Obama's jobs bill blocked in Senate vote - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Ridge;32754936]Are you like six goddamned years old? I'll meet you at the flag pole at 3 o'clock, if that's what you want. The bill hasn't been killed, it hasn't been destroyed, they just want to take part in the sole job they have, which is to discuss a bill at hand before blindly voting it. They're not as dim-witted as people like Nancy Pelosi, who believe that we should pass a bill into law, then find out what the hell it does.[/QUOTE] I honestly had to check your IP and make sure you weren't Glaber even so, I honestly hope that there's some intent to discuss this, but what reason on this god forsaken earth is there to delay something that fixes all of these extreme problems

[QUOTE=yawmwen;32754922]Which is alright. Those are mostly the only jobs the government can create anyways. The economic theory behind it is that it gives money to otherwise unemployed people, who then spend the money at stores and shit. That increase in demand causes a store or corporation to be able to expand and hire more workers. It is sort of like using a defribulator, you give a single shock to the heart and the heart does the rest of the work. Or you give a single spike to demand and the economy starts doing the rest of the work, in theory.[/QUOTE] But stores cannot expand because the housing and property markets are still shit, more and more jobs are being shipped overseas, and there's no guarantee the money "created" by this "spike" would even stay in the US economy. Isn't it feasible that a construction worker or teacher who just got a job after a prolonged period of unemployment (who don't even make that much to begin with) would be more likely to "live below their means?" Even if, let's say, a teacher who gets a job just because of this bill decides to splurge on a nice new Sony TV, whose to say that profit won't go towards hiring more sweatshop workers in South Korea?

[QUOTE=daijitsu;32754663] [b]What would the American Jobs Act have accomplished? The bill would have reduced the deficit by $6 billion over ten years, according to the Congressional Budget Office. The Republicans filibustered deficit reduction. The bill would have created nearly two million new jobs. The Republicans filibustered the creation of two million new jobs. The bill would have increased the gross domestic product (GDP) by two points. The Republicans filibustered increasing the GDP. The bill would have cut taxes for 98 percent of businesses. The Republicans filibustered a tax cut for businesses. The bill would have offered a tax credit for military veterans returning from war. The Republicans filibustered a tax credit for the troops. The bill would have reduced unemployment by a full percentage point. The Republicans filibustered a reduction in unemployment. The bill would have been paid for by a 5.6 percent surtax on millionaires -- a surtax that, again, a majority of Republican voters support. The Republicans filibustered paying for the bill.[/b] [/QUOTE] A rather dramatic accusation, and frankly putting it this way is just as dumb as redneck conservatives accusing Obama of wanting to destroy the States. How many of the jobs created would be permanent? And for that matter, how many jobs did Obama create compared to the number he promised? This bill might sound like the answer to all our problems, but people also felt that way about the stimulus Bush signed in 08, which is now looked at in a much more realistic light now that the money is spent and gone.

[QUOTE=daijitsu;32754984]I honestly had to check your IP and make sure you weren't Glaber even so, I honestly hope that there's some intent to discuss this, but what reason on this god forsaken earth is there to delay something that fixes all of these extreme problems[/QUOTE] Because the fix is temporary. It's another huge spending bill that will have a temporary benefit, and then in a year or two, we'll be at this exact spot again.

[url]http://www.scribd.com/doc/64725696/American-Jobs-Act-Final[/url] In case anyone likes to read the bill.

