[QUOTE=Karbinev2;22166832]something like 70% of the US agrees with the bill, isn't surprising others are taking up on az's courageousness[/QUOTE]
And over 50% wanted a public option, but it didn't happen. Polls mean nothing.
[editline]12:40AM[/editline]
If illegal immigrants could arrive here legally, they would. You guys are like a bunch of whiny suburban 15 year olds, you don't know shit about how this works.
[QUOTE=Thy Reaper;22175808]Nothing in that first link seems even slightly related to the Arizona law.
The text in the second link is far too long to read at the moment.[/QUOTE]
The actual bill was called [url="http://www.azleg.gov/legtext/49leg/2r/bills/sb1070s.pdf"][B]sb1070s[/B][/url].
It's 17 pages long. Only one thing stands out. However there is no mention of [url="http://antithaksin.files.wordpress.com/2009/04/gestapo.jpg"][B]these guys[/B][/url] roaming the streets as the media says.
[QUOTE=Leon Trotsky;22175917]they have rights regardless of whether they're here legally or not
they're still humans[/QUOTE]I'm in your house, living in it and eating your food. I have a right to live, so don't you DARE shoot me with your gun! I have a right to happiness, so hitting me with a baseball bat would give me displeasure, which is the antitheses of happiness.
[QUOTE=FoxwolfJackson;22175919]Tell that to the illegals who stand in the welfare lines in my hometown.[/QUOTE]
you have to be a legal citizen to get welfare
anecdotal stories? cool
[QUOTE=FoxwolfJackson;22175919]If all illegal immigrants arrived here legally, they would be working in jobs that paid taxes to help PAY for those welfare checks.[/QUOTE]
You miss the part where that costs more money than is made back in taxes. So no, they wouldn't help enough to pay the taxes because far more immigrants come from poor, uneducated backgrounds than native citizens. (~9% for natives, 26% for legals, and 55% for illegals, for the particular measure they used).
[QUOTE=FoxwolfJackson;22175953]I'm in your house, living in it and eating your food. I have a right to live, so don't you DARE shoot me with your gun! I have a right to happiness, so hitting me with a baseball bat would give me displeasure, which is the antitheses of happiness.[/QUOTE]
terrible analogy
and you don't kill people just because they're in your house
[QUOTE=FoxwolfJackson;22175953]I'm in your house, living in it and eating your food. I have a right to live, so don't you DARE shoot me with your gun! I have a right to happiness, so hitting me with a baseball bat would give me displeasure, which is the antitheses of happiness.[/QUOTE]
What an exaggerated analogy.
[editline]12:44AM[/editline]
Damnit Trotsky
[QUOTE=Nyaos;22175931]If illegal immigrants could arrive here legally, they would. You guys are like a bunch of whiny suburban 15 year olds, you don't know shit about how this works.[/QUOTE]
basically this
summarization of this thread: "but they're criminals.. they need to be punished. nah nah nah you're wrong, anything you say does not matter because they're breaking the law!"
[QUOTE=Thy Reaper;22175967]You miss the part where that costs more money than is made back in taxes. So no, they wouldn't help enough to pay the taxes because far more immigrants come from poor, uneducated backgrounds than native citizens. (~9% for natives, 26% for legals, and 55% for illegals, for the particular measure they used).[/QUOTE]
Then perhaps it is best that the welfare system either be revamped OR abolished completely. There's another wonderful tax cut that the middle class direly needs.
--------------------
[QUOTE=Leon Trotsky;22175971]terrible analogy
and you don't kill people just because they're in your house[/QUOTE]I wouldn't? I know how to handle the guns in this house (and the bow). I feel bad for the poor son of a bitch who is on the wrong end of the deer hunting rifle. You got five seconds to get out before I shoot.
Don't tell me I wouldn't shoot someone for tresspassing, because this is MY house and you are in MY area without permission.
---------------------
EDIT: I HAD to make exaggerated analogies. It's what liberals are good at! I need to speak their language to get anything done. Obviously, speaking with logic doesn't work. It's like speaking English to an alien who can only speak Spanish.
[QUOTE=FoxwolfJackson;22176026]Then perhaps it is best that the welfare system either be revamped OR abolished completely. There's another wonderful tax cut that the middle class direly needs.
--------------------
I wouldn't? I know how to handle the guns in this house (and the bow). I feel bad for the poor son of a bitch who is on the wrong end of the deer hunting rifle. You got five seconds to get out before I shoot.
Don't tell me I wouldn't shoot someone for tresspassing, because this is MY house and you are in MY area without permission.
---------------------
EDIT: I HAD to make exaggerated analogies. It's what liberals are good at! I need to speak their language to get anything done. Obviously, speaking with logic doesn't work. It's like speaking English to an alien who can only speak Spanish.[/QUOTE]
Now you're turning it into a typical us versus them shitstorm, the type you see on Fox. "It's what liberals are good at!" by saying that, you alienate yourself from any true discourse, by siding with an ideology instead of an actual argument.
