[QUOTE=gokiyono;41883463]How on earth can a game be objectively bad?[/QUOTE]
Well, actually, a game [I]can[/I] be objectively bad. It just has to be literally unplayable. And not the kind of literally that's used as a superlative; [I]literally[/I] literal.
So like, if it can't start at all because it needs to connect to servers which aren't online.
That's too bad, it sounded like a really interesting premise.
[QUOTE=SweetSwifter;41883529]Well, to be frank, all the things you mentioned as examples can be found in Minecraft.
I think you're looking at game-design as if it's a rigid set of rules that must be followed to the absolute for any game to be classed as being well-designed. I personally don't think this is true.
I respect you for having a strong opinion and willing to voice it even in the face of mass-adversity. Especially in the 3D art thread, although the adversity isn't there, at least you give good critique generally. But in this case I think you're purely looking at rulebooks and documentation of older games and simply compare what those games had, and what Minecraft has.
I'll definitely check out critical-gaming.com. I've googled Richard Terrell, but couldn't find any games released by him. Don't get me wrong, I'm not one of those people that believe that 'if you judge something you have to be really good at said something'. But I do think that if he had any game releases, it'd be a good few extra points to his credibility.[/QUOTE]
he doesn't make games, he's really weird and the theory is what hes most passionate about
i wouldnt say that im lookin at it from a rigid standpoint either, im looking at it from the point of depth in the interaction with what the game designer creates. in that regard, minecraft has complexity (vast amount of blocks, nearly infinite unique worlds, etc) but it doesn't have depth without the depth that players create inside it. that works for a pure sandbox, but the game has no longevity playing on your own and that's where it fails most
[QUOTE=DOG-GY;41883479]because there is a vast amount of structure and theory which define the analysis and design of games[/QUOTE]
then why can't amazing, truly amazing games be made in a factorial sense then if they're so easily and readily defined in all conditions with no flex in those rules.
Your statement that you're objectively right because you've studied game design is ridiculous to me. If you studied film in the 1960's Italy you'd understand italian neo realist film. You wouldn't understand the theory of all films. You wouldn't have an infallible strutcture that films follow. Video game design, you're telling me is so fully understood, such an easy task that we can now safely say we understand games at a perfect theoretical level?
Notch should release his next game under a false name to prevent unnecessary hype
[QUOTE=DOG-GY;41883572]he doesn't make games, he's really weird and the theory is what hes most passionate about
i wouldnt say that im lookin at it from a rigid standpoint either, im looking at it from the point of depth in the interaction with what the game designer creates. in that regard, minecraft has complexity (vast amount of blocks, nearly infinite unique worlds, etc) but it doesn't have depth without the depth that players create inside it. that works for a pure sandbox, [B]but the game has no longevity playing on your own and that's where it fails most[/B][/QUOTE]
isn't that a large assumption?
[QUOTE=DOG-GY;41883572]he doesn't make games, he's really weird and the theory is what hes most passionate about
i wouldnt say that im lookin at it from a rigid standpoint either, im looking at it from the point of depth in the interaction with what the game designer creates. in that regard, minecraft has complexity (vast amount of blocks, nearly infinite unique worlds, etc) but it doesn't have depth without the depth that players create inside it. that works for a pure sandbox, but the game has no longevity playing on your own and that's where it fails most[/QUOTE]
Then the theories he created are untested, basically? If he has never made a game using the theories he developed, then that's indeed the case, no? Just making sure, that is all.
I believe Minecraft has all the depths players bestow upon it, like with most sandboxes. If a player wants to make a town that can function, they can. If they want to make a fortress with strategic defensible points, they can.
There's a few metric tons of games that have no longevity, but it doesn't mean the four-six hour experience wasn't worth it and that the game is immediately bad. Minecraft has multi-player for a reason, and offers further gameplay. I myself haven't touched the game in over a year, but before that I had a lot of fun with it, both on my own and with other people on servers. I wouldn't put it near my top ten of favorite games, but for the game it was I had a lot of fun hours with it, and a lot of fun experiences. That for me makes it a successful game. Not perfect, but very fun.
[QUOTE=Kirbunny431;41883254]This post...there's just so much wrong with it...it hurts...[/QUOTE]
Okay, list what's wrong with it then, because from what I can see, it's all correct.
Notch pretty much got incredibly lucky and won the lottery. He made a tech demo at the right time and place. Nothing wrong with that really, good for him.
Notch always seemed most at home during jams. He can prototype a new and fun game in no time at all. Minecraft basically turned too big, which led him out of his comfort (and interest) zone, which resulted in, what I find, poor design choices near the game's release.
He says himself that Minecraft is a fluke and knows he'll never reproduce the game's success, yet his fans and the press will watch and judge his every move. Not the greatest position to be in creatively.
