Science says there is no God, no Afterlife. And religion says too shut up and have a little faith.
The only people who really know if their is an Afterlife or not are the dead, and they arent very talkative. So what science should really do is Resurrect a dead person and ask him. (And hope he doesn't turn into a zombie)
Nuff said
[QUOTE=Kill Me No;29884182]Science says there is no God, no Afterlife. And religion says too shut up and have a little faith.
The only people who really know if their is an Afterlife or not are the dead, and they arent very talkative. So what science should really do is Resurrect a dead person and ask him. (And hope he doesn't turn into a zombie)
Nuff said[/QUOTE]
Or ask someone who has had heart surgery, you technically die during the procedure. ie heart stopping.
[QUOTE=Spacewolf;29871240]Nah, you're right. I don't know if he says it's a fact, but he is quite convinced that it's true. I think of all people, he knows when something is the solid truth or not.[/QUOTE]
Only time will let us know, Hopefully we'll be living until then to find out.
I don't really believe in the concept of god. Like one of the above posters said, I live my life based on facts. Also, I have a friend who lives in Malaysia. He says the Islamic people use some scary shit to make children believe in the existence in god. For example, a person dies during his sleep because he doesn't believe in god. It's pathetic.
[QUOTE=Third_Freako;29884843]I don't really believe in the concept of god. Like one of the above posters said, I live my life based on facts. Also, I have a friend who lives in Malaysia. He says the Islamic people use some scary shit to make children believe in the existence in god. For example, a person dies during his sleep because he doesn't believe in god. It's pathetic.[/QUOTE]
When growing up, the main reason I was Christian was because of my fear of eternal torment in hell.
Really, all religions has some sort of threat to make you believe... some are really sadistic ones, while other ones are just "no membership in the after-death cool club".
[QUOTE=PyroCF;29884434]Or ask someone who has had heart surgery, you technically die during the procedure. ie heart stopping.[/QUOTE]
Of course, then there is the question of whether whatever force decides on the afterlife, judgement etc. would bother letting you in if they knew you were just having a heart operation.
It's unfortunate the concept of afterlife has to be synonymous with "God".
[QUOTE=Kill Me No;29884182]So what science should really do is Resurrect a dead person and ask him. (And hope he doesn't turn into a zombie)
Nuff said[/QUOTE]
Good luck with that
I remember making a thread back in 2007 about this subject.
Someone should just do it so this question can be put to rest once and for all, I mean we're in 2011 and people still believe in fairy tales. So the faster we prove them wrong the better.
[QUOTE=Jayhawker30;29885064]It's unfortunate the concept of afterlife has to be synonymous with "God".[/QUOTE]
Considering that half the world believes in Abrahamic religions it's expected.
Sigh.. another "science vs religion" thread where dumbass FP atheist bandwagoners get to gloat, without even knowing what religion is about. Well yeah, what you know about religiousness are the stupid things, when religion has a good purpose.
[QUOTE=Fables;29885783]Considering that half the world believes in Abrahamic religions it's expected.[/QUOTE]
I don't think it should be like that, though. Although I am atheist myself, reading up on studies into the possibilities of life after death as well as a few personal observations have, for me, made the concept significantly more plausible than just a "fairy tale".
However, I AM still skeptical of it. I'm just saying that people may be too quick to completely discard the idea.
[QUOTE=Kill Me No;29884182]Science says there is no God, no Afterlife. And religion says too shut up and have a little faith.
The only people who really know if their is an Afterlife or not are the dead, and they arent very talkative. So what science should really do is Resurrect a dead person and ask him. (And hope he doesn't turn into a zombie)
Nuff said[/QUOTE]
Science says nothing of the sort. Absence of proof of existence is not evidence for non existence.
Anyways, this argument has nothing to do with god, or religion for that matter.
I fucking adore this man.
[QUOTE=Jayhawker30;29886098]I don't think it should be like that, though. Although I am atheist myself, reading up on studies into the possibilities of life after death as well as a few personal observations have, for me, made the concept significantly more plausible than just a "fairy tale".
However, I AM still skeptical of it. I'm just saying that people may be too quick to completely discard the idea.[/QUOTE]
why the fuck do people even care what happens when they die? god damnit that's so stupid. why would WE HUMANS deserve to go to heaven out of ALL other animals when we die? that makes no sense at all, so.. what a privilege it is to be a human right? :v:
[QUOTE=Zet;29882293]But Morgan Freeman is God, what more proof do you need? It's like saying everything about black holes are correct, even though no one has gone into one to live the tale.[/QUOTE]
No one has seen gravity or an atom so they don't exist
[QUOTE=Gekkosan;29886176]why the fuck do people even care what happens when they die? god damnit that's so stupid. why would WE HUMANS deserve to go to heaven out of ALL other animals when we die? that makes no sense at all, so.. what a privilege it is to be a human right? :v:[/QUOTE]
You're just bursting with anti-societal angst, aren't you?
