Plants Can Tell When They’re Being Eaten And Send Distress Signalls - take this vegetarians - Polidicks

Lots of people care about morality and I guess you're right in that plants aren't intelligent, in that they have no memory or knowledge, and can't apply it to the outside world.

[QUOTE=Tinter;46287937]Lots of people care about morality and I guess you're right in that plants aren't intelligent, in that they have no memory or knowledge, and can't apply it to the outside world.[/QUOTE] No they're not intelligent in the sense that they have literally zero construct capable of supporting even the simplest of intellects. They're things that grow, spread, grow some more and react to environmental stimuli which isn't a sign of intelligence, merely of being alive.

[QUOTE=Awesomecaek;46287025]Does this make a well kept lawn something akin to a plant purgatory?[/QUOTE] I'm currently taking a break from mowing my lawn. When I go out there to finish it, I'm going to feel like a monster. Thanks, you've just ruined the next hour of my life.

[QUOTE=Boba_Fett;46287977]I'm currently taking a break from mowing my lawn. When I go out there to finish it, I'm going to feel like a monster. Thanks, you've just ruined the next hour of my life.[/QUOTE] Don't worry, their terror smells great.

[QUOTE=bravehat;46287787]It's literally just chemical reactions, there's no more intelligence in a plant than there is in a stone. [editline]20th October 2014[/editline] We have, bolt guns to the brain stem, kills them stone dead, besides there are people who hate the texture, folk who hate battery farming, there are people who just fundamentally hate the concept of eating something that was once alive. There will always be vegans and vegetarians.[/QUOTE] Bolt guns don't kill the animal they are simply stunned and this particular method whilst more reassuring compared to other methods, ideally something on the lines of inert gas asphyxiation which is basically death by hypoxia seems like the most competent method for irradiating unnecessary suffering because of human error or other inconsistencies that may arise from inflicting direct blunt trauma.

[QUOTE=Daemon;46288039]Bolt guns don't kill the animal they are simply stunned and this particular method whilst more reassuring compared to other methods, ideally something on the lines of inert gas asphyxiation which is basically death by hypoxia seems like the most competent method for irradiating unnecessary suffering because of human error or other complications that may arise from inflicting direct blunt trauma.[/QUOTE] Well that's gonna be pretty inefficient so that's not likely to happen.

[QUOTE=bravehat;46287846]Yeah we've known about this for a decade or some shit, there's plants that send out distress signals when caterpillars are eating them and shit so other bugs come and fuck them up.[/QUOTE] Oak trees do that if they if they're being absolutely swarmed, and nearby oak trees then pump their leaves full of tannin to make them both distasteful and harmful to caterpillars. Acacia trees do a similiar thing against giraffes, so giraffes will try to approach trees upwind to prevent the signal spreading and making their food taste bad.

Have a heart, eat a rock.

[QUOTE=bravehat;46288101]Well that's gonna be pretty inefficient so that's not likely to happen.[/QUOTE] Well i guess I'm not exactly making the appeal to maximize the effectiveness of lining the pockets of those who are in opposition to stricter welfare policies on the basis that companies and the general public could do with the extra cash if that's what you mean.

[QUOTE=Daemon;46288401]Well i guess I'm not exactly making the appeal to maximize the effectiveness of lining the pockets of those who are in opposition to stricter welfare policies on the basis that companies and the general public could do with the extra cash if that's what you mean.[/QUOTE] No I agree it would be a better way to do it, but let's face it, it's not gonna happen cause you're gonna have to lead the cattle into the machine that holds em, gas em which won't immediately knock em out and kill em then you can go bananas but it'll take extra time and with how companies are running shit now they'd rather just pop it in the noggin and go to town. So one way to make it somewhat efficient is mass gassing the cows and just having some like, giant (dis)assembly line type deal to pick the cows up and wreck em.

Vegeterrorists.

[QUOTE=Alex141;46286964]They will only eat fallen leaves now[/QUOTE] [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fruitarianism]There are actually people who will only eat fallen fruit because they believe anything else would be immoral[/url] [QUOTE=Killuah;46287826]It might be my stupid brain but I' sure I've heard of something like this ages ago? Some even send out chemicals that tell other plants of the same species that an "enemy" is attacking, I think it was tobacco.[/QUOTE] Yes, nicotine is tobacco's pesticide.

