• Life among U.S. enemies: Journalist embedded self with the Taliban
    59 replies, posted
[QUOTE=RayDark;26666420]America wants their oil, so they fight back using any means necessary, simple as that. This fucking entire war is a cover.[/QUOTE] Ahahahahahhhhahahahahahahaah! You're dumb if you believe that. [editline]13th December 2010[/editline] [QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;26667732]Imagine that in America. A guy decides to go hunting for deer then suddenly gets killed by a missile because he was spotted going through the forest with a gun.[/QUOTE] I wouldn't carry a gun if there were predators and attack helicopters flying all over the place.
[QUOTE=Raiskauskone V2;26666566]You're a fucking idiot. They are just common civilians like you and me, it requires a lot of courage to take up arms and fight for their land against invaders that they can't fully understand why they are invading in the first place. As for the roadside bombs, do you think using cruise missiles, drones, airstrikes and Main Battle tanks against poorly-armed talibans is fair and brave? They aren't scared to fight, granted, they aren't the best markmans, but they sure as hell try their best. I'm quite sure you wouldn't perform any fucking better. Now go wave your flag somewhere else without us knowing it[/QUOTE] And all get slaughtered by superior trained forces, hence they use roadside bombs. No prejudice, just observation.
[QUOTE=PvtCupcakes;26664907]I liked this article. America needs to leave these poor guys alone.[/QUOTE] The Taliban is the biggest fucking burden in Afganistan. The country of Afghanistan as a majority don't support the Taliban, yet they are running a lot of the country though power. If you had a past view on the Taliban, but got your opinion changed by one single article... You need to grow a backbone.
[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;26666964] Afghan fighters are known to be one of the fiercest fighters in the world, not just today, but over the past centuries. I don't mean by their skill or training, but by their sheer willpower to fight against incredible odds despite the lack of training or skill.[/QUOTE] A promise to heaven can make a man do anything. Please, this is the Taliban, they're extremist bigots who stone women and oppress anything against their belief in Islam, despite stories like this I can firmly believe clear majority support radical views. They are also not sacred defenders, they have a history of being raider tribes, often raiding into India (now Pakistan).
[QUOTE=Vasili;26668304]A promise to heaven can make a man do anything. Please, this is the Taliban, they're extremist bigots who stone women and oppress anything against their belief in Islam, despite stories like this I can firmly believe clear majority support radical views. They are also not sacred defenders, they have a history of being raider tribes, often raiding into India (now Pakistan).[/QUOTE] I wasn't questioning their motives or beliefs. Only saying that they're fierce fighters. Not why they fight.
[QUOTE=Lenni;26668200]The problem is that they're not exactly better themselves. When left to their own wit, they'll oppress populations and especially, as the article states, women. I'm sure they're doing it in good faith and all that, but that's not an excuse.[/QUOTE] A little bit of opression here and there doesn't seem to bother anyone enough to invade in other instances. As bad as it may be, it's not bad enough to justify this.
[QUOTE=Mr_Razzums;26668231]I wouldn't carry a gun if there were predators and attack helicopters flying all over the place.[/QUOTE] But what if everyone else is carrying a gun as well? Won't you feel a bit insecure? What if hunting is the only way to sustain yourself? [editline]13th December 2010[/editline] [QUOTE=Lenni;26668200]The problem is that they're not exactly better themselves. When left to their own wit, they'll oppress populations and especially, as the article states, women. I'm sure they're doing it in good faith and all that, but that's not an excuse.[/QUOTE] I agree that the Taliban is generally bad for Afghanistan, but I don't feel the US should be a "world police" to knock out any regime it feels is not "good" for its nation. Plus, Afghanistan has always been a fractured society. I doubt [I]any[/I] organization or government will ever get the support of majority of the population.
Fierce is giving them far to much credit, majority of my friends have served a few tours in Afghanistan and from what I hear its the complete opposite, they're your average gorilla warfare soldiers that have been brainwashed with a motive to which is why they are stubborn to say the least. You can take that with a pinch of salt if you will, but that's my view these people. A lot of media companies seem to portray these guys as deadly assassins in the bushes who read old SAS books. [editline]13th December 2010[/editline] [QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;26668344] Plus, Afghanistan has always been a fractured society. I doubt [I]any[/I] organization or government will ever get the support of majority of the population.[/QUOTE] The Soviets almost did it with their atheist type campaign. A faith system is what keeps those people in control. You bring schools and give women equal rights out there and I can promise you that you could stabilize that place.
