• Projection, much?: Tropes Vs MEN creators abscond with cash.
    392 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Protocol7;39859435]people will find something to whine about one way or another it's simply just not possible to cover your ass 100% of the way either[/QUOTE] Which is exactly what I'm saying and which is why I don't think that not performing additional research with the additional money because of whining people is a good idea.
I highly doubt she is just going to give up entirely because "people are whining"
HGngghghgh thats what I was saying this whole time.
yeah that's my bad for having awful reading comprehension
[QUOTE=Shadaez;39859360]she never claimed that she bought all the games with the money though so that's just conjured criticism, people are just looking for ANYTHING wrong with it to attack, and most of it has nothing to do with the video itself. People payed her for a product, they are getting it - albeit a little late. The majority of kickstarters are late. She just wanted to pose a pic with a bunch of video games, OH SHIT SHE USED ONES SHE HAD ALREADY FUCKIN SCAMMMMMMMMMMMM [editline]9th March 2013[/editline] exactly[/QUOTE] Hey you never replied to my response to your response regarding ME. That was p much the whole reason I came into this thread anyway.
[QUOTE=Shadaez;39859360]she never claimed that she bought all the games with the money though so that's just conjured criticism, people are just looking for ANYTHING wrong with it to attack, and most of it has nothing to do with the video itself. People payed her for a product, they are getting it - albeit a little late. The majority of kickstarters are late. She just wanted to pose a pic with a bunch of video games, OH SHIT SHE USED ONES SHE HAD ALREADY FUCKIN SCAMMMMMMMMMMMM [editline]9th March 2013[/editline] exactly[/QUOTE] Zeke claimed she needed the money to buy the games. Obviously not since she already had the games. My comment was aimed towards zeke's claim, not the woman who's making these videos.
[QUOTE=mobrockers2;39859543]Zeke claimed she needed the money to buy the games. Obviously not since she already had the games. My comment was aimed towards zeke's claim, not the woman who's making these videos.[/QUOTE] maybe she needed money for something else who cares it's not your money
[QUOTE=RoadOfGirl;39859575]maybe she needed money for something else who cares it's not your money[/QUOTE] Even if she only requested an initial 6k, 150k should be a bit of a booster. Seemingly not. 6000 is still a hell of a lot of money for making small videos like this, too.
[QUOTE=RoadOfGirl;39859575]maybe she needed money for something else who cares it's not your money[/QUOTE] Did you back the project?
[QUOTE=G-Strogg;39859531]Hey you never replied to my response to your response regarding ME. That was p much the whole reason I came into this thread anyway.[/QUOTE] its so many worrrrrrds [QUOTE=G-Strogg;39858889]That entire pre-conception is thrown out the window once Kate is arrested. Faith loves Kate and goes through the world to get her back. In more well-developed stories we can see a similar example, only that there's usually a male protagonist. I don't see how different genders would affect the actual trope "outcome", so to speak. I can understand the issue if it's just a plot device to create a farcical state of actual character affection, but I can definitely excuse the first mario games, considering the state of technology back then and that miyamoto most definitely constructed the gameplay and design before thinking about the story. The fact that it stays the same throughout the games is another issue, though.[/QUOTE] i mean like its not a question or anything, I agree completely I guess? you didn't say anything controversial what am i supposed to do :( I don't really think that's the point of the series, this is just a single trope that she is 'exploring' of all tropes, focusing on positive use of the tropes isn't her intention or point
[QUOTE=G-Strogg;39859299]As I said, I'm not trying to disown her or make her earnings unjust. As for the extra money, while she has freedom to do what she wants I'd rather have seen them being put towards added research. For example, taking $20k and actually visiting japan and talking to some of the devs over there. I think it would be nice if we got insight from all parts.[/QUOTE] The kickstarter didn't mention anything about travelling to do interviews so she could not use the money for that purpose. If you lie in a kickstarter you'll get sued.
