US inequality at historic high, surpassing Roaring ’20s - Polidicks

[QUOTE=sgman91;42163062]Yeah, why not just print 100 million for everyone! That way we could all be rich![/QUOTE] That's not even fucking close to my suggestion.

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;42183907]he does when it's a shitty oven[/QUOTE] Communists always blame the circumstances in which their revolution is in. The government crushes them . The proletariat is not yet conscious. The country has yet to develop industrially. The Capitalists have used the welfare state to delay things. The capitalist countries have used their militaries to crush communist revolutions. The police oppress the proletariat. The anarchists/feminists/social democrats/people I don't like have split up our movement. Why don't you address faults in your ideology for once instead of blaming somebody else? Every attempt at a Communist revolution has failed in every conceivable circumstance.

The problem is congress is made up of a bunch of iron triangles. Introduce term limits and there wont be these career politicians getting relected year after year with bank money. The mind is a very powerful thing that can do the work of hundreds of thousands of people by coming up with new ways of doing things so ingenius that all of humanity looks dumb. I wouldn't underestimate rich folk's contribution to society and would be willing to bet that they know more about how to successfully implement a new way of doing things more than anyone else.

[QUOTE=DanRatherman;42161123]While I'll fully agree that every system has it's flaws I have both logical and moral problems with capitalism as the basis of a civilized society. I've recently come to find that syndicalist direct democracy makes the best impression and is suitably realistic to apply even to a country with a high-expectation of luxury goods and services like the U.S.; a system where both economics and government are dictated by direct voting and decision making on behalf of the participants. I haven't really scratched the surface, but I think models proposed by Noam Chomsky and the examples of co-op ownership in businesses is a good example of the direction we should take. [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarcho-syndicalism[/url] Do away with the entire middleman of government and executives so to speak.[/QUOTE] Any A or AS system only works in a relatively small pool with fairly limited resources, ideally in situations where everyone knows everyone. Essentially these systems are as effective as communist system in these fairly small communities and do indeed create a fairly well working framework. But they tend to collapse in larger groups for various reasons. The government and executives aren't a merely extraneous element that has showed up over time and can be removed as well. They do perform a number of semi vital functions which an AS system just cannot.

The thing is, poor people today (at least in the US) are still better-off than poor people in many other countries and better-off than they were in the past. Poor people don't starve to death today. And people below the poverty line still have iPhones and cable TV. In their [I]houses[/I].

[QUOTE=DanRatherman;42183762]Well if being shot to death by Fascists and Communists counts as failing.[/QUOTE] It counts when a society doesn't have the number and organization to avoid being shot to death.

[QUOTE=Van-man;42166219]Except those working in factories. AKA the bottom-end class. [editline]12th September 2013[/editline] Yay free-market capitalism[/QUOTE] No one is forcing them to work in factories. People work in those factories because they pay far better than any other job available and they don't have to worry about starving every year when harvest isn't ideal. It's ignorant to compare a country with hundreds of years of free market and industrialization to a country were a very large portion of people still live in rural, secluded, farming villages.

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;42184447]Communists always blame the circumstances in which their revolution is in. The government crushes them . The proletariat is not yet conscious. The country has yet to develop industrially. The Capitalists have used the welfare state to delay things. The capitalist countries have used their militaries to crush communist revolutions. The police oppress the proletariat. The anarchists/feminists/social democrats/people I don't like have split up our movement. Why don't you address faults in your ideology for once instead of blaming somebody else? Every attempt at a Communist revolution has failed in every conceivable circumstance.[/QUOTE] To be fair communism rests upon certain things needing to be achieved before it ever could be successful (superabundance etc.). Things that didn't exist at the time of communist revolutions

[QUOTE=KillerJaguar;42166263]Did you know Foxconn had to install safety nets around their factories to stop people from constantly killing themselves?[/QUOTE] Again, no one was forcing them to work there. They took the job because it was better than any other possible job. I never said capitalism instantly gets rid of suffering. I said it makes LESS suffering. [editline]13th September 2013[/editline] Also, "The suicide rate at Foxconn during the suicide spate remained lower than that of the general Chinese population[8] as well as all 50 states in the United States.[9]" - ([URL]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foxconn_suicides[/URL])

[QUOTE=Lonestriper;42186664]To be fair communism rests upon certain things needing to be achieved before it ever could be successful (superabundance etc.). Things that didn't exist at the time of communist revolutions[/QUOTE] Superabundance is physically impossible. Why is it that there is always an excuse for the failings of Communism? Why can't I defend monarchism in the same way?

[QUOTE=UziXxX;42158476]I honestly would rather be dead than red. Socialism doesn't work. Ask anyone who lived through the USSR and remembers the bread lines. The quality of things were terrible. (Look at soviet cars of the era). There wasn't enough food... I can go on. There is as reason why that system collapsed. There is also a reason why countries that have some form of capitalism are a lot more prosperous than those that don't. I personaly support a flat tax. When you lower taxes, people have more disposable income (History tells us this). Lower interest rates to encourage investing. Even though any economist will tell you that raising minimum wage will raise unemployment, I do support raising the minimum wage to the point where if you work full time at minimum, you won't be in poverty. I don't like this assumption. I'm not sure why people have this early 1900s view of wealthy people where they laugh at the misfortune of peasents. Just because someone is wealthy doesn't mean they don't give a shit about poor people. If you started a company with your blood sweat and tears, what is your motivation to continue to work hard if your money is taken away from you because "there are poor people that have less money than you"? There are extremes are both sides of the fence there, but wealth and success =/= hatred & superiority for /over poor people[/QUOTE] Educate yourself. Many countries in Europe have a government system that adopted a Socialist Capitalism stance. Add to it liberal/green/rightist parties that also have some say in the overall working of the government. Each political system has its benefits. Just mix and match the benefits to outpower the disadvantages. At the moment the USA is just a bag filled with disadvantages for the poor, but greatly beneficial for rich and born rich folk. [editline]14th September 2013[/editline] You guys. The only viable options aren't Communism or Capitalism. There is a wonderful grey area all in between. When it comes to Welfare, adopt the socialist even communist ideas. When it comes down to Economy use the Capitalistic ones. There you go.

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;42188327]Superabundance is physically impossible. Why is it that there is always an excuse for the failings of Communism? Why can't I defend monarchism in the same way?[/QUOTE] There are excuses for the failings of communism because too many idiots decided that their country was a special snowflake which didn't need to check off everything on the list before launching into a complete upheaval of the social fabric. Superabundance is certainly a far-fetched idea but boy that didn't stop Lenin or Mao!

[QUOTE=Lonestriper;42188868]There are excuses for the failings of communism because too many idiots decided that their country was a special snowflake which didn't need to check off everything on the list before launching into a complete upheaval of the social fabric. Superabundance is certainly a far-fetched idea but boy that didn't stop Lenin or Mao![/QUOTE] As long as Communists leave the country alone and don't try to kill people I'm fine with them. We will wait for "superabundance".

Things would be so much better if we were all communist! I didn't pay attention in history class