• RUMOR: Star Wars Episode 7 to be named ''Order of the Jedi'' & more
    149 replies, posted
I'm not going to argue that the Yoda fight contributed to the story in any meaningful way but I don't think it's detrimental, and I think it's okay to give him just one good fight. Ohhs and Ahhs are okay every once in a while. When I saw it in the theater, everyone went nuts. People wanted to see it. That theater blowing up is my most vivid memory of seeing any of the prequels in theaters.
[QUOTE=Bread_Baron;44722620]Eh, I still think it ruined Yoda to take him out of his element and make him into this crazy little fighter dude. See below, I guess. I'm not really concerned about explanations as to why Yoda can do crazy shit. It's the fact that he actually does it that bothers me. Also, I'd say he's still wise in the prequel canon although he wasn't able to see through the most paper-thin Sith plot. That's probably down to poor writing, I doubt he lived 800 years of his life but then got wise over the next 30. If I recall correctly, lightsabers were originally supposed to have the weight of real swords. I imagine Lucas wanted something flashier for the prequels and probably said some shit like "But what if they're actually [I]light[/I]sabers, not [I]heavy[/I]sabers!" Again, I'm not concerned with explanations but his official one is that in the OT the Jedi were old and Luke was barely trained so the fights are slower. He's clearly made that up in a quick attempt at consistency. The logic behind crazy powers that make you do sword-ballet wasn't the point of the original fights. They were there to demonstrate conflict, moreso than X wants to kill Y so they fight. That's why there's usually more dialogue than actual fighting. Long story short, the prequel fights are basically waving CGI and glowsticks in the our faces in a bid to impress us. Giving Yoda a little green lightsaber and having him jump around doing mad shit isn't there to develop his character or advance the plot, it's just Lucas' attempt to make us go "oooh" and "aaah" because a pop culture icon is flying around the screen for the first time despite any inconsistencies this may cause.[/QUOTE] I wanted more story out of the prequels. The fights existing didn't diminish the story. If the writing was better, then i'd have less issue with the prequels. The fights being showy moments isn't by definition a bad thing. You can see even in original sequels that the fights steadily got more showy and fast paced as it goes on and Luke learned how to fight. He learned even outside of being taught it, so to me, I can see the explanation that those fights weren't similar to the prequels fights. You don't have to like it, and I don't even like the prequels, but they're not 100% pure shit.
[QUOTE=Cone;44712129]it also vaguely happened in the clone wars anime where Jedi sometimes wear clone armor under their robes, which makes way more sense and looks super cool. [B]the clones were pretty rad in that as well[/B][/QUOTE] [IMG]http://static.fjcdn.com/gifs/Ownage_2f7175_135982.gif[/IMG] I can only dream of a Republic Commando 2.
Also, when talking about the simpler fight choreography of the original trilogy, one should take into account the circumstances. Vader was burned, aged and living in a giant life-support suit. Obi-Wan was an old man, who had probably been out of practice for over a decade. Luke was just becoming a Jedi in his late teens, and didn't really have much training, especially in lightsaber combat. So it does make some sense that Obi-Wan and Anakin in the New Trilogy would be pulling off much more impressive moves. They were far younger and had been raised in an environment that cultivated such skills while Luke grew up on a moisture farm, shooting womprats with a T-16. I know Lucas probably didn't intend any of that, but it does make some sense in context.
To this day I still think Skywalker won that fight with Vader because of pure brutal strength over what Vader could muster with his RoboLimbs. Luke was swinging his lightsaber like a frustrated Tee Ball player. But in context, it shows a passion that was running through him. Ever see a singer looking for their big break? They go mental And I like the flashy choreographed fights in the prequels myself. They had an entire order dedicated to teaching people, over the course of their entire life time starting as a tiny kid. If you could sense stuff happening a split second before it happened, fights would look rehearsed, because they kind of are
[QUOTE=Marden;44722461]And Solo High Commander? That goes against his whole character. I'm sure it's just an excuse for Ford to play grumpy old military leader.[/QUOTE] Did you watch Episode 6? He was in charge of the strike team to take down Endor's shield bunker. Leia also noted in Episode 5 that "he's a natural born leader," and the Hoth base commander was sad to see him go, indicating he was very valuable to the rebels. His [i]character development[/i] turned him from a selfish smuggler only caring for himself, to one of the leading generals in the alliance.
