Pro-government forces are going to keep saying that the coup is fizzling out so that people who would otherwise support the coup don't do so.
[QUOTE=NeonpieDFTBA;50718067]Those are some very tight turns on flightradar.[/QUOTE]
[t]http://up.nlan.org/UTDb.png[/t]
They got corrected, sometimes the tracking fucks up.
Yeah, no, this isn't nowhere near over. The parliament getting bombed confirms this.
[QUOTE=srobins;50718050]I don't understand, you seem to acknowledge the unlikelihood of him being replaced democratically, yet you oppose the idea of a coup in favor of democracy? Democracy is a golden principal but I don't think it's black and white, if someone is democratically elected and then subverts the democratic process to make it unfair going forward, I think it's entirely justified to "un-democratically" refresh the system. That being said, I honestly know fuck all about Turkish politics so I can't say whether or not this is the case for Erdogan, but at least hypothetically I think a coup could be justified under those circumstances.[/QUOTE]
I oppose coups because it brings sudden unstability to a country and considering that Turkey is a very important country for many issues revolving the West, having it being unstable is absolutely insane. Its' why I don't oppose the idea of stability through undemocratic takeovers by dictators. If the dictators keep the country stable why interrupt and we all know all authoritarian figures falls whether its by the peoples' will (Egypt) or by the western governments will (Libya).
But, yeah. Its a problematic situation. I honestly dont know if I want the coup to succeed now or later. It's a hard question. But delaying it would be good for the west though.
[QUOTE=Silentfood;50718073][t]http://up.nlan.org/UTDb.png[/t]
They got corrected, sometimes the tracking fucks up.[/QUOTE]
Looks like the plane's getting the hell outta Turkey.
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/jrSGtsC.png[/IMG]
They are gaining and leaving the circle
[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XXKdJBZi_TU[/url]
[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5fehLYL4CCs[/url]
Hey guys just to ambient the night. Some cool music. It adds some drama to an already fucked up and messed up situation.
It's like part of the air force joined in the coup and started bombing loyalists while another part remained with the loyalists.
[QUOTE]Turkish Prime Minister Binali Yıldırım has said military action was being "taken outside the chain of command" and it was an "illegal attempt" to seize power by "part of the military".[4] He further said that those involved "will pay the highest price".[17] [/QUOTE]
[url]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Turkish_coup_d%27%C3%A9tat_attempt[/url]
Oh....that's good....that's good....not "Justice will be served" but "You gonna get rekt'd"....very helpful
[QUOTE=srobins;50718034]This is what I don't understand about the situation. I won't pretend I'm religiously following every piece of breaking news because frankly I'm finding it borderline impossible to keep up here, but if he really is on that plane, and if the coup is primarily being conducted by the air force, I really don't understand how that plane is still flying. Can someone smarter than me explain?[/QUOTE]
Because a bloody coup would result in a never ending civil war.
You take control of the government, give him a trial (even if he isn't there), you get some people to advocates about all the horrible things he's done (real or not), and give him a sentence.
[QUOTE=InvaderNouga;50718028]You guys gotta thing with your minds, not your hearts about this.[/QUOTE]
My mind and my heart agree that erdogan should die ASAP
[URL]http://www.liveatc.net/flisten.php?mount=ltba&icao=ltba[/URL]
if you wanna listen to Istambul's airport tower ATC
[QUOTE=DeEz;50717926]He supports the democratic process, not Erdogan. He may be a snake but Erdogan [B]was[/B] elected by the people, and a military coup is a direct affront to democracy.[/QUOTE]
... Are we entirely sure that he was really elected, though? Its not as if up and coming dictators arent known to commit election fraud to further their goals.
[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;50718054]He's supporting Erdogen's Government, which is not pro-democracy, and after this I doubt Erdogen will relent power. He's been steadily strengthening his power the entire time he's been in office, and weakening his enemy's power to ensure they can't take him down. Turkey funding our enemies and bombing our allies, [B]we should already be at odds with them[/B]. The fact that we turn a blind eye to this shit just because they're "an ally" is horrendous. But it seems if something doesn't have an immediate economic or military benefit, we won't lift a finger. And if it does, we'll turn a blind eye and let you do whatever you damn well please. And we don't give a shit about stability, if we did, we'd throw our support behind Assad and end the war in Syria already, because Assad is the only hope for stability that Syria has. But we don't like Assad, so we haven't done that.[/QUOTE]
Okay, and the United States realizes that his government is not pro-democracy. You're not thinking about this on a larger scale, I feel like your case is largely based on emotion and romantic visions of democracy and freedom. While I totally agree that Erdogan needs to GTFO there's more nuance to politics than trying to look like the shining white knights of the world. In the real world there are serious economic and political consequences for every action; even for something you see as noble as supporting the deposing of Erdogan (which by the way we don't even know if the military would actually install a democratic government since all military coups tend to be carried out under the pretense of "Democracy and freedom for the people".) Supporting the coup would also send the message to other countries experiencing similar situations that the United States is not to be trusted, even when you're an ally.
