Bernie and Donald are already competing for voters - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Atlascore;49715433]I never said his posts weren't harsh either. As to why, who knows? maybe he's have a bad day and needs to vent, or he's just terrible at communicating with people. Regardless, bringing yourself down to his level is just making it worse for everybody involved.[/QUOTE] Someone who genuinely thinks we're all fucked because we don't "see the light" is not a person who can even be sunk down to.

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;49715429]Who's tougher? The guy who got 7.6 million from Daddy Or the guy who spent 40 years fighting tooth and nail just to have the right to be the only socialist, independent in an entire nation, that literally hated him for being "socialist".[/QUOTE] Not to mention who is running a so far surprisingly successful campaign for President, despite being a democratic socialist.

[QUOTE=Atlascore;49715433]I never said his posts weren't harsh either. As to why, who knows? maybe he's have a bad day and needs to vent, or he's just terrible at communicating with people. Regardless, bringing yourself down to his level is just making it worse for everybody involved.[/QUOTE]i am not bringing myself to his level, no amount of harsh words can do more damage to the discourse in this thread than actively ignoring questions & issues. if you took out the harsh tone of all the posts, the content of his posts are still not addressing any questions that i or other posts have asked. i don't think it's a big deal or any huge amount of effort to express the platform and policies of a candidate you are supporting for the most powerful position in the world.

[QUOTE=CrumbleShake;49715451]Not to mention who is running a so far surprisingly successful campaign for President, despite being a democratic socialist.[/QUOTE] It should be worth to note that if Bernie Sanders isn't strong, how is he beating the most "part of the establishment" candidate in either side of the race - Hillary Clinton? The person with decades of political dealings, decades in Washington, and decades of name recognition and most likely a bigger war chest for her campaign?

[QUOTE=CrumbleShake;49715399]I studied American politics at college, and as a European there's a lot at stake in this election, doesn't matter that I'm not American myself. We actually studied Bernie in a fair amount of depth, way before he was running for President, because of what an interesting politician he is. There's a difference between using your political platform to leverage mass anti-communist hysteria to influence public opinion for the worse as McCarthy did, and attempting to pass bills that are further to the left of almost all of congress, against massive corporate lobbying as the single solitary self-professed democratic socialist in the whole of Congress. Especially when you're given next to no media coverage, from being so anti establishment. Hysteria is more effective at mobilising people than hope, unfortunately. Most of what Bernie talks about and the bills he puts to congress are popular with the general public, Congress is just too much of a roadblock. Within congress, Sanders was fighting an impossible job. As president, with the mandate of a general election under his belt, he can hopefully do an awful lot. He'll have a heck of a job fighting congress, but there's congressional elections coming up as well. If he were president, I imagine we'd see a lot of executive action to curb campaign finance laws. That's a very optimistic viewpoint though, and there's not that much chance he'll get in.[/QUOTE] You really are one of the better posters around here. I'll get this out of the way. I think Sanders is at least 90% legit in his beliefs. I think he's telling the truth about what he wants to do. I think that, based on what you are saying, he must have been fighting very hard to get these things done, over many years. You've at least changed my opinion about that, I don't think he's been loafing around any more. This, unfortunately, makes me wonder why he hasn't succeeded. Is it a lack of creativity? Is he afraid to stir the pot too much? Trump isn't even a politician, yet he's succeeded in just a couple of months in doing more to rally the public than Sanders ever did before he was running for president. My issue isn't with Sanders now, it's the Sanders of the past. If he was so capable, why wasn't he able to rally people the way he is now? What's changed between now and then? Where's his ability to be creative and change the rules of the game? This is what I see in Trump that I don't see in Sander. Creative authority is the ability to break the rules and make up new rules to replace them, and get away with it. For all his good qualities, Sanders is only able to work within the rules. Trump is able to change the game entirely. [editline]10th February 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;49715426]Is your only example of a "good leader" a man who led a witch hunt and ruined the lives of people based on the mere suspicion of their political affiliations.[/QUOTE] Well, no. I've got Hitler too.

[QUOTE=SaltyWaters;49715483]Well, no. I've got Hitler too.[/QUOTE] We're done. Wrap it up folks. At least I'm done. :thisthread:

[QUOTE]This is what I see in Trump that I don't see in Sander. Creative authority is the ability to break the rules and make up new rules to replace them, and get away with it. For all his good qualities, Sanders is only able to work within the rules. Trump is able to change the game entirely.[/QUOTE] So you want some one who will stir the pot in order to enact change. Doesn't matter what change it brings, as long gets broken down. Either you're paid by trump or you are a troll voter wanting him in office for the lulz.