[QUOTE=daijitsu;32754984]I honestly had to check your IP and make sure you weren't Glaber even so, I honestly hope that there's some intent to discuss this, but what reason on this god forsaken earth is there to delay something that fixes all of these extreme problems[/QUOTE] There's a difference between Ridge and Glaber. Ridge actually responds to valid arguments. [editline]13th October 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=Ridge;32755006]Because the fix is temporary. It's another huge spending bill that will have a temporary benefit, and then in a year or two, we'll be at this exact spot again.[/QUOTE] In a year or two there will also be different people sitting in the Senate.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;32754922]Which is alright. Those are mostly the only jobs the government can create anyways. The economic theory behind it is that it gives money to otherwise unemployed people, who then spend the money at stores and shit. That increase in demand causes a store or corporation to be able to expand and hire more workers. It is sort of like using a defribulator, you give a single shock to the heart and the heart does the rest of the work. Or you give a single spike to demand and the economy starts doing the rest of the work, in theory.[/QUOTE] Jobs are always good, temporary or prolonged, the only issue is that this isn't just free jobs, this act needs to be paid for, and with the huge amount of debt we've accumulated some would argue it's not a great time to be giving small shops 2 million bi-monthly customers. I really can't say whether or not I support this until I see how they plan on paying for it. The bill itself sounds absolutely fucking fantastic, but you need to remember there's a pricetag on whatever product you're excited for.

[QUOTE=areolop;32754958]I think its time for me to get a passport and a visa to Canada. Since we cannot get a damn thing done here without someone being really fucking stupid not to look past the parties and actually see the common good in this.[/QUOTE] You could do that, or you could fight. Not enough people in this country fight, we've all become too complacent with our comforts to realize the only way things are going to remain comfortable is if we fight to keep our comfort. The OccupyWallStreet protests are a fantastic start, but even then we need more people to fight on every front to protect our freedoms. If we all decide to quit and leave the country, then they win. They get to continue screwing over the nation and the world entire, and everybody you left behind will continue to suffer, all because you refused to fight. We must all fight collectively, otherwise nothing will change and we'll all continue to suffer for decades to come.

[QUOTE=Nikota;32755009]There's a difference between Ridge and Glaber. Ridge actually responds to valid arguments. [editline]13th October 2011[/editline] In a year or two there will also be different people sitting in the Senate.[/QUOTE] Different people on which side of the aisle? There will also be different people in the House, and potentially a different person in the White House.

[QUOTE=Kopimi;32754913]Yeah but temporary construction projects aren't really a solution to the jobs issue, just a delay.[/QUOTE] Better than relentlessly insisting that lowering all taxes and deregulating every industry is going to create jobs. They might be temporary, but tax incentives for companies that hire chronic unemployed and some job opportunities for the "labourer" class like construction workers would be great right now.

[url]http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/biden-warns-more-rapes-and-murders-if-jobs-bill-not-passed_595784.html[/url] ------- ....And the bullshit coninues from our Vice President. Way to stay Classy Biden.

[QUOTE=Ridge;32755042]Different people on which side of the aisle? There will also be different people in the House, and potentially a [b]different person in the White House.[/b][/QUOTE] It's not going to happen. There's not a single GOP/Republican candidate that's competent enough to lead. The smartest person there is Ron Paul and I only say that because he has a medical background. Ron Paul would be a terrible leader.

[QUOTE=Kopimi;32755029]Jobs are always good, temporary or prolonged, the only issue is that this isn't just free jobs, this act needs to be paid for, and with the huge amount of debt we've accumulated some would argue it's not a great time to be giving small shops 2 million bi-monthly customers. I really can't say whether or not I support this until I see how they plan on paying for it. The bill itself sounds absolutely fucking fantastic, but you need to remember there's a pricetag on whatever product you're excited for.[/QUOTE] They've already said how they're going to pay for it. Let the Bush Tax Cuts expire and couple that extra revenue with a 5% surtax on millionaires or wealthier.

[QUOTE=Megafanx13;32755076]Better than relentlessly insisting that lowering all taxes and deregulating every industry is going to create jobs. They might be temporary, but tax incentives for companies that hire chronic unemployed and some job opportunities for the "labourer" class like construction workers would be great right now.[/QUOTE] The question is, will they? It's an employer's market right now. They can choose to ignore people that are a good fit for a position because they've been unemployed for too long. What says this won't continue to happen? And that is ignoring the fact that most of the money goes to teachers and construction, which a fairly small percentage of the unemployed actually have the knowledge and skills needed to do the job.