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/6Mc03tV.png[/IMG]
They are going down at quite the speed, are they going to land near Istanbul?
At the start of this, I thought the military would actually succeed but now it seems very unclear.
His plane is getting the fuck outta there
[IMG]http://puu.sh/q36Bl/8db851bea1.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/e1Wjwz2.png[/IMG]
How could he even safely land when the entire coop is going all out
[QUOTE=darth-veger;50718095][IMG]http://i.imgur.com/6Mc03tV.png[/IMG]
They are going down at quite the speed, are they going to land near Istanbul?[/QUOTE]
Seems like it, they've turned towards one of the airports in Istanbul.
Sure wish I knew Turkish right now. They're at 10,000ft, were at 20,000 when circling earlier. Landing seems likely.
turkish state television is supposedly back on air
[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;50718054]He's supporting Erdogen's Government, which is not pro-democracy, and after this I doubt Erdogen will relent power. He's been steadily strengthening his power the entire time he's been in office, and weakening his enemy's power to ensure they can't take him down. Turkey funding our enemies and bombing our allies, [B]we should already be at odds with them[/B]. The fact that we turn a blind eye to this shit just because they're "an ally" is horrendous. But it seems if something doesn't have an immediate economic or military benefit, we won't lift a finger. And if it does, we'll turn a blind eye and let you do whatever you damn well please. And we don't give a shit about stability, if we did, we'd throw our support behind Assad and end the war in Syria already, because Assad is the only hope for stability that Syria has. But we don't like Assad, so we haven't done that.[/QUOTE]
As much as I want Erdogan ousted by any means, Turkey is far too geostrategically important to risk losing.
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/oVAHl1F.png[/IMG]
I don't think he can, safely anyways. He may need to though, because of fuel or whatever. Also, does anyone know if the coup is also going on in Istanbul?
Is he actually going to do this? Wow, he's going out blazing.
[QUOTE=darth-veger;50718102][IMG]http://i.imgur.com/e1Wjwz2.png[/IMG]
How could he even safely land when the entire coop is going all out[/QUOTE]
He seems to be heading for Sabiha Gocken airport, not Ataturk. Ataturk is probably a higher risk right now.
I sure hope the military has an exit plan if this goes fully shit for them.
[QUOTE=racerfan;50718115]He seems to be heading for Sabiha Gocken airport, not Ataturk. Ataturk is probably a higher risk right now.[/QUOTE]
Wonder if they're landing for a reason, or if they're just low on fuel.
[QUOTE=niiiiiiiiok;50718118]I sure hope the military has an exit plan if this goes fully shit for them.[/QUOTE]
Potential Civil War with guerilla warfare units or get executed? I don't know mate. Seems unlikely anything will happen at this point, anymore. Well, except the executions.
[QUOTE=FezianEmperor;50718080]I oppose coups because it brings sudden unstability to a country and considering that Turkey is a very important country for many issues revolving the West, having it being unstable is absolutely insane. Its' why I don't oppose the idea of stability through undemocratic takeovers by dictators. If the dictators keep the country stable why interrupt and we all know all authoritarian figures falls whether its by the peoples' will (Egypt) or by the western governments will (Libya).
But, yeah. Its a problematic situation. I honestly dont know if I want the coup to succeed now or later. It's a hard question. But delaying it would be good for the west though.[/QUOTE]
Stability isn't necessarily the most important or beneficial thing for a country, though. Stability under an oppressive regime is arguably worse than temporary instability in the process of restructuring a country for a better future.
[QUOTE=mr appie;50718108][IMG]http://i.imgur.com/oVAHl1F.png[/IMG][/QUOTE]
I'll wait to see of the fighting stops
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/vIVXW65.png[/IMG]
They keep on diving yo
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