• Boy who shot intruder says suspect 'cried like a little baby'
    468 replies, posted
[QUOTE=ElectronicG19;50228224]When have I said you shouldn't defend yourself if threatened? I said in a previous post I'd try to defend myself if some guy broke into my house and had a knife to me and I had [I]no other choice[/I](it wouldn't be a gun in the UK) This guy was legging it away, he wasn't about to carve the kid up. Standing there and shooting him doesn't do anything useful apart from get a few material items back.[/QUOTE] You haven't explicitly said you shouldn't defend yourself but you and others are establishing so many rules to what counts as "legitimate" self defense that you might as well. It's not this particular instance that concerns me, it's the standards that you want to apply to [I]all [/I]instances of self defense and home invasion wherein you want home owners to place themselves in positions compromising enough to you for it to feel right to defend themselves. [QUOTE=AK'z;50228231]you want to start pulling guns on people, be my guest. I'm just saying you are most likely to die.[/QUOTE] What an absurd argument. "Instead of defending yourself and most likely dying, you should retreat and only maybe die".
[QUOTE=Raidyr;50228264]You haven't explicitly said you shouldn't defend yourself but you and others are establishing so many rules to what counts as "legitimate" self defense that you might as well. It's not this particular instance that concerns me, it's the standards that you want to apply to [I]all [/I]instances of self defense and home invasion wherein you want home owners to place themselves in positions compromising enough to you for it to feel right to defend themselves. [/QUOTE] Yes, because there comes a point where you cross a line to vigilantism and get in the way of real justice. It's all well and good saying it's self defence, but this kid shot him while running away. If he had killed the guy, would it be murder or self defence d'you reckon?
[QUOTE=KingGrim;50228251]So you're most likely to die by choosing to defend yourself? Lol alright.[/QUOTE] you defend when there's imminent danger in front of you right now, when your life is being threatened. you don't defend when you go to the danger and have a bubble then get shot.
Which is past the point of self defense. This was self defense.
cops take upwards of 30 minutes to arrive at my place, if not longer. a lot can happen in that time and due to isolation someone could very easily decide it would be easier to knock me and my family off and could pretty easily get away with it. sure, they probably won't, but i don't want to take chances. give them a warning and if they don't comply then chances are they're willing and able to do damage to me.
[QUOTE=ElectronicG19;50228279]Yes, because there comes a point where you cross a line to vigilantism and get in the way of real justice. It's all well and good saying it's self defence, but this kid shot him while running away. If he had killed the guy, would it be murder or self defence d'you reckon?[/QUOTE] Shooting someone who threatened your life then ran away is arguably self-defense but it is certainly not murder, neither is it vigilantism. [QUOTE=AK'z;50228286]you defend when there's imminent danger in front of you right now, when your life is being threatened. you don't defend when you go to the danger and have a bubble then get shot.[/QUOTE] By "go to the danger" do you mean "go to my living room that is actively being ransacked"?
[QUOTE=KingGrim;50228287]Which is past the point of self defense. This was self defense.[/QUOTE] NO it wasn't Oh my god, he walked out the front door and the kid shot at him 12 times.
[QUOTE=ElectronicG19;50228142]If you really think that every burglar wants to murder you in cold blood, holy shit dude. Loving all the hard men in this thread saying they'd shoot someone if they broke into their house. I doubt it.[/QUOTE] It's not that I think they all want to. It's "jeez, this stranger that just busted into my room as I'm typing this post looks kinda scary, he might just kill me where I sit.". Also you really just don't understand Americans and our culture do you? You really think we love shooting people for fun? If Chicago, where I live had a gun ban, then only the Criminals could have guns, and the entire city would be at their mercy. Have you ever had someone try to break into your own home? You can't predict a criminal, you can't just assume they're just a burglar and take your shit and run. They can take your shit, shoot your father, rape your mother and your sister, and tie you up just to make you watch as they do it before probably killing them and you. Or, you could not be a moron in the face of danger, get the gun that you can easily acquire, and attempt to get them to surrender. And if they die, they die, and while it does suck to kill someone, there is no shame in being proud that you did protect yourself, your family, and your house.
[QUOTE=AK'z;50228286]you defend when there's imminent danger in front of you right now, when your life is being threatened. you don't defend when you go to the danger and have a bubble then get shot.[/QUOTE] The danger is already in my house. I will definitely shoot the danger over hoping it goes away without hurting me.