[QUOTE=Kinversulath;44724187]Also, when talking about the simpler fight choreography of the original trilogy, one should take into account the circumstances. Vader was burned, aged and living in a giant life-support suit. Obi-Wan was an old man, who had probably been out of practice for over a decade. Luke was just becoming a Jedi in his late teens, and didn't really have much training, especially in lightsaber combat. So it does make some sense that Obi-Wan and Anakin in the New Trilogy would be pulling off much more impressive moves. They were far younger and had been raised in an environment that cultivated such skills while Luke grew up on a moisture farm, shooting womprats with a T-16. I know Lucas probably didn't intend any of that, but it does make some sense in context.[/QUOTE] it's kinda not as good from a storytelling perspective though, cos when you're doing these crazy acrobatic moves and everything's going a mile a minute the choreography can come to block the performance - sometimes you gotta have a more up close and personal duel so you get time to see how the characters emote through their fighting, and through that you get to care about them. i'm not saying it's gotta be slow, fast fights are super rad, but there's only so many sick flips you can do before you start to realize that you're effectively watching a robot do them. i mean you look at the final fight from Episode 3 and you can tell that Lucas is trying super hard to make it all epic and shit, but a comparatively slow fight with actual characters fighting would have served that end way better. even a super fast and cool looking fight is dull if it's got nothing going on.
[QUOTE=TheTalon;44724364]To this day I still think Skywalker won that fight with Vader because of pure brutal strength over what Vader could muster with his RoboLimbs. Luke was swinging his lightsaber like a frustrated Tee Ball player. But in context, it shows a passion that was running through him. Ever see a singer looking for their big break? They go mental And I like the flashy choreographed fights in the prequels myself. They had an entire order dedicated to teaching people, over the course of their entire life time starting as a tiny kid. If you could sense stuff happening a split second before it happened, fights would look rehearsed, because they kind of are[/QUOTE] I hope they manage to make them look like [url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vnkMyVLLxMY]the fight in this Old Republic trailer[/url]. It has that rehearsed edge to it, but they also look like they actually want each other dead. That was something about the OT fights; they were few and far between, but the participants always looked like their goal was to kill and not to look stylish. That trailer to me is the best of both worlds.
[QUOTE=Cone;44724877]it's kinda not as good from a storytelling perspective though, cos when you're doing these crazy acrobatic moves and everything's going a mile a minute the choreography can come to block the performance - sometimes you gotta have a more up close and personal duel so you get time to see how the characters emote through their fighting, and through that you get to care about them. i'm not saying it's gotta be slow, fast fights are super rad, but there's only so many sick flips you can do before you start to realize that you're effectively watching a robot do them. i mean you look at the final fight from Episode 3 and you can tell that Lucas is trying super hard to make it all epic and shit, but a comparatively slow fight with actual characters fighting would have served that end way better. even a super fast and cool looking fight is dull if it's got nothing going on.[/QUOTE] I agree and I actually have faith in JJ with this particular area, I think while the star trek films were obvs lacking in the scientific side, the actual action felt like it would fit fairly well in a space opera/sword and sandals in space/whatever Star Wars is. The person to person combat in Star Trek 09 actually felt like it had some weight behind it
So, the day is almost over and no press-release. it is safe to say this rumour was false.
[QUOTE=KillerJaguar;44724684]His [i]character development[/i] turned him from a selfish smuggler only caring for himself, to one of the leading generals in the alliance.[/QUOTE] THIS. My biggest gripe with the prequels was the utter lack of character development. Anakin Skywalker goes from being an ungrateful brat to being an ungrateful brat in a cybernetic suit. Obi-Wan goes from disappointed father figure to more or less the same by Episode III. Count Dooku showed promise with his whole "acting as a double agent against Palpatine's plot" thing, up until an hour later in Episode II where it turned out he was just another evil sidekick for the plot. The prequels were written as if George Lucas just assumed that the characters we knew had always been that way, which makes for terribly bland storytelling. People complain that "X" is too out-of-character for somebody, but I think it's only that way if it comes off as abrupt and without rhyme or reason. It's all in the writing, really. Luke Skywalker went from being a wayward kid who made rash decisions to a wise yet troubled Jedi Knight, and we saw every step of his development though the movies. It really felt like you were growing up with him at times. Same for other OT characters. Based on JJ's work, I have no doubt he can right most of the wrongs of the PT and surpass it, even if the movies may not live up to the OT.
