• Malaysian passenger airliner shot down over Ukraine near Russian border
    1,595 replies, posted
[QUOTE=KillerJaguar;45420244]Has any country ever purposely killed their own citizens in a false flag operation to start a conflict? And don't give me 9/11 conspiracy theories.[/QUOTE] [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shelling_of_Mainila[/url]
[QUOTE=BananaFoam;45420210]Without trying to sound like a conspiracy nut, what if this was some cleverly executed false flag or terrorist ordeal where they [I]planned[/I] to bring it down over the Ukraine on purpose?[/QUOTE] everyone at /pol/ thinks its a false flag thats all that needs to be said about that
[QUOTE=Demeschik;45420280][url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shelling_of_Mainila[/url][/QUOTE] I think that kind of stuff happened all the time throught history. For example when Napoleon declared war on Portugal he ordered some border guards to attack Portugal soldiers and then blaimed the other party, using it as a reason to invade. It's probably the most common way to start a war.
[QUOTE=MuffinZerg;45420238][b]Sure[/b] I am booking my flight to Ukraine now. Oh wait... Okay, I will buy a bus ticket. I will go to Kiev. I will torture the politcians, bribe military, inspect confidential data. Then I will go to DNR, ride a tank right into Donetsk. I will capture their leaders and will cut their fingers until I find out the truth. Then I will go back to my house, open my browser and write you a post about who did what in that war. After all, [b] I wrote 4 lines on the internet, it's now my life goal to prove something to an anonymous[/b].[/QUOTE] people are discussing this incident and they generally post sources, not because they need to "prove themselves to an anonymous" (lmao) but because when you make a claim, the burden of proof is on you. people can say whatever they want about Conscript but at least the guy posted sources to back up his claims, you, on the other hand, came yelling and threadshitting about how the evil westerners are ignoring your baseless claims and soiling the image of the innocent pro-russians. if you want people to stop dismissing you as an idiot then step it up and explain yourself, stop acting indignant and playing the victim.
[QUOTE=KillerJaguar;45420244]Has any country ever purposely killed their own citizens in a false flag operation to start a conflict? And don't give me 9/11 conspiracy theories.[/QUOTE] [URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gleiwitz_incident"]There's a pretty important one that happened once.[/URL]
[QUOTE=Teddybeer;45420295]I'm having some lovely memories back when little green men walked into Crimea wearing russian uniforms driving russian vehicles spoke russian were flying russian helicopters etc. But to pretend they weren't russian because russia apologist were crying their eyes out. Later on it turned out that we were right all along. So I have a decent expectation that if we put our sherlock hats on and keep monitoring the media we can paint a rough image of who it roughly could have been. Means, motive, and opportunity[/QUOTE] Yet too early for the guillotines.
[QUOTE=KillerJaguar;45420244]Has any country ever purposely killed their own citizens in a false flag operation to start a conflict? And don't give me 9/11 conspiracy theories.[/QUOTE] The Russians in Chechnya's conflict.
[QUOTE=Teddybeer;45420295]I'm having some lovely memories back when little green men walked into Crimea wearing russian uniforms driving russian vehicles spoke russian were flying russian helicopters etc. But to pretend they weren't russian because russia apologist were crying their eyes out.[/QUOTE] They're spontanous Crimean self-defense forces! They got those machine guns and APCs at the surplus store!
[QUOTE=MuffinZerg;45420238][b]Sure[/b] I am booking my flight to Ukraine now. Oh wait... Okay, I will buy a bus ticket. I will go to Kiev. I will torture the politcians, bribe military, inspect confidential data. Then I will go to DNR, ride a tank right into Donetsk. I will capture their leaders and will cut their fingers until I find out the truth. Then I will go back to my house, open my browser and write you a post about who did what in that war. After all, [b] I wrote 4 lines on the internet, it's now my life goal to prove something to an anonymous[/b].[/QUOTE] Look. You made a claim, and made no effort to back it up. Other people making claims are doing their best by citing sources. Somebody called you out on it and this is your response. Get the fuck out. You're not contributing to the thread whatsoever.
[QUOTE=Teddybeer;45420295]I'm having some lovely memories back when [b]little green men walked into Crimea[/b] wearing russian uniforms driving russian vehicles spoke russian were flying russian helicopters etc. But to pretend they weren't russian because russia apologist were crying their eyes out. Later on it turned out that we were right all along. So I have a decent expectation that if we put our sherlock hats on and keep monitoring the media we can paint a rough image of who it roughly could have been. Means, motive, and opportunity[/QUOTE] [img]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/53/Stalin_vs_Martians_cover.jpg[/img] ?
[QUOTE=Awesomecaek;45420279]Honestly my best guess is that Rebels with a Buk fucked up and targeted the wrong plane, ignoring the distinction of it being civilian, too high for an Ukrainian plane, etc. Obviously, that's just a guess that may or may not be various degrees of educated, but that's besides the point.[/QUOTE] Yeah, I think some rebels got over anxious or something and may have misfired a rocket. I doubt Russia or Ukraine would gain anything but shooting down a civilian aircraft.
[QUOTE=MuffinZerg;45420311]Yet too early for the guillotines.[/QUOTE] You're the one bringing them up.
