Justice Department Files Suit Against Arizona Immigration Law - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Ragy;23752534]Because every officer is corrupt and yet, you still have no idea like JDK what a officer can and can not do.[/QUOTE] ok so what can they do you're just saying a whole bunch of stuff and not really doing any kind of debate which makes this a very shitty thread

One of the hardest things to change in a person is their opinion, ragy obviously had some sort of ultra-conservative uprising, it'll be hard to bring him back to logic.

[QUOTE=thisispain;23752565]yeah what are they gonna do?[/QUOTE] [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._Customs_and_Border_Protection[/url] Guess.

[QUOTE=sloppy_joes;23752570]Not every officer, but some are, which is why it should be illegal.[/QUOTE] What you mean by some is very few and yet, even they can't abuse this law. They would lose their job. Because one officer abuses a law means there should be no law. Stupid statement. [QUOTE=sloppy_joes;23752570]You shouldn't be forced to carry ID/papers to prove your immigration status.[/QUOTE] You already have to carry immigration papers by law if you are an immigrant. Anyway this bill has nothing to even do with immigrants, so why are you bringing up immigration. They're illegal aliens, not immigrants.

[QUOTE=Morcam;23752624][url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._Customs_and_Border_Protection[/url] Guess.[/QUOTE] ok what are they gonna do you can't really tell an agency "FIX IT"

[QUOTE=Ragy;23752641]What you mean by some is very few and yet, even they can't abuse this law. They would lose their job. [/QUOTE] That at least is correct. But the few court cases that arise would probably end up making this ridiculously unpopular anyways. [QUOTE]You already have to carry immigration papers by law if you are an immigrant. Anyway this bill has nothing to even do with immigrants, so why are you bringing up immigration. They're illegal aliens, not immigrants.[/QUOTE] But legal citizens who happen to be mexicans don't have to carry papers. [editline]01:56AM[/editline] [QUOTE=thisispain;23752652]ok what are they gonna do you can't really tell an agency "FIX IT"[/QUOTE] Actually, if you're the president, you can. Give funding. Tell them to increase border patrols. Success. The judicial branch won't be able to, of course.

[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arizona_SB_1070#Provisions[/url] Basically if an officer has "reasonable suspicion" (to be used at the officers descretion) they can ask you for a ID/papers, if you don't present these, you get arrested. Also, not all officers are good, some are assholes, and they will arrest people they don't like simply for not having ID on them. For example, if you're at a party and don't have ID on you, you can get arrested if an officer questions you.

[QUOTE=Morcam;23752664]That at least is correct. But the few court cases that arise would probably end up making this ridiculously unpopular anyways. But legal citizens who happen to be mexicans don't have to carry papers.[/QUOTE] This isn't targeting Mexicans or any single racial group. It's targeting illegal aliens. People throw out that statement, because that's the large minority group. Just because there are more apples than oranges doesn't mean it's targeting only apples, it's targeting everyone and everyone is affected by it. [QUOTE=Morcam;23752664]Actually, if you're the president, you can. Give funding. Tell them to increase border patrols. Success.[/QUOTE]Arizona already asked [b]multiple[/b] times for help. All were ignored by our great and successful leader.

[QUOTE=Morcam;23752664] Actually, if you're the president, you can. Give funding. Tell them to increase border patrols. Success. The judicial branch won't be able to, of course.[/QUOTE] In the end CBP can only do so much. No matter how much they try there's still going to be people crossing illegally. There's just to many miles of boarder to cover. Maybe if you built a giant ass wall and armed it with motion sensors and what not but that would just be ridiculous.

[QUOTE=OvB;23752729]In the end CBP can only do so much. No matter how much they try there's still going to be people crossing illegally. There's just to many miles of boarder to cover. Maybe if you built a giant ass wall and armed it with motion sensors and what not but that would just be ridiculous.[/QUOTE] What you call ridiculous I call sensible. We don't have the money for that and our own citizens are living in constant fear. If I remember correctly, our own citizens come before illegal aliens.

Arizona touches Mexico and no other country, so I bet you most illegals are Mexican. Canadians most likely aren't going to illegally go to Arizona. Besides, Arizona is a desert, and most people don't like living in a hot sandy place, when they can easily go to a cool temperate city to live.

[QUOTE=Ragy;23752715]This isn't targeting [b]Mexicans[/b] or any single racial group..[/QUOTE] Yeah, it's targeting all those illegal Canadians crossing the Arizona border.

