[QUOTE=normandie;51099996]hes saying that if you value your second amendment rights, dont vote for clinton.[/QUOTE]
If that's the message he was trying to imply, why didn't he say it outright?
I don't care about the strong Trump voters. I just don't get how there are so many people that say they dislike both candidates but are still willing to vote for Trump. He is the Asshole Candidate. He's so fucking rude and unprofessional all the time it's insane.
GOP Policy guys!
Vote Trump!
[QUOTE=normandie;51099949]ah yes, because asking someones bodyguards to disarm in order to show the hypocrisy of allowing the political elite to acquire protection without normal citizens having the same privilege is equal to calling for an assassination
keith olbermann is a blowhard, watching this video was painful[/QUOTE]
What about telling the "second amendment people" they should "do something" about Hillary Clinton?
[editline]/[/editline]
Ah, nevermind. I see you've already rationalized it away. Don't know why I expected anything different.
He needs to work harder, Hillary has years of lies under her belt.
[QUOTE=FinalHunter;51102270][thumb]http://i.imgur.com/vje6k0f.jpg[/thumb]
Uh, this is why? If you fundamentally disagree with the policies of Clinton? As people, they're both terrible - you can't objectively claim one is worse than the other. Hillary is corrupt and either knowingly takes advantage of the system or is so blatantly ignorant she doesn't understand how to handle classified material - in addition there is a strong amount of evidence to lead to the conclusion that she can be bought. Trump on the other hand is a loose cannon who doesn't have a good grasp on his emotions which would damage our foreign relations and possibly lead to some poor snap decisions. You can't say one is worse than the other, there is no scale for this, it's a matter of opinion.
Personally, I don't think it matters which is "worse" as a person, I think they're both so bad it won't make a difference so I judge them on their policies, which is why I attached the chart.
I support increasing the military budget, drug testing for welfare, I am against increased gun control, I believe common core is damaging the future of our country. While there are aspects I disagree with Trump on (global warming regulation, abortion) I support him more than Clinton because in general I like his policies more. I support Trump more than I support Clinton because I believe the difference between the two is that she is proven to be a danger to this country - Benghazi, the email scandal, the Clinton Foundation, etc. But, as I mentioned earlier, I'm not voting for either one. I live in a state that has gone Republican for decades and will continue to go Republican for the foreseeable future so I'm fortunate enough to not have to overcome the mental hurdle it would take to vote for one of these two, just because of the electoral college system.[/QUOTE]
What about him being opposed to requiring vaccines? He could literally bring back eradicated diseases to the extent that they sweep the nation and impact hundreds of thousands of lives if he actually goes through with such legislation.
That should automatically disqualify anyone from office, wanting to bring back eradicated life-ruining diseases by undercutting necessary prevention.
[QUOTE=FinalHunter;51102270][thumb]http://i.imgur.com/vje6k0f.jpg[/thumb][/QUOTE]
[t]http://i.imgur.com/v5DWVVu.png[/t]
if only...
[QUOTE=FinalHunter;51100127]No, that's not what you're doing. You're just being a bully.
You're not just correcting misinformation you're literally out to insult people and condescend. I can't even count the number of times I've seen either you or Archangel show up just to generalize every single Trump supporter as some blind ignorant buffoon.[/QUOTE]
All right, let's talk. Because this bullshit needs to be cleared up right the hell now.
One, aye, I'm not able to vote in the American election. But America, a country that has the misfortune to be largely run by corrupt idiots right now, also is very unfortunately one of the most powerful countries in the world economically and military, as well as one of the most populous. What this means is that the outcome of the election is going to affect the rest of the world considerably. Last I checked, I lived in the rest of the world. So it's hardly surprising that a Canadian would be interested in the outcome of an American election when you're south of the border of us.
Furthermore, I have family in the States, my girlfriend is originally from there, and SHE has family living there. One way or another, I'm invested in this election.
Believe you me, I despise Hillary almost as much as I despise Trump. More than, even. Trump's an unabashed bigot, a narcissist, crude and immature. Hillary's a lying snake, a political backroom dealer and one who's willing to do anything to get her way. There's something to be said for those who purposefully seek a seat of power, and both Hillary and Trump are examples of the worst sorts of politicians America has to offer.