[QUOTE=Wrathborne;32755095][url]http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/biden-warns-more-rapes-and-murders-if-jobs-bill-not-passed_595784.html[/url] ------- ....And the bullshit coninues from our Vice President. Way to stay Classy Biden.[/QUOTE] He was in Flint, Michigan. Not exactly a place known for employment or low crime rate.

[QUOTE=Wrathborne;32755095][url]http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/biden-warns-more-rapes-and-murders-if-jobs-bill-not-passed_595784.html[/url] ------- ....And the bullshit coninues from our Vice President. Way to stay Classy Biden.[/QUOTE] He indirectly said it at best, implying more the idea that if funding gets dropped for police and firefighters that crime, and specifically violent crime, will go up.

[QUOTE=Megafanx13;32755076]Better than relentlessly insisting that lowering all taxes and deregulating every industry is going to create jobs. They might be temporary, but [b]tax incentives for companies that hire chronic unemployed and some job opportunities for the "labourer" class like construction workers would be great right now.[/b][/QUOTE] I totally agree, all I'm saying is that people should keep in mind that the 2 million jobs aren't permanent, well paying desk jobs, they're temporary construction jobs. [QUOTE=Wrathborne;32755095][url]http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/biden-warns-more-rapes-and-murders-if-jobs-bill-not-passed_595784.html[/url] ------- ....And the bullshit coninues from our Vice President. Way to stay Classy Biden.[/QUOTE] Biden is literally the worst Vice President ever

[QUOTE=Nikota;32755097]It's not going to happen. There's not a single GOP/Republican candidate that's competent enough to lead. The smartest person there is Ron Paul and I only say that because he has a medical background. Ron Paul would be a terrible leader.[/QUOTE] At least he stands for the old Republican Party, the one before Christian fundamentalists hijacked it and used it to push their own agenda. Regardless of how competent of a leader he is, I'd rather have him than any of the other children that the Republican Party picked out of their pre-school.

[QUOTE=daijitsu;32754984]I honestly had to check your IP and make sure you weren't Glaber even so, I honestly hope that there's some intent to discuss this, but what reason on this god forsaken earth is there to delay something that fixes all of these extreme problems[/QUOTE] really? You had to check to see that he wasn't me? In any case, in relation to the "jobs" bill, this was expected. [url=http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/daily/2011/10/12/ap_headline_makes_me_look_like_nostradamus_senate_republicans_vote_to_kill_obama_s_jobs_bill]AP Headline Makes [RUSH] Look like Nostradamus: "Senate Republicans Vote to Kill Obama's Jobs Bill‎"[/url]

[QUOTE=Megafanx13;32755101]They've already said how they're going to pay for it. Let the Bush Tax Cuts expire and couple that extra revenue with a 5% surtax on millionaires or wealthier.[/QUOTE] They plan to spend in 1 year what they say will be paid for over 10 goddamned years of tax cuts. Bullshit statements like that should not be allowed. The man who makes those statements is long since retired when it comes time to see if he was right. There is no accountability.

[QUOTE=Wrathborne;32755095][url]http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/biden-warns-more-rapes-and-murders-if-jobs-bill-not-passed_595784.html[/url] ------- ....And the bullshit coninues from our Vice President. Way to stay Classy Biden.[/QUOTE] [t]http://filesmelt.com/dl/ha4.png[/t] Great source.

[QUOTE=Glaber;32755142]really? You had to check to see that he wasn't me? In any case, in relation to the "jobs" bill, this was expected. [url=http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/daily/2011/10/12/ap_headline_makes_me_look_like_nostradamus_senate_republicans_vote_to_kill_obama_s_jobs_bill]AP Headline Makes Me[RUSH] Look like Nostradamus: "Senate Republicans Vote to Kill Obama's Jobs Bill‎"[/url][/QUOTE] I'd rephrase that link. They're going to think you personally are Rush Limbaugh, and all hell will break loose.