[QUOTE=Ragy;23752715]This isn't targeting Mexicans or any single racial group. It's targeting illegal aliens. People throw out that statement, because that's the large minority group. Just because there are more apples than oranges doesn't mean it's targeting only apples, it's targeting everyone and everyone is affected by it.[/QUOTE]Arizona borders Mexico, and the vast majority of illegal immigrants there are Mexican. It doesn't target ethnic groups equally by any but an idealistic assumption. [QUOTE]Arizona already asked [B]multiple[/B] times for help. All were ignored by our great and successful leader.[/QUOTE]But now he has to actually do something. He's been backed into a corner by this law by Arizona. [editline]02:06AM[/editline] [QUOTE=OvB;23752729]In the end CBP can only do so much. No matter how much they try there's still going to be people crossing illegally. There's just to many miles of boarder to cover. Maybe if you built a giant ass wall and armed it with motion sensors and what not but that would just be ridiculous.[/QUOTE] Snipers.

[QUOTE=sloppy_joes;23752761]Arizona touches Mexico and no other country, so I bet you most illegals are Mexican. Canadians most likely aren't going to illegally go to Arizona. Besides, Arizona is a desert, and most people don't like living in a hot sandy place, when they can easily go to a cool temperate city to live.[/QUOTE] Yes, most illegal aliens are Mexican since Arizona boarders Mexico. That doesn't exempt them. Just because there is a large minority doesn't mean it's targeting them. If it was evenly mixed, this "it's targeting Mexicans" stupid statement wouldn't be going around.

Anyone who doesn't think this bill attempts to legalize racial profiling clearly has no concept of what motives are behind it and who it's being passed by. The argument that anyone is liable to be searched is just stupid. Plainly dressed white Arizonans are NEVER going to get searched, because let's be honest; they probably aren't within five generations of an immigrant and the police know that. It's a legitimate effort to make racist policy legal to avoid the difficulties of having to legally search for the illegal immigrants. And if Arizona just came out and was honest it would be one thing, but they try to disguise their obvious profiling with weak excuses.

Its not Obama's fault. He is ONE PERSON. There are many different things in the government and blaming it on one person is like blaming a cat for blowing up a store. And don't the police only ask for PAPERS when a person gets illegal. Hmm, that does sound kind of rascist a bit, but I am kind of sick of these Illegals coming into the country getting welfare and just being babied to. Oh, well arguments on the internet do not matter as everyone will forget withen a few days. Have fun gentleman.

[QUOTE=sloppy_joes;23752488]Nazi to jew: "let me see your papers" Arizona officer to mexican: "let me see your papers" :godwin:[/QUOTE] Your understanding of the law is impeccable.

I still don't know for sure why the federal government thinks this is a federal issue. I'm not taking sides, but the Arizona law isn't about border patrol, it's about finding illegal immigrants within the state. They can be hundreds of miles away from the border and still within Arizona. Why isn't it a state issue? I don't really like the law, and it could lead to racial profiling and all that, but I don't see how it's a federal issue.

[QUOTE=Ragy;23752831]Yes, most illegal aliens are Mexican since Arizona boarders Mexico. That doesn't exempt them. Just because there is a large minority doesn't mean it's targeting them. If it was evenly mixed, this "it's targeting Mexicans" stupid statement wouldn't be going around.[/QUOTE] You just said most illegals are mexican, how are you going to get "reasonable suspicion" without some form of racial profiling. Stop being such an idealist. [editline]02:09AM[/editline] [QUOTE=lulzbocks;23752837]Your understanding of the law is impeccable.[/QUOTE] The emote was to show it was a joke.

[QUOTE=Ragy;23752758]What you call ridiculous I call sensible. We don't have the money for that and our own citizens are living in constant fear. If I remember correctly, our own citizens come before illegal aliens.[/QUOTE] Or they could just make it a lot easier and cheaper to become a legal citizen and punish those found here illegally. That would raise the incentive to become [I]legal[/I] and not to jump the boarder. The idea is to get rid of the "bad guys."

[QUOTE=OvB;23752870]Or they could just make it a lot easier and cheaper to become a legal citizen and punish those found here illegally. That would raise the incentive to become [I]legal[/I] and not to jump the boarder. The idea is to get rid of the "bad guys."[/QUOTE] We can't just let in everyone who wants in. I'm sorry, but it doesn't work that way.

