Valve pulls "Kill the Faggot" from Steam Greenlight - Polidicks

[QUOTE=dedo678;47659304]The game is trying to offend people, that's the point. Why it passed Greenlight is beyond me but his mission was successful as you can plainly see from this thread.[/QUOTE] what did it do other than get people to think this guy is an arsehole

[QUOTE=.Lain;47659522]what did it do other than get people to think this guy is an arsehole[/QUOTE] [quote]2. Originally this was only going to be a part of the other game, but I decided to release it on Greenlight to see people's reactions. The reason behind this particular game is because of how tired I am of people being overly sensitive and how easily offended people are by every little thing, especially with LGBT issues. I have worked in the game industry since 2007, so I know that's how the game industry pretty much is. I didn't make this game to attack LGBT people personally, but I made this game just to piss off those people that are way too sensitive, which includes straight people. These people that think if you are even remotely homophobic, you are "hateful" and a "bigot", and do everything they can to destroy you in every vicious way possible.. So I decided to go down a path that most developers are afraid to go down: to piss these people off by making the most overly offensive game possible to these idiots to prove a point. The point being that a crappy made video game would offend people so much. I mean so offended that people will waste all their time posting on forums, redit, etc of how disgusted they are, offended, how much everyone involved in the game should die, and even getting into large debates over it of how worthless and evil we are, etc. Lots of people are sending very vicious and disgusting emails as well, and it just proves that my mission was accomplished in pissing off these people, and how many of these sick people in the gaming world there are that would wish all kinds of physical harm on me. I mean come on, its just a crappy made video game made by a no-name developer. Why do you care so much? It's obvious no one in their right mind would take this game seriously. If someone made a "Kill all straight white people game", I would totally play it and have a laugh, as seeing it wasn't made to be serious. Keep sending all the threats and hate mail though, its a fun read, and proves you have no time on your hands.[/quote] [quote]6. As for an apology. Ain't gonna happen. To everyone that got overly offended. Good, thats what we were going for. Just wait for our next game we are working on, its gonna be way more offensive as this one.[/quote] Proved what a [I]BADASS[/I] they are

So basically, the game is just [I]"Let's make a """"satirically"""" homophobic game to offend people, then laugh at them!"[/I]? Is it somehow ridiculous that people don't like homophobia...? Like, I don't get the point, unless this guy is a homophobe himself why would he think that being offended over what appears to be a violently homophobic game is something to laugh at?

This reminds me so much of this shit(as in the taliban thinking they totally owned them in this episode) [video=youtube;DX5MTFWSuM8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DX5MTFWSuM8[/video]

[QUOTE=_Axel;47659194]I don't really see how that makes much of a difference. Killing people vs killing a specific kind of people? If anything it reduces the amount of potential victims. Applying real life moral logic to fictional media is only going to net ridiculous statements. If you don't have a problem with video game murder why would you be bothered with other, equally morally fucked up shit being depicted in fiction? This isn't the same thing as news media presenting hateful rhetoric as facts, or activist groups stating bigoted shit. You can call this game bad, tasteless, insensitive, offensive, but to label it as hate speech misses the point of fiction in the first place. Events that take place in it don't necessarily correspond with the author's opinion.[/QUOTE] Well for one, this one targets a very specific group of people which puts it on the same level as hate speech. Hatred doesn't target any specific group at all and does nothing that other games haven't done before. Tons of games allow you to kill whoever you want and they didn't receive this kind of attention. What about Hotline Miami? When I look at Hatred I see that top-down perspective, I see that gore (HM is pixelated but still gore), and I see a guy killing people because he can.

[QUOTE='[Seed Eater];47658072']that's not any better, that's just broadening the "hate speech" except that it's a game meant to be played for entertainment. other than turning mass murder into entertainment, it doesn't take it lightly. I can mostly agree with this because you're right, but I don't really believe that turning it into a joke is any better than playing it deadpan for entertainment purposes. Frankly the over the top silliness and low production value of this game is less threatening to me than the mostly serious, edgy nature of Hatred. I mean, there are people who legit think like the character of Hatred, and there are people who have acted on that and I'd gander there will be again in the future. Glorify that isn't good. This game isn't good either for the same reasons. I still don't see how Hatred gets a free pass from gamers when it practically embodies the stigma that gamers received throughout eh 90s and early 2000s following Columbine and the media frenzy about GTA. But whatever. If we as a community are fine with drawing arbitrary lines around who it's ok to indiscriminately kill for entertainment and for what reasons, that's fine, as long as it makes it clear that the deaths are realistic and painful as opposed to silly and stereotypical then it's accepted by the community.[/QUOTE] So go get almost all video games that have you play a murderer(most violent games) pulled then, you clearly think you have the right to deputize yourself for the moral decisions of everyone.