[QUOTE=TheFilmSlacker;46286960]I've literally always wondered about this.[/QUOTE] That smell of freshly cut grass? The combined suffering of every blade you cut down you monster. This is why I don't do yard work, because I'm a pacifist.

[QUOTE=autodesknoob;46287179]"take this vegetarians" very mature[/QUOTE] How do you fail to understand a joke this badly?

The plants send distress signals... but in hopes of achieving what? Is a big-ass tree with a face going to try and stomp me for attempting to eat some weeds? Is that what's been going on all along and we never had any idea?

[QUOTE=FetusFondler;46289273]The plants send distress signals... but in hopes of achieving what? Is a big-ass tree with a face going to try and stomp me for attempting to eat some weeds? Is that what's been going on all along and we never had any idea?[/QUOTE] It's so the other plants have enough time to run.

[QUOTE=bravehat;46287846]Yeah we've known about this for a decade or some shit, there's plants that send out distress signals when caterpillars are eating them and shit so other bugs come and fuck them up.[/QUOTE] Yeah, the chemicals are called Green Leaf Volatiles and they've been known for quite a while, definitely more than a decade. It's more that they're confirming they perform the same function across all plant families. [editline]21st October 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=FetusFondler;46289273]The plants send distress signals... but in hopes of achieving what? Is a big-ass tree with a face going to try and stomp me for attempting to eat some weeds? Is that what's been going on all along and we never had any idea?[/QUOTE] If the plant is big enough (say, a tree), then it allows other parts of the plant to start chemically preparing for herbivory, but it is also a form of communal protection, as they also warn other plants to prepare for being eaten. (Basically to start manufacturing chemical or physical defenses - Tannens or to start toughening your leaf matter, etc) There was a cool study performed in Sweden or Norway (I can't remember which, I read the paper 4 years ago for an essay during my undergrad) where they found that a particularly voracious moth caterpillar which decimates spruce forests would enter a forested patch, and that trees which were affected would release these GLVs and trees downwind of them saw an upswing in Tannen production amongst other defence responses. (Tannens inhibit digestion when they are consumed)

[QUOTE=rewkasu;46286932]What are you gonna eat now vegetarians?[/QUOTE] Rocks.

[QUOTE=Rockeiro123;46289454]It's so the other plants have enough time to run.[/QUOTE] It's highly important in their defensive shoaling behavior: [video=youtube;4nwdQgdxg2M]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4nwdQgdxg2M[/video]

[QUOTE=FetusFondler;46289273]The plants send distress signals... but in hopes of achieving what? Is a big-ass tree with a face going to try and stomp me for attempting to eat some weeds? Is that what's been going on all along and we never had any idea?[/QUOTE] It draws bugs, that kill the bugs, killing it.

[QUOTE=bravehat;46287787] besides there are people who hate the texture, folk who hate battery farming, there are people who just fundamentally hate the concept of eating something that was once alive.[/quote] And of the lot only not liking the texture makes logical sense. You can eat meat without battery farming and funamentally hating the concept of eating something alive is so illogical that logic fails to describe how illogical it is. Plants are alive too, after all. [quote]There will always be vegans and vegetarians.[/QUOTE] Vegetarians, sure. Vegans....we can be rid of those. It's one thing to not eat meat, it's another to try to crusade against it and force that lifestyle down someone's throat. Vegans far too often are in that category, only rarely are vegetarians.

[QUOTE=bravehat;46288101]Well that's gonna be pretty inefficient so that's not likely to happen.[/QUOTE] you could make a sort of chamber thats fills with gas

This is old news. I'm a vegetarian and it doesn't bother me. All living things have defense mechanisms and react to destruction. This isn't the issue. If it were we wouldn't use hand sanitizer and would need to purge ourselves of antibodies. The issue is either A) We believe that [i]suffering[/i] in sentient things is bad B) We believe that sentient things have a [I]natural right to life[/I] the same as humans If you're interested in the philosophical and moral aspects of animal rights, I recommend Pete Singer's [URL="http://spot.colorado.edu/~heathwoo/phil1200,Spr07/singer.pdf"]All Animals Are Equal[/URL], which is a great step-by-step and isn't sensationalist. It's a bit long but it's a good read.

