Marco Rubio calls for overhaul of higher education in U.S, calls current system a 'cartel'.
87 replies, posted
Community college definitely helps eases the pain of debt, but it can still be pretty expensive.
[QUOTE=~Kiwi~v2;48143158]I don't know how expensive you're talking here but $11KNZD got my course in MCSA/Cisco and A+ with CompTIA in NZ.
If it's any higher then that then christ I guess I got a deal.[/QUOTE]
the course i wanted to take is like 80,000$ now i don't know about you but i do not have 80,000$ just laying around and i certainly don't want a loan on my ass so to ease things in i decided to just teach myself how to do it thanks to google.
[QUOTE=~Kiwi~v2;48143158]I don't know how expensive you're talking here but $11KNZD got my course in MCSA/Cisco and A+ with CompTIA in NZ.
If it's any higher then that then christ I guess I got a deal.[/QUOTE]
College here is anywhere from 30k-90k/year with financial aid being a conditional benefit instead of being just built into the damn cost. Pretty much every college has a massive trust from patents, donors, or investments but they don't just build that money into their bills
another thing i should note, look for colleges with internships otherwise your fucked coming out of college
[QUOTE=FinalHunter;48143726]My university is private and about 50k a year and I don't pay a dime because I'm on academic scholarships. I'll get dumbed for this but sometimes I really don't understand people who take out all these student loans and such for a degree.
It's very feasible to go to college (especially a public one) and pay very little if anything with some hard work. I'm not going to call anybody lazy or dumb but there are definitely opportunities out there to go to college without putting yourself into crippling debt.
There are people at my university that have tens of thousands in student loans already and they picked one of the most expensive private universities in the state when they easily could have gone to a public school and cut that cost by 75%. Really don't understand some people's financial decision making.[/QUOTE]
Scholarships aren't as easy to obtain and even the easy ones are barely anything. I've applied to who-knows-how-many. Wrote all the essays and everything and yet I've never gotten a damn thing from them. I had decent grades all throughout high school and community college so it's not that I'm too dumb or anything.
I imagine that it's the same for a lot of others who can't quite manage to get assistance.
A lot of people go to these schools because of pressure too. Societal, familial. Especially if their parents went to somewhere prestigious. It's the expectation. It's balls but a lot of times it's unavoidable for some people.
[QUOTE=~Kiwi~v2;48143913]And my plans of studying in America just became null.
That's a scary fucking amount of cash to put into education.[/QUOTE]
You basically sign your life away without the guarantee of getting a well paying job.
In America it's either an all or nothing thing. If you really think you can become a doctor or an engineer go for it, because you'll sure as hell need that high paying job to even begin to think about paying off your debt.
I think I've seen more unicorns than I have people I know getting scholarships and FAFSA sucks huge ass, also the state gives you like $500 in KEES money if you made good grades in Highschool so hey you can pay off half of one community college class!
[QUOTE=~Kiwi~v2;48143913]And my plans of studying in America just became null.
That's a scary fucking amount of cash to put into education.[/QUOTE]
Like our healthcare system , what it costs and what you pay are two different numbers , I've got about 30k in loans for a school that's 48k/year and I graduate this year. But that said I've also been living in basically the cheapest housing near my school, doing what I can to save costs as well as taking tons of classes at community colleges
[QUOTE=~Kiwi~v2;48143941]Was thinking of IT. But I can imagine that's probably just as bad in terms of costs.[/QUOTE]
Not so much, I'm also in for IT. You can get an associates in CIT or CIS from a community college and it will still be thousands of dollars without any aid whatsoever. I can't REALLY give you super accurate figures because I am really fortunate and I got into a joint UPS and University of Louisville program where as long as I work for UPS they pay for college.
This is literally my only option for going to school though. I'm not living with quadruple digits of debt by the time I've got a bachelors, fuck that.
IMO it boils down to going to a community college and getting an associates and trying to apply it, or going all in and getting a bachelors or even a masters from one of the larger, pricier colleges.
Or not going to college at all.
[QUOTE=~Kiwi~v2;48143158]I don't know how expensive you're talking here but $11KNZD got my course in MCSA/Cisco and A+ with CompTIA in NZ.