If the devs wanted to kill faggots so bad, why don't they kill themselves? :~) No but in all seriousness, I can't believe this even was let on to begin with. I mean, it doesn't even look fun. There's no fucking interest to it other than shock value.

[QUOTE=shozamar;47658328]Well obviously, but what he did was still morally fucked. Trying to prove an entirely unrelated point by being unbelievably horrible to a particular, already fucked over demographic? Bullshit. He cares so much about how a subsection of an online videogame store is regulated that he's willing to fake hate speech (which sounds the same as real hate speech to everyone but the speaker). It's just pathetic. Basically, if you dislike Valve's regulation, fine. Email them, start a petition, whatever. Just don't reel the gay and transgender community in and meaninglessly target them just to prove an unrelated point.[/QUOTE] It's hardly meaningless. How else are you gonna make that point?

this is not something that should be greenlit and stands testament as to how the greenlight system is inerently flawed but it's fucking hilarious all the same. i cracked up at "aids carrier eliminated".

the best thing about this game is the level of butthurt it caused

[QUOTE=IceWarrior98;47659683]Well for one, this one targets a very specific group of people which puts it on the same level as hate speech. Hatred doesn't target any specific group at all and does nothing that other games haven't done before. Tons of games allow you to kill whoever you want and they didn't receive this kind of attention. What about Hotline Miami? When I look at Hatred I see that top-down perspective, I see that gore (HM is pixelated but still gore), and I see a guy killing people because he can.[/QUOTE] How does 'targeting' a very specific group of people automatically makes it hate speech? If you don't take virtual murder seriously in any mainstream game why should you when it targets a specific subset of people? There's a rampage mission for Trevor in GTA V where you have to kill rednecks, and another where you kill hipsters. Does the fact these target a specific kind of person make Rockstar a hate-speech-spouting, bigot company?

hipsters and rednecks aren't protected demographics and can't be objectively defined in the first place saying you hate gay people obviously carries a lot more weight than saying you hate hipsters what's the point in so obviously just dancing around the fact that this is hate speech?

[QUOTE=.Lain;47660387]hipsters aren't a protected demographic and can't be objectively defined, nor can a redneck saying you hate gay people obviously carries a lot more weight than saying you hate hipsters[/QUOTE] And the developers of this game have said neither, so I don't see how that's relevant. The whole point is that you can't attribute beliefs on media authors merely based on the fiction they write. I also don't see why being a 'protected demographic' should have any bearing on the situation. You shouldn't have to be officially recognized by the state to be respected as a person, which is why [I]in real life[/I] any form of hateful speech that calls for violence or negative behavior against people based on their appearance, race, culture or the trends they follow shouldn't be the norm. Saying you hate gay people carries just as much weight as saying you hate hipsters, in both case you are arbitrarily hateful against people because of choices or characteristics that only affect themselves. Why should we classify who gets to be 'protected' and who shouldn't based on those very characteristics?

[QUOTE=_Axel;47660442] Saying you hate gay people carries just as much weight as saying you hate hipsters, in both case you are arbitrarily hateful against people because of choices or characteristics that only affect themselves.[/QUOTE] okay first of all, gay people don't choose to be gay hipsters are a culture piece, not a demographic in any way near the same as homosexual people and how does the former not carry more weight than the latter??

