Transgender teen leaves note on tumblr blaming Christian parents for suicide - Polidicks

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;46824207]You can't claim to care about homosexuals and then claim the acts they do are evil by the nature of the act. God created gay people and created the system by which they MUST be systematically oppressed away from the same things you might enjoy but deny to them. God created them with an inherit flaw. Can you explain to me how that works? Why we should believe that's true? Why we should actively oppress people because of that simple belief? And don't even go there saying you're not oppressing them. Demanding they be segregated into a class of people who aren't allowed the same carnal pleasures you are is oppression.[/QUOTE] You ignored what I said. Literally every single person on the entire planet desires, even strongly desires, to do things that are Biblically wrong. Every. Single. Person. This is not something unique to homosexuals. If you want to call not allowing people to do anything they want oppression, then fine, but I don't think it accurately describes the situation. The purpose of it is that both sex and marriage are sacred with Christianity. They hold purpose beyond the purely natural function, and because of that their definition is completely independent of human desire or description.

Typical of this generation to demonize the parents if they happen to be Christian, if this was a family of any other faith it wouldn't be news worthy. Their child was obviously mentally unwell and at age 16 emotions and hormones run rampant; a stage in life with high suicide rates. Many a local teenager have taken their life for reasons less than this and it usually follows the same pattern (i.e. blaming a person/entity for their suicide). He states clearly in his suicide note that he's pissed at his parents as they happen to disagree with his planned lifestyle choices. He acted impulsively and selfishly to spite his parents and other family/friends who disagreed with him (with emphasis on Christianity). His parents absolutely did not fail in his upbringing and remained true to their Christian faith throughout. When parents get their child baptized (depending on denomination), they enter into a covenant with God; which one of the vows may read [URL=https://www.presbyterianireland.org/getmedia/03b96521-8ce1-4852-b152-599a6707be64/CT_Baptism_Leaflet.pdf.aspx]“Do you promise, in dependence on Divine grace, to teach your child the truths and duties of the Christian faith, and by your prayers, teaching, and example, to bring up your child in the nurture and admonition of the Lord and in the ways of the Church of God?”[/URL]. Homosexuality is in direct contradiction to church and biblical teachings and no true Christian would ever support such a lifestyle. It could be also be argued that modern culture of celebrating deviant behaviors is equally to blame for Josh's death. He mentioned in his note that "I just continued to do traditionally “boyish” things to try to fit in." and "When I was 14, I learned what transgender meant". If millennials adapted the moral code of their parents, this kid would have integrated with society without family friction and would still be alive today. I'd also like to point out that the attitude towards the Mother in this thread is a bloody disgrace. There is nothing at all wrong with her Facebook post, just because she uses names and pronouns that doesn't fit you're view of the situation, doesn't warrant the vile hatred directed towards her. Josh is dead and gone, his parents are not, it's them who are now suffering, not just from their loss but also the wretchedness of the internet. Have some respect for fuck sack. [highlight](User was permabanned for this post ("Alt/gimmick" - SteveUK))[/highlight]

Oh man this thread was such a shitstorm waiting t happen since the very beginning.

[QUOTE=Nasi Nebula;46824281]Typical of this generation to demonize the parents if they happen to be Christian, if this was a family of any other faith it wouldn't be news worthy. Their child was obviously mentally unwell and at age 16 emotions and hormones run rampant; a stage in life with high suicide rates. Many a local teenager have taken their life for reasons less than this and it usually follows the same pattern (i.e. blaming a person/entity for their suicide). He states clearly in his suicide note that he's pissed at his parents as they happen to disagree with his planned lifestyle choices. He acted impulsively and selfishly to spite his parents and other family/friends who disagreed with him (with emphasis on Christianity). His parents absolutely did not fail in his upbringing and remained true to their Christian faith throughout. When parents get their child baptized (depending on denomination), they enter into a covenant with God; which one of the vows may read [URL="https://www.presbyterianireland.org/getmedia/03b96521-8ce1-4852-b152-599a6707be64/CT_Baptism_Leaflet.pdf.aspx]“Do you promise, in dependence on Divine grace, to teach your child the truths and duties of the Christian faith, and by your prayers, teaching, and example, to bring up your child in the nurture and admonition of the Lord and in the ways of the Church of God?”[/URL]. Homosexuality is in direct contradiction to church and biblical teachings and no true Christian would ever support such a lifestyle. It could be also be argued that modern culture of celebrating deviant behaviors is equally to blame for Josh's death. He mentioned in his note that "I just continued to do traditionally “boyish” things to try to fit in." and "When I was 14, I learned what transgender meant". If millennials adapted the moral code of their parents, this kid would have integrated with society without family friction and would still be alive today. I'd also like to point out that the attitude towards the Mother in this thread is a bloody disgrace. There is nothing at all wrong with her Facebook post, just because she uses names and pronouns that doesn't fit you're view of the situation, doesn't warrant the vile hatred directed towards her. Josh is dead and gone, his parents are not, it's them who are now suffering, not just from their loss but also the wretchedness of the internet. Have some respect for fuck sack.[/QUOTE] You're referring to her as a "he." Nobody is going to take you seriously.

