[QUOTE=Xystus234;43530466]How about mining neutron stars for ultra-dense matter, there might be a use we could have for ultra-dense matter with no charge. There's plenty of materials in space that we could find uses for that we don't have on earth[/QUOTE]
you do realize that a spoonful of degenerate matter would sink to the core of the earth just because of how heavy it is right?
How the fuck do you expect to mine something like that?
[QUOTE=Kyle902;43530544]you do realize that a spoonful of degenerate matter would sink to the core of the earth just because of how heavy it is right?
How the fuck do you expect to mine something like that?[/QUOTE]
The point is theoretically you could do it, therefore it is theoretically possible. It would possibly take subatomic fields that we don't understand fully or know about at all at the energy scales that we don't have yet. But the fact that those energy scales themselves are possible, no matter how vast - mining it is most likely possible, and someone is going to find a reason for it several thousand years in the future when they have the technology - or at least the energy scales to contain something of that mass.
[QUOTE=Gordy H.;43529737]Dr. Elvis sounds like he just wanted to rain on peoples parade.
He chose to use the costs of current space missions and the estimated costs of currently experimental space mining techniques to say that returning a profit in space mining would be difficult. This ignores the expectation that better technology will drastically reduce the costs of operating in space in the future.
As another Dr. pointed out, he also only addressed the mineral content of type-m asteroids - not the mineral content of type-c asteroids which are the ones we WANT to mine.
The only genuinely decent point Dr. Elvis makes is this:
That's true, the idea that every single asteroid out in space is a treasure trove is a silly one. But that doesn't mean there aren't tens of thousands of mineral rich asteroids in our solar system.[/QUOTE]
for all we know it could end up costing only 5$ to go to another galaxy, as if it was a bus ride. I don't mean to exaggerate, but what if technology eventually gets THAT good?
so to go on the basis of current costs is very insane
[QUOTE=Xystus234;43530500]Titan is filled with Hydrocarbons. More oil than the earth like a bazillion times over.
When we run out of oil here and interplanetary travel becomes viable, don't tell me we aren't going over there to mine it.[/QUOTE]
hauling oil on spaceships seems so inefficient it isn't even funny
more likely is that we'll just invent some fancy algae or something and turn it into oil or equivalents
It would be funny if that was the actual title of the study:
"Asteroid Mining Ain't Worth Shit"
-Professor ....
[QUOTE=Xystus234;43530500]Titan is filled with Hydrocarbons. More oil than the earth like a bazillion times over.[/QUOTE]
We're not going to be setting up cargo hauling from Titan on a fossil-fuel-based economy.
[QUOTE=Xystus234;43530466]How about mining neutron stars for ultra-dense matter, there might be a use we could have for ultra-dense matter with no charge. There's plenty of materials in space that we could find uses for that we don't have on earth[/QUOTE]
a teaspoon of material from a neutron star weighs millions of tons.
Good luck with that.
The way I see it, why strip mine an asteroid when you can already do that on Earth. I mean, mining isn't like it is in the movies where you have some prospector with a pick axe and nuggets of gold. In reality, they blow up the ground and scoop it up into a dump truck and haul it off to a refinery.
[QUOTE=cqbcat;43531516]The way I see it, why strip mine an asteroid when you can already do that on Earth. I mean, mining isn't like it is in the movies where you have some prospector with a pick axe and nuggets of gold. In reality, they blow up the ground and scoop it up into a dump truck and haul it off to a refinery.[/QUOTE]
All of the platinum ever mined by humanity ever up until this point would only fill a volume of roughly 10% the volume of an Olympic sized swimming pool. One good asteroid could potentially contain that much platinum AGAIN. Humanity also has surprisingly less silver and gold than you'd probably imagine, too.
Now, of course, there's MUCH more platinum on (or rather in) Earth than there is in any asteroid, but the issue is most of it isn't readily available. An asteroid is relatively small though and it would be orders of magnitude easier to break them apart and extract useful materials such as platinum group elements from them than it would be to continue mining for them on Earth.
[editline]14th January 2014[/editline]
[URL]http://money.howstuffworks.com/question213.htm[/URL]
Source on the platinum info, by the way.