[QUOTE=.Lain;47660481]okay first of all, gay people don't choose to be gay hipsters are a culture piece, not a demographic in any way near the same as homosexual people[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=_Axel;47660442]Saying you hate gay people carries just as much weight as saying you hate hipsters, in both case you are arbitrarily hateful against people because of choices [B]or characteristics[/B] that only affect themselves.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE]and how does the former not carry more weight than the latter??[/QUOTE] Because your lifestyle or culture choices are yours alone and don't affect others, why should we only protect people who don't have a choice being who they are? If gay people actually chose to be gay, would that make hate speech against them any more justifiable?

if we're going to be technical, no? but that's how society works. we pick and choose and define things on a scale. you're being incredibly awkward just for the sake of it one's sexual preference, something very basic to humanity, is far more important in society than your choice of clothing or musical choices i mean, you could say that the scenes in GTA V are very tasteless, and many wouldn't disagree! but that doesn't make 'Kill the Faggot' not hate speech

[QUOTE=.Lain;47660506]if we're going to be technical, no? but that's how society works. we pick and choose and define things on a scale. you're being incredibly awkward just for the sake of it[/QUOTE] So you're justifying arbitrary defense of some demographics and not others by saying it's just the way things are. That doesn't seem like much of an argument and I doubt you'd agree with it if I used it to justify common bigoted stuff. I don't even see what the point of your last sentence is. I'm being awkward by answering your questions? [editline]5th May 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=.Lain;47660506]i mean, you could say that the scenes in GTA V are very tasteless, and many wouldn't disagree! but that doesn't make 'Kill the Faggot' not hate speech[/QUOTE] What criteria make it hate speech and not GTA V? Both are fictional works and aren't supposed to reflect the views of the authors. [editline]5th May 2015[/editline] [QUOTE]one's sexual preference, something very basic to humanity, is far more important in society than your choice of clothing or musical choices[/QUOTE] Yet that doesn't make it any more right to enact hate speech against people who wear certain clothes? Both demographics don't deserve to be arbitrarily hated. Should we only protect those who are harassed for criteria you deem 'important'? Picking on someone for reasons that don't even affect the bully is unjustifiable either way, so why is that reason relevant when it's of no importance? Their pretext for picking on certain demographics is literally just that, a pretext.

[QUOTE=_Axel;47660442]And the developers of this game have said neither, so I don't see how that's relevant. The whole point is that you can't attribute beliefs on media authors merely based on the fiction they write. I also don't see why being a 'protected demographic' should have any bearing on the situation. You shouldn't have to be officially recognized by the state to be respected as a person, which is why [I]in real life[/I] any form of hateful speech that calls for violence or negative behavior against people based on their appearance, race, culture or the trends they follow shouldn't be the norm. Saying you hate gay people carries just as much weight as saying you hate hipsters, in both case you are arbitrarily hateful against people because of choices or characteristics that only affect themselves. Why should we classify who gets to be 'protected' and who shouldn't based on those very characteristics?[/QUOTE] I think you are seeing a message here that isnt. This has nothing to do with separating the author and his work. This has never been a point they were trying to make. [editline]4th May 2015[/editline] There was a clear intent in them picking homosexuals as a target dude. Bullying hipsters or even cripples does not evoke the same amount of wrath as "killin some fags" does and that precisely shows how easy, and unimportant this criticism that this game tried to convey was. They said absolutely nothing about anything.

[QUOTE=Starlight 456;47659576]So basically, the game is just [I]"Let's make a """"satirically"""" homophobic game to offend people, then laugh at them!"[/I]? Is it somehow ridiculous that people don't like homophobia...? Like, I don't get the point, unless this guy is a homophobe himself why would he think that being offended over what appears to be a violently homophobic game is something to laugh at?[/QUOTE] I don't really think so. Just follow me for a second here: According to his statement, I see it more as a social experiment to show just how far people will go to purge anything they deem offensive from society. I mean think about it, it's a game that: 1) Is crapplily made. 2) Has a no-name developer. 3) Nobody is forced to buy or play. So why all of the outrage against him? This does not affect anyone else but those who made it or those who play it. If a person is neither of these, why should they even care? And what gives people the right to send threats and try to destroy their career? In the end, that's what he was trying to point out, and successfully so. Look at how many people who would never even play the game, much less own it, are calling for it not to exist. Look at how many people who would never play this game are saying that it should never be allowed to be on steam. You say that he was just trying to offend people to laugh at them, when it's not the whole story. The reason he laughs at them is because they did exactly what he thought they would. Instead of just saying "I choose not to buy or play this game.", they've taken it up a notch by sending hate mail and threats in an attempt to force him to stop producing something they aren't even interested in. I'm not trying to condone any type of hatred, but as a social experiment, it worked pretty well.