[QUOTE=Vasili;26668387]Fierce is giving them far to much credit, majority of my friends have served a few tours in Afghanistan and from what I hear its the complete opposite, they're your average gorilla warfare soldiers that have been brainwashed with a motive to which is why they are stubborn to say the least. You can take that with a pinch of salt if you will, but that's my view these people. A lot of media companies seem to portray these guys as deadly assassins in the bushes who read old SAS books.[/QUOTE] You misinterpreted my definition of fierce. I said they are fierce fighters not because of skill or training, but from their willingness to always fight. I'm not saying their skilled fighters. They aren't, by far. But they are willing and willing and willing to keep on shooting. Its the dedications, regardless of why they are dedicated, that makes the Afghan War of lasted a whole decade with no end in sight still.
[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;26668410]You misinterpreted my definition of fierce. I said they are fierce fighters not because of skill or training, but from their willingness to always fight. I'm not saying their skilled fighters. They aren't, by far. But they are willing and willing and willing to keep on shooting. Its the dedications, regardless of why they are dedicated, that makes the Afghan War of lasted a whole decade with no end in sight still.[/QUOTE] My mistake, I would personally call it stubbornness - it feels rather flattery to use a word such as fierce on the Taliban. The situation is shit poor because America seems to keep bombing everything to shit, I don't understand why they do not do like the British did in our many rebellions in the Empire by building houses, roads, schools, hospitals - we did things for the people and we won them over.
They kind of seem like a bunch of pretty cool guys. Giving each other high fives, shouting sentence long curses and shit, while in reality they're fighting so bad that the US didn't even notice they attacked their convoy.
[QUOTE=Vasili;26668470]My mistake, I would personally call it stubbornness - it feels rather flattery to use a word such as fierce on the Taliban. The situation is shit poor because America seems to keep bombing everything to shit, I don't understand why they do not do like the British did in our many rebellions in the Empire by building houses, roads, schools, hospitals - we did things for the people and we won them over.[/QUOTE] Because of two reasons - - The US is not out to "conquer and incorporate" Afghanistan and thus doesn't need to build shit like that and - The US taxpayer does not want to waste tax money building schools in Afghanistan when the schools in their own neighborhood need renovation. Also, I wasn't really using "fierce" as a compliment to them, just a description. I've always known the word to be neutral, not complementary or insulting.
[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;26668646]Because of two reasons - - The US is not out to "conquer and incorporate" Afghanistan and thus doesn't need to build shit like that and - The US taxpayer does not want to waste tax money building schools in Afghanistan when the schools in their own neighborhood need renovation.[/QUOTE] Then they're going to fail. You can't just keep giving money to farmers and ask them to not grow opium.
[QUOTE=Vasili;26668672]Then they're going to fail. You can't just keep giving money to farmers and ask them to not grow opium.[/QUOTE] Yep. Basically, it will. This is an eternal war that will never end if it continues how it is now and has been for the past 10 years. You'll eventually have kids who grow up in the war and start fighting. Not because they want to or because they're brainwashed or because they have to. They'll end up fighting because that's what they've always known. Fighting in war will be the status quo of life there and they'll fight because "that's life".
[img]http://oswego.edu/student/blogs/wp-content/uploads/2009/01/penguins_polar_bear1.jpg[/img]
[QUOTE=Vasili;26668672]Then they're going to fail. You can't just keep giving money to farmers and ask them to not grow opium.[/QUOTE] Why is growing opium a bad thing in Afghanistan again? They've been doing it for thousands of years, who are we to step in and say "herp derp drugs are bad mkay stop growing it right now". I actually think our war on drugs being extended over to Afghanistan is part of the reason they don't like us.