[QUOTE=Xystus234;43530466]How about mining neutron stars for ultra-dense matter, there might be a use we could have for ultra-dense matter with no charge. There's plenty of materials in space that we could find uses for that we don't have on earth[/QUOTE]What possible use could we have for degenerate matter that weighs millions of tonnes in a teaspoon? The gravity of neutron stars is also one step away from black holes.
Yeah no shit it isn't feasible right now. Logistics of getting there, mining it, and then taking it back to earth are mind boggling. Nevermind that if asteroid mining opens up, the market is flooded with the material dropping it's value overnight.
Now a better idea would be to send an unmanned probe, attach it to the asteroid, start the thrusters towards earth and calculate a trajectory so it lands in Africa, Siberia, or some other remote location, then you can mine it (not like we don't do worse to Africa everyday anyway, also preferably a non-populated part of said places). Only problem there is that the asteroid has to preferably be small and not coming in too fast, oh also if you fuck up the calculations and hit a city you'll probably be in the shit.
[editline]14th January 2014[/editline]
[QUOTE=Xystus234;43530466]How about mining neutron stars for ultra-dense matter, there might be a use we could have for ultra-dense matter with no charge. There's plenty of materials in space that we could find uses for that we don't have on earth[/QUOTE]
Not in a long long time. We'll have to start manipulating gravity before we can think of mining from that.
[QUOTE=GunFox;43530324]When I think about asteroid mining, I tend to think about water and iron mining, not precious metals. You harvest water and iron in order to manufacture things and fuel vehicles in space. I figured precious metal mining would eventually arrive, but only after an orbital shipyard is produced. Delta v requirements change drastically at that point.[/QUOTE]
I thought everyone thought this?
I mean did people really think that asteroid mining is where we find all kinds of valuable gems/stones/whatever?
Yeah naah.
[QUOTE=cqbcat;43531516]The way I see it, why strip mine an asteroid when you can already do that on Earth. I mean, mining isn't like it is in the movies where you have some prospector with a pick axe and nuggets of gold. In reality, they blow up the ground and scoop it up into a dump truck and haul it off to a refinery.[/QUOTE]
We don't have a ifinite amount on earth dude, we may have a metric fuckton of alot, but its all gonna go away someday...
[QUOTE=Native Hunter;43530094]Well there is an asteroid of sorts in the galaxy that is pure diamond and thousands of kilometers wide, I think that would definetly be worth mining[/QUOTE]
Diamonds are not expensive. They aren't even terribly rare. The only reason why natural diamonds have such an inflated price, is because the diamond cartel makes certain to keep demand up.
Hell, they also aren't terribly complex to manufacture.
Well is it possible that we will find new elements to add to the periodic table of elements on asteroids as what we were able to find mostly so far is what could exist or form within our atmosphere? If so that would be pretty cool, could open new possibilities.
Most of the rare earth minerals are running out and China holds a vast majority of the market. Not only that but China has reduced its rare earth mineral export. Rare earth minerals are crucial for basically any technological device out there. A little more info on the composition of near earth asteroids below...
Shameful copy and past wall inbound;
WATER FROM ASTEROIDS
Water from asteroids is a key resource in space. Water can be converted to rocket propellant, or supply the needs of humans living off Earth, and can completely change the way we explore space with rockets. A single water-rich 500-meter-wide asteroid contains 80 times more water than the largest supertanker could carry and could provide, if the water were converted to rocket propellant, more than 200 times the rocket fuel required to launch all the rockets ever launched in human history.
RARE METALS FROM ASTEROIDS
Once we are able to access, process, and utilize asteroid water resources, mining metals becomes more feasible. Some near-Earth asteroids contain platinum group metals in much higher concentrations than the richest Earth mines. In space, a single platinum-rich 500 meter wide asteroid contains about 174 times the yearly world output of platinum, and 1.5 times the known world-reserves of platinum group metals (ruthenium, rhodium, palladium, osmium, iridium, and platinum). This amount is enough to fill a basketball court to four times the height of the rim. By contrast, all of the platinum group metals mined to date in history would not reach waist-high on that same basketball court.
