Court Orders Military to Refer to Chelsea Manning As ‘She’ - Polidicks

[QUOTE=acarvromvroom;47282948]It is for prisoners. If the prisoner feels like he has too many penises that's his problem, not the state's. They wouldn't refer to him as a him just to unbalance him, it's to not give him a luxury that a prisooner doesn't deserve. You don't see guards calling prisoners "your highness".[/QUOTE] Since when is basic respect and kindness even close to calling someone "your highness"? It's not some game of "Prove me you're worth calling you the right pronouns" dude, it's the absolute basic amount of respect you give to any trans person and acting like it's some privilege is extremely shitty and transphobic It's like telling a gay person that it's just a phase, or they're doing it for attention, it's plain shitty and incredibly disrespectful

[QUOTE=acarvromvroom;47282948]It is for prisoners. If the prisoner feels like he has too many penises that's his problem, not the state's. They wouldn't refer to him as a him just to unbalance him, it's to not give him a luxury that a prisooner doesn't deserve. You don't see guards calling prisoners "your highness".[/QUOTE] There's a difference between treating a prisoner like a king and treating a prisoner with respect. In any case, many prisoners can actually earn common luxuries, like television or videogames through good behaviour. If she has been on good behaviour, why shouldn't they be allowed access to medical treatment, and expect to be treated with respect by the authorities (which they do anyway since they gave her a fair trial)

[QUOTE=acarvromvroom;47282948]It is for prisoners. If the prisoner feels like he has too many penises that's his problem, not the state's. They wouldn't refer to him as a him just to unbalance him, it's to not give him a luxury that a prisooner doesn't deserve. You don't see guards calling prisoners "your highness".[/QUOTE] Ask yourself this question. How much [I]actual effort[/I] does it take to show somebody you don't even know the sufficient respect to refer to them with the right pronouns? By this logic, you might as well call all prisoners 'it', because at least that's painting them all with the same, shit-smeared brush. [editline]8th March 2015[/editline] If Chelsea had been born biologically female, would you still be advocating calling her 'him'? If not, why not? What's the difference between calling one woman 'her' and another?

[QUOTE=acarvromvroom;47282948]It is for prisoners. If the prisoner feels like he has too many penises that's his problem, not the state's. They wouldn't refer to him as a him just to unbalance him, it's to not give him a luxury that a prisooner doesn't deserve. You don't see guards calling prisoners "your highness".[/QUOTE] in what world is being referred to by the correct pronoun equivalent to being royalty? what a fucking strawman that is

[QUOTE=Jamsponge;47283021]Ask yourself this question. How much [I]actual effort[/I] does it take to show somebody you don't even know the sufficient respect to refer to them with the right pronouns? By this logic, you might as well call all prisoners 'it', because at least that's painting them all with the same, shit-smeared brush. [editline]8th March 2015[/editline] If Chelsea had been born biologically female, would you still be advocating calling her 'him'? If not, why not? What's the difference between calling one woman 'her' and another?[/QUOTE] The difference is he is not a true woman, calling him a she is a sign of respect for him, it's something extra that you do because you know that he's not a true woman but you still do it. Since he is a traitor he does not deserve this respect that other transsexual people have. [highlight](User was banned for this post ("Bigot" - Craptasket))[/highlight]

[QUOTE=acarvromvroom;47282812]Except that it isn't a big problem nor a life threatening disease. It's something akin to plastic surgery, it's a luxury not a necessity. It's nice that people are all for transsexual rights and what not but there's bigger problems to worry about than a prisoner getting a fucking sex change and what pronoun is used in documents relating to him.[/QUOTE] You know being transgender is a bit more than "Oh, I casually want to be a girl but I can't be :(". There's a reason transgender people have some of the highest suicide rates of any demopgraphic.

[QUOTE=acarvromvroom;47283042]The difference is he is not a true woman, calling him a she is a sign of respect for him, it's something extra that you do because you know that he's not a true woman but you still do it. Since he is a traitor he does not deserve this respect that other transsexual people have.[/QUOTE] Manning is as much a woman as you are a man, [URL="http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn20032-transsexual-differences-caught-on-brain-scan.html#.VPzA4vnF-ao"]her brain is biologically closer to a woman's brain.[/URL] Arguing that she isn't a "real" woman (whatever that is arbitrarily defined as to you) is false.