[QUOTE=The golden;29881744]Well, let's start with the fact that there isn't a single molecule of proper documented proof in the entire human existence about the presence of a real afterlife.[/QUOTE]
How would you be able to find proof of something that solely exists in the supernatural world in the natural world?
You can't apply scientific tenets to supernatural things, because by definition, they are unprovable.
In the natural world, there is a difference in validity of saying that the world is flat, and the world is mostly spherical.
With supernatural things, however, saying there XYZ doesn't exist is as valid as saying it does, or that XYZ is actually a drunken dolphin that molests kids and smokes crack.
Which is why most scientists don't touch supernatural things, because there is [B]no possible way to actually know[/B], and I would have thought Stephen Hawking was one of them.
[editline]18th May 2011[/editline]
That said, most conceptualizations of an afterlife are ridiculously problematic and fraught with innumerable internal inconsistencies making them steaming piles of shit.
I like to think there is an afterlife, but obviously I don't know.
I think there could be a god, but he's nothing like any god from earth.
I don't think any of us could imagine him/her/it.
I don't care what any of your beliefs are, or if you disagree with me.
This is just how I comprehend this shit, life is fucking weird.
[QUOTE=Simski;29882084]If somebody were to recreate my entire body, then that body would live and think it was me.
It would however only be a clone of me, because the same brain (and consciousness) can not possibly exist at two places at the same time, and my original brain is surely being withered away in some grave by then and the consciousness in my real body has forever ended.
[editline]17th May 2011[/editline]
You have then not recreated me or transfered my consciousness, you have created a clone of me with an identical but separate consciousness.
My clone is a different person, with a mind and body identical to the original me.[/QUOTE]
This is exactly what I'm talking about. Even though it has the same chemical processes as you, and the same thoughts and memories, it's not you. So there is something to consciousness beyond just chemical reactions and our physical bodies and mind. That's what I was trying to get you to say.
Now if that's true, that our consciousness isn't the same thing as our brain, why should we assume that our consciousness has to end when our brain stops functioning?
[QUOTE=Key_in_skillee;29888028]So there is something to consciousness beyond just chemical reactions and our physical bodies and mind.[/QUOTE]
nope
I read an interesting article about death a while back. It proposed the idea that even if there is no spiritual "afterlife" that in a universe with infinite time all things are inevitable and therefore death would not be a final end, more of a pause.
[QUOTE=Sanius;29888050]nope[/QUOTE]
Well at the very least I got Simski to admit there was.
[QUOTE=Sanius;29888050]nope[/QUOTE]
How can you, or anyone know?
[img]http://i.imm.io/5Ixb.png[/img]
[QUOTE=Contag;29888191]How can you, or anyone know?[/QUOTE]
I don't sniff glue all day so that's a start
[QUOTE=Sanius;29888212]I don't sniff glue all day so that's a start[/QUOTE]
[B]WOW AWESOME RESPONSE
ARE YOU A FULL TIME POSTER WHO JUST POSTS REALLY AWESOME POSTS ALL DAY?
I WISH I COULD COOL AND WITTY LIKE YOU.[/B]
Thank you for that wonderful intellectual engagement.
I have enclosed a picture of a cute frog to thank you for the delightful conversation.
:frog:
[QUOTE=Key_in_skillee;29888028]This is exactly what I'm talking about. Even though it has the same chemical processes as you, and the same thoughts and memories, it's not you. So there is something to consciousness beyond just chemical reactions and our physical bodies and mind. That's what I was trying to get you to say.
Now if that's true, that our consciousness isn't the same thing as our brain, why should we assume that our consciousness has to end when our brain stops functioning?[/QUOTE]
Just because "stream of consciousness" exists, doesn't prove a soul. The "teleport" argument really doesn't support your view point. It kind of negates it.
And why don't you respond to other points against your argument
[editline]17th May 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Key_in_skillee;29888154]Well at the very least I got Simski to admit there was.[/QUOTE]
No you didn't. You taking him saying something out of context and using it for your own benefit isn't getting him to agree with you that there is an invisible, unknowable and unmeasurable entity attached to ALL of us that we ALL can't see or experience in anyway, but it's there.
[editline]17th May 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=dogmachines;29888131]I read an interesting article about death a while back. It proposed the idea that even if there is no spiritual "afterlife" that in a universe with infinite time all things are inevitable and therefore death would not be a final end, more of a pause.[/QUOTE]
But we don't live in an infinite universe. We live in a finite one.
[QUOTE=Key_in_skillee;29888028]So there is something to consciousness beyond just chemical reactions and our physical bodies and mind.[/QUOTE]
Do you have a single fact to back that up? Besides,
[QUOTE]Even though it has the same chemical processes as you, and the same thoughts and memories, it's not you.[/QUOTE]
Which isn't even an argument when it has never been done and relies on the above premise. Hint: You don't draw evidence from conclusions.
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