look at the title of this thread maybe? Just because people have a right to do something now from an authority doesn't mean the people will actually like that. Even though black slavery was ended, black people were treated as subhuman for DECADES to come. Teaching bigoted people why they're wrong is still important. Even if they become a minority, because minorities do have this thing of trying to stand their ground, and harmful opinions shouldn't be allowed to survive that process. If they don't listen, then fine, they should just expect to get shit from people in response.

[QUOTE=SeamanStains;46850722]listen and believe... why do you care? transfolk are going to get their way at this rate anyway. why crusade against every irrelevant person with a dissenting opinion?[/QUOTE] As someone who fucking loathes "listen and believe" bullshit, HA isn't doing anything even close. What's crazy is that I actually somewhat agree that people with conservative viewpoints are unnecessarily demonized. I actually think that's a point worth bringing up. Just not as a last defense when your bullshit gets wrecked and you can't defend your position logically.

a copy of a response I sent to a PM I got: [url]http://waltheyer.typepad.com/blog/2013/11/20-regret-changing-genders-over-40attempt-suicide-and-even-after-surgery-a-large-number-remain-traum.html[/url] this is a relatively concise article with links to various sources for most of what I've said. as for the backlash in LGBT communities, that's a difficult thing to link source for, however: [url]http://yiannopoulos.net/2014/08/15/transgenderism-is-a-psychiatric-disorder-its-sufferers-need-therapy-not-surgery/[/url] this is a personal blog post from BreitBart journalist and LGBT activist Milo Yiannopoulos. it discusses in considerable detail the feelings that many in the community have about the effects of transition surgery and also makes references to some of the sources discussed in the first article. the point was that since transition surgery was invented, it has essentially been accepted as the cure for trans gender people, and thought to be a wholly positive procedure. Reputable people in the medical field, over the years, have grown concerned about what they see in the statistics of people who undergo these surgeries. what the data suggests is that a substantial number of these people are ending up dead. to me, this is a very important issue and the fact that it's mostly ignored is alarming to me.

[QUOTE=SeamanStains;46850722]listen and believe... why do you care? transfolk are going to get their way at this rate anyway. why crusade against every irrelevant person with a dissenting opinion?[/QUOTE] In other words you're saying "medical shmedical!" I care because transfolk, like some of my best friends in real life, have nearly been killed over their nature. And that's in a city like Vancouver, a progressive, LGBT friendly town. I fear for those that exist in worse environments if even people in this environment aren't fucking safe.

[QUOTE=Mr. Scorpio;46850761]As someone who fucking loathes "listen and believe" bullshit, HA isn't doing anything even close. What's crazy is that I actually somewhat agree that people with conservative viewpoints are unnecessarily demonized. I actually think that's a point worth bringing up. Just not as a last defense when your bullshit gets wrecked and you can't defend your position logically.[/QUOTE] I don't know about dark raven, but nothing I've said is conservative. just because I said people are afraid of sounding non-liberal that doesn't make me conservative. there's nothing conservative about thinking that transgender people aren't getting proper treatment.

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;46850694]Because you cannot alter already set brain chemistry. When I previously said this to you, you ignored it. If you cared about this issue, you would have some capability of compromise and understanding.[/QUOTE] I didn't ignore it, I even rated Agree on your post. However, if you cannot alter already set brain chemistry, what about, as someone mentioned in the topic, schizophrenia, depression? Depression is arguably, but researches showed that predisposition is a huge factor of occurrence, ergo another already set brain chemistry, is it not? Why not try using more gender-based steroids in accordance to your sex/gender(?) you were born with? [QUOTE=Ownederd;46850704]ok then dude if you're not bigoted towards trans people then why are you making a completely stupid appeal to nature argument, or putting out completely random remarks like "hey SNOWFLAKE...." ,or making fun of what people identify as[/QUOTE] You failed to recognize the context for the snowflake, so your reply is completely irrelevant. [quote]If you genuinely cared about getting answers to those questions you should *Read the thread* as many posters have already explained how the condition works and why its not possible for a transgender person to just pop some pills and suddenly be thrilled to have the body of a boy/girl.[/quote] Give me at least a hint of the pages, its not like FP's search tool is google tier. [editline]3rd January 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=Ownederd;46850729]because opinions like dark raven's continue to harm people[/QUOTE] in what way? im not even a scientist or a doctor, you're just pulling shit out of your ass just to spite my image or what? [quote]I don't know about dark raven[/quote] im as conservative as transphobic

[QUOTE=Bruhmis;46850767]a copy of a response I sent to a PM I got: [url]http://waltheyer.typepad.com/blog/2013/11/20-regret-changing-genders-over-40attempt-suicide-and-even-after-surgery-a-large-number-remain-traum.html[/url] this is a relatively concise article with links to various sources for most of what I've said. as for the backlash in LGBT communities, that's a difficult thing to link source for, however: [url]http://yiannopoulos.net/2014/08/15/transgenderism-is-a-psychiatric-disorder-its-sufferers-need-therapy-not-surgery/[/url] this is a personal blog post from BreitBart journalist and LGBT activist Milo Yiannopoulos. it discusses in considerable detail the feelings that many in the community have about the effects of transition surgery and also makes references to some of the sources discussed in the first article. the point was that since transition surgery was invented, it has essentially been accepted as the cure for trans gender people, and thought to be a wholly positive procedure. Reputable people in the medical field, over the years, have grown concerned about what they see in the statistics of people who undergo these surgeries. what the data suggests is that a substantial number of these people are ending up dead. to me, this is a very important issue and the fact that it's mostly ignored is alarming to me.[/QUOTE] Wasn't the study from 30+ years ago in the John Hopkins hospital already debunked in an earlier post? [url]http://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1444050&p=46849360&viewfull=1#post46849360[/url]

[QUOTE=Dark RaveN;46850238]Then enlighten me, or else your words are just as bullshit as mine. This thread provides another great example of how retarded any discussion is on the Internet. We have one group, who may be inherently wrong, but are right because they think so, and every time you suggest another, vastly different opinion, you get branded a moron who does no research, albeit not supporting your own claims at all. [editline]3rd January 2015[/editline] yeah, what is ad hominem anyway[/QUOTE] [url]http://transsexual.org/What.html[/url] [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Causes_of_transsexualism#Brain_structure[/url] on the first page of google, but hey it's probably all a lie right? I never said they were my claims, obviously they're the claims of neurologists people that, well, know a hell of a lot more about the subject than you or I do, but we can still read and understand it. That is unless you're too stubborn to even think about changing your viewpoint.

[QUOTE=Dark RaveN;46850798]I didn't ignore it, I even rated Agree on your post. However, if you cannot alter already set brain chemistry, what about, as someone mentioned in the topic, schizophrenia, depression? Depression is arguably, but researches showed that predisposition is a huge factor of occurrence, ergo another already set brain chemistry, is it not? Why not try using more gender-based steroids in accordance to your sex/gender(?) you were born with? You failed to recognize the context for the snowflake, so your reply is completely irrelevant. Give me at least a hint of the pages, its not like FP's search tool is google tier.[/QUOTE] The difference between depression and a total gender dysphoria is pretty huge. Whilst you can increase dopamine production or combat many of the symptoms that lead to depression, depression is incurable in some people who are genetically predisposed to it. So you can combat it in the average sufferer but you can't cure it in all cases. With gender dysphoria you have the problem of the emotional imbalance caused by the chemical imbalance of the wrong set of horomones, because of how prevasive these hormones are, it's pretty difficult to combat it. Part of SRS and HRT is about bringing out the normal brain chemistry in those people as to their genders.