it should be called "End of the Jedi". That would be more promising
[QUOTE=IrishBandit;44722956][IMG]http://static.fjcdn.com/gifs/Ownage_2f7175_135982.gif[/IMG] I can only dream of a Republic Commando 2.[/QUOTE] Unfortunately that gif would never be possible in RC, the dang supers take a few mags to take down with blaster mode
[QUOTE=Ekalektik_1;44724895]I hope they manage to make them look like [url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vnkMyVLLxMY]the fight in this Old Republic trailer[/url]. It has that rehearsed edge to it, but they also look like they actually want each other dead. That was something about the OT fights; they were few and far between, but the participants always looked like their goal was to kill and not to look stylish. That trailer to me is the best of both worlds.[/QUOTE] I agree with you completely and almost posted all three of the TOR CGI trailers in my previous post. They have more complex choreography than OT, fighters want to hit each other and most importantly they use Force a lot.
I remember a friend who was way into Star Wars telling me about a race of people in the extended material that had pets which could negate 'the force'. They were immune to everything the Jedi could (often literally) throw at them. I would love to see these guys in the movie.
[QUOTE=Ekalektik_1;44724895]I hope they manage to make them look like [url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vnkMyVLLxMY]the fight in this Old Republic trailer[/url]. It has that rehearsed edge to it, but they also look like they actually want each other dead. That was something about the OT fights; they were few and far between, but the participants always looked like their goal was to kill and not to look stylish. That trailer to me is the best of both worlds.[/QUOTE] Holy crap this is literally the perfect balance, and they actually use the force more often
[del]I just realised something, in the 3 original Star Wars films, do they ever say that Luke and Leia are brother and sister? I haven't watched them in ages so I'm unsure. If they don't, in 3 they do. So it kinda changes the tone of the original 3, you know, being about incest and such.[/del] Searched it up, apparently they DO say, in VI. Anyway, I have high hopes for this film.
[QUOTE=TheTalon;44724364]To this day I still think Skywalker won that fight with Vader because of pure brutal strength over what Vader could muster with his RoboLimbs. Luke was swinging his lightsaber like a frustrated Tee Ball player. But in context, it shows a passion that was running through him. Ever see a singer looking for their big break? They go mental And I like the flashy choreographed fights in the prequels myself. They had an entire order dedicated to teaching people, over the course of their entire life time starting as a tiny kid. If you could sense stuff happening a split second before it happened, fights would look rehearsed, because they kind of are[/QUOTE] I love how Luke just goes nuts when Vader talks about his sister, they presented Luke in a very passionate and real way. The previous fights look a lot flashier and perhaps rehearsed but that doesn't explain the sometimes absolutely stupid swordfighting that they're doing. They do lightsaber ballet instead of hitting eachother with the damn saber. Sometimes it just really destroy the whole fight, there are numerous times where the fights in the prequels could have ended. I understand the concept of honor and duels but overall at times it's just ridiculous. I hope the new Star Wars they will take an approach similiar to the old trilogy, something that is more down to earth instead of ridiculous acrobatics.
[QUOTE=Tuskin;44709201]Better then 'General Calrissian' What did Lando do other then try to turn them over to the Empire and Rescue Han from Jabba?[/QUOTE] i always thought it was because he was a high-ranking dude who was in charge of the most important city of an entire planet(at least according to the EU his city was the capital of bespin), so they gave him a high rank in the rebellion as well, or i don't know, maybe he did stuff for the rebellion during the time han solo spent frozen, EU and games like x-wing alliance expand on that somewhat(you play as lando during the final missions).
