[QUOTE=Complifused;45925823]I used to think the mods were worse than nazis but looking back on it I was a worse than terrible poster[/QUOTE]
I like strict moderation on facepunch, it encourages actually putting effort into posting, well, by that i mean any effort at all and not going:
"l0l +1"
"omg pwnd noob"
, or even wrose, long post without any kind of interpuction.
I think reddit is shit because it's one big bandwagon actually, suuure there are good subreddits and all, but we are not speaking about them tbh, if shit like that goes on it deserves to die right now.
I still think it's kind of cool how reddit worked, with all subreddits etc, i think that if reddit actually goes down somebody will make a replacement fast, because having possibility to make your own 'subforum' is kind of neat if used properly.
[QUOTE=TurboSax;45925208]A couple of things (lots of text):
First off, insulting everyone by calling them stupid kids is a bad way to start a counterargument, assuming you want people to side with you that is.
Second, sites like FP and even 4chan of all places still have very basic boundaries that they're not willing to cross, despite all the stupid shit posted in various sections of both sites.
For example, 4chan, despite its supposed history of being a haven for CP, actually nukes any of it off the site as soon as a moderator can notice it. Beyond that, a lot of the site besides /b/ has decently-strict guidelines into what is and isn't allowed, and most of the heinous shit you see in the awful subreddits people listed is a no-go on those 4chan boards.
FP also disallows CP, while disallowing a shitload of other unsavory garbage at the same time and having a competent staff that quickly deals with issues. Same deal as 4chan, with specific restrictions in specific places and site-wide bans and specific terrible content types, although FP completely nuked its own version of /b/ a long time ago (not counting Rust section).
With both FP and 4chan, some of the most basic awful content is banned and people are expected to not be terrible in general. With both sites as well, the policing staff are mostly-decentralized, with some hanging around specific areas, but all of them having equal powers and the ability to deal with problems anywhere they're needed. They're also expected to all adhere to the same basic rules and standards of conduct on both sites.
How does this relate to the thoroughly-horrible subreddits being called out? Simple, the subreddits lack a lot of (if not all of) these regulations and standards among staff.
All moderators for a subreddit are added by the owner/other moderators, so the only rules they're obligated to follow are the owner's. That's fine for a standalone website, but not for a section of a massive sectional website with its own overseeing admins, since the subsection owner's opinions should logically be overridden by the full site owners'. Without control from the full site's owners, the moderators can be self-serving assholes all they want, as long as the subreddit owner allows it.
Another thing is that there's no global policing of content, and thus no standards to adhere to for the whole site. It's too big in totality for the global administrators to handle, hence why subreddits each have their own staff groups. However, this allows for a subreddit's staff to be entirely out-of control and working together behind the scenes to allow or censor any content they wish. This results in subreddts that have all kinds of sick, disgusting content that cannot reasonably be policed by global staff, such as child porn, corpse images and rape victim abuse. It also results in mass censorship, as has been seen both recently and in the past.
You might be thinking that the subreddit owners are the bad guys here, and the global site staff are helpless to stop them, right? Wrong. There have been lightning-fast takedowns of entire subreddits previously by global site staff, subreddits which featured this very kind of horrifying and/or highly-illegal content, or which just struck the wrong nerve. They're not incapable of putting a stop to this sort of thing rapidly and effectively on a mass scale, they just don't bother to unless it gets noticed by the wrong people and tarnishes the whole site's reputation.
So as you can see, we have a decentralized moderation system, which allows for mass-nepotism and circlejerking on a level rarely seen, and we also have a total lack of control and regard for legality/good taste on the part of the global admins. It's not unfixable mechanically-speaking, but it's not going to get fixed with this extreme nepotism and apathy going on at both the highest and the lowest levels.
In a way, 4chan and FP are objectively better than Reddit, at least in terms of content policing and staff trustworthiness. With both sites, the staff are at least global and expected to adhere to standards, and there are basic, well-enforced policies in place to prevent the harboring of disgusting and/or illegal content like CP.
Reddit not only lacks both of those elements, it actively subverts them to the point of being a massive, nearly-uncontrollable clusterfuck of circlejerks, with the only ones able to bring global order just sitting back and watching it go on.
