[QUOTE=MachiniOs;31747515]It's hardly tough, looks like another piece of rushed legislation to me.[/QUOTE]
Most of the government's reaction to the riots have been rushed.
PEOPLE WANT THEM EVICTED.
Er yeah ok we better evict them.
TAKE AWAY THEIR BENEFITS.
Oh ok yeah lets do that to.
They were talking about it on BBC radio 2 earlier. Virtually every political commentator says that the government haven't thought this through enough.
So you evict a family of 4 which had 1 member join in the riots, despite the fact the council have a duty to keep families off the street.
Their only option is to move to another county and apply for the housing list there, even then it'll be a while on the streets before they get anywhere.
[QUOTE=smurfy;31746048]If you read the article it says the national service will be voluntary and tells you what it involves.[/QUOTE]
Are you sure? I could've sworn it says it used to be volunteer-only, but he's suggesting making it mandatory.
[editline]15th August 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=RainbowStalin;31748926]Most of the government's reaction to the riots have been rushed.
PEOPLE WANT THEM EVICTED.
Er yeah ok we better evict them.
TAKE AWAY THEIR BENEFITS.
Oh ok yeah lets do that to.
They were talking about it on BBC radio 2 earlier. Virtually every political commentator says that the government haven't thought this through enough.
So you evict a family of 4 which had 1 member join in the riots, despite the fact the council have a duty to keep families off the street.
Their only option is to move to another county and apply for the housing list there, even then it'll be a while on the streets before they get anywhere.[/QUOTE]
Not to mention those are awful ideas rooted in some "punish the scum" mentality.
See? The police use their batons on looters and now its the police who are the bad guys.
Imagine what would've happened if they had rubber bullets.
Also ew Daily Mail.
Also that kid deserved getting his ass beat.
[QUOTE=RainbowStalin;31752565]See? The police use their batons on looters and now its the police who are the bad guys.
Imagine what would've happened if they had rubber bullets.
Also ew Daily Mail.
Also that kid deserved getting his ass beat.[/QUOTE]
I still view the police as doing their job to keep the nation safe. Just because the violence is over it doesn't mean "Oh the threat to myself is gone now, better go and insult the police until I need them again."
More like 'My son got caught looting and the police set him straight. Maybe if I call police brutality enough people will see us as the victims.'
In don't think any of these knee jerk reactions they've come up with are any good at all. Some are more shit than others though.
I don't know what I would do instead, but I haven't asked for people to vote for me to run the country.
I hope David Cameron doesn't get re-elected. If David Milliband were leading labour right now the'd be in better shape.
A guy got 6 months for stealing a bottle of water :v:
[QUOTE=Carne;31771992]A guy got 6 months for stealing a bottle of water :v:[/QUOTE]
and a politician got less for stealing thousands of pounds.
[QUOTE=jaykray;31772346]and a politician got less for stealing thousands of pounds.[/QUOTE]
Wow...
just... what.
That's ridiculous.
[QUOTE=Jallen;31743844]What would this "non-military 'national service' for ALL 16-year-olds" involve? I'm 20 now so it won't really affect me, but I'm wondering exactly what it's going to be all about. Sounds like a load of shit to be honest.
Community service for everyone pretty much. Maybe it will solve problems, but when I was 16 (and if I had to do it now too) I wouldn't have cared about it and would have put in the least amount of effort to get through it without causing a problem for myself.[/QUOTE]
Basically all it does is stop them getting jobs v:v:v
[QUOTE=DaCommie1;31693828]Both sets of people want to preserve their culture, you can't honestly say Bill 101 promoted multiculturalism, nor does the separatist ideal. Matter of fact, Quebec even now does the best it can to oppress especially English and American cultures in an effort to preserve their own. Quebec tries to get its culture recognized by prevent other cultures from taking it over. In Britain, if their culture gets taken over completely, then they'd just end up becoming an America with a different accent, a nation perceived as "cultureless," despite the fact that America is far from.
Immigration is, as I see it, supposed to be about moving from one nation and culture to another, and accepting that as you have gone somewhere new they are not going to operate as your old country did, and you should do the best you can to integrate with the new society. Issues arise when that doesn't happen, and when a new culture attempts to take over, as it leads to unrest and disorder from all parties involved, the new culture because they feel the need to be recognized and the old one because they want theirs to be preserved. Such an issue has lead to wars in the past, and will likely lead to more in the future, because often times both parties feel an entitlement to their respective culture, especially if there is a lot of it present, even if it is a foreign culture. In my eyes, allowing another culture to co-exist in one's country is no problem, but when it begins to rob that country of its own culture, then it becomes a problem. That doesn't mean necessarily you should oppress the other culture, or try to eliminate it, but it can lead to major issues with national identity, and can often only be solved through concessions to the one culture that tend to take away from the other. I see no problem in saying you want to preserve your culture in your homeland, and I see no problem in saying you want some recognition of your culture in a foreign land, however I see a problem if your culture begins to take over the native one, and yes, that includes our current treatment of the Natives here.[/QUOTE]
Late, but these are my exact words. I totally agree with you. This might happen to Sweden too in a not too distant future.
