• Russia: Somali pirates freed 300 miles offshore may have drowned. No shit.
    155 replies, posted
Sell drugs. i think.... they can grow stuff in Somalia right? its not a desert? That's how mexico does it I think.
[QUOTE=mzathemind;21900614]Russia is so badass. i'm gonna buy Rosetta stone: Russian just in case shit happens.[/QUOTE] Rosetta stone kinda sucks, especially the Russian version. Teaches you a bunch of stuff you'll never hear a Russian say.
[QUOTE=Sleepy Head;21895034]who the fuck cares, theyʻre some scum of the earth who have nothing better to do than be thugs[/QUOTE] They live in [I]somalia. [/I]Does somebody need to explain this to you? The country is a rock bottom shithole, you do what you have to do or you [B][I]die[/I][/B], it's as simple as that.
The pirate captains response is almost comical.
[QUOTE=The_Fly56556;21908351]Good. Fucking pirates don't deserve a trial.[/QUOTE] I think you're definitely going to give Gmod_fan777 a run for his money.
That was quite harsh move from russia, but then again. What do you expect from a country that has closest thing to a God as their leader? [img]http://img28.imageshack.us/img28/769/1272238859663.jpg[/img]
Good on Russia.
[QUOTE=TH89;21914708]Please, tell us how you got yourself out of poverty in Somalia.[/QUOTE] The answer currently appears to be: Move to Finland!
[QUOTE=Heroms;21913928] There are other ways to make money and get yourself out of poverty, it just takes half a brain and some patience. [/QUOTE] I believe you are unfamiliar with the term poverty. Dismissing the crime as "a crime is a crime" is stupid. They have motivations for their crimes, and their motivations aren't to score 10 million dollars and blow it all on hookers. They are driven by their poverty to seek high reward from a risky activity. You can crack down on the piracy in these areas as much as you like, but until you put a fucking concrete wall between somalia and the cargo ships, its still going to happen. If we help them, if we can try and find ways to improve their country and standards of living, piracy will be reduced. That may not be a simple task, but calling them scumbags is just sidestepping the real issue which is that they live in an area ravaged by war and poverty, and this drives them to commit the crime.
Why wont Russia and some other countries just run the shit to the ground, every one hates these pirates anyway and they only do harm for everyone.
America tried helping Somalia once, look at what happened then, two black hawks got destroyed, 20 killed, 91 wounded, 1 captured so it's not like they haven't tried before.
Putin is SO bad-ass. And his puppet Medevev too, by extension. [editline]09:37AM[/editline] Anyway, TH. Somali pirates say they'll harm anyone from the countries that don't allow them to get away with piracy. Why even put the pirates back in their boat, FFS. Give them life jackets, put them down a couple hundred miles offshore, and tell them to swim. Justice at its sweetest. Oh, and leave one of them with a radio with which they can contact their friends elsewhere. Tell me a better deterrent and I'd love to hear it.
[QUOTE=Sirdangolot5;21899742] Those are both things they could have done and in fact are what most people usually do [/QUOTE] You read the article right? They weren't going to go to trial if they'd taken them home with them. And I imagine heading toward the coast of Somalia in a warship is an invitation to get shot at. Like I said though, taking their navigation equipment after dropping them in a skiff was a bit over the top. I'm not passing judgment on the pirates, I'm just saying they knew it wouldn't be all Sunshine and Lollipops trying to hijack ships.
ten bucks says it was the Russians who killed them
[QUOTE=duckduckdean;21914600]In the end it comes down to circumstance. When you are born into poverty, war and violence with little to no means of climbing out sometimes you have no options and jsut do anything to meet your necessities and get out alive. I do not see many stories of them killing their hostages, even when a family cannot afford the ransom they normally fund-raise it. And when you say it takes half a brain to get out of poverty. Please elaborate. I think its safe to say that the eductaion available to these pirates was not cutting edge. I'd love to hear your method for getting out of poverty as long as it doesn't involve me getting an email that I won some contest in Nigeria. Yes they did commit a crime. And their motivations were primarily monetary. But who knows what that money was going to be used for. To get their families out of poverty, to feed their children, to live a better life or possibly to do drugs but i doubt it. Saying things like its not our fault they live in their "little mud huts"is extremely close minded and ignorant. You could just as easily be in that mud hut, except you lucked out. /My point of view [/QUOTE] So you're saying holding people hostage with guns is okay as long as you're doing it out of the need for food? What about the people that are being held hostage? I don't think getting out of poverty is even these pirates goal, seems to me like they are just pissed off. If they were trying to get out of poverty they wouldn't hold people ransom for a million dollars, that's pushing it. I didn't live or know anything about living in Somalia to explain how you would get out of poverty, but don't tell me there isn't a better way then taking people hostage. If you decide to go down that path, you may as well be ready to face the consequences, not whine about your dead pirate friends. I don't see how them living in mud huts is close minded or ignorant, it's a fact for some areas of Africa. Back in Ancient Rome when the Roman's were busy building houses out of bricks, bridges, war contraptions, metal armor, having some form of a government, etc, people in Africa were chasing lions and building straw houses in their clans. Rome didn't have any help persay, why were they able to do it and not Africa? [QUOTE=TH89;21914708] Also, if you honestly believe that anyone accused of a crime should be put to death without a trial, there is something wrong with you. That's not meant as an attack or anything, I'm serious. That is pretty sociopathic thinking.[/QUOTE] When did I ever say something like that? If there is evidence rendering the person guilty beyond a reasonable doubt and the crime was one deserving the death penalty then yeah go for it, is that not how the law works? (rhetorical question) Trials are always necessary, our system isn't perfect and wrongful convictions still exist. Again, as I said in my previous post, if there is an influence of a foreign nation then something should definitely be done, that doesn't mean people should now go and start harming others. Have you ever been robbed or assaulted before? Just because some guy stole my jacket I should go punch a random person in the face? Of course what the somalians are going through outweighs being robbed or assaulted, but the point remains.