uneducated opinion coming through I think the whole damsel in distress is used so much because the writers and creators of the games/movies are men. Men naturally like and seek out women, so it works well as a plot device for them. Their target audience are obviously men, too. Now games made by women would have more female protagonists and less of the shit we see every day etc it's just that there's not enough women out there interested in making videogames, to balance it out. I stand for equal opportunities. If you're a guy and want to make a videogame, go ahead. If you're a girl, go ahead. Contribute to the change instead of asking others to do it your way. It sounds really simple to me, so if somebody has an argument against this, please do tell, I'd really appreciate other views on this.
[QUOTE=G-Strogg;39859593]Did you back the project?[/QUOTE] no, so I don't care what she spends the money on. I have no investment on it, nor does anyone else that has not contributed. that's my point
[QUOTE=mobrockers2;39859543]Zeke claimed she needed the money to buy the games. Obviously not since she already had the games. My comment was aimed towards zeke's claim, not the woman who's making these videos.[/QUOTE] she needs money to live and stuff too, 6k was probably just to support her while she did things people liked, and since they liked them they could be like 'hey yeah ill support you while you do this'. With 160k to use for whatever she wants, she still needs to create DVDs, manufacture the DVDs (of her entire series + this one) and send them out to all the people who paid for it (this takes a lot of time + cost of materials) send out stickers and post cards to hundreds of others (this takes a lot of time + money for materials) + production costs + time to research things
[QUOTE=JurajIsNotPirat;39859660]uneducated opinion coming through I think the whole damsel in distress is used so much because the writers and creators of the games/movies are men. Men naturally like and seek out women, so it works well as a plot device for them. Their target audience are obviously men, too. Now games made by women would have more female protagonists and less of the shit we see every day etc I stand for equal opportunities. If you're a guy and want to make a videogame, go ahead. If you're a girl, go ahead. Contribute to the change instead of asking others to do it your way. It sounds really simple to me, so if somebody has an argument against this, please do tell, I'd really appreciate other views on this.[/QUOTE] (a part of) the idea is to change this, make an environment guys stop using such tropes despite being men so that said games can be more inviting to everyone, or at the very least do not treat characters of the opposite gender with such careless disregard
if this was a different thing for a physical product (say, the OUYA) you could legitimately criticize what she did with the money, but she's delivering what she said so I don't get what you're angry about and it seems like you can't find any flaws with the video so you're attacking her but idk that's just me and my crazy feminist ideas
I miss times when games were games because they were games...
[QUOTE=RoadOfGirl;39859701](a part of) the idea is to change this, make an environment guys stop using such tropes despite being men so that said games can be more inviting to everyone, or at the very least do not treat characters of the opposite gender with such careless disregard[/QUOTE] Yeah I guess I sort of see that, but to me it seems selfish to ask other people to change their ways, just because you don't agree with them. The tropes really are cheap but it's not my business that the developers want to use them. I would do things my way in my own projects. my self esteem is pretty low though so that might have something to do with my opinions also I think that men and women are simply not equal ever since forever, we're just different. Different bodies, different thinking. One gender excells in one field, the other one in another. We should still provide both with equal opportunities, though. So asking one gender to not be biased towards it's own is just not going to work.
[QUOTE=Shadaez;39859712]if this was a different thing for a physical product (say, the OUYA) you could legitimately criticize what she did with the money, but she's delivering what she said so I don't get what you're angry about and it seems like you can't find any flaws with the video so you're attacking her but idk that's just me and my crazy feminist ideas[/QUOTE] I'm not criticizing her about the money she received. [editline]10th March 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=dass;39859730]I miss times when games were games because they were games...[/QUOTE] I don't think I get it.