[QUOTE=acarvromvroom;47283042]The difference is he is not a true woman, calling him a she is a sign of respect for him, it's something extra that you do because you know that he's not a true woman but you still do it. Since he is a traitor he does not deserve this respect that other transsexual people have.[/QUOTE] Who made you the judge of who is/isn't a woman? Does someone stop being their gender the moment they commit a crime? Please never be in a position of power.

[QUOTE=acarvromvroom;47282948]If the prisoner feels like he has too many penises that's his problem, not the state's. They wouldn't refer to him as a him just to unbalance him, it's to not give him a luxury that a prisooner doesn't deserve. You don't see guards calling prisoners "your highness".[/QUOTE] but it's obviously NOT their problem because the government is the one that put them in prison? like are they supposed to break out and go find a surgeon and then come back? and something i've just realized is that prison as a concept exists solely because people have problems that need fixing - some people say that involves therapy and other people say it involves deterrence and punishment, that's not important here. but if you think any kind of analysis or manipulation of someone's problems is a sheer luxury, then how is this prison even supposed to function or do anything other than waste people's time? it's like a Luddite trying to use an electron microscope.

[QUOTE=acarvromvroom;47283042]The difference is he is not a true woman, calling him a she is a sign of respect for him, it's something extra that you do because you know that he's not a true woman but you still do it. Since he is a traitor he does not deserve this respect that other transsexual people have.[/QUOTE] So would you refer to me, a transgender woman, as 'she' because I'm not in prison and therefore are worthy of your respect? Or do you believe that the most fundamental level of politeness is a privilege rather than something which should be expected? How are you actually aware that anyone is 'male' or 'female' unless you have inspected: Their hormone levels Their genitalia (in case they're on HRT) Their chromosomal structure (in case they've undergone genital reconstruction surgery) Any signs that they might have a condition which means that they have chromosomes which are not standard for their biological sex? I think it would be far, far simpler to just take somebody's word for it when they say what their gender is.

[QUOTE=acarvromvroom;47283042]The difference is he is not a true woman, calling him a she is a sign of respect for him, it's something extra that you do because you know that he's not a true woman but you still do it. Since he is a traitor he does not deserve this respect that other transsexual people have.[/QUOTE] "Something extra you have to do" I have to type one more character, that is clearly too much worth the iota of energy expanded to press that extra character and the 0.0000000001 cent of government ink being wasted on that s in she.

I'm going to stop replying since this argument is going in a circle, I respect transsexual people, but when it comes to a traitor that deserves a life sentence I will have no pity.

[QUOTE=acarvromvroom;47283106]I'm going to stop replying since this argument is going in a circle, I respect transsexual people, but when it comes to a traitor that deserves a life sentence I will have no pity.[/QUOTE] Hello backpedaling You respect trans people so much, you ignore their requests to call them the right pronouns Clearly you're what trans acceptance needs: "I'm fine with trans people as long as they don't bother me, they're weird"

[QUOTE=Starlight 456;47283112]Hello backpedaling You respect trans people so much, you ignore their requests to call them the right pronouns Clearly you're what trans acceptance needs: "I'm fine with trans people as long as they don't bother me, they're weird"[/QUOTE] I'm not backpedaling, I can tell there's nothing more I can add to convince you that what he got is a luxury and that he did not deserve it. And there's nothing more you can add to convince me that the government did well in spending money to give him a sex change. Therefore this discussion is pointless.

[QUOTE=acarvromvroom;47283106]I'm going to stop replying since this argument is going in a circle, I respect transsexual people, but when it comes to a traitor that deserves a life sentence I will have no pity.[/QUOTE] The argument isn't going in a circle, your 'argument' was torn to shreds and now you're trying to save face.