Having said that, had I a vote, I'd still pick Hillary any day over Trump. Most of Hillary's policies make sense for most Americans, make sense for the middle class, make sense for the working class who make up the absolute majority of the American population. They focus on social security, healthcare, regulated economy growth, and education, from what I've read. Most people in America are living day to day, struggling to make ends meet. Hillary's policies, if they're enacted, will help make that struggle just a little bit easier by easing the access to social services for those who need it most.
Will she engage in more sneaky backroom dealing to appease her corporate puppeteers? Abso-fucking-lutely. And yes, this is very, very bad.
Now let's look at Trump. We can begin with his temperament. The man is extremely insecure, to the point of resorting to grade-school-tier name-calling when talking about anyone who has criticised him or even called him out on his lying. He has promised to 'expand libel laws' to silence those who would openly criticize him. He considers Vladimir Putin a role model. And oh boy, is Trump a compulsive liar. He rarely seems to be able to open his mouth without bullshit spewing forth, as not only the front page of SH, but any fact-checking website, can attest.
[img]http://i.imgur.com/0NTonMm.png[/img]
Sure, that's problematic in a politician, but not what makes Trump so dangerous.
Second, the man is a bigot - And not your run of the mill inbred hick, but one with an agenda. All of his lies have served a purpose - to portray America as a country gone to shit with himself as the only man who can save it, America, the innocent victim of the predations of dirty minorities. He's specifically targeted those groups in American society that are the most vulnerable, the easiest scapegoats - Muslims, refugees, immigrants, the LGBT community. The USA doesn't have a clear enemy to fight in a major war right now, and he sees that the time is ripe to create enemies at home, a fantastic distraction while he runs the country like a personal bank account. If his incessant pandering to bigots doesn't much concern you, you're almost certainly not one who will be affected by it. Even if Trump's stonewalled by congress at every turn and achieves almost nothing as president, the very fact that a man with his views sits on the seat of power will embolden those degenerates who blame their shortcomings on minorities, and those minorities will suffer for it. Brexit wasn't at all about minorities, it was about the UK's autonomy and the upkeep costs of being a member state of the EU. But I remember reading the news after that vote went through - Minorities being attacked in the streets, their homes and businesses firebombed, regardless of whether they were refugees or citizens who had lived in the UK for generations. How much worse do you think it'll be in America, where racial tensions are already at boiling point, and where so much of the citizenry is armed?
The truth is, Trump has lied constantly to make the USA seem like a dangerous, ugly place to live. His policies will make his lies a reality, and if he is elected, he will spark riots that will lead to a lot of bloodshed.
Which brings us to the man's policies. Keeping in mind that Donald Trump has talked about murdering the families of terrorists and suspected terrorists, has proposed banning Muslims from entering the country repeatedly, has demonstrated an inability to grasp why the use of nuclear weapons in war is verboten, experts globally seem to agree that his economic policies may result at best in short-term growth for the country before leading to another global recession. His foreign policy will further destabilize the Middle East and much of the rest of the world, leading to many more terror attacks at home and abroad - fitting his narrative perfectly. How convenient. His idea of abandoning America's efforts to prevent the proliferation of nuclear weapons abroad has the potential to bring humanity back to the brink of the catastrophe we so narrowly avoided during the Cuban Missile Crisis. His policies, furthermore, completely fail to help the vast majority of Americans in any way - He will, however, remove legal protections for certain minorities, gut social security, healthcare and education, deregulate businesses further so they can more easily exploit their already struggling workers, and worse. This is a man who, may I remind you, proposed defaulting on the national debt as a solution to that problem. To vote him in because of a dislike of Clinton, no matter how well deserved, and trust that he won't be allowed to enact any of his insane policies is foolhardy at best, and madness at worst.
Now let's get to why I go around 'bullying' Trump supporters. I have been in several conversations with Trump supporters, and have made of them a simple request - I wanted them to explain to me how the policies of the Trump platform were going to help the common American.