[QUOTE=sgman91;46823693]Honestly, how can people who think like this call themselves open minded? What you really mean is that you're right and everyone else is either a completely idiot and/or evil. You're no different from those you hate. We have a mother who just lost her child to suicide. I don't know if there's anything more tragic and depressing than to have the child that you bore and rose think that their life isn't worth living anymore so intensely that they end it, and all you have to say is, "Oh, she's probably so evil that she doesn't even feel grief." Can you be more callous and close minded? Dumb me all you want. I couldn't care less, but don't pretend that you have any desire to understand the point of view of others. All you care about is making sure that everyone knows how much better of a person you are.[/QUOTE] i usually don't hold sympathy for people if they make their child's life a living hell, then don't even bother to address them using their proper pronouns after they're fucking [I]dead.[/I]

[QUOTE=Nasi Nebula;46824281][B]Typical of this generation to demonize the parents if they happen to be Christian, if this was a family of any other faith it wouldn't be news worthy. Their child was obviously mentally unwell and at age 16 emotions and hormones run rampant; a stage in life with high suicide rates.[/B] Many a local teenager have taken their life for reasons less than this and it usually follows the same pattern (i.e. blaming a person/entity for their suicide). -more BS-[/QUOTE] I really hope you don't actually believe what you are saying and you are some gimmick troll alt.

You know what sucks? If I killed myself, my parents would do the exact same thing. It's not uncommon for parents to be shitfucks to their trans children.

[QUOTE=sgman91;46824280]You ignored what I said. Literally every single person on the entire planet desires, even strongly desires, to do things that are Biblically wrong. Every. Single. Person. This is not something unique to homosexuals. If you want to call not allowing people to do anything they want oppression, then fine, but I don't think it accurately describes the situation. The purpose of it is that both sex and marriage are sacred with Christianity. They hold purpose beyond the purely natural function, and because of that their definition is completely independent of human desire or description.[/QUOTE] No I didn't ignore it. I just find it interesting that gays are put in their own little class of evil and wrong. I know that in the christian perspective sex and marriage are sacred. They're so sacred and special, that they're denied to an entire class of people who are not worthy of the most important bond in the world, they're created to be alone and to suffer by this mindset.

i'm glad to see the mods are catering to the autists that take ratings seriously [highlight](User was banned for this post ("Derailing" - SteveUK))[/highlight]

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;46824308]No I didn't ignore it. I just find it interesting that gays are put in their own little class of evil and wrong. I know that in the christian perspective sex and marriage are sacred. They're so sacred and special, that they're denied to an entire class of people who are not worthy of the most important bond in the world, they're created to be alone and to suffer by this mindset.[/QUOTE] It makes sense though, think of how much religion encourages hierarchies.

[QUOTE=Nasi Nebula;46824281]Have some respect for fuck sack.[/QUOTE] This is quite frankly the only truly intelligible thing I pulled from that wall of text. Side note, welcome to FP. I say that because your account was made today seeing as how that was your first post.

The point of a parent is to guide the child, not to control them. Trying to shape your own kid to your own likings is a selfish and terrible thing to do.