[QUOTE=StormHammer;32755000]A rather dramatic accusation, and frankly putting it this way is just as dumb as redneck conservatives accusing Obama of wanting to destroy the States. How many of the jobs created would be permanent? And for that matter, how many jobs did Obama create compared to the number he promised? This bill might sound like the answer to all our problems, but people also felt that way about the stimulus Bush signed in 08, which is now looked at in a much more realistic light now that the money is spent and gone.[/QUOTE] it's pretty cold cut as "THIS FIXES EVERYTHING AND IS PERFECT", but with any political news it's usually presented by someone with a loyalty to one side or another. Go figure. still, there's too much being trampled for too little reason, even given recent past with this senate that throws hissy fits and doesn't let anyone have their way. [QUOTE=Ridge;32755042]Different people on which side of the aisle? There will also be different people in the House, and potentially a different person in the White House.[/QUOTE] that was a terrible attempt at turning that around [QUOTE=Nikota;32755009]There's a difference between Ridge and Glaber. Ridge actually responds to valid arguments.[/QUOTE] does he actually respond with something valid, or is it just uninformed dry political jargon? seems to have potential

[QUOTE=Ridge;32755117]The question is, will they? It's an employer's market right now. They can choose to ignore people that are a good fit for a position because they've been unemployed for too long. What says this won't continue to happen? And that is ignoring the fact that most of the money goes to teachers and construction, which a fairly small percentage of the unemployed actually have the knowledge and skills needed to do the job.[/QUOTE] Look, either they hire unemployed or they don't, but at least there would be some incentive to do so. Again I ask, what is the alternative plan? Lower taxes across the board? Deregulate all industry? How in the name of god is that going to create jobs on a level anywhere near tax incentives directly for lowering unemployment and putting lower-class jobs back into action?

[QUOTE=Nikota;32755157][t]http://filesmelt.com/dl/ha4.png[/t] Great source.[/QUOTE] Web advertising nowadays is usually based more on your surfing habits. What does that say about YOU?

[QUOTE=Fhenexx;32755041]You could do that, or you could fight. Not enough people in this country fight, we've all become too complacent with our comforts to realize the only way things are going to remain comfortable is if we fight to keep our comfort. The OccupyWallStreet protests are a fantastic start, but even then we need more people to fight on every front to protect our freedoms. If we all decide to quit and leave the country, then they win. They get to continue screwing over the nation and the world entire, and everybody you left behind will continue to suffer, all because you refused to fight. We must all fight collectively, otherwise nothing will change and we'll all continue to suffer for decades to come.[/QUOTE] I kind of want to start a riot and take over congress but, I dont see a legal way of doing such a thing.

[QUOTE=Fhenexx;32755138]At least he stands for the old Republican Party, the one before Christian fundamentalists hijacked it and used it to push their own agenda. Regardless of how competent of a leader he is, I'd rather have him than any of the other children that the Republican Party picked out of their pre-school.[/QUOTE] I would honestly rather have...actually none of them. Still. Having state rights be a top priority is just the most fucked up thing.

[QUOTE=Atlascore;32755098]After this hits major news networks and newspapers? Somewhere between 50%-80% Democrats and another 4 years for Obama. All the average person is going to hear is "Republicans stopped bill that would have created tons of jobs and cut taxes"[/QUOTE] Optimistic thinking. Fox News, Rush Limbaugh, all of them always find a way to twist facts and make every single scenario look like a Democratic blunder.

[QUOTE=Ridge;32755175]Web advertising nowadays is usually based more on your surfing habits. What does that say about YOU?[/QUOTE] Look to the right. That look any bit racist? [editline]13th October 2011[/editline] I can go to their website and pull up more racist shit but I dont want to give them ad money.

[QUOTE=Ridge;32755175]Web advertising nowadays is usually based more on your surfing habits. What does that say about YOU?[/QUOTE] Apparently I'm a single mom then, because I need a whole lot of tampons and candles according to my local advertisements [QUOTE=Nikota;32755194]Look to the right. That look any bit racist? [editline]13th October 2011[/editline] I can go to their website and pull up more racist shit but I dont want to give them ad money.[/QUOTE] I don't see anything racist.