If it's any higher then that then christ I guess I got a deal.[/QUOTE]
Part of it is my field of study, but basically to get the same accreditation worth out of my degree (Because degrees in the U.S have name value, and a very good amount of degrees are essentially worthless in a good many fields because they don't come from a specific list of schools due to how the accreditation system in the U.S. works.) I'd be paying ~50k USD per year for tution or more. And since in the U.S. a lot of degrees are four years, I'd be paying about 200k USD into just my bachelors degree. In the UK where I am going to school I have 3 years of school for my bachelors and it's only ~20k USD tuition per year. I'm going to school with a total cost per year [I]less than just tuition[/I] at a U.S. school for the same valued degree. AND I get it done in 3/4 the time with essentially a 25% discount on my degree because of that difference.
The fact that you literally cannot get student loans removed through bankruptcy unless you actually starve to death/near death basically sure doesn't fucking help either. Higher education in the U.S. is literally just like gambling away your future in a lottery. You MIGHT get a pay out, and if you don't, well too fucking bad, looks like a life of poverty and probably suicidal depression/alcoholism/suffering in general await you.
[QUOTE=FinalHunter;48143726]My university is private and about 50k a year and I don't pay a dime because I'm on academic scholarships. I'll get dumbed for this but sometimes I really don't understand people who take out all these student loans and such for a degree.
It's very feasible to go to college (especially a public one) and pay very little if anything with some hard work. I'm not going to call anybody lazy or dumb but there are definitely opportunities out there to go to college without putting yourself into crippling debt.
There are people at my university that have tens of thousands in student loans already and they picked one of the most expensive private universities in the state when they easily could have gone to a public school and cut that cost by 75%. Really don't understand some people's financial decision making.[/QUOTE]
This is true but financial aid is such a gigantic crutch, if you loose it because somebody in an office accidentally flagged your account for any reason, suddenly they're hounding you for 50k that you cannot pay and it sucks even worse when you're in the last year or middle of your degree
I went to a for profit school like you see on TV for medical assisting because classes were at night and were pretty small. Long story short I got done with 2 years of it and got my associates degree only to find out that it pays $10 an hour and you don't even need a degree to do it but thankfully I am going back hopefully in the fall to get my Bachelors of Science in Nursing so most of my classes will transfer over. The only thing that sucks is I have $30,000 in Student Loans and thankfully my parents just helped me pay off 9000 of it cuz they sold a house that they had but Student Loans definitely suck.
[QUOTE=FinalHunter;48143726]My university is private and about 50k a year and I don't pay a dime because I'm on academic scholarships. I'll get dumbed for this but sometimes I really don't understand people who take out all these student loans and such for a degree.
It's very feasible to go to college (especially a public one) and pay very little if anything with some hard work. I'm not going to call anybody lazy or dumb but there are definitely opportunities out there to go to college without putting yourself into crippling debt.
There are people at my university that have tens of thousands in student loans already and they picked one of the most expensive private universities in the state when they easily could have gone to a public school and cut that cost by 75%. Really don't understand some people's financial decision making.[/QUOTE]
It's basically a gamble; go into debt now and hope that the prestige of the place you're going helps you get a better, more lucrative job than you otherwise would have gotten. There's a perception that going to a public university or community college can trap you under a ceiling, and that's probably true for a lot of fields.
No one wants to give up the opportunity they've earned simply because it isn't affordable, and I think it's sad and embarrassing that the US, of all nations, forces young people to make a decision between reaching their potential and possibly going bankrupt. It's antithetical to the "land of opportunity" narrative our country prides itself on, and it's a completely solvable problem.
Sanders '16.
What's sort of sickening is that the last 3 elections this has been a fringe issue yet economists are saying this will drag down the US GDP ad graduates won't have any disposable income if they have a good job and they will be permanently bankrupted if they can't get a job, as well as it creates a massive class barrier between rich who can afford to pay for college without scholarships and the middle class who have to take loans out but don't qualify for federal aid. Basically if your middle middle class your college chances are dim, while poor students have very tough home life's they get full scholarships and rich pay in cash
[QUOTE=JCDentonUNATCO;48143932]also the state gives you like $500 in KEES money if you made good grades in Highschool so hey you can pay [B]off half of one community college class![/B][/QUOTE]
Woah what?
Maybe it's just anecdotal but the classes that I take are $300-400 at the most if you aren't going into the medical classes.