Well, that ain't new. The sweet smell of freshly-mowed grass? Chemical signals to attract flying insects.

Legit question for vegetarians and the likes: What if the animal being consumed died of natural causes? Is that fair game?

So this means that they also will not buy wood products. Like paper. Like furniture. Like so many things. Also no clothing. [editline]21st October 2014[/editline] [QUOTE='[Seed Eater];46290428']This is old news. I'm a vegetarian and it doesn't bother me. All living things have defense mechanisms and react to destruction. This isn't the issue. If it were we wouldn't use hand sanitizer and would need to purge ourselves of antibodies. The issue is either A) We believe that [i]suffering[/i] in sentient things is bad B) We believe that sentient things have a [I]natural right to life[/I] the same as humans If you're interested in the philosophical and moral aspects of animal rights, I recommend Pete Singer's [URL="http://spot.colorado.edu/~heathwoo/phil1200,Spr07/singer.pdf"]All Animals Are Equal[/URL], which is a great step-by-step and isn't sensationalist. It's a bit long but it's a good read.[/QUOTE] So when are you gonna go to africa and arrest all these carnivores? They are all guilty of murder and torture

[QUOTE=Impact1986;46292541] So when are you gonna go to africa and arrest all these carnivores? They are all guilty of murder and torture[/QUOTE] While I think there's a moral aspect to not killing sentient things, I also recognize that we do live in a world with suffering and that it isn't feasible to give every wild animal a comfy pillow and a life free from burden or suffering. It's also impossible to prevent the food chain from occurring in nature. I don't blame anyone of a lower class for eating meat, because many people do not have another option. From a utilitarian perspective, the poor or those in the third world will have better lives than not by eating meat. Simply establishing guidelines for the sake of the welfare of the animals is the best alternative here. Just like with war, it's not so simple to say "alright, we seek peace in the developed world, now let's go arrest all those warmakers and soldiers in Africa"- we have to accept that that's not a possibility and that this is due to socioeconomic forces beyond anyone's control currently. While no one expects Africa to become peaceful just because pacifists say so, we can emplace peacekeepers and rules on conflict that hopefully lessens the negative impact. This is the same with animal rights- we can't prevent animals being slaughtered in Africa, but we also can't prevent humans from being slaughtered, and this is for the same reason really. "Alright stop killing each other, Africans" is just as ridiculous as "Alright, quite killing animals, Africans." Of course we could be and should be doing more to establish welfare guidelines, but these things will come when we lift Africa out of poverty and see the continent develop. [editline]21st October 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=EuSKalduna;46292317]Legit question for vegetarians and the likes: What if the animal being consumed died of natural causes? Is that fair game?[/QUOTE] I would say yes. I would also say it's acceptable to kill an animal if it's out of necessity, like your living situation prevents you from living if you don't eat animals- that is, if you're impoverished or from a developing nation or extreme rural location. Like I've said above the issue isn't with the meat itself so much as the "right to life" and prevention of suffering of living things. If an animal dies of natural causes, then that's not something imposed by humans and is fair game- it wasn't killed for the sake of eating it, so its "right to life" was not infringed. Similarly, when it comes down between "me or them", then I don't blame any humans for choosing "me", but of course you would need to prove that is the case- that you will suffer if they do not- for it to be justified in my book.

[QUOTE=bravehat;46287990]Don't worry, their terror smells great.[/QUOTE] Turns out I'm allergic to genocide.

[QUOTE=Cutthecrap;46287929]If they hate the concept of eating something that was once alive, then they are totally incoherent and are irrational. The only rational side I can see in the vegetarian world-view, is the economic and environmental impacts eating animals have. The ethics side is...just wrong.[/QUOTE] I just personally feel bad about eating something i could be petting and playing with instead :/

dude who in the hell would play with a cow?