[QUOTE=proch;46814942]There's a difference between a crash and a [I]plane[/I] just disappearing and never being found.[/QUOTE]
I guess so, so far the only one that's been basically known to go missing the malayasia airlines one. this one might still have some wreckage found soon because its so recent. I wouldn't be so quick to call it a trend.
[QUOTE=PolarEventide;46814956]Plane crashes in the ocean spread debris across a wide area. It took two years to find all of the wreckage of Air France Flight 447.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=sloppy_joes;46814962]I guess so, so far the only one that's been basically known to go missing the malayasia airlines one, this one might still be found because it's still recent. I wouldn't be so quick to call it a trend.[/QUOTE]
I guess that makes sense.
[QUOTE=PolarEventide;46814956]Plane crashes in the ocean spread debris across a wide area. It took two years to find all of the wreckage of Air France Flight 447.[/QUOTE]
exactly.
[QUOTE=proch;46814942]There's a difference between a crash and a [I]plane[/I] just disappearing and never being found. Twice in the same year.[/QUOTE]
Well oceans are big and deep.
While plane crashes get a lot of media attention, car crashes are way way more common and quite a few are deadly. It just that deadly car crashes happen so often it doesnt even get in the news sometimes. Planes are still much much safer than driving.
[QUOTE=Nak;46810147][t]http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/assets/img/how-risky-is-flying/image-01-large.jpg[/t]
(For US 1999-2003 .. but my guess it is the same everywhere else)[/QUOTE]
How many people are killed in ship disasters each year exactly? I mean proper ships: cruise liners/passenger liners.
Stick to them over planes. They're massive, hulking floating palaces of entertainment full of people that don't travel at hundreds of miles per hour tens of thousands of feet up in the air. They don't sink or burn often, and when they do, they take a long ass time to do so giving you plenty of chances to escape and save yourself.
[QUOTE=Govna;46817715]How many people are killed in ship disasters each year exactly? I mean proper ships: cruise liners/passenger liners.
Stick to them over planes. They're massive, hulking floating palaces of entertainment full of people that don't travel at hundreds of miles per hour tens of thousands of feet up in the air. They don't sink or burn often, and when they do, they take a long ass time to do so giving you plenty of chances to escape and save yourself.[/QUOTE]They're also festering, unclean messes riddled with disease and crime.
[QUOTE=Govna;46817715]How many people are killed in ship disasters each year exactly? I mean proper ships: cruise liners/passenger liners.
Stick to them over planes. They're massive, hulking floating palaces of entertainment full of people that don't travel at hundreds of miles per hour tens of thousands of feet up in the air. They don't sink or burn often, and when they do, they take a long ass time to do so giving you plenty of chances to escape and save yourself.[/QUOTE]
Yup next time I visit my family in Australia I will spend however many months travelling rather than just getting a flight. Ships are slow, expensive and impractical as a means of transport over long distances. Cruises are holidays in and of themselves, not transport.
[QUOTE=Govna;46817715]How many people are killed in ship disasters each year exactly? I mean proper ships: cruise liners/passenger liners.
Stick to them over planes. They're massive, hulking floating palaces of entertainment full of people that don't travel at hundreds of miles per hour tens of thousands of feet up in the air. They don't sink or burn often, and when they do, they take a long ass time to do so giving you plenty of chances to escape and save yourself.[/QUOTE]
Remind me of [I]any[/I] transoceanic passenger ships currently in service. Cruises don't count, they are just floating hotels that follow a fixed path and eventually return to the original port. Planes are cheaper and faster
[QUOTE=Govna;46817715]How many people are killed in ship disasters each year exactly? I mean proper ships: cruise liners/passenger liners.