[QUOTE=Ragy;23752891]We can't just let in everyone who wants in. I'm sorry, but it doesn't work that way.[/QUOTE] Why not? I don't care if half of Mexico wants to live in the US personally.

[QUOTE=sloppy_joes;23752863]You just said most illegals are mexican, how are you going to get "reasonable suspicion" without some form of racial profiling.[/QUOTE] Why do you think that every cop can detain or arrest someone, because their Mexican? They can't, they need reasonable suspicion. This is where you don't understand law. A cop can't stop anyone just based on looks. [editline]06:13AM[/editline] [QUOTE=PvtCupcakes;23752906]Why not? I don't care if half of Mexico wants to live in the US personally.[/QUOTE] There's only so much we can hold. Opening our boarders brings in more poverty which in return brings in crime.

[QUOTE=Ragy;23752891]We can't just let in everyone who wants in. I'm sorry, but it doesn't work that way.[/QUOTE] That's not what I said at all but alright. [editline]01:15AM[/editline] [QUOTE=Ragy;23752916] There's only so much we can hold.[/QUOTE] America was built on immigrants, everyone from anywhere should be allowed in if they want. (a person looking to be a citizen should have a background check, fingerprinted, documented, etc. not just, WELCOME TO AMERICA, HERES YOUR GUN. That's not what I said at all.)

[QUOTE=OvB;23752932]That's not what I said at all but alright.[/QUOTE] Sorry. People jump the boarder, because they simply can't get in legally. Many of them being smuggling drugs and criminals who are not allowed in the U.S. Arizona's own citizens are in fear, because of the amount of crime coming over the boarders.

[QUOTE=Ragy;23752916] Opening our boarders[/QUOTE] Making it easier to be a legal citizen =/= Opening the boarder.

[QUOTE=OvB;23752932]That's not what I said at all but alright. [editline]01:15AM[/editline] America was built on immigrants, everyone from anywhere should be allowed in if they want. (a person looking to be a citizen should have a background check, fingerprinted, documented, etc. not just, WELCOME TO AMERICA, HERES YOUR GUN. That's not what I said at all.)[/QUOTE] Anyone can come from anywhere, yet people don't want to go through the legal process. If they don't want to, don't come in. Don't break our laws. On the other hand, if you legally come into the U.S., you are fully checked, background, and they don't hand you a gun.

[QUOTE=Ragy;23752967]Sorry. People jump the boarder, because they simply can't get in legally. Many of them being smuggling drugs and criminals who are not allowed in the U.S. Arizona's own citizens are in fear, because of the amount of crime coming over the boarders.[/QUOTE] Well we're going to be able to stop the obvious criminals jumping the fence for illegal activity, but at least we can make it easier for 18 year old Paco who want's to make a better living in America so he can support his family and have a chance at a better life, to become legal. The way it is now is crazy long, and its causing people to "skip the line" and jump the fence which is a large number of our illegal population. If we made it easier to be legal less honest Mexicans would jump, Therefore making the ones we found jumping more likely to be criminals smuggling shit and therefore easier to punish for obviously illegal acts.

[QUOTE=sloppy_joes;23752863]You just said most illegals are mexican, how are you going to get "reasonable suspicion" without some form of racial profiling. [/QUOTE] The thing is people expect that whenever there is a problem like this they are supposed to treat everyone fair, keep it civil, clean. Whatever happened to that saying "Life is not fair." The illegal immigration is a problem, The best way right now is to put them back in Mexico. If they are not here legally. If they really want to be here that bad they will go through all the paper work. If I were a cop and I pulled someone over for a busted tail light, and he has 6 Mexican friends in the back that don't speak a word of English. I'm going to check for papers, if they don't have the papers, the officer can not do his job. The illegal aliens are messing with the economy. Whenever you fix a problem, you have to get dirty sometimes.

[QUOTE=mbutler2;23753033]The thing is people expect that whenever there is a problem like this they are supposed to treat everyone fair, keep it civil, clean. Whatever happened to that saying "Life is not fair." The illegal immigration is a problem, The best way right now is to put them back in Mexico. If they are not here legally. If they really want to be here that bad they will go through all the paper work. If I were a cop and I pulled someone over for a busted tail light, and he has 6 Mexican friends in the back that don't speak a word of English. I'm going to check for papers, if they don't have the papers, the officer can not do his job. The illegal aliens are messing with the economy. Whenever you fix a problem, you have to get dirty sometimes.[/QUOTE] Not being able to speak English isn't illegal.