And you know damn well (at least I hope) that not everyone can be loved equally. That's not the point of these campaigns for tolerance. Not everyone can be loved equally, but we can definitely avoid hating irrationally. Marginalization happens and that won't change.

[QUOTE=Take_Opal;47660691]I think you are seeing a message here that isnt. This has nothing to do with separating the author and his work. This has never been a point they were trying to make. [editline]4th May 2015[/editline] There was a clear intent in them picking homosexuals as a target dude. Bullying hipsters or even cripples does not evoke the same amount of wrath as "killin some fags" does and that precisely shows how easy, and unimportant this criticism that this game tried to convey was. They said absolutely nothing about anything.[/QUOTE] And why should a game about "killing some fags" evoke more wrath than a game about "killing some hipsters"? You say that's the case but you don't state any reason for that. If someone were to encourage others to 'kill all hipsters!' he should be punished for it just as much as he would be if he attacked gay people instead. [editline]5th May 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=Take_Opal;47660746]And you know damn well (at least I hope) that not everyone can be loved equally. That's not the point of these campaigns for tolerance. Not everyone can be loved equally, but we can definitely avoid hating irrationally. Marginalization happens and that won't change.[/QUOTE] But hating people for being hipsters is just as irrational as hating people for being gay. There's no substantial difference yet one is apparently considered hate speech and not the other.

[QUOTE=Korova;47657028]No, but seriously I can't decide what's more offensive, the content or the fact that someone took the time to make such a shit game based on one terribly unfunny "joke". [/QUOTE] Sorry but you are the livestock that fueled this game, your reactions, your 'offendedness' and all helped the developer achieve his goal.

Ah yes, the "limits of free speech" argument, it comes around often here on FP. You'd be better off coming to a peaceful resolution now because this is one for the ages.

Hating both is stupid, but there has never been a history of documented genocide against dudes in plaid with The Decemberists on their MP3 player like there has been for homosexuals dude. You're being a full of idiot.

[QUOTE=_Axel;47660753]And why should a game about "killing some fags" evoke more wrath than a game about "killing some hipsters"? You say that's the case but you don't state any reason for that. If someone were to encourage others to 'kill all hipsters!' he should be punished for it just as much as he would be if he attacked gay people instead. [editline]5th May 2015[/editline] But hating people for being hipsters is just as irrational as hating people for being gay. There's no substantial difference yet one is apparently considered hate speech and not the other.[/QUOTE] People choose to be hipsters, people don't choose to be gay.

It'll be out on Origin soon

[QUOTE=Take_Opal;47660781]Hating both is stupid, but there has never been a history of documented genocide against dudes in plaid with The Decemberists on their MP3 player like there has been for homosexuals dude. You're being a full of idiot.[/QUOTE] If someone is being harassed for choosing a certain lifestyle he's as much a victim as someone who's harassed for being gay, and should be protected just the same. Again, the 'reason' bullies pick on others for is meaningless, it doesn't matter if the pathetic excuse they use to do it has been used before to justify atrocities, what matters is the victims who are being harmed for doing something that only affects them. Why does everything have to devolve in some sort of victim contest when we could just prevent undue harassment altogether? Do we have to keep tabs on how many people are massacred for such and such arbitrary reason, just to know whether inciting violence against them is hate speech? That's like saying spouting hate against white people is not racism because they weren't exploited as much as other peoples. You don't get to change the definitions of words just to force your arbitrary conditions in.

[QUOTE=Korova;47657131]But Hatred isn't hate speech.[/QUOTE] isn't that the game that has at least one neo-nazi as a developer?

[QUOTE=Levithan;47660874]isn't that the game that has at least one neo-nazi as a developer?[/QUOTE] I believe it was disproved, he was just a heavy metal fan or something like that. [editline]5th May 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=matt000024;47660784]People choose to be hipsters, people don't choose to be gay.[/QUOTE] So calling for the death of, say, communists like I'm sure has happened during the cold war isn't hate speech because they themselves chose their political stance?

kill all jews its ok because being jewish is a choice