[QUOTE=Tuskin;44709201]Better then 'General Calrissian' What did Lando do other then try to turn them over to the Empire and Rescue Han from Jabba?[/QUOTE] Lando doesn't get as developed as Han Solo, but he already had his character development before Episode 5. He went from a shady person like Solo, to acquiring the rights to the Bespin mining colony and becoming the administrator. Han noted that he sounded like a responsible leader while they were walking and talking through Bespin. And then sometime between Episode 5 and 6, Lando officially joined the rebellion after Vader screwed him over their deal, and got promoted to general from, "his maneuvers at the Battle of Tanaab," which Han and Lando mention before the Death Star II briefing in Episode 6. This is all information that it stated in the movie. None of this is from the EU or anything. I've watched the original trilogy religiously, so I know almost every little fact and detail of them. There's a lot more depth than "this is so OOC for Han or Lando." The only one I do find odd is Leia becoming Queen Regent.
I cling to my pre-special edition trilogy like a baby blanket. I'm one of those people who don't even acknowledge the newer trilogy as existing. But I guess I am a litttttle excited for these new ones which says a lot.
Is this not going to be about Young Jedi Knights?
[QUOTE=KillerJaguar;44728942]Lando doesn't get as developed as Han Solo, but he already had his character development before Episode 5. He went from a shady person like Solo, to acquiring the rights to the Bespin mining colony and becoming the administrator. Han noted that he sounded like a responsible leader while they were walking and talking through Bespin. And then sometime between Episode 5 and 6, Lando officially joined the rebellion after Vader screwed him over their deal, [B]and got promoted to general from, "his maneuvers at the Battle of Tanaab," which Han and Lando mention before the Death Star II briefing in Episode 6.[/B] This is all information that it stated in the movie. None of this is from the EU or anything. I've watched the original trilogy religiously, so I know almost every little fact and detail of them. There's a lot more depth than "this is so OOC for Han or Lando." The only one I do find odd is Leia becoming Queen Regent.[/QUOTE] That sounds like something Plinkett points out in the star wars reviews for the prequels. When Anakin mentions a time when Obi-Wan was trapped in a cave of gundarks or something like that Plinkett flipped out and said "why don't we see that happening so we feel attached?"
[QUOTE=LtKyle2;44730254]That sounds like something Plinkett points out in the star wars reviews for the prequels. When Anakin mentions a time when Obi-Wan was trapped in a cave of gundarks or something like that Plinkett flipped out and said "why don't we see that happening so we feel attached?"[/QUOTE] Plinkett raises very good points in his videos but also a couple of really bullshit ones, especially the one you mentioned
[QUOTE=Ashes;44727125]Holy crap this is literally the perfect balance, and they actually use the force more often[/QUOTE] The other thing I love is how Malgus uses brute force too. He's not afraid to knee his opponent in the gut or use his saber like a club, which is something nobody else really ever did except for maybe Grievous. That really makes it seem more like a fight than a lightshow.
[QUOTE=Marden;44722461]*Princess Leia is now "Queen Regent of the Republic". *Han Solo is "High Commander of the Republic". These two rumors don't sound right. I thought the idea behind the New Republic was the power would go back to the senate instead of one person. Queen Regent sounds awfully dominant. Why can't she be an Alderaan ambassador? Oh wait, it got destroyed... New Alderaan ambassador? And Solo High Commander? That goes against his whole character. I'm sure it's just an excuse for Ford to play grumpy old military leader. I hope these rumors stay rumors and not a real thing. It reminds me how JJ hypercharged his characters in his Star Trek (Sulu's sword fighting, Uhura's language knowledge...) only this time it's about the amount of power they hold. I also see a discussion about the lightsaber fights. Over the weekend I played both The Force Unleashed games so I'm open to a more Force-injected fighting. Just less dance moves in the choreography, please. Also it's time some evil Force user, Sith or whoever, fucked things up. Refer to the sequence at 52:50. [video=youtube;XTmIwOLfUlM]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XTmIwOLfUlM[/video][/QUOTE] Love how palpatines just sitting there with his tea giving zero fucks
[QUOTE=Ashes;44727125]Holy crap this is literally the perfect balance, and they actually use the force more often[/QUOTE] Still way too many moments of people doing a 360 and turning their back on the opponent for no reason at all
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