[quote]Jordan Blackshaw, 21, of Marston, Cheshire, and Perry Sutcliffe-Keenan, 22, of Warrington, also Cheshire, were[B] jailed for four years each after admitting using Facebook to incite disorder[/B], although none actually resulted.[/quote]
[quote]A 17-year-old from Suffolk has been [B]banned from using social networking sites for 12 months and ordered to observe a three month overnight curfew for using Facebook to encourage people to riot[/B]. He said the remarks were not meant to be taken seriously.[/quote]
[quote]Anderson Fernandes, 22, was warned by a judge at Manchester Magistrates' Court [B]he may face jail for stealing two scoops of ice cream. He will be sentenced next week after admitting burglary.[/B] [/quote]
[quote]Nicolas Robinson, 23, of Borough, south-east London, was [B]jailed for six months for burglary. He took a £3.50 case of water from Lidl[/B] supermarket[/quote]
[quote]Mother-of-two Ursula Nevin, from Manchester, was [B]jailed for five months for receiving a pair of shorts given to her after they had been looted from a city centre store[/B].[/quote]
[quote]The Recorder of Chester, Judge Elgan Edwards, said he hoped the sentences, which carried[B] maximum sentences of 10 years[/B], would act as a deterrent to others.[/quote]
I'm all for tough sentences but wow
[QUOTE=matt.ant;31785609]I'm all for tough sentences but wow[/QUOTE]
"Hmm, these people were rioting over absolutely nothing, lets give them something to riot about!"
[QUOTE=matt.ant;31785609]I'm all for tough sentences but wow[/QUOTE]
They're seriously doing "deterrent" sentences? What a joke.
[QUOTE=Megafanx13;31787527]They're seriously doing "deterrent" sentences? What a joke.[/QUOTE]
The Conservatives are desperate to prove their Law and Order credentials so of course they are.
[QUOTE=jaykray;31787247]"Hmm, these people were rioting over absolutely nothing, lets give them something to riot about!"[/QUOTE]
No ones going to riot if it means a 10 year sentence
[QUOTE=matt.ant;31790654]No ones going to riot if it means a 10 year sentence[/QUOTE]
That's a fucking ridiculous legth for a democracy, sure maybe if we were an autocracy but we aren't.
The only reason the riots spread was because people thought they could get away with it. Tough sentencing is a way to try and tell people they [i]can't[/i] get away with it.
[QUOTE=Mort and Charon;31792039]The only reason the riots spread was because people thought they could get away with it. Tough sentencing is a way to try and tell people they [i]can't[/i] get away with it.[/QUOTE]
Tougher sentences as a "deterrent" simply don't work. It might scare people momentarily, but I guarantee you if an opportunity came by again, opportunists aren't going to stay at home and say "well if I did that I'd go to jail".
That's what I think they're doing it for. To stamp out the rioting completely so they can get shit together.
SUPER NANNY has the riots all figured out. [url=http://gamepolitics.com/2011/08/17/super-nanny-discusses-london-riots-blames-video-games]It's the video games.[/url]
[editline]17th August 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=matt.ant;31785609]I'm all for tough sentences but wow[/QUOTE]
what bullshit
at least now people have a legit reason to riot
"OMG peaople getting jailed for theft!!111 RIOT!!!!"
Those sentences should be used normally. Then we'd have people who actually obeyed the law instead of not giving a shit because sentencing is so light.
[QUOTE=Mort and Charon;31793738]"OMG peaople getting jailed for theft!!111 RIOT!!!!"
Those sentences should be used normally. Then we'd have people who actually obeyed the law instead of not giving a shit because sentencing is so light.[/QUOTE]
Deterrence doesn't work
[QUOTE=Zeke129;31793512]SUPER NANNY has the riots all figured out. [url=http://gamepolitics.com/2011/08/17/super-nanny-discusses-london-riots-blames-video-games]It's the video games.[/url][/QUOTE]
People need to stop using phrases like "killing and burning for points", it's so archaic.
[editline]18th August 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Zeke129;31793746]Deterrence doesn't work[/QUOTE]
Has there been a nuclear war?
Really? Jail time instead of a fucking community service that most people get should be enough to make people think twice. It's a joke when we have police and detectives working hard to catch criminals and they get off with hardly anything. What happened to the "Justice"?
My dad worked a case on a thief, who committed 12 burglaries (one was his own grandmother) and 2 muggings. Got him to admit to them all and everything. He got 5 years. Won't even serve all of that.
[QUOTE=Mort and Charon;31793862]Really? Jail time instead of a fucking community service that most people get should be enough to make people think twice. It's a joke when we have police and detectives working hard to catch criminals and they get off with hardly anything. What happened to the "Justice"?
My dad worked a case on a thief, who committed 12 burglaries (one was his own grandmother) and 2 muggings. Got him to admit to them all and everything. He got 5 years. Won't even serve all of that.[/QUOTE]
Justice means nothing when people are looking
[QUOTE=Mort and Charon;31793862]Really? Jail time instead of a fucking community service that most people get should be enough to make people think twice. It's a joke when we have police and detectives working hard to catch criminals and they get off with hardly anything. What happened to the "Justice"?[/QUOTE]
Sounds to me like you aren't interesting in reform, rehabilitation, or any real "justice", only retribution and bloodlust.
[editline]17th August 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=jaykray;31793849]Has there been a nuclear war?[/QUOTE]
You're seriously comparing Mutually Assured Destruction to "tough on crime" policies?
[editline]17th August 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Mort and Charon;31793738]"OMG peaople getting jailed for theft!!111 RIOT!!!!"
Those sentences should be used normally. Then we'd have people who actually obeyed the law instead of not giving a shit because sentencing is so light.[/QUOTE]
That has not worked and will [B]never[/B] work.
[editline]17th August 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Mort and Charon;31793343]To stamp out the rioting completely so they can get shit together.[/QUOTE]
Again, that's not going to be the result.
[QUOTE=Zeke129;31793512]SUPER NANNY has the riots all figured out. [url=http://gamepolitics.com/2011/08/17/super-nanny-discusses-london-riots-blames-video-games]It's the video games.[/url][/QUOTE]
ah what
Supernanny was fun to watch, that woman was disturbingly good at child discipline. Then the parents invariably let it all go to hell again in the week where she disappeared :v:
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