[QUOTE=SaltyWaters;49715483]You really are one of the better posters around here. I'll get this out of the way. I think Sanders is at least 90% legit in his beliefs. I think he's telling the truth about what he wants to do. I think that, based on what you are saying, he must have been fighting very hard to get these things done, over many years. You've at least changed my opinion about that, I don't think he's been loafing around any more. This, unfortunately, makes me wonder why he hasn't succeeded. Is it a lack of creativity? Is he afraid to stir the pot too much? Trump isn't even a politician, yet he's succeeded in just a couple of months in doing more to rally the public than Sanders ever did before he was running for president. My issue isn't with Sanders now, it's the Sanders of the past. If he was so capable, why wasn't he able to rally people the way he is now? What's changed between now and then? Where's his ability to be creative and change the rules of the game? This is what I see in Trump that I don't see in Sander. Creative authority is the ability to break the rules and make up new rules to replace them, and get away with it. For all his good qualities, Sanders is only able to work within the rules. Trump is able to change the game entirely.[/quote] You realize that he's gone from almost no name recognition to beating the fucking Clintons in the primaries one-on-one? What the fuck is "rally people" if not that? Trump has been in the media for years and years and yet he didn't even win Iowa. [QUOTE=SaltyWaters;49715483][editline]10th February 2016[/editline] Well, no. I've got Hitler too.[/QUOTE] Shitposting is bannable, just so you know.

[QUOTE=SaltyWaters;49715483]You really are one of the better posters around here. I'll get this out of the way. I think Sanders is at least 90% legit in his beliefs. I think he's telling the truth about what he wants to do. I think that, based on what you are saying, he must have been fighting very hard to get these things done, over many years. You've at least changed my opinion about that, I don't think he's been loafing around any more. This, unfortunately, makes me wonder why he hasn't succeeded. Is it a lack of creativity? Is he afraid to stir the pot too much? Trump isn't even a politician, yet he's succeeded in just a couple of months in doing more to rally the public than Sanders ever did before he was running for president. My issue isn't with Sanders now, it's the Sanders of the past. If he was so capable, why wasn't he able to rally people the way he is now? What's changed between now and then? Where's his ability to be creative and change the rules of the game? This is what I see in Trump that I don't see in Sander. Creative authority is the ability to break the rules and make up new rules to replace them, and get away with it. For all his good qualities, Sanders is only able to work within the rules. Trump is able to change the game entirely.[/QUOTE] Maybe it's the fact that for 40 years the nation has seen the word "SOCIALIST" as codeword for "THE DEVIL" and he's [B]STILL[/B] done that much work despite not having any good will for most of his career. "Sanders of the past". You mean the past of "BETTER RED THAN DEAD" filled with people like yourself who couldn't spell socialist let alone define it(hyperbole for effect)? Jeeze, I wonder why he couldn't fix the nation singlehandedly in the time it took Trump to take more of Daddy's money and work with a foot, a giant leap, above any competitors of his at the time

[QUOTE=Atlascore;49715500]He's not beating Hillary, she's still got an almost unbreakable grip on minorities and older voters, she's maintaining a huge lead in every state that isn't overwhelmingly populated by liberal whites.[/QUOTE] The numbers for Iowa and NH, the ones that only count right at this moment, say otherwise. But the point is, he's saying that Sanders is incapable of rallying people when he's gone from no one 6 months ago to at the least, tying in Iowa and having a clear victory in New Hampshire. That is an achievement and I don't see how rallying people could not be part of that.

[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;49715442]He isn't venting, he's ~telling us the truth~[/QUOTE] Telling you the truth? Shit, I'm just talking about Donald Trump. I'll be telling you the truth when you're all ready to hear it.

[QUOTE=SaltyWaters;49715483]You really are one of the better posters around here. I'll get this out of the way. I think Sanders is at least 90% legit in his beliefs. I think he's telling the truth about what he wants to do. I think that, based on what you are saying, he must have been fighting very hard to get these things done, over many years. You've at least changed my opinion about that, I don't think he's been loafing around any more. This, unfortunately, makes me wonder why he hasn't succeeded. Is it a lack of creativity? Is he afraid to stir the pot too much? Trump isn't even a politician, yet he's succeeded in just a couple of months in doing more to rally the public than Sanders ever did before he was running for president. My issue isn't with Sanders now, it's the Sanders of the past. If he was so capable, why wasn't he able to rally people the way he is now? What's changed between now and then? Where's his ability to be creative and change the rules of the game? This is what I see in Trump that I don't see in Sander. Creative authority is the ability to break the rules and make up new rules to replace them, and get away with it. For all his good qualities, Sanders is only able to work within the rules. Trump is able to change the game entirely.[/QUOTE]bernie sanders has not ran for president before donald trump has not ran for president before ergo the context in which they are able to rally the people is recent and unique, bernie has rallied people to go head to head with someone who has led her whole life with the hope to be president. this is a fact. you say you look to trump to rally people and then disregard bernie's rallying of the people. you have no point. [editline]10th February 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=SaltyWaters;49715519]Telling you the truth? Shit, I'm just talking about Donald Trump. I'll be telling you the truth when you're all ready to hear it.[/QUOTE]you have no concept of how arguments work, dude