[QUOTE=SM0K3 B4N4N4;26669539]Why is growing opium a bad thing in Afghanistan again? They've been doing it for thousands of years, who are we to step in and say "herp derp drugs are bad mkay stop growing it right now". I actually think our war on drugs being extended over to Afghanistan is part of the reason they don't like us.[/QUOTE] Its not the drugs we dislike about it. It's that the money is the main source of income for the Taliban, which is the US enemy. Basically, we're trying to hurt the Taliban's economy.
[QUOTE=SM0K3 B4N4N4;26669539]Why is growing opium a bad thing in Afghanistan again? They've been doing it for thousands of years, who are we to step in and say "herp derp drugs are bad mkay stop growing it right now". I actually think our war on drugs being extended over to Afghanistan is part of the reason they don't like us.[/QUOTE] Because thats how these terrorists fund their campaigns, they sell these drugs to the west and in return get to kill you.
[QUOTE=CabooseRvB;26664138]They're people with 11th century motives given modern weapons.[/QUOTE] Islamic society was a hell of a lot more progressive in the 11th century than it is in the middle east today
[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;26668344]But what if everyone else is carrying a gun as well? Won't you feel a bit insecure? What if hunting is the only way to sustain yourself?[/QUOTE] If I was in a war zone, I would find another way to find food. Domesticated animals and farming are alternatives. An Apache flying overhead sees a few guys in the woods(In an area where Americans and the Afghan army are operating) with guns, they can't assume they are hunting for food. That's just the reality of it. The best way to stop Taliban is to cooperate with the locals and have them push the Taliban out. I mean Taliban just go to these villages and pay 10-15 dollars or less to get their sons to fight the Americans. And educating the locals of the situation and educating them the truth about the Taliban is a great way to help stop this war.
Alot of you have no idea what you're talking about... We hire local's to work on the base (run stores, the chow halls, cleaning, trash, ect...) Many Taliban don't know why we are here (there's many people in this country who think russia is still here...) leaders of the Taliban use this to their advantage so they can recruit more. A invading force that seems like it's there for no reason other then taking over seems alot better then "We blew up some of their buildings and killed alot of civilians" They're horrible shots, but creative with explosives, by no means are they dumb Taliban is an oppressing force, they kill those who don't believe what they believe, they're radical's, despite how "religious" they are, they'll break every little rule to get a stab at U.S. troops, they've even been known to turn burial sites into IED's... We're trying to stop the growth of opium because it does nothing for the economy here, all it does is fund terrorist act's. Essentially we are trying to give the nation of Afghanistan the ability to fight for it's self and survive on it's own.
[QUOTE=Sasasing;26664417]I think we would win their hearts if we showed them more games other than "throwing the rock"[/QUOTE] "Guys, check out this new game called Medal of H-wait, no"
people tend to forget that these are actual human beings we're fighting really, they're fighting for what they believe in, and while that's not always honourable, it doesn't change that these people have emotions, they are human.
[QUOTE=Archy;26678487]people tend to forget that these are actual human beings we're fighting really, they're fighting for what they believe in, and while that's not always honourable, it doesn't change that these people have emotions, they are human.[/QUOTE] Quite a bit of people don't like thinking of the enemy as human, causes the war to lose support. And I'm damn sure the government wants to keep that support.
[QUOTE=Fables;26679193]Quite a bit of people don't like thinking of the enemy as human, causes the war to lose support. And I'm damn sure the government wants to keep that support.[/QUOTE] The government has the support of the people for this war?
[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;26680258]The government has the support of the people for this war?[/QUOTE] Maybe not, but soldiers often do. Watch restrepo.
[QUOTE=Roof;26664124]Interesting.. :saddowns:[/QUOTE] Yeah, it's almost like they're human... Oh, wait... [editline]14th December 2010[/editline] I checked wikipedia - They are.
Wait, The "Source" only shows a bit of the documentary? How do I see the full version which was broadcasted on the 11th. [editline]13th December 2010[/editline] Come on, nobody knows where I can see the entire thing?
This video reminds me another video i once saw about a reporter in the taliban. In that video they tried to blow up a convoy or something and they were waiting in the fields for hours... anyone got a link to that video?
[QUOTE=Mr_Razzums;26681295]Maybe not, but soldiers often do. Watch restrepo.[/QUOTE] They don't really have much choice but to support the war they're in. It's not like they can just walk out when they dislike it.
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