Whether because they did not know of Trump's policies, or because they could not defend them, I don't know, but every single Trump supporter I have spoken to so far has clumsily dodged the question. Do I think that *all* Trump supporters are as stupid? No, because over 40% of the USA can't possibly be that dumb. I think better of Americans than that. I simply do not entertain a very high opinion of those who support the man, because not one person so far has given me a reasonable justification for choosing to stand behind this fool, beyond "Congress will stop him so he doesn't do too much damage".
Give me a few good reasons and I might start showing some respect.
[QUOTE=archangel125;51102327]~huge post~[/QUOTE]
Yeah to condense it a little I keep telling people to pull it together and look at the policies.
Hillary is a boring politician with a decent platform. Trump is a garbage tier candidate with a worse than usual Republican platform.
Sorry but if you're one of the middle to lower-class un-ironic Trump voters, you're trolling yourself.
[QUOTE=Splarg!;51102382]Yeah to condense it a little I keep telling people to pull it together and look at the policies.
Hillary is a boring politician with a decent platform. Trump is a garbage tier candidate with a worse than usual Republican platform.
Sorry but if you're one of the middle to lower-class un-ironic Trump voters, you're trolling yourself.[/QUOTE]
But...the Internet tells me I'll be a cuck if I vote for Hillary! I don't wanna be a cuck, whatever that means!
[QUOTE=normandie;51099949]ah yes, because asking someones bodyguards to disarm in order to show the hypocrisy of allowing the political elite to acquire protection without normal citizens having the same privilege is equal to calling for an assassination
keith olbermann is a blowhard, watching this video was painful[/QUOTE]
The political elite's bodyguards are trained and make their livelihood from being able to use a gun and use it correctly based on a situation.
a "normal citizen" is told where the safety is, and not to shoot at people.
Which is why gun deaths in the US are retardo levels
[editline]25th September 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=normandie;51099996]hes saying that if you value your second amendment rights, dont vote for clinton.[/QUOTE]
No?
"If she gets to pick her judges" is the premise of the hypothetical which applies to the following two conclusions.
"Nothing you can do, folks" is conclusion 1
"Although the second amendment people - maybe there is" is conclusion 2.
It's clearly meant as "If she gets to pick her judges, maybe the second amendment people can do something about that"
[QUOTE=FinalHunter;51103982]Well if I had seen you explain any of what you just posted before, you would have had my respect. That is why you keep seeing me come into threads about Trump defending people who clearly know nothing about foreign policy, economics, etc. because even though I recognize they're coming pretty close to shitposting, up until now it has just been a lot of people dogpiling them on a liberal leaning forum on how stupid they are rather than giving an actual explanation as to why they disagree like you just did.[/QUOTE]
But I have explained it. Repeatedly. Practically every conversation I've had with Trump supporters has had me backing up my arguments with evidence and asking them to do the same. Granted, I'm not nice about it, but since the ones I've spoken to lately can't even seem to defend their position without breaking down into a fit of meme shitposting when cornered, I'm having a hard time being respectful.
[QUOTE=normandie;51099987]you need to calm down, i always see you getting so angry in these threads for absolutely no reason. clouds your judgement a bit.[/QUOTE]If you can't handle somebody explaining themselves and using the word "fuck" then I suggest you abandon the thread, and your computer, and get as fucking far away from the internet and to your safe space, it'll save you years of therapy.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;51100016]She doesn't actually want to destroy the second amendment so you can keep that lie going as long as you want[/QUOTE]This is bullshit, she's always been for gun control and has made statements for either gutting civilian firearm ownership or severely restricting it. If gun rights are a voter's single most important issue Clinton should be the first candidate disqualified, she is [B]not[/B] a friend to anyone who owns a gun.
[editline]25th September 2016[/editline]
Also is anyone seriously surprised that Donald fucking Trump has lied? Really?
I'm not saying she's a friend.
I'm saying she's not going to destroy the second amendment
very different things.
I don't understand putting gun rights ahead of things like the economy or foreign policy. So people are willing to let their country become a global embarrassment if it means less gun regulations?