Stick to them over planes. They're massive, hulking floating palaces of entertainment full of people that don't travel at hundreds of miles per hour tens of thousands of feet up in the air. They don't sink or burn often, and when they do, they take a long ass time to do so giving you plenty of chances to escape and save yourself.[/QUOTE]
i am convinced this is a joke post
[QUOTE=FFStudios;46819170]i am convinced this is a joke post[/QUOTE]
You win.
they found pieces in the ocean, so it's not "gone without a trace"
this 2 planes magically disappearing thing that the media is spouting is over since they've found AirAsia pieces
Possibly, but whether or not they're from this flight is unconfirmed. This one's troubling though:
[url=http://www.twitter.com/PzFeed/status/549813832672378881]@PzFeed: "Indonesian official says aircraft searching for missing AirAsia have sighted "red and white coloured" debris off Kalimantan coast. Reuters"[/url]
[QUOTE=fruxodaily;46819820]they found pieces in the ocean, so it's not "gone without a trace"
this 2 planes magically disappearing thing that the media is spouting is over since they've found AirAsia pieces[/QUOTE]
Yep, confirmed. A fisherman found some sort of debris in the ocean, and now everyone is concentrating their search on that area
BODIES
[url=http://www.twitter.com/PzFeed/status/549838305656057856]@PzFeed: "[B]Three bodies recovered so far[/B] from flight QZ8501 and have been brought on to an Indonesian navy ship. AP"[/url]
40 bodies have been recovered - none wearing lifejackets.
[url]http://news.sky.com/story/1399627/bodies-found-in-airasia-missing-plane-search[/url]
[quote]Geoffrey Thomas, editor of AirlineRatings.com, told Sky News: "We have a radar plot which shows the plane actually climbing through 36,300ft - it wasn't given permission to do that.
"It also shows that its speed had decayed by 134mph and dropped dramatically to a level where it couldn't sustain flight."[/quote]
Sounds like a similar problem to the air france incident. Pitot tubes freeze up and give faulty air speed indications to the pilot, resulting in either them diving to increase speed pushing it past the never exceed speed or (as it seems in this case) climbing to decrease the air speed and not noticing that the aircraft hits stall speed.
But we wont know until the black box is found i guess. Terrible shame if it is the case though as the problem can be avoided.
Pretty bad at how they're recording the reactions of the families while they're watching the recovery of the bodies
[QUOTE=Rong;46820695]Pretty bad at how they're recording the reactions of the families while they're watching the recovery of the bodies[/QUOTE]
Indonesian news channels are pretty terrible. Most of the questions they're asking aren't even relevant.
[editline]30th December 2014[/editline]
Also apparently the buzzfeed of Indonesia shamelessly mentions this incident for an ad for an airplane game on their twitter...
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/gIfHeZdh.jpg[/IMG]
It translates to "QZ8501 dissapears! Experience the difficulty of being a pilot in this flight sim game! [click here to play] "
How insensitive can you get..
[QUOTE=Impulse101;46820717]Indonesian news channels are pretty terrible. Most of the questions they're asking aren't even relevant.
[editline]30th December 2014[/editline]
Also apparently the buzzfeed of Indonesia shamelessly mentions this incident for an ad for an airplane game on their twitter...
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/gIfHeZdh.jpg[/IMG]
It translates to "QZ8501 dissapears! Experience the difficulty of being a pilot in this flight sim game! [click here to play] "
How insensitive can you get..[/QUOTE]
which isn't really surprising since they're the kind of people who would park their public transport in the middle of the fucking road.
Apparently a Pinoy Air Asia plane just overshot and went off the runway a few hours ago. Huh bad week for them.
At least there's more hope finding the cause of the crash then what has happened with MH370
Honestly devastating everyone lost their lives, but seeing as they didn't have lifejackets on then it means it must've fell without warning to the crew
[QUOTE=Impulse101;46820717]Indonesian news channels are pretty terrible. Most of the questions they're asking aren't even relevant.
[editline]30th December 2014[/editline]
Also apparently the buzzfeed of Indonesia shamelessly mentions this incident for an ad for an airplane game on their twitter...
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/gIfHeZdh.jpg[/IMG]
It translates to "QZ8501 dissapears! Experience the difficulty of being a pilot in this flight sim game! [click here to play] "
How insensitive can you get..[/QUOTE]
what to expect from Indonesia's broken ass media
Lots of different factors to consider so far. Low airspeed at or around 320kts ground speed isn't that uncommon - an airliner will not stall until ~200kts fully laden. That's a good buffer.