This kinda hits home for me a bit because my friends and I have recently had a good friend come out as being transgender, and we've all been super supportive of her/make sure we as friends accept her. Life is precious (duh) and there is no reason to be destructive to people just because of who they are. And no, it's not a [I]'choice'[/I] for these people. That's a concept I've had to understand myself, to be honest, but once you understand that from their perspective they just want to live their life as they truly are, it's a lot easier to just move on and be friendly. On a secondary note, suicide is never the answer. No matter what. It's super hard sometimes to be stronger than that, and that's fine, but the best thing you can do is to pay attention to whatever positive influences you can find. Whether they're people you know in real life, or people on the web sharing their experiences. I can't imagine having such disrespectful and love-less parents though. That is so rough.

It's kind of weird thinking there are people in this thread who would actively be happy if I killed myself right now, just cuz' I'm trans.

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;46824308]No I didn't ignore it. I just find it interesting that gays are put in their own little class of evil and wrong.[/QUOTE] I already said that I think Christians put too much emphasis on homosexuality. The same Biblical list that contains that also contains things like lying. In my mind the person who intentionally lies for their own benefit is no better than the person who intentionally has sex with people of the same sex. With that said, much of the seeming difference lies in society, not Christianity. Society has grown to accept homosexuality and therefore, the non-acceptance of Christianity stands out. [QUOTE]I know that in the christian perspective sex and marriage are sacred. They're so sacred and special, that they're denied to an entire class of people who are not worthy of the most important bond in the world, they're created to be alone and to suffer by this mindset.[/QUOTE] Christians deny marriage to more than just people of the same sex. They also deny it to siblings and polygamists. It just so happens that society still agrees on both those counts, so the church's stance doesn't seem so bad. Note that they also deny sex to any non-married person. Marriage also isn't denied to gay people. Getting married to people of the same sex is denied. I know this doesn't matter much to a gay person, but it's still good to be clear.

[QUOTE=Shark Bones;46824366]It's kind of weird thinking there are people in this thread who would actively be happy if I killed myself right now, just cuz' I'm trans.[/QUOTE] Everyone has a list of people who would be happy if they were dead. It's best to not waste energy thinking about the happiness of those people.

[QUOTE=sgman91;46824384]I already said that I think Christians put too much emphasis on homosexuality. The same Biblical list that contains that also contains things like lying. In my mind the person who intentionally lies for their own benefit is no better than the person who intentionally has sex with people of the same sex. With that said, much of the seeming difference lies in society, not Christianity. Society has grown to accept homosexuality and therefore, the non-acceptance of Christianity stands out. Christians deny marriage to more than just people of the same sex. They also deny it to siblings and polygamists. It just so happens that society still agrees on both those counts, so the church's stance doesn't seem so bad. Note that they also deny sex to any non-married person. [B]Marriage also isn't denied to gay people. Getting married to people of the same sex is denied. I know this doesn't matter much to a gay person, but it's still good to be clear.[/B][/QUOTE] That's mindless semantics. No straight person would marry the same sex, so it's effectively the same as denying marriage to gay people.

[QUOTE=sgman91;46824384]I already said that I think Christians put too much emphasis on homosexuality. The same Biblical list that contains that also contains things like lying. In my mind the person who intentionally lies for their own benefit is no better than the person who intentionally has sex with people of the same sex. With that said, much of the seeming difference lies in society, not Christianity. Society has grown to accept homosexuality and therefore, the non-acceptance of Christianity stands out. Christians deny marriage to more than just people of the same sex. They also deny it to siblings and polygamists. It just so happens that society still agrees on both those counts, so the church's stance doesn't seem so bad. Note that they also deny sex to any non-married person. Marriage also isn't denied to gay people. Getting married to people of the same sex is denied. I know this doesn't matter much to a gay person, but it's still good to be clear.[/QUOTE] And here we are. Your true colours. Christianity to you is the default view. I don't think it is at all.

[QUOTE=Starlight 456;46824401]That's mindless semantics. No straight person would marry the same sex, so it's effectively the same as denying marriage to gay people.[/QUOTE] Clarity is of the utmost importance to me. A discernible difference exists. So I wanted to make it clear. If you didn't notice, I also admitted that it doesn't mean much of anything to a gay person. [QUOTE]And here we are. Your true colours. Christianity to you is the default view. I don't think it is at all.[/QUOTE] And there's the vague accusation that I've come to expect from you time and time again once you're done trying.

I've always wanted to convince myself that these kinds of parents can't exist, it just seems unbelievable that there are people who are so against something that barely affects them, regardless of what their religion teaches them. Trans people who deal with shit like this have my respect and I hope shit like this will stop happening in the years to come, but maybe that's just too optimistic.