[QUOTE=Steve Harvey;41883257]remember when facepunch was a hivemind??????????
oh right it wasnt[/QUOTE]
I am aware of this, but it's just fun to look back on old minecraft threads and see posts what would right now get filled with agrees get disagrees and dumbs.
If i had 10+ million dollars i wouldnt have much inspiration to work on things either
you're talking like notch actually sat down and said "i want to make an AAA quality video game and have it reveilled by the masses"
no, you stupid pricks, he was just a scandinavian dude that decided to make a video game and - [i]wow[/i] - a bunch of people liked it and it got really really popular. learn the difference
Minecraft is horribly unfinished, horribly unoptimized, and horribly unpolished, but it still brought me more hours of fun than most games could ever come close to.
I remember when Minecraft appeared back in May of 2009 as this blocky lego type game and I thought "oh this is kinda cool"
Then over time the game became a survival thing and it was still cool.
Then when they added shit like enchanting and hunger, the game became too big and it all felt too much.
[QUOTE=simkas;41883175]Notch made this in a week instead:
[url]http://shambles.notch.net/[/url]
And honestly it's the first game by notch that I had interest playing.[/QUOTE]
Pretty awesome actually.
[QUOTE=DOG-GY;41883155]just because people have fun with a piece of shit doesn't mean its not a piece of shit, it just means they don't recognize good game design and disregard that they got a quarter finished game.[/QUOTE]
I'm relatively certain I've read this word for word in an image about /v/.
[QUOTE=DOG-GY;41883043]good i hope he never makes another game, minecraft was the poorest excuse for a finished product ive ever seen and i dont want his shitty work ethic to spawn another terrible game[/QUOTE]
Fucking hilarious. It's not even finished, it's still going on I believe. But then again. I stopped playing it because it got too fucking boring for me.
[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;41883074]What the hell is this man DOING?
He literally does nothing at all. Geez, he's like me on summer break, only all the time.[/QUOTE]
If you won the lottery, would you go back to work the next day?
[QUOTE=Coffee;41883804]I remember when Minecraft appeared back in May of 2009 as this blocky lego type game and I thought "oh this is kinda cool"
Then over time the game became a survival thing and it was still cool.
Then when they added shit like enchanting and hunger, the game became too big and it all felt too much.[/QUOTE]
I lost a lot of interest in minecraft thanks to that hunger system, really tedious.
[QUOTE=FpShepard;41883176]Remember when you guys used to love Notch and Minecraft :v: ?[/QUOTE]
Remember when Minecraft was an incredibly promising alpha, not a disappointing final product?
He could have done so much with it, but ended up adding a small amount of incredibly mediocre content, and hardly any actual gameplay mechanics to speak of.
[QUOTE=DOG-GY;41883479]because there is a vast amount of structure and theory which define the analysis and design of games[/QUOTE]
I have played a lot of hours of minecraft and enjoyed them, but never in my life have I played a game that felt so incomplete. every aspect of minecraft leaves me wishing there was more to it. I wish the game was optimized properly, I was the world had things to do in it, I wish the mobs served a purpose other than fucking with you when you build your first house, I wish creating/installing/maintaining mods wasn't a complete disaster. I agree with most of your points, and I really wish that someone would pick up where notch left off and make something of the game because we all know jeb is good for absolutely nothing aside from adding useless blocks.
[QUOTE=Steve Harvey;41883257]remember when facepunch was a hivemind??????????
oh right it wasnt[/QUOTE]
remember when the majority opinion was that minecraft was a sick game????
the whole hivemind joke stopped being funny a year ago
[QUOTE=FpShepard;41883176]Remember when you guys used to love Notch and Minecraft :v: ?[/QUOTE]
maybe it's because minecraft was good in its beginnings and we saw potential in it until notch became lazy with time thanks to money and stopped adding good stuff????
Let's turn every slightly notch related thread into a notch and minecraft hivemind hate thread.
The whole "notch is always on vacation" has always been complete BS. During the times of massive vacationing, he really was just taking time to visit his dad, (the only one to really support his game development in his family) who had relapsed into his substance and alcohol abuse. Notch's dad eventually ended up committing suicide.
But Oogala, It's more fun to spin it to make people agree with me!
[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;41883074]What the hell is this man DOING?[/QUOTE]
Jerking off
This is why you don't announce your game until it's well under its way.
I'm quite sad about those news. I kind of knew it would come as he said a few months ago that he hold up the project because it wasn't enough. It's great that he discovered this in proper time and actually admit it.
But I liked the concept though - So I hope somebody can take the idea up properly.
I remember when notch said the minecraft textures were placeholders
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