[QUOTE=FoxwolfJackson;22176026]Then perhaps it is best that the welfare system either be revamped OR abolished completely. There's another wonderful tax cut that the middle class direly needs.[/QUOTE]
yeah, heaven forbid we help feed people.
[QUOTE=FoxwolfJackson;22176026]I wouldn't? I know how to handle the guns in this house (and the bow). I feel bad for the poor son of a bitch who is on the wrong end of the deer hunting rifle. You got five seconds to get out before I shoot.
Don't tell me I wouldn't shoot someone for tresspassing, because this is MY house and you are in MY area without permission.[/QUOTE]
you are a fucking lunatic. you're one of those people who would shoot and kill someone because they were stealing your TV.
you're ignorant on this subject as well? the only place you'd probably get away with shooting someone like that is Texas. other than that it's just not going to work. you can only shoot someone if they're an imminent threat to you or someone else (bodily harm). you can't legally shoot someone just because they're on your property or they're stealing property you fucking trigger happy psycho.
[QUOTE=Nyaos;22176077]Now you're turning it into a typical us versus them shitstorm, the type you see on Fox. "It's what liberals are good at!" by saying that, you alienate yourself from any true discourse, by siding with an ideology instead of an actual argument.[/QUOTE]Well, seeing as how you fail to see the logic and the light of my enlighteningly intelligent posts, I had to make a new attempt.
The definition of insanity is to do the same thing over and over expecting to get different results.
[QUOTE=Leon Trotsky;22176080]yeah, heaven forbid we help feed people.[/QUOTE]
Social Darwinism: Survival of the fittest. The welfare system is supposed to be for seven years, yet would you deny it when I say people are on the program for longer than that?
[QUOTE=Leon Trotsky;22176080]you are a fucking lunatic. you're one of those people who would shoot and kill someone because they were stealing your TV.
you're ignorant on this subject as well? the only place you'd probably get away with shooting someone like that is Texas. other than that it's just not going to work. you can only shoot someone if they're an imminent threat to you or someone else (bodily harm). you can't legally shoot someone for stealing property you fucking trigger happy psycho.[/QUOTE]
Let me tell you something. When you spot a robber in the house, most likely they are going to attack you if they see you're there. I'm simply taking initiative for preventing bodily harm.
[QUOTE=FoxwolfJackson;22176026] I HAD to make exaggerated analogies. It's what liberals are good at! I need to speak their language to get anything done. Obviously, speaking with logic doesn't work. It's like speaking English to an alien who can only speak Spanish.[/QUOTE]
Ha whatever
[QUOTE=FoxwolfJackson;22176084]Social Darwinism: Survival of the fittest.[/QUOTE]
lol, yeah you're an idiot. what little credibility you had left is now gone. anyone who believes in social darwinism is a fucking lunatic.
[QUOTE=FoxwolfJackson;22176084]Let me tell you something. When you spot a robber in the house, most likely they are going to attack you if they see you're there. I'm simply taking initiative for preventing bodily harm.[/QUOTE]
baseless claim
most burglars try to avoid any confrontations
[editline]01:54AM[/editline]
where do you live and how old are you?
[QUOTE=FoxwolfJackson;22176084]Well, seeing as how you fail to see the logic and the light of my enlighteningly intelligent posts, I had to make a new attempt.
The definition of insanity is to do the same thing over and over expecting to get different results.
Social Darwinism: Survival of the fittest. The welfare system is supposed to be for seven years, yet would you deny it when I say people are on the program for longer than that?
Let me tell you something. When you spot a robber in the house, most likely they are going to attack you if they see you're there. I'm simply taking initiative for preventing bodily harm.[/QUOTE]
US law does not change within the boundaries of your house.
[QUOTE=FoxwolfJackson;22176084]Social Darwinism: Survival of the fittest. The welfare system is supposed to be for seven years, yet would you deny it when I say people are on the program for longer than that?[/QUOTE]
We have evolved well past the point in which we need to fight to survive.
[QUOTE=Nyaos;22176120]US law does not change within the boundaries of your house.[/QUOTE]
I believe I have every right to protect my rights, as a legal citizen, of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.
[QUOTE=davidofmk771;22176138]We have evolved well past the point in which we need to fight to survive.[/QUOTE]
I don't know... the job market is pretty brutal.
[QUOTE=Leon Trotsky;22176113]where do you live and how old are you?[/QUOTE]
I'm twenty and I live in southern New Jersey. If you knew anything about the area, you'd know that a lot of the area is full of illegal immigrants. I fail to see how this is of any relevance, but I'll humor your inquiries.
EDIT: [QUOTE=Leon Trotsky;22176113]most burglars try to avoid any confrontations[/QUOTE]
Obviously you don't have many gang wars going on in your town. It's a dog eat dog world... sometimes it's kill or be killed.