OTHER ASTEROID RESOURCES
Asteroids also contain more common metallic elements such as iron, nickel, and cobalt, sometimes in incredible quantities. In addition to water, other volatiles, such as nitrogen, CO, CO2, and methane, exist in quantities sufficient to warrant extraction and utilization.
[url]http://www.planetaryresources.com/asteroids/composition/[/url]
Dark energy is where it's at. Yeah.
Why stop at dark energy? What about vacuum energy?
We're joking right?
Well this means we have to make space travel cheaper.
[QUOTE=Sgt Doom;43531604]What possible use could we have for degenerate matter that weighs millions of tonnes in a teaspoon? The gravity of neutron stars is also one step away from black holes.[/QUOTE]
Artificial gravity?
I imagine a century or so we'll all be breathing, eating, and fabricating nanomachines every square inch of the planet, so resources won't by a problem!*
*Based on personal thesis that nanobots solve every problem ever.
[QUOTE=yannickgd;43532974]Artificial gravity?[/QUOTE]That's not a particularly useful way of doing it, since it's completely out of the question for spacecraft, and nobody spends long enough in a space station for it to be necessary. That still leaves the near impossibility of extracting it from neutron stars, and that the degenerate matter only remains in that state due to the immense gravity of a neutron star.
[QUOTE=yannickgd;43532974]Artificial gravity?[/QUOTE]
Gonna be fun trying to accelerate a spaceship with that in it.
[QUOTE=counterpo0;43532111]I thought everyone thought this?
I mean did people really think that asteroid mining is where we find all kinds of valuable gems/stones/whatever?
[/QUOTE]
I'm imagining space dwarves.
[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;43533963]I'm imagining space dwarves.[/QUOTE]
[t]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/3/33/Squat-command.jpg[/t]
???
[QUOTE=acds;43531949]Yeah no shit it isn't feasible right now. Logistics of getting there, mining it, and then taking it back to earth are mind boggling. Nevermind that if asteroid mining opens up, the market is flooded with the material dropping it's value [/QUOTE]
Reduced costs (don't confuse cost with value, there's a difference) means it's more easily attainable. Meaning development of technologies that rely on those materials can become a reality.
[QUOTE=yannickgd;43532974]Artificial gravity?[/QUOTE]
If you wanted artificial gravity on a long haul ship you just have to align the floors with the engines so the force of acceleration acts as a substitute for gravity.
[QUOTE=Janus Vesta;43534183]If you wanted artificial gravity on a long haul ship you just have to align the floors with the engines so the force of acceleration acts as a substitute for gravity.[/QUOTE]
Won't that require a lot of acceleration to mimic Earth's gravity?
well we won't really know what they are made of until we go there, galaleo probe discovered super rich deposited of rare metals all over the moon, stuff previously unknown , let's let the spaceprobes do the talking
[editline]14th January 2014[/editline]
[QUOTE=Janus Vesta;43534183]If you wanted artificial gravity on a long haul ship you just have to align the floors with the engines so the force of acceleration acts as a substitute for gravity.[/QUOTE]
or spin the ship or have spinning portions
[editline]14th January 2014[/editline]
still its not as if we are running out of rare earths here, China may have the top market share but because of their manipulation of prices, other older and newer deposited which became uneconomical to mine are being looked at again, already the largest u.s. mine which rivals the Chinese mine in size, came back online after a ten year halt
I am more thinking how valuable it is to mine asteroids in terms of transportation. Bring something into orbit costs about 15000 dollars/kg. The thing that will be mining asteroids will be very heavy, considering it needs multiple drill heads which all degrade over time, the massive amounts of fuel to get to the asteroids, and then you also need some spacetruck to get that stuff back to us.
[QUOTE=acds;43533775]Gonna be fun trying to accelerate a spaceship with that in it.[/QUOTE]If we're manipulating gravity to do what we see in Star Wars and Star Trek, we're probably doing it on ships that have FTL capability. Manipulating gravity like that is pretty much in the same league as wormholes and other fun stuff.
So acceleration won't really matter because we can just space boogaloo long distances anyway.
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