THAT is how you free prisoners. Sort of like in movies, where the hero will say 'let them go' and then they drop them off of a building
[QUOTE=Heroms;21924990]So you're saying holding people hostage with guns is okay as long as you're doing it out of the need for food? What about the people that are being held hostage?[/quote] No, what he is saying is that it's not quite clear cut and dry as you are seeing it through your white knight lenses. [quote] I don't think getting out of poverty is even these pirates goal, seems to me like they are just pissed off. If they were trying to get out of poverty they wouldn't hold people ransom for a million dollars, that's pushing it. I didn't live or know anything about living in Somalia to explain how you would get out of poverty, but don't tell me there isn't a better way then taking people hostage. If you decide to go down that path, you may as well be ready to face the consequences, not whine about your dead pirate friends.[/quote] Take a look at your city's or state's budget. You'll notice it runs into the millions, if not billions for larger ones. You need big cash to run cities, and it's no different from the collection of coastal cities these pirates represents. [quote]I don't see how them living in mud huts is close minded or ignorant, it's a fact for some areas of Africa. Back in Ancient Rome when the Roman's were busy building houses out of bricks, bridges, war contraptions, metal armor, having some form of a government, etc, people in Africa were chasing lions and building straw houses in their clans.[/quote] Rome was a single civilization. Africa is an entire continent. Africa had some advanced civilizations like the ones that arose in west Africa. [quote]Rome didn't have any help persay, why were they able to do it and not Africa?[/quote] It helped that Europe had some distinct advantages in terms of resources and geographical distribution. Guns, Germs, and Steel by Jared Diamond is a good examination of this. However I don't see your point in trying to compare ancient history with modern issues. It's obvious you are approaching this from a Eurocentric perspective. [quote] Again, as I said in my previous post, if there is an influence of a foreign nation then something should definitely be done, that doesn't mean people should now go and start harming others.[/quote] Somalia's government can't do anything about other countries overfishing on their waters. What's left for the coastal people to do if they can't fish? They clearly can't get help from their state so they take matters into their own hands. [quote] Have you ever been robbed or assaulted before? Just because some guy stole my jacket I should go punch a random person in the face? Of course what the somalians are going through outweighs being robbed or assaulted, but the point remains.[/QUOTE] Well it does help that you have police to call and live in a stable state. Of course if you're getting robbed in Somalia you're probably losing a lot more than a measly jacket. Something more important like your village's stock of grain for the season.
[QUOTE=MercZ;21925185]No, what he is saying is that it's not quite clear cut and dry as you are seeing it through your white knight lenses. [/QUOTE] Uhh, okay. They're still holding innocent people hostage with guns. Nothing else matters. The law doesn't give a shit if you were drunk when you killed the guy or you killed him because you liked his shoes, murder is murder. [QUOTE=MercZ;21925185] Take a look at your city's or state's budget. You'll notice it runs into the millions, if not billions for larger ones. You need big cash to run cities, and it's no different from the collection of coastal cities these pirates represents. [/QUOTE] Again, how is my city's budget relevant? Are you saying these Somalian pirates want to run Somalia with the money they get from ransom? If they want to get out of povery, a million dollars is crossing the line. In-fact, as I said before, taking people hostage is crossing the line. [QUOTE=MercZ;21925185] Rome was a single civilization. Africa is an entire continent. Africa had some advanced civilizations like the ones that arose in west Africa. [/QUOTE] You just keep rolling in with the irrelvant remarks. Okay, West and South Africa are quite civilized, they should pat themselves on the back. Somalia and many other African countries aren't. [QUOTE=MercZ;21925185] It helped that Europe had some distinct advantages in terms of resources and geographical distribution. Guns, Germs, and Steel by Jared Diamond is a good examination of this. However I don't see your point in trying to compare ancient history with modern issues. It's obvious you are approaching this from a Eurocentric perspective. [/QUOTE] FYI Congo is one of the most nutrient and mineral rich places in the world, yet look at what's going on there. I'm not trying to compare ancient history with modern issues. I'm trying to get people to look at it a different way rather then spew this "We should help poverty in Africa" bullshit. They are and were more than capable of helping themselves. Let's play theories for a second here. If all the foreign government influences were to go away, (all the mines, all the fisheries, everything) are you telling me that Africa would suddenly stand up on it's feet and become a first world country? No. They are still going to continue living in poverty and we really had nothing to do with it, they just for some reason didn't keep up with the times. If foreign nations never interfered in the first place, they would still be living in poverty. [QUOTE=MercZ;21925185] Somalia's government can't do anything about other countries overfishing on their waters. What's left for the coastal people to do if they can't fish? They clearly can't get help from their state so they take matters into their own hands. [/QUOTE] Obviously stop fishing and find another way to make money. Taking people hostage is not the answer. I'd like to see you on one of those boats when a bunch of armed Somalians take it over. [QUOTE=MercZ;21925185] Well it does help that you have police to call and live in a stable state. Of course if you're getting robbed in Somalia you're probably losing a lot more than a measly jacket. Something more important like your village's stock of grain for the season. [/QUOTE] Most of the time when it comes to robberies police doesn't do anything. Again, how is this relevant? That wasn't what I was getting at.