[QUOTE=dass;39859730]I miss times when games were games because they were games...[/QUOTE] Well they're not now, there's been too many good ones with proper stories for them just to stay as mindless whack-a-mole simulators anymore. So you might as well embrace the change, and while you're at it support this documentary, because it might actually change something, and make videogames a more valid art-form. [editline]10th March 2013[/editline] Sorry, that reads a bit like a personal attack, but its more directed at everyone who's throwing a hissy fit over the documentary.
[QUOTE=Shadaez;39859619]its so many worrrrrrds i mean like its not a question or anything, I agree completely I guess? you didn't say anything controversial what am i supposed to do :( I don't really think that's the point of the series, this is just a single trope that she is 'exploring' of all tropes, focusing on positive use of the tropes isn't her intention or point[/QUOTE] I know the point of the series, but what I want to know is how Kate would become less of a damsel just because a woman rescued her instead of a man. Don't get me wrong, in regards to the video and the content shown there, I would consider ME a disruptive example of the trope. I think that the trope "outcome" would be completely the same regardless of the protagonists gender. It could be a brother or a sister rescuing his/her sister, in the end it is still a badly constructed plot device to push the story forward. I was 100x more interested in the actual big brother part of it all, which was very present in the beginning and after Kate's arrest it was sort of a dwindling subject. When the player rescues Kate at the end it is limpid that there is no reason to care about the whole big brother thing anymore. Kate is free, and all is well. And that's p much why I don't think it's necessarily the gender of the protagonist that creates a bad example of a damsel trope. I think it is of extreme importance to note that games back in the 80's and 90's were made by engineers who didnt know shit about storytelling and therefore referred to old myths and tales when constructing a story. I'm not saying that to defend the inclusion of the trope, rather defend the creators, since they obviously didn't have any ill intentions.
[QUOTE=JurajIsNotPirat;39859744]Yeah I guess I sort of see that, but to me it seems selfish to ask other people to change their ways, just because you don't agree with them. The tropes really are cheap but it's not my business that the developers want to use them. I would do things my way in my own projects. my self esteem is pretty low though so that might have something to do with my opinions also I think that men and women are simply not equal ever since forever, we're just different. Different bodies, different thinking. One gender excells in one field, the other one in another. We should still provide both with equal opportunities, though. So asking one gender to not be biased towards it's own is just not going to work.[/QUOTE] just apply the same concept to racism. would you consider it "selfish" to tell people to stop using blackface? You're right, we're different, but that doesn't make discrimination okay, and assuming one gender is better at, or can/can't do this this or that is wrong.
[QUOTE=Zeke129;39859655]The kickstarter didn't mention anything about travelling to do interviews so she could not use the money for that purpose. If you lie in a kickstarter you'll get sued.[/QUOTE] I'm more than certain she could've updated her kickstarter once she realised she was going to hit a larger sum than the goal.
[QUOTE=Hellduck;39859775]Well they're not now, there's been too many good ones with proper stories for them just to stay as mindless whack-a-mole simulators anymore. So you might as well embrace the change, and while you're at it support this documentary, because it might actually change something, and make videogames a more valid art-form. [editline]10th March 2013[/editline] Sorry, that reads a bit like a personal attack, but its more directed at everyone who's throwing a hissy fit over the documentary.[/QUOTE] mhm. if you want "game" games, just go play the old videogames you love so much with no story. they haven't gone anywhere [editline]10th March 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=G-Strogg;39859810]I'm more than certain she could've updated her kickstarter once she realised she was going to hit a larger sum than the goal.[/QUOTE] you're certain she should have done something?
She should take those earrings out when making her next video because I just cannot concentrate with those big shiny metal rings swinging about.
[QUOTE=Shadaez;39859691]she needs money to live and stuff too, 6k was probably just to support her while she did things people liked, and since they liked them they could be like 'hey yeah ill support you while you do this'. With 160k to use for whatever she wants, she still needs to create DVDs, manufacture the DVDs (of her entire series + this one) and send them out to all the people who paid for it (this takes a lot of time + cost of materials) send out stickers and post cards to hundreds of others (this takes a lot of time + money for materials) + production costs + time to research things[/QUOTE] That doesn't hold tho, kickstarter presses that you should include the costs of perks in your budget. So for example if someone donates $30 it's not that she would actually get $30, she keeps whatever is left once the cost of the perk has been subtracted. If you don't base your budget around this it will crash and fail horribly. So if she has thought about it right then she wouldn't have to use that much money towards perk production.