[QUOTE=SaltyWaters;49715519]Telling you the truth? Shit, I'm just talking about Donald Trump. I'll be telling you the truth when you're all ready to hear it.[/QUOTE] You don't have any clue what the truth is any more so than any other average joe on the street dude you're average we're all average we all know jack shit about the world and you've just deluded yourself into thinking you know more than everyone else it's actually sad if I wasn't laughing

[QUOTE=SaltyWaters;49715519]Telling you the truth? Shit, I'm just talking about Donald Trump. I'll be telling you the truth when you're all ready to hear it.[/QUOTE] You're welcome to keep whatever delusions you think is truth for yourself.

[QUOTE=benzi2k7;49715523]donald trump has not ran for president before [/QUOTE] Yeah he has, he ran in 08 and lost because he's a fucking idiot. How he's doing so amazing now doing the same thing as before is literal dumbfuck luck.

[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;49715499]You realize that he's gone from almost no name recognition to beating the fucking Clintons in the primaries one-on-one? What the fuck is "rally people" if not that? Trump has been in the media for years and years and yet he didn't even win Iowa. Shitposting is bannable, just so you know.[/QUOTE] Hitler is one of the greatest leaders in modern history. He did amazing and terrible things, and he got an entire nation to do it with him. That's fucking leadership. Also, the Clintons have been under assault for years. Hillary is one of the most universally hated creatures in politics. Beating her is kind of like beating Hitler in a popularity contest.

My god he's going full Erdogan.

[QUOTE=Atlascore;49715537]Iowa and NH were those overwhelmingly white states I was talking about, he's going to get massacred in any state with a significant non-white population, Hillary's predicted to confidently take both Nevada and South Carolina.[/QUOTE] She was supposed to clean sweep both primaries. I don't really think Sanders is gonna get to the end of this election, but I can't help but laugh at the constant attempts to make it seem like Sanders is just unelectable, and even if he weren't, can't draw the attention Hilary does. I mean he keeps proving it wrong but everyone keeps going "Nah he's fucked". Why not just try supporting him maybe, he's doing pretty well for being unelectable.

[QUOTE=SaltyWaters;49715541]Hitler is one of the greatest leaders in modern history. He did amazing and terrible things, and he got an entire nation to do it with him. That's fucking leadership. Also, the Clintons have been under assault for years. Hillary is one of the most universally hated creatures in politics. Beating her is kind of like beating Hitler in a popularity contest.[/QUOTE] Hitler gained power through bullying his way into it. There are numerous sources that talk about voter intimidation at voting stations in Germany to get the Nazis into power, they would severely beat anyone who didn't support them beforehand, and after they gained power they [I]literally fucking killed whomever they disagreed with.[/I] That's not fucking leadership, that's executing the opposition I can't believe I'm staying in this thread past the Godwin stage, but fuck it. I'm sure you're just a troll at this point but I'll play along.

[QUOTE=SaltyWaters;49715541]Hitler is one of the greatest leaders in modern history. He did amazing and terrible things, and he got an entire nation to do it with him. That's fucking leadership. Also, the Clintons have been under assault for years. Hillary is one of the most universally hated creatures in politics. Beating her is kind of like beating Hitler in a popularity contest.[/QUOTE] welp I think we're done here you've reached the maximum historical ignorance that a thread can contain. Yes, hitlers governmnet was responsbile for the reformation of germany. However, [B]almost none of this was hitler himself.[/B] But regardless, you're perfectly fine with electing a person who will attempt genocide based on your statement that he's a so called great leader of modern history.

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;49715528]You don't have any clue what the truth is any more so than any other average joe on the street dude you're average we're all average we all know jack shit about the world and you've just deluded yourself into thinking you know more than everyone else it's actually sad if I wasn't laughing[/QUOTE] That is sad. I know many different things than you know. I likely know most of the same things you know. You don't have to be average. The world isn't going to be this awful for much longer, I can promise you that. Just hold on a little longer, and you'll see something pretty special.