[B]TL;DR:[/B] Reddit is worse than both FP and 4chan because it actively breeds nepotism among staff, and is a haven for both biased censorship and horrific content being freely posted. Also, while its issues could easily be fixed, the only people with the power to do so don't give a shit, and possibly actively encourage it all behind the scenes.
Source for all this info: Lurking and/or being a user on all three sites for years.[/QUOTE]
You seem to completely miss subreddits are m9derated and watched by people and dont just let shit through? /r/leagueoflegends is so heavily moderated that good luck ever gettting a rude remark through. You are generalizing reddit because of subreddits which are fucking bad. Why dont you base fp off the fact oify is left to exist?
You havent lurked enough if you like to generalize this much
What if you guys think you're not being oppressed because everyone that has spoken out about us areshadowbanned :tinfoil:
[QUOTE=zerothefallen;45924882]Anyone that thinks "reddit is awful" and etc are honestly just stupid kids who have never used it lmao. It's like 4chan. you're going to find shit if you go looking for it.
Facepunch? Grats, this is a website full of fucking children, stupid radical feminists, and other stupid shit. Facepunch could be considered worse in almost every way. While reddit is visited by millions and has subreddits dedicated to whatever you like, and content that is posted continuously. (Not everything is a repost either)
There is a reason why no one knows facepunch and why everyone knows reddit, because it's a general purpose board and it's what you make of it.
god reading the anti-reddit shit is just as cancerous as anything. as if fp is better in anyway lmao[/QUOTE]
And do you think this is ok, for a website that claims to be the "front page of the internet", that is in the top 50 of the most visited websites ( 18th in the USA, facepunch is 11485 to give you a comparaison ) that have something like 50% of their userbase between 12 and 15 year old, to allow and let grow the communities we all are talking about ? Would you fine normal that, on the same website your son is watching funny cat pictures, reading George Clooney's AMA and browsing minecraft news, you have boards having walls of texts explaining how rape is women's fault , how racism is ok, tutorials on how to make a clean suicide , people laughing at pics of a 3 year old being ran on by a bus with brain crubbs and skull bones stuck on the tire, video of a man fucking a dog ( woof woof ) ? Do I need to continue ?
[QUOTE=426_Hemi;45926247]And do you think this is ok, for a website that claims to be the "front page of the internet", that is in the top 50 of the most visited websites ( 18th in the USA, facepunch is 11485 to give you a comparaison ) that have something like 50% of their userbase between 12 and 15 year old, to allow and let grow the communities we all are talking about ? Would you fine normal that, on the same website your son is watching funny cat pictures and browsing minecraft news, you have board having walls of texts explaining how rape is women's fault , how racism is ok, laughing at pics of a 3 year old being ran on by a bus with brain crubbs and skull bones stuck on the tire, video of a man fucking a dog ( woof woof ) , tutorials on how to make a clean suicide ? Do I need to continue ?[/QUOTE]
Freedom of speech. I dont look at that shit, and 98% of reddit doesnt
The only possible way for it to appear on the front page is if [b]you[/b] subscribe to it
I understand some shit is disgusting, but thats the price you pay for freedom of speech (or at least attempted, as reddit has been ... questionable with recent allegations)
[editline]8th September 2014[/editline]
[QUOTE=Swebonny;45926139]What if you guys think you're not being oppressed because everyone that has spoken out about us areshadowbanned :tinfoil:[/QUOTE]
I have 74 shadowbanned accounts. True story
[QUOTE=zerothefallen;45926097]You seem to completely miss subreddits are m9derated and watched by people and dont just let shit through? /r/leagueoflegends is so heavily moderated that good luck ever gettting a rude remark through. You are generalizing reddit because of subreddits which are fucking bad. Why dont you base fp off the fact oify is left to exist?
You havent lurked enough if you like to generalize this much[/QUOTE]
OIFY is the most exclusive club on FP. It used to be that if you were so much of a shit poster that instead of being banned, members would dig up shit about your life and publicly shame you in a "call out" thread. It was fucking brutal and only reserved for the worst of the worst.
It wasn't posting your address and personal stuff like that, it was like finding your diary and reading the contents aloud to your crush
[QUOTE=Dr.C;45926355]OIFY is the most exclusive club on FP. It used to be that if you were so much of a shit poster that instead of being banned, members would dig up shit about your life and publicly shame you in a "call out" thread. It was fucking brutal and only reserved for the worst of the worst.