Putin sets off to hunt Somalian Pirates [img]http://www.odt.co.nz/files/story/2008/09/prime_minister_vladimir_putin_holds_a_tranquilizer_4014831664.JPG[/img]
Let Russia put them in their place.
[QUOTE=Mingebox;21895237]As far as the Russians are concerned,[/QUOTE] [img]http://filesmelt.com/dl/PutinOnTheShades.png[/img] [QUOTE=Mingebox;21895237]this operation went swimmingly.[/QUOTE] [img]http://filesmelt.com/dl/PutinOnShades.jpg[/img] [B][I]Da.[/I][/B]
[QUOTE=Mac2468;21914808]Rosetta stone kinda sucks, especially the Russian version. Teaches you a bunch of stuff you'll never hear a Russian say.[/QUOTE] "Where can I get some tea?"
It's like a fucking game of cops and robbers, they expect once they're caught for the russians to just go "Oop! got ya! now we'll close our eyes while you go hide again!" no, that's ridiculous.
Maybe the pirates didn't have any choice before actually joining the crew, you people are lucky being born in decent country's.
I'm lolling at all the neckbeards in this thread "IF I WERE THERE I WOULD PUNCH THEIR BLOOD OUT WITH MY BULLETS" too bad they're taken to piracy by necessity and poverty, in Somalia there is literally no way of making money that isn't owned by a warlord, so the only way is piracy
[QUOTE=Silly;21895206]My friend took hostages and wanted a ransom for them but the SWAT killed him. SWAT's fault. I'm gonna sue them for 1 million dollars.[/QUOTE] Taking out a potential threat and leaving people to die are two very different things. You're supporting murder.
Putin, the most respected leader in the world? [editline]08:56AM[/editline] [img]http://www.bitesizeyoga.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/new-image-300x264.jpg[/img] They must stand trial! [img]http://www.realclearworld.com/blog/Putin.jpg[/img] No!
[QUOTE=Raiskauskone;21917723]That was quite harsh move from russia, but then again. What do you expect from a country that has closest thing to a God as their leader?[/QUOTE] Harsh? against pirates? they know the risks they're taking, and immoral is it may sound i wouldn't mind if the Russian navy had just dealt with them... semi automatically. It would dissuade others.
[IMG]http://punditkitchen.files.wordpress.com/2008/11/political-pictures-vladimir-putin-heart.jpg[/IMG]
[QUOTE=Heroms;21925768]Uhh, okay. They're still holding innocent people hostage with guns. Nothing else matters. The law doesn't give a shit if you were drunk when you killed the guy or you killed him because you liked his shoes, murder is murder. [/QUOTE] No one is arguing that this isn't a crime. People are arguing against your ignorant attitude to the the motivations of these pirates. The absolute core of this problem is the instability of Somalias government. It virtually doesn't have one, with the country in the hands of violent warlords. Without proper law enforcement on their own countries behalf, and far more importantly control over their own waters, piracy will continue. The lack of control in their waters has lead to huge overfishing, NOT on their behalf. Almost $300 million worth of fish per year is taken illegally from their waters by Asian and European companies, depriving local fishermen of their livelihoods. Not only that, but other Asian and European countries dump toxic waste into their waters, proving disastrous for the natual ecosystem. The lack of government control means that Somalia has no resources or institutions to deal with the problem. Piracy is definently linked to this. Their own waters have been exploited by foreigners, and local fisheries have been destroyed thus. You can almost scrape a tiny bit of empathy for them. Admittedly, providing Somalia with proper control over its waters wouldn't solve the problem entirely, given the high risk high reward nature of piracy, but it would undeniably improve the situation. Preventing piracy through international enforcement is of upmost importance, but this is only a treatment for the symptom, not the disease of the problem. Assisting Somalia in establishing control and providing aid is the only way to ensuring the cessation of piracy. That isn't a simple task, but it is a solution.
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