Considering they were approaching severe weather and they should have been thinking about diverting their route, it makes sense to me that they would decrease their airspeed to give them thinking time. You don't continue at cruise speed when you are considering a detour - you would give yourself all the time you can to plan, coordinate and execute that change.
Pitot tubes freezing up are definitely a possibility - someone previously in the thread mentioned the Air France crash. Modern airliners do have backups for reading speed though - namely GPS and other navigational aids. If the pitot tubes were frozen and the GPS not operable - both knocked out due to adverse weather - then that there is a scenario where airspeed would be very difficult to judge at cruise. But even then there are gyros which are independent of GPS and external sensors such as the pitots, that could give you a very rough and ready reading of speed. All airliners have these multiple inputs that are isolated from each other, so if any one source of data fails there are backups.
At this stage all these different buts and ifs will make for a very difficult challenge for the air accident investigators. Very sad to hear that bodies have been found. I was really hoping we wouldn't have that this time.
Anyone really interested in this, reddit has a great live feed - [url]http://www.reddit.com/live/u5bmnl5imzk4[/url]
Lets see. This year, one plane went missing without a trace, another got shot down by some assholes intentionally and this third one crashed into the sea. But out of the three, only two of the crash are mystery. The other one was an obvious attack by a missile. But please people. Air plane crash are rare and unlucky events. The probability of you dying in an airplane crash is far lower than striking a lottery.
I wish you people take a look at the good record Air Asia had for the past decade. This was a single terrible incident to happen to AirAsia. They are normally well known to have the safest airplane ride around South East Asia.
[QUOTE=usaokay;46807757]Pretty sure this is a terrorist related activity, but the only problem is that they're not public about their attacks.[/QUOTE]
Not very successful as terrorists if they don't claim the attacks, after all the point of being a terrorist is to cause fear and awareness towards a certain group, if they don't claim it they just cause pointless fear and confusion.
[QUOTE=Technopath;46821224]Not very successful as terrorists if they don't claim the attacks, after all the point of being a terrorist is to cause fear and awareness towards a certain group, if they don't claim it they just cause pointless fear and confusion.[/QUOTE]
But in a way, would that not be an even more terrifying terror organisation? At least with like Al Qaeda or ISIS you can label them with, "radical Islamic extremists," with militias in Africa you can label them as such, but can you imagine how terrifying it'd be to know that there's people out there downing planes [I]and we don't even fucking know who they are?[/I] It'd cause paranoia. It could be anyone, of any background, from any country, for any reason. It'd make everyone turn on everyone else.
[QUOTE=runtime;46821075]Lots of different factors to consider so far. Low airspeed at or around 320kts ground speed isn't that uncommon - an airliner will not stall until ~200kts fully laden. That's a good buffer.
Considering they were approaching severe weather and they should have been thinking about diverting their route, it makes sense to me that they would decrease their airspeed to give them thinking time. You don't continue at cruise speed when you are considering a detour - you would give yourself all the time you can to plan, coordinate and execute that change.
Pitot tubes freezing up are definitely a possibility - someone previously in the thread mentioned the Air France crash. Modern airliners do have backups for reading speed though - namely GPS and other navigational aids. If the pitot tubes were frozen and the GPS not operable - both knocked out due to adverse weather - then that there is a scenario where airspeed would be very difficult to judge at cruise. But even then there are gyros which are independent of GPS and external sensors such as the pitots, that could give you a very rough and ready reading of speed. All airliners have these multiple inputs that are isolated from each other, so if any one source of data fails there are backups.
At this stage all these different buts and ifs will make for a very difficult challenge for the air accident investigators. Very sad to hear that bodies have been found. I was really hoping we wouldn't have that this time.
Anyone really interested in this, reddit has a great live feed - [url]http://www.reddit.com/live/u5bmnl5imzk4[/url][/QUOTE]
Seems like every other episode of Air Crash Investigation has to do with pitot tubes, you'd think by now they would have engineered a better system or multiple backups...
Wondering how all the "it was abducted by the aliums like mh370" people are going to have to formulate a response now that bodies and debris are being found
I wish we were at the stage in evolution where we could come up with a mode of transportation that never suffered any potential disasters. Elon Musk's hyperloop, for example.
Sorry, you need to Log In to post a reply to this thread.