It wasn't posting your address and personal stuff like that, it was like finding your diary and reading the contents aloud to your crush[/QUOTE]
Any subreddit worth visiting will remove any content that does that. Its unfair to generalize entire sites, still.
[QUOTE=zerothefallen;45926287]Freedom of speech. I dont look at that shit, and 98% of reddit doesnt
The only possible way for it to appear on the front page is if [b]you[/b] subscribe to it
I understand some shit is disgusting, but thats the price you pay for freedom of speech (or at least attempted, as reddit has been ... questionable with recent allegations)[/QUOTE]
I would respect this a lot more if they didn't ban Gawker media links, keep the revengeporn subreddits but instantly remove the celebrity nudes, and shadowban users for being pro-GamerGate or talking about this. Their "freedom of speech" is very selective.
One of my beef with Reddit is with their administration, which affects the whole site.
[QUOTE=Itachi_Crow;45925567]I had to Google r/raping women just becsuse I couldn't believe that was an actual subbed fit
Holy shit[/QUOTE]
well, it's satire/parody/not serious
[QUOTE=zerothefallen;45926287]Freedom of speech[/QUOTE]
What the fuck is wrong with you?
What makes you think "freedom of speech" justifies a private website letting subreddits exclusively for looking at pictures of dead children exist?
That's fucking garbage.
[QUOTE=Helix Snake;45926571]What the fuck is wrong with you?
What makes you think "freedom of speech" justifies a private website letting subreddits exclusively for looking at pictures of dead children exist?
That's fucking garbage.[/QUOTE]
And then there's that. By that logic, r/childporn would be freedom of speech.
[editline]8th September 2014[/editline]
Reddit doesn't know what freedom of speech means
[QUOTE=Amic;45926048]I like strict moderation on facepunch, it encourages actually putting effort into posting, well, by that i mean any effort at all and not going:
"l0l +1"
"omg pwnd noob"
, or even wrose, long post without any kind of interpuction.
I think reddit is shit because it's one big bandwagon actually, suuure there are good subreddits and all, but we are not speaking about them tbh, if shit like that goes on it deserves to die right now.
I still think it's kind of cool how reddit worked, with all subreddits etc, i think that if reddit actually goes down somebody will make a replacement fast, because having possibility to make your own 'subforum' is kind of neat if used properly.[/QUOTE]
Honestly Amic I don't think the moderation has much to do with it at this point. Whenever people post like that the Facepunch community generally tells them to fuck off on their own. And really, that's the most effective way to do it.
[QUOTE=Swebonny;45926139]What if you guys think you're not being oppressed because everyone that has spoken out about us areshadowbanned :tinfoil:[/QUOTE]
lol... but seriously I would have been banned a long time ago had this been the case.
[QUOTE=KillerJaguar;45926537]
One of my beef with Reddit is with their administration, which affects the whole site.[/QUOTE]
I agree, the administration is trash and needs to be reworked. I am arguing against the people that dismiss literally the entire site all together
[editline]8th September 2014[/editline]
[QUOTE=Helix Snake;45926571]What the fuck is wrong with you?
What makes you think "freedom of speech" justifies a private website letting subreddits exclusively for looking at pictures of dead children exist?
That's fucking garbage.[/QUOTE]
... says the person who lives in the USA
... ?
[QUOTE=zerothefallen;45926630]
... says the person who lives in the USA
... ?[/QUOTE]
Location does not equate to personal politics.
[QUOTE=zerothefallen;45926630]
... says the person who lives in the USA
... ?[/QUOTE]
I'm not sure how the fact he lives in the US helps. Here in the US, most sane-minded people think (or taught) that freedom of speech isn't 100% - there are boundaries, and if you think "WELL, AMERICANS BELIEVE IN FREE SPEECH GUESS THEY CAN'T SAY NO TO ANY FORM OF SPEECH NO MATTER THE CONTENT EVER!" then you're flat out wrong.
You should know this.
Neckbeard dramas
[QUOTE=KillerJaguar;45926537]I would respect this a lot more if they didn't ban Gawker media links, keep the revengeporn subreddits but instantly remove the celebrity nudes, and shadowban users for being pro-GamerGate or talking about this. Their "freedom of speech" is very selective.
One of my beef with Reddit is with their administration, which affects the whole site.[/QUOTE]
I thought Facepunch banned certain news sites as well?