[QUOTE=davidofmk771;22176138]We have evolved well past the point in which we need to fight to survive.[/QUOTE]
I love you.
[QUOTE=FoxwolfJackson;22175953]I'm in your house, living in it and eating your food. I have a right to live, so don't you DARE shoot me with your gun! [b] I have a right to happiness[/b], so hitting me with a baseball bat would give me displeasure, which is the antitheses of happiness.[/QUOTE]
Wrong! You have the right to the [b]Pursuit[/b] of Happiness. The [b]Pursuit[/b] does not guarantee that you obtain it.
[QUOTE=Leon Trotsky;22176113]lol, yeah you're an idiot. what little credibility you had left is now gone. anyone who believes in social darwinism is a fucking lunatic.
baseless claim
most burglars try to avoid any confrontations
[editline]01:54AM[/editline]
where do you live and how old are you?[/QUOTE]
LOL. Typical retarded tangent that leads to age being a factor. He has a view and it differs from yours. You should realize by now he's not going to change his mind. His view on shooting burglars is not a lunatic idea. If someone were to break into my house and try to steal my shit, if I had an opportunity I would call the police I would. However I live in home invasion central where burglars come in and just kill entire families for crap to pawn. So I side with shoot the fuckers. They are scum.
By the way this thread is about a state that doesn't matter saying fuck you arizona. So lets go on with that.
[QUOTE=FoxwolfJackson;22176161]I believe I have every right to protect my rights, as a legal citizen, of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.[/QUOTE]
you're not legally allowed to shoot someone just because they're on your property
read what I posted
you own guns and you don't even know the laws pertaining to deadly force?
what is wrong with you
[QUOTE=FoxwolfJackson;22176161]I believe I have every right to protect my rights, as a legal citizen, of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.[/QUOTE]
This is such a general statement. You have no right to punish theft with death. Would the court do so? No, absolutely not.
[QUOTE=Sgt.Sgt;22176171]His view on shooting burglars is not a lunatic idea. [/QUOTE]
shooting someone who isn't an imminent threat to you or others (bodily harm) is a retarded idea. you can't legally shoot someone just because they broke into your house brohound.
[QUOTE=Sgt.Sgt;22176171]LOL. Typical retarded tangent that leads to age being a factor. He has a view and it differs from yours. You should realize by now he's not going to change his mind. His view on shooting burglars is not a lunatic idea. If someone were to break into my house and try to steal my shit, if I had an opportunity I would call the police I would. However I live in home invasion central where burglars come in and just kill entire families for crap to pawn. So I side with shoot the fuckers. They are scum.
By the way this thread is about a state that doesn't matter saying fuck you arizona. So lets go on with that.[/QUOTE]
You can threaten with a gun, but when you shoot someone, you cross the line.
[QUOTE=FoxwolfJackson;22176161]I don't know... the job market is pretty brutal.[/QUOTE]
Compared to the times when Homo Sapiens were just getting started?
[QUOTE=Leon Trotsky;22176204]shooting someone who isn't an imminent threat to you or others (bodily harm) is a retarded idea. you can't legally shoot someone just because they broke into your house brohound.[/QUOTE]
Yes you can actually. All you have to do is feel threatened.
[QUOTE=Nyaos;22176215]You can threaten with a gun, but when you shoot someone, you cross the line.[/QUOTE]
Not if there is a good reason.
[QUOTE=Sgt.Sgt;22176171]By the way this thread is about a state that doesn't matter saying fuck you arizona. So lets go on with that.[/QUOTE]
Agreed. I still want to know what's so great about keeping illegal immigrants here. What's to stop every single Tom, Dick, and Harry from coming into the country illegally? Overcrowding issues aside, how will we be able to spot terroristic threats on home soil.
We had 9/11 happen to us at the current (albeit lax) levels of immigration security. Imagine if we lowered them even further!
[QUOTE=Sgt.Sgt;22176219]Yes you can actually. All you have to do is feel threatened.[/QUOTE]
breaking into house =/= threatened
they have to act in a manner that makes you fear for you or someone else's life
that doesn't mean someone breaking into your house and looting a TV justifies you shooting them
[QUOTE=Sgt.Sgt;22176219]Yes you can actually. All you have to do is feel threatened.[/QUOTE]
No, you fucking can't. Some thug guy comes up to you and gives you the look, you shoot him, and then you justify it because you are threatened? Unless they find evidence of his gun or weapon out, you're fucked with an assault or murder charge.
[QUOTE=FoxwolfJackson;22176222]Agreed. I still want to know what's so great about keeping illegal immigrants here. What's to stop every single Tom, Dick, and Harry from coming into the country illegally? Overcrowding issues aside, how will we be able to spot terroristic threats on home soil.
We had 9/11 happen to us at the current (albeit lax) levels of immigration security. Imagine if we lowered them even further![/QUOTE]
What the fuck ever. There are plenty of terrorists that born and raised Americans.
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