[QUOTE=G-Strogg;39859797]I know the point of the series, but what I want to know is how Kate would become less of a damsel just because a woman rescued her instead of a man. Don't get me wrong, in regards to the video and the content shown there, I would consider ME a disruptive example of the trope. I think that the trope "outcome" would be completely the same regardless of the protagonists gender. It could be a brother or a sister rescuing his/her sister, in the end it is still a badly constructed plot device to push the story forward. I was 100x more interested in the actual big brother part of it all, which was very present in the beginning and after Kate's arrest it was sort of a dwindling subject. When the player rescues Kate at the end it is limpid that there is no reason to care about the whole big brother thing anymore. Kate is free, and all is well. And that's p much why I don't think it's necessarily the gender of the protagonist that creates a bad example of a damsel trope. I think it is of extreme importance to note that games back in the 80's and 90's were made by engineers who didnt know shit about storytelling and therefore referred to old myths and tales when constructing a story. I'm not saying that to defend the inclusion of the trope, rather defend the creators, since they obviously didn't have any ill intentions.[/QUOTE] He doesn't become any less of a damsel in distress, I don't really know what you're trying to get at but the trope itself is not harmful and the games that use it don't suddenly become problematic in any way. It's a completely different thing when a woman saves a woman, a man saves a man, when a woman saves a man, and when a man saves a woman. In my opinion the most progressive of those is when a woman saves a man because it's dissenting views of gender roles and it shows that dudebros can need help 2 ;( and that woman can be heroes. The point of the videos isn't that the damsel in distress trope is bad, it's that the way the industry relies on it and uses it is harmful to women.
[QUOTE=G-Strogg;39859861]That doesn't hold tho, kickstarter presses that you should include the costs of perks in your budget. So for example if someone donates $30 it's not that she would actually get $30, she keeps whatever is left once the cost of the perk has been subtracted. If you don't base your budget around this it will crash and fail horribly. So if she has thought about it right then she wouldn't have to use that much money towards perk production.[/QUOTE] you are correct, but it is still irrelevant what she puts the money towards as long as she does what she promises her backers.
[QUOTE=G-Strogg;39859861]That doesn't hold tho, kickstarter presses that you should include the costs of perks in your budget. So for example if someone donates $30 it's not that she would actually get $30, she keeps whatever is left once the cost of the perk has been subtracted. If you don't base your budget around this it will crash and fail horribly. So if she has thought about it right then she wouldn't have to use that much money towards perk production.[/QUOTE] I know, if people factored in tax, kickstarter's percentage, and the cost of the perks I don't think they'd be so mangry. It's not like she's being thrown (or ever HAD the intention of being thrown) 160,000 to do what she's doing. If she had only planned to get 6,000 creating a complete DVD would be a WAY larger chunk of that money. For real, people are just looking for things to attack.
[QUOTE=RoadOfGirl;39859802]just apply the same concept to racism. would you consider it "selfish" to tell people to stop using blackface? You're right, we're different, but that doesn't make discrimination okay, and assuming one gender is better at, or can/can't do this this or that is wrong.[/QUOTE] Now that got me thinking. Certainly sheds some lights on this, but still. I think it's different. There's no valid reason for race humiliation, except power desires growing from an inflated ego. The driving point of the tropes is natural human attraction.. But I guess there is a power desire side to that aswell.. not always, though. ugh, I really can't wrap my head around this topic. Been trying for a good while, yet i'm still standing somewhere inbetween everything. maybe one day I'll figure it out.
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