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;51099887]Sure pal, sure.
It's not like you're right, but "sure". anything to placate you enough for you to stop talking about things you don't know about.[/QUOTE]
Taking the "my view is right and your view is wrong" stance isn't exactly mature
especially when you're trying to act smug about it
[QUOTE=SirJon;51104631]Taking the "my view is right and your view is wrong" stance isn't exactly mature
especially when you're trying to act smug about it[/QUOTE]
Honestly, stop.
He was being a dismissive arrogant child, unwilling to discuss any subject, and really just trying to get under my skin, and personally attack me.
You can go ahead and be "Ah be mature guys it's so important" while, hypocritically, ignoring the one who actually acted like a child because your bias is showing.
Fuck I'm so tired of you people making this more about me than it is about the topic. Get over it, I disagree with people in a harsh way, that's who I am. I laid out reasoning and arguments, I never just made statements. When those arguments are ignored to goad me, and flame me, then no, I still have the high ground no matter how much people like yourself want to make it seem the other way.
[editline]25th September 2016[/editline]
I'm not saying I'm right because my view is right. I'm saying I'm right because of reasons, I laid out those reasons. Rather than get an argument back, I basically get flamed and ignored, and I'm the "immature" one?
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;51104654]Honestly, stop.
He was being a dismissive arrogant child, unwilling to discuss any subject, and really just trying to get under my skin, and personally attack me.
You can go ahead and be "Ah be mature guys it's so important" while, hypocritically, ignoring the one who actually acted like a child because your bias is showing.
Fuck I'm so tired of you people making this more about me than it is about the topic. Get over it, I disagree with people in a harsh way, that's who I am. I laid out reasoning and arguments, I never just made statements. When those arguments are ignored to goad me, and flame me, then no, I still have the high ground no matter how much people like yourself want to make it seem the other way.
[editline]25th September 2016[/editline]
I'm not saying I'm right because my view is right. I'm saying I'm right because of reasons, I laid out those reasons. Rather than get an argument back, I basically get flamed and ignored, and I'm the "immature" one?[/QUOTE]
The discussion is not relevant. If you're gonna act like a child, you'll get treated like one. That's a very bad way to get your point across outside of an echo chamber.
[QUOTE=SirJon;51104715]The discussion is not relevant. If you're gonna act like a child, you'll get treated like one. That's a very bad way to get your point across.[/QUOTE]
So you're going to go after me, and not the guy literally calling me, and my country, a cuck
yeah
you're the only one who's actually not seeing how pathetic your tirade actually is.
[editline]25th September 2016[/editline]
It seems like, you know, rather than target the actual culprit, due to your bias, you're going to target me
nice.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;51104722]So you're going to go after me, and not the guy literally calling me, and my country, a cuck
yeah
you're the only one who's actually not seeing how pathetic your tirade actually is.[/QUOTE]
I'm not saying he's any better, but I can't even take his post seriously. You on the other hand have a point. It'd be a shame to ruin that through a un-presentable attitude, and that's a very important part of any kind of sensitive discussion, such as politics.
[QUOTE=SirJon;51104715]The discussion is not relevant. If you're gonna act like a child, you'll get treated like one..[/QUOTE]
Which is exactly what happened though?? :v:
[QUOTE=SirJon;51104730]I'm not saying he's any better, but I can't even take his post seriously. You on the other hand have a point. It'd be a shame to ruin that through a un-presentable attitude, and that's a very important part of any kind of sensitive discussion, such as politics.[/QUOTE]
What you're essentially saying is that when people like Arktomys act like children, nobody's supposed to treat them like children? You make no sense.
[QUOTE=archangel125;51104928]What you're essentially saying is that when people like Arktomys act like children, nobody's supposed to treat them like children? You make no sense.[/QUOTE]
No, that's not at all what I'm saying. Please try to read my posts again.
He's saying that tact and respect are very important in debate. Even when you're wrong, if your argument is coherent and airtight, and the other guy is spewing ad hominems and buzzwords, you're more likely to win. Well, maybe not "win," but you'll make the other guy look like one hell of a jerk.
-snip-
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