You do sound like you got pretty lucky! I have people in very similar circumstances who work constantly to get assistance who never do.
It's not a bad thing to benefit from the system how it is. Just gotta acknowledge that not everyone has their circumstances line up in that way.
[QUOTE=Pascall;48144152]You do sound like you got pretty lucky! I have people in very similar circumstances who work constantly to get assistance who never do.
It's not a bad thing to benefit from the system how it is. Just gotta acknowledge that not everyone has their circumstances line up in that way.[/QUOTE]
It's crazy but I'm basically the first one of my siblings to be needing to pay for college.
My sisters got scholarships and full rides and all that shit paid for preemptively, they only paid for housing/meals/textbooks.
I've been poking around and trying to find the cheapest alternatives possible so I don't saddle myself with debt/put pressure on my parents, hence my staying at a community college for a couple years to get my associates, then move on to a college not too far away, and then convert to various religions and pray that people are still hiring history teachers when I graduate.
[QUOTE=~Kiwi~v2;48143941]Was thinking of IT. But I can imagine that's probably just as bad in terms of costs.[/QUOTE]
I'm going back to school (online so I can stay working full time) for a BSIT specializing in software programming, and it's going to cost me 40k to 50k for the entire thing. The degree is more for the jobs that say *Degree Required*, but for most jobs in IT, sufficient experience will suffice, if you can show that you know what you're doing. At the same time, I'm looking to get an entry level position in IT so I can build experience while getting my degree. One of the reasons I chose this online program is that it doesn't have all the extra bullshit gen ed classes, and has more degree focused classes.
I'm paying $4,000/year out of pocket to cover what the student loans won't cover (apparently they only pay out so much a year, so since I wanted to take more classes than they would pay for, I'm paying for the extra out of pocket), but that's going to be $12k - $16k I won't have to finance through student loans, and less interest.
[QUOTE=Major_Vice;48143324]After graduating from state college, I left school with a fine piece of paper, a STEM degree with no job, and $60,000 in debt, and a bumper sticker.
The bumper sticker did look nice on my hand-me down junker while I worked in retail though. I'm not that bad off now, but I'm making a good 20k less per year then what I anticipated with a computer engineering degree. I still don't make enough to be financially independent, given I pay a house note's worth of loan payments every month in the hope I'll be out from this burden by the time I hit 35.[/QUOTE]
Where are you that you couldn't get a job in CoE? I just graduated with a BS in CoE and I had recruiters out the ass. I got interviews for jobs I didn't even apply for.
I got super lucky as far as costs go. NY has a great public university system so I got an ivy league level education for public school prices. Still like $40-50k all told. It's kind of sad but $40-50k is a steal for decent education.
[QUOTE=JCDentonUNATCO;48143932]You basically sign your life away without the guarantee of getting a well paying job.
In America it's either an all or nothing thing. If you really think you can become a doctor or an engineer go for it, because you'll sure as hell need that high paying job to even begin to think about paying off your debt.
I think I've seen more unicorns than I have people I know getting scholarships and FAFSA sucks huge ass, also the state gives you like $500 in KEES money if you made good grades in Highschool so hey you can pay off half of one community college class![/QUOTE]
a single community college class costs a thousand dollars where you live?
what the fuck where do you live
[QUOTE=meppers;48144345]a single community college class costs a thousand dollars where you live?
what the fuck where do you live[/QUOTE]
Shit in the burbs of Chicago I spent 5k on 4 classes for 1 semester at a community college. 1 of those classes(Sociology iirc) was literally watch Equilibrium and write a paper about it.
[QUOTE=bitches;48143037][quote]behind Bush, the nominal front-runner, and reality-show star and tycoon Donald Trump.[/quote][/QUOTE]
Jesus christ, Trump is in [I]front[/I] of other candidates?
[editline]7th July 2015[/editline]
[QUOTE=-nesto-;48144543]Shit in the burbs of Chicago I spent 5k on 4 classes for 1 semester at a community college. 1 of those classes(Sociology iirc) was literally watch Equilibrium and write a paper about it.[/QUOTE]
You got robbed
[QUOTE=meppers;48143626]I dont understand why people go to private universities instead of a state college.
employers don't give a shit where you went to school
if you have to pay more than 1k per class before scholarships, grants, etc you are being screwed.[/QUOTE]
Think of it as interest for the "better chance at landing a more successful career and life" they give you.