[QUOTE=SaltyWaters;49715578]That is sad. I know many different things than you know. I likely know most of the same things you know. You don't have to be average. The world isn't going to be this awful for much longer, I can promise you that. Just hold on a little longer, and you'll see something pretty special.[/QUOTE] Dear god your pretentiousness and condescension is almost worth fucking bottling and selling. Either you're trolling, or you have an ego the size of trumps asshole

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;49715591]Dear god your pretentiousness and condescension is almost worth fucking bottling and selling. Either you're trolling, or you have an ego the size of trumps asshole[/QUOTE] At this point I think it's best to just take the "report and move on" mentality.

Golly gee I sure hope Sanders beats Trump! That'd be just swell.

[QUOTE=Atlascore;49715602]In bold; There's that attitude I was talking about earlier, all I did was disagree and now I'm getting shit-talked.[/QUOTE] What. That's no where even close to shit talking. [editline]10th February 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=SaltyWaters;49715578]The world isn't going to be this awful for much longer, I can promise you that. Just hold on a little longer, and you'll see something pretty special.[/QUOTE] Can I buy pot from you.

[QUOTE=SaltyWaters;49715578] You don't have to be average. The world isn't going to be this awful for much longer, I can promise you that. Just hold on a little longer, and you'll see something pretty special.[/QUOTE] What do you think is going to happen out of curiosity [editline]s[/editline] You keep making apocolyptic posts like this and I'm very curious as to what you mean.

[QUOTE=SaltyWaters;49715519] I'll be telling you the truth when you're all ready to hear it.[/QUOTE] Okay, Neo. [video=youtube;pFS4zYWxzNA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFS4zYWxzNA[/video]

[QUOTE=SaltyWaters;49715483]You really are one of the better posters around here. I'll get this out of the way. I think Sanders is at least 90% legit in his beliefs. I think he's telling the truth about what he wants to do. I think that, based on what you are saying, he must have been fighting very hard to get these things done, over many years. You've at least changed my opinion about that, I don't think he's been loafing around any more. This, unfortunately, makes me wonder why he hasn't succeeded. Is it a lack of creativity? Is he afraid to stir the pot too much? Trump isn't even a politician, yet he's succeeded in just a couple of months in doing more to rally the public than Sanders ever did before he was running for president. My issue isn't with Sanders now, it's the Sanders of the past. If he was so capable, why wasn't he able to rally people the way he is now? What's changed between now and then? Where's his ability to be creative and change the rules of the game? This is what I see in Trump that I don't see in Sander. Creative authority is the ability to break the rules and make up new rules to replace them, and get away with it. For all his good qualities, Sanders is only able to work within the rules. Trump is able to change the game entirely.[/QUOTE] Because he was a little known senator with no media attention awarded to him, who doesn't take corporate donations, up against the corporate lobbying that's ravaged American politics, fighting the issues with the political system as a whole. It's an impossible battle for a senator, it's nothing personal with Sanders. Trump meanwhile has provided nothing to the political system. Sanders and Trump would have the same amount of power as president, only one of them is talking about wealth redistribution and improving public spending. Only one of them has the backing of tonne of economists. Only one of them has policies to fight the corrupt campaign financing system in the US. The other is running a campaign of intolerance based on loose rhetoric, with no solid domestic policy to speak of, with a lot to personally lose by following the policies America needs to tackle its oligarchy and its massive wealth inequality.

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;49715557]She was supposed to clean sweep both primaries. I don't really think Sanders is gonna get to the end of this election, but I can't help but laugh at the constant attempts to make it seem like Sanders is just unelectable, and even if he weren't, can't draw the attention Hilary does. I mean he keeps proving it wrong but everyone keeps going "Nah he's fucked". Why not just try supporting him maybe, he's doing pretty well for being unelectable.[/QUOTE] Sanders is super electable. If Trump wasn't around, I'd likely be voting for Sanders. I think Trump is a much better option. Sanders doesn't have the energy that Trump has, and he's a socialist. Historically, the only Socialist nation that was able to prosper under socialism, was Germany, under National Socialism. Every other nation that tries socialism stagnates. There's no real growth or prosperity, it slowly crumbles. This should be obvious.

[QUOTE=SaltyWaters;49715687]Sanders is super electable. If Trump wasn't around, I'd likely be voting for Sanders. I think Trump is a much better option. Sanders doesn't have the energy that Trump has, and he's a socialist. Historically, the only Socialist nation that was able to prosper under socialism, was Germany, under National Socialism. Every other nation that tries socialism stagnates. There's no real growth or prosperity, it slowly crumbles. This should be obvious.[/QUOTE] Jesus christ you actually thing nazism is socialism