[QUOTE=Orkel;45420219]80 of the 295 passengers were children :I[/QUOTE] Not to sound rude, but any sources on this? I want to know more.
[QUOTE=MuffinZerg;45420311]Yet too early for the guillotines.[/QUOTE] What are you even trying to accomplish with your posts?
[QUOTE=Scot;45420290]everyone at /pol/ thinks its a false flag thats all that needs to be said about that[/QUOTE] I don't understand why we would have to dismiss the idea of a false flag. Are we dismissing it because it is silly?
[QUOTE=supersnail11;45420310][URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gleiwitz_incident"]There's a pretty important one that happened once.[/URL][/QUOTE] There were many such incidents, but never at this scale I believe. If anyone wanted to provoke Ukraine/DNR/Russia or just get an excuse they would kill a journalist or something. [editline]17th July 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=Cutthecrap;45420336]I don't understand why we would have to dismiss the idea of a false flag. Are we dismissing it because it is silly?[/QUOTE] Generally seems too chaotic for a planned event. But of course no one can say anything for sure now. If it's a false flag then whoever planned it was a mad man.
[QUOTE=Scot;45420290]everyone at /pol/ thinks its a false flag thats all that needs to be said about that[/QUOTE] Well that goes without saying.
[QUOTE=Scot;45420290]everyone at /pol/ thinks its a false flag thats all that needs to be said about that[/QUOTE] I've been on Politically Incorrect for almost three years and everything is a false flag. Not to say false flag events don't exist of course. I hope you realize that most posts there are not serious. These are the same guys who made the Ron Paul Happening pictures and the Ben Garrison edits.
[QUOTE=MuffinZerg;45420337] Generally seems too chaotic for a planned event. But of course no one can say anything for sure now. If it's a false flag then whoever planned it was a [B]mad man[/B].[/QUOTE] Like Putin or Strelkov?
[QUOTE=Cutthecrap;45420336]I don't understand why we would have to dismiss the idea of a false flag. Are we dismissing it because it is silly?[/QUOTE] Mostly because there is just one person yelling "false flag! false flag!" and making a terrible(non existant) argument out of it. It's a reasonable thing to speculate on, but the person who is bringing up the point is looking like an idiot so people aren't associating with the idea.
[QUOTE=Awesomecaek;45420230]Ukraine was recently successfully getting rid of the rebels, they had no reason to risk like this.[/QUOTE] I'm not saying Ukraine did it. Hell, maybe the people responsible [I]aren't affiliated with Ukraine, the rebels, or the Russians.[/I] Honestly, it is just wild speculation because I fail to see a motive for anybody and the rebels likely don't have the capability to bring down the flight.
I doubt either Ukraine ot Russia would do a false flag operation involving this amount of foreign citizens though.
[QUOTE=Kyle902;45420359]Like Putin or Strelkov?[/QUOTE] Anything mad any of them did?
[QUOTE=MuffinZerg;45420238][b]Sure[/b] I am booking my flight to Ukraine now. Oh wait... Okay, I will buy a bus ticket. I will go to Kiev. I will torture the politcians, bribe military, inspect confidential data. Then I will go to DNR, ride a tank right into Donetsk. I will capture their leaders and will cut their fingers until I find out the truth. Then I will go back to my house, open my browser and write you a post about who did what in that war. After all, [b] I wrote 4 lines on the internet, it's now my life goal to prove something to an anonymous[/b].[/QUOTE] you're pretty edgy aren't you I genuinely feel bad for some of the Russians in this thread who believe in the propaganda their government espouses.
[QUOTE=BananaFoam;45420374]the rebels likely don't have the capability to bring down the flight.[/QUOTE] the rebels were bragging about capturing SAMs before this happened, and now they're backpedaling
[QUOTE=BananaFoam;45420374]I'm not saying Ukraine did it. Hell, maybe the people responsible [I]aren't affiliated with Ukraine, the rebels, or the Russians.[/I] Honestly, it is just wild speculation because I fail to see a motive for anybody and the rebels likely don't have the capability to bring down the flight.[/QUOTE] It just doesn't look like a false flag because this kind of event has more consequences then one can predict. A typical "border incident" false flag will not be investigates as death of two hundred foreign citizens in a war zone. There is really no motive to be that extreme.
[QUOTE=BananaFoam;45420374]and the rebels likely don't have the capability to bring down the flight.[/QUOTE] theyve been bragging about having captured Buk SAMs which absolutely have the capability to bring down the flight
[QUOTE=MuffinZerg;45420382]Anything mad any of them did?[/QUOTE] i think flattening Grozny and shooting down planes full of civilians fall neatly into the "not cool" category
[QUOTE=MuffinZerg;45420395]It just doesn't look like a false flag because this kind of event has more consequences then one can predict. A typical "border incident" false flag will not be investigates as death of two hundred foreign citizens in a war zone. There is really no motive to be that extreme.[/QUOTE] Weren't you just sperging out about how people on FP act like experts on stuff and then you act like you're an expert on border incidents and false flag operations
[QUOTE=Kyle902;45420359]Like Putin or Strelkov?[/QUOTE] You made the claim. The burden of proof is on you.
Sorry, you need to Log In to post a reply to this thread.