[editline]8th July 2015[/editline]
[QUOTE=-nesto-;48144543]Shit in the burbs of Chicago I spent 5k on 4 classes for 1 semester at a community college. 1 of those classes(Sociology iirc) was literally watch Equilibrium and write a paper about it.[/QUOTE]
Insaaaaane. now I know what those schooling advisors truly meant then they said that "money talks" when studying in America.
[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;48144568]Jesus christ, Trump is in [I]front[/I] of other candidates?
[/QUOTE]
Both Trump and Jeb are recognizable to the majority of voters, that's why at this point they have a lead. I'm pretty sure the race will get all mixed up once some debates and the RNC happen.
[QUOTE=.Isak.;48143211]hahaha my college is around $20k a semester, $40k a year, $160k for a degree
that's just tuition, not room and board or meal plans or books or anything[/QUOTE]
Do you have a good reason for spending so much on school? Unless you're at MIT or something I can't see why it would be necessary to dump that much per semester.
[QUOTE=meppers;48143626]I dont understand why people go to private universities instead of a state college.
employers don't give a shit where you went to school
if you have to pay more than 1k per class before scholarships, grants, etc you are being screwed.[/QUOTE]
Employers care where you went to school, and grad schools really care!
[QUOTE=srobins;48145141]Do you have a good reason for spending so much on school? Unless you're at MIT or something I can't see why it would be necessary to dump that much per semester.[/QUOTE]
It's one of the best liberal arts colleges in the country (hovers around top 30ish), my parents went there so I could get a legacy advantage in admissions, and they offered me a renewable scholarship of $12k a year. Their fees are also surprisingly low, yearly cost hovers around $47k-ish for full housing and full quality meals and books, 12k off that and it's a very reasonable $35k a year.
I was also looking at University of Texas, where tuition is a nice $9k for in-state students but where they absolutely fucking bone you for room and board for almost $12k a year for a moldy shit dorm (i've seen UT dorms, they're ass), plus plenty of extra hidden fees that you don't really think about (parking, etc) that balloon it to $26k a year or more.
I'm also diagnosed ADHD and have a lot of difficulty with learning through having someone lecture at me through powerpoint slides. My school's student-faculty ratio is 12:1 which is way better than UT's and almost no classes have more than 50 students while over a quarter of UT's classes have over 50 students. It's a better place for me to learn, and with scholarships it didn't cost me too much more than a state school would have, plus it's close enough to Minneapolis and my extended family.
Plus it was the only school that offered me a scholarship of any kind.
[QUOTE=draugur;48143138]He's not wrong. It's leagues cheaper for me to literally fucking pay out of pocket/take student loans and study in another country than it is to stay in this one, even with scholarships.[/QUOTE]
Fucking, some European nations will give American students free tuition such as Germany.
I'm already too far into college to quit now, and I'm gonna be probably at least 60k in the hole when I get out.
I don't know how I'll deal with it. I don't know where my life's even going at this point.
[QUOTE=Disgruntled;48145434]I'm already too far into college to quit now, and I'm gonna be probably at least 60k in the hole when I get out.
I don't know how I'll deal with it. I don't know where my life's even going at this point.[/QUOTE]
You'll be okay dude, keep going and just finish. There are a decent amount of jobs out there for those with degrees, it definitely improves your chances I promise
[QUOTE=.Isak.;48143348]i've regularly considered taking a plumbing/electrician/woodworking/auto mechanic apprenticeship instead of going to college.
you learn immediately applicable skills, you are essentially guaranteed a job if you're a decent worker, and by the time you're in your mid-late 30's you're making six figures so long as you can work hard.
the entire "a diploma guarantees a good job!" is dead. if I'm not working in the field I major in within about 2-3 years of graduating, I'm taking an apprenticeship and forgetting I ever had a diploma.[/QUOTE]
I'm in the same rut. I can jump out of school, get a CDL-A and become a trucker making MINIMUM 50k a year. If I get laid off from a trucking company I can walk across the street to the next one. These days most degrees that don't cost a fuckton usually saddle you with an insurmountable amount of debt. I'm currently a warehouse manager at a small company and the girls in the office have each 40k of debt and they're struggling to pay it off. I graduated only from high school and I make more than them, granted they chose degrees that aren't even marketable anymore.
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