[QUOTE=LegndNikko;45927146]I thought Facepunch banned certain news sites as well?[/QUOTE]
The difference being Facepunch doesn't wave around "freedom of speech"
[QUOTE=Helix Snake;45926571]What the fuck is wrong with you?
What makes you think "freedom of speech" justifies a private website letting subreddits exclusively for looking at pictures of dead children exist?
That's fucking garbage.[/QUOTE]
Because they're just pictures, they're not telling people to kill children.
[QUOTE=kibble;45926968]Neckbeard dramas[/QUOTE]
Speaking of "enlightened ones", here is one now.
[QUOTE=Valnar;45925448]Ratings can affect how people respond to you.
How often do you think a post that has more dumbs than other ratings is taken seriously?
Ratings also don't add anything to any discussion.[/QUOTE]
IMHO if you don't take a post seriously because of ratings alone, you're an idiot in the first place.
Ratings aren't supposed to add anything to the discussion and they're certainly not removing anything either. It just allows people to quickly weight in on that specific post.
The fact that you care at all about ratings says more about you than it says about Facepunch.
[QUOTE=xxncxx;45926045]Yet it still happens? I stopped browsing a while ago but every time I saw a post that was linked to by SRS, it was downvoted hard.[/QUOTE]
The admins can see voting trends and what subreddits voters are coming from. Most of the time SRS simply links to posts as they become more popular instead of actively seeking out new posts to link (which makes sense - they link to terrible upvoted posts). It stands to reason that controversial posts will receive more downvotes from people [i]not[/i] coming from SRS as they become more popular. In some cases, this surge in popularity is enough to tip the post from net upvoted to net downvoted. (ie, during a raid from a racist subreddit "black people r dum lol" might get hundreds of upvotes and get linked on SRS, but at the same time the rest of reddit will begin noticing it and downvote it)
This is an edge case though. Posts linked to by SRS continue following the same voting trends as before being linked more often than not.
[QUOTE=pessimistic;45927521]Because they're just pictures, they're not telling people to kill children.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=KillerJaguar;45926598]And then there's that. By that logic, r/childporn would be freedom of speech.[/QUOTE]
They're just pictures, they're not telling people to make child porn
[QUOTE=KillerJaguar;45928339]They're just pictures, they're not telling people to make child porn[/QUOTE]
That's technically correct. Doesn't make such material any less horrible, though.
[QUOTE=Svinnik;45918779]Wtf is with the reddit admins? Are they trying to kill off their site? First ignoring SRS even though they openly doxx and vote brigade. After that, during the beginning of Quinngate shadow banning left and right and now this?[/QUOTE]
Literally none of this made sense to me. Maybe I spend too much time paying attention to real news.
[QUOTE=LegoGuy;45920884]I don't know why people are so surprised about this. Anything mainstream is censored.[/QUOTE]
Thats the problem with this whole thing, they are selectively censoring subbreddits that have to deal with actual problems and allowing really fucked up ones to exist like the white supremacy subbreddit.
Reddit is as full of shit as any discussion boards with lots of immature men in it. I can name a few, but I won't. Good thing is, there's still variety on the Internet, enough to at least be quite equilibrated.
Reddit holds certain types of users depending on the part of it you're in. So, not ALL Reddit is really to blame.
About the Reddit corruption, didn't we already have #gamergate in between?
Reddit's stance is that a subreddit can stay open as long as it doesn't break any actual laws. /r/watchchildrendie is a morally deplorable subreddit, but AFAIK it doesn't break the law. Therefore, reddit will allow it to stay open.
This is crucial if reddit wants to be open to free speech.
It's like calling for the closing of the internet because a website dedicated to watching children die exists. It only affects you if you visit it.
[QUOTE=geel9;45930441]Reddit's stance is that a subreddit can stay open as long as it doesn't break any actual laws. /r/watchchildrendie is a morally deplorable subreddit, but AFAIK it doesn't break the law. Therefore, reddit will allow it to stay open.
This is crucial if reddit wants to be open to free speech.
It's like calling for the closing of the internet because a website dedicated to watching children die exists. It only affects you if you visit it.[/QUOTE]
Reddit isn't open to free speech as has been demonstrated and called out many times before.
[QUOTE=KillerJaguar;45930487]Reddit isn't open to free speech as has been demonstrated and called out many times before.[/QUOTE]
Such as?
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