Done trying? To explain to you your view isn't the default nature of humanity? Yeah I find that to be like discussing with a brick wall as you will never change your view.

This thread is just going to get nowhere quick, and make a whole bunch of people angry, when that shouldn't be the point. The point is a child killed theirself because of emotional abuse. And I can fucking relate to that. Emotional abuse is way worse than any of the beatings I ever got.

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;46824448]Done trying? To explain to you your view isn't the default nature of humanity? Yeah I find that to be like discussing with a brick wall as you will never change your view.[/QUOTE] Yes, done trying. Instead of responding to what I actually say you respond to what you think I mean without actually addressing anything I've said. I can't respond to it because it's meaningless.

[QUOTE=sgman91;46824469]Yes, done trying. Instead of responding to what I actually say you respond to what you think I mean without actually addressing anything I've said. I can't respond to it because it's meaningless.[/QUOTE] It's not meaningless. You don't get my argument what so ever and how can I respond to your argument when your argument is that "Hey, the world is the way I say it is, the way my religion and my god says it is, and you can't argue that, it's true, it's just the way of the world", and when it comes to the emotional, and actual abuse of these people in real life, I don't know what more to say to you, you acknowledge the abuse is bad, but basically admit it has to happen. I know you say they're just in the same tier as liars, but frankly, liars are usually regarded as terrible people who manipulate and abuse those around them, so to put those who have gay sex on that tier, though you find truthful and fitting, is in my eyes an opinion that is entirely uninformed by any actual awareness of reality about these people. The way you lay your view out, the only thing gay people can have in life is an empty hollow feeling, and no answers to their questions, just the promise they must be faithful, celibate, and never to indulge in their nature, a nature that almost all people get to engage with in some way in the christian faith. Good men and good women who are born created by god to wonder for their life and feel even more out of place than you can imagine. People wonder why this is, and you and your religion can offer no actual answers, or solace to these people, just the knowledge god created them "wrong", to be viewed as wrong and as bad as liars in the world, worse for many others who are not as forgiving as you. And you're JUST one point of view in a religion that has many points of view and isn't objectively defined and objectively held to a rule. It's evolved and changed and fallen and risen and had paradigm shifts and changes of opinion so how do people really ever get anywhere in a system where each person believing it believes they know the truth and the right way but have slight differences from other people in the very same so called objective system of belief? Can I convey to you that your belief is one of a pantheon and have you take that seriously? No, because you always have some explanation and escape for that that is so unsatisfying and sloppy that I actually do stop trying.

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;46824524]It's not meaningless. You don't get my argument what so ever and how can I respond to your argument when your argument is that [B]"Hey, the world is the way I say it is, the way my religion and my god says it is, and you can't argue that, it's true, it's just the way of the world"[/B][/QUOTE] This is what I mean. I never said this. It's what you think I'm saying, but you're just plain wrong. Nothing I've said has literally anything to do with whether Christianity is true or not. My statements would apply either way.

[QUOTE=sgman91;46824533]This is what I mean. I never said this. It's what you think I'm saying. Nothing I've said has literally anything to do with whether Christianity is true or not. My statements would apply either way.[/QUOTE] So if Christianity is not true, why should we follow the bible and oppress/discriminate based on its' contents?

[QUOTE=FreakyMe;46824540]So if Christianity is not true, why should we follow the bible and oppress/discriminate based on its' contents?[/QUOTE] Who cares what a little jumping fox has to say gawsh

[QUOTE=FreakyMe;46824540]So if Christianity is not true, why should we follow the bible and oppress/discriminate based on its' contents?[/QUOTE] I've never said anything about why you SHOULD follow it. I'm simply describing the beliefs and where they are coming from.

[QUOTE=sgman91;46824545]I've never said anything about why you SHOULD follow. I'm simply describing the beliefs and where they are coming from.[/QUOTE] Doesn't make them right/fair/acceptible.

[QUOTE=sgman91;46824545]I've never said anything about why you SHOULD follow it. I'm simply describing the beliefs and where they are coming from.[/QUOTE] Oh don't even act like you're not doing this as a method to justify why you're right and why these people are also right. [editline]30th December 2014[/editline] that's so transparent.