[QUOTE=acarvromvroom;47283106]I'm going to stop replying since this argument is going in a circle, I respect transsexual people, but when it comes to a traitor that deserves a life sentence I will have no pity.[/QUOTE] [video=youtube;ubU-dB8B-94]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubU-dB8B-94[/video] [highlight](User was banned for this post ("Reaction video" - Craptasket))[/highlight]

[QUOTE=acarvromvroom;47283124]I'm not backpedaling, I can tell there's nothing more I can add to convince you that what he got is a luxury and that he did not deserve it. And there's nothing more you can add to convince me that the government did well in spending money to give him a sex change. Therefore this discussion is pointless.[/QUOTE] "I respect transsexuals" he says, as he disrespects a transsexual for committing a crime

[QUOTE=acarvromvroom;47283124]I'm not backpedaling, I can tell there's nothing more I can add to convince you that what he got is a luxury and that he did not deserve it. And there's nothing more you can add to convince me that the government did well in spending money to give him a sex change. Therefore this discussion is pointless.[/QUOTE] you couldn't offer up any substantial reasons as to why you're right other than your emotional reasoning that anyone who is transexual is "not really their gender" and that prisoners deserve to be disrespected further.

[QUOTE=MissZoey;47283128][video=youtube;ubU-dB8B-94]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubU-dB8B-94[/video][/QUOTE] Backpedaling would be changing my stance on the subject. In my case, it remains the same.

[QUOTE=acarvromvroom;47283135]Backpedaling would be changing my stance on the subject. Yet it remains the same.[/QUOTE] you clearly don't understand what backpedaling means in this context because it has nothing to do with changing your stance and everything to do with say "No i didn't mean those exact words I said cause I meant a slightly different but basically the same thing"

[QUOTE=acarvromvroom;47283124]I'm not backpedaling, I can tell there's nothing more I can add to convince you that what he got is a luxury and that he did not deserve it. And there's nothing more you can add to convince me that the government did well in spending money to give him a sex change. Therefore this discussion is pointless.[/QUOTE] What if someone had a crippling disorder that left them in horrible pain? It isn't a necessity to give them the painkillers to manage it but it would still be done. It's the same thing, instead of physical pain though, she experiences mental pain which could result in suicide. The hormones are the equivalent of the painkillers, they help stop possible suicide to end their pain, be it physical or mental.

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;47283144]you clearly don't understand what backpedaling means in this context because it has nothing to do with changing your stance and everything to do with say "No i didn't mean those exact words I said cause I meant a slightly different but basically the same thing"[/QUOTE] Except I meant those exact words?

[QUOTE=acarvromvroom;47283135]Backpedaling would be changing my stance on the subject. In my case, it remains the same.[/QUOTE] "I respect transsexual rights" "Also, I don't respect transsexual rights"

[QUOTE=acarvromvroom;47283106]I'm going to stop replying since this argument is going in a circle, I respect transsexual people, but when it comes to a traitor that deserves a life sentence I will have no pity.[/QUOTE] Can you explain why she deserves a life sentence and why you refuse to acknowledge her identity?

[QUOTE=acarvromvroom;47283042]The difference is he is not a true woman[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=acarvromvroom;47283106]I respect transsexual people.[/QUOTE] Not really buddy, not really.

[QUOTE=acarvromvroom;47283135]Backpedaling would be changing my stance on the subject. In my case, it remains the same.[/QUOTE] i-im going to stop replying now

Just report them and move on

If she is trans mtf then she is a woman, it shouldn't be this hard for people to grasp.

[QUOTE=Tuskin;47283174]Just report them and move on[/QUOTE] Report me for what, having a different opinion from you?

[QUOTE=acarvromvroom;47283210]Report me for what, having a different opinion from you?[/QUOTE] Your posts are highly inflammatory, and extremely transphobic. Their content is almost exactly what would cause such people to slip into suicidal depression, which is, as mentioned, very very bad no matter who it happens to. It is within the state's best interests to keep their prisoners in a calm state of mind, treating them like dirt will not do that. Suicide, coincidentally, is considered a bad thing to happen at a prison, as it suggests that the prisoners are not being treated properly or afforded their basic human rights.