[QUOTE=AK'z;50228310]NO it wasn't Oh my god, he walked out the front door and the kid shot at him 12 times.[/QUOTE] are you saying there was 0 danger to his life after the robber said "I'm going to kill you"? man we're going in circles here and we're talking about two scenarios at once
[QUOTE=Raidyr;50228306]Shooting someone who threatened your life then ran away is arguably self-defense but it is certainly not murder, neither is it vigilantism. [/QUOTE] The guy was running away, kid wasn't in immediate danger, it isn't self defence.
[QUOTE=Raidyr;50228264] What an absurd argument. "Instead of defending yourself and most likely dying, you should retreat and only maybe die".[/QUOTE] it's not absurd when it works you doughnut.
[QUOTE=AK'z;50228332]it's not absurd when it works you doughnut.[/QUOTE] If you say so. I'll take my chances with what leaves what happens next in my hands, not a burglars. I don't think I'd "most likely" die, if it came down to it. If that makes me a, uh... doughnut, then so be it, I guess.
To all the people saying they'd have done the same thing, kind in mind you're not an eleven year old child (I hope.)
[QUOTE=Perrine;50228325]are you saying there was 0 danger to his life after the robber said "I'm going to kill you"? man we're going in circles here[/QUOTE] the danger was there well before he said that apparently. we're not going in circles, you are the one who is more likely to die in that scenario and it's not ridiculous to assume that. [editline]30th April 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=evilweazel;50228339]If you say so. I'll take my chances.[/QUOTE] that's good, enjoy your gunfight.
[QUOTE=AK'z;50228358]the danger was there well before he said that apparently. we're not going in circles, you are the one who is more likely to die in that scenario and it's not ridiculous to assume that. [/QUOTE] how are you more likely to die shooting at a guy who isn't armed than shooting at the same guy who came back armed?
[QUOTE=evilweazel;50228324]The danger is already in my house. I will definitely shoot the danger over hoping it goes away without hurting me.[/QUOTE] the kid apparently had plenty of time to get out of danger in this situation. but a gun was there, so may as well risk your life further.
Person A: Maybe if I sit still the intruder in my home won't harm me. Person B actually does something other than just sitting there. How the hell are you having a gunfight by getting rid of the person before he draws his gun or grabs something in your house to try and harm you? Have fun with your logic.
[QUOTE=ElectronicG19;50228142]If you really think that every burglar wants to murder you in cold blood, holy shit dude. Loving all the hard men in this thread saying they'd shoot someone if they broke into their house. I doubt it.[/QUOTE] I live in Canada - the laws here do not reflect the American laws when it comes to home defense (at least, I don't believe they do). I still get where they're coming from. If somebody breaks into my house, is confronted by me, and continues to not get the fuck out and utters threats towards me, you can bet your sweet ass I'm going to use a gun if I have access to one. If they're not GTFOing once they realize the home is currently occupied and they're not alone, I sincerely doubt that burglarizing you will be their stopping point. I'm not taking that chance. If they've already broken into my home and aren't leaving once they see me, clearly they're fucked in the head, and I have no guarantee that they're not going to do something erratic. By this point, they already have.
[QUOTE=KingGrim;50228385] How the hell are you having a gunfight by getting rid of the person before he draws his gun.[/QUOTE] ok hang on a second here's a scene I think you'll understand. [media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Ae6B7C05Nk[/media] The guy should have stayed in the toilet. No argument.
[QUOTE=KingGrim;50228385]Person A: Maybe if I sit still the intruder in my home won't harm me. Person B actually does something other than just sitting there. How the hell are you having a gunfight by getting rid of the person before he draws his gun or grabs something in your house to try and harm you? Have fun with your logic.[/QUOTE] You're going to run to your gun safe, open it up, grab the gun, shoot the robber before he can get a round of?
[QUOTE=plunger435;50228414]You're going to run to your gun safe, open it up, grab the gun, shoot the robber before he can get a round of?[/QUOTE] you should confront them gun in hand, before you know if they are armed or not.
[QUOTE=Ninja Gnome;50228435]you should confront them gun in hand, before you know if they are armed or not.[/QUOTE] do you do this to everyone who knocks on your front door?
[QUOTE=Ninja Gnome;50228435]you should confront them gun in hand, before you know if they are armed or not.[/QUOTE] The scenario here is the robbery already threatened the kids life. So obviously he'd be aware you're in the house.
Presumably, some one would hear them first, get their gun and investigate
[QUOTE=AK'z;50228443]do you do this to everyone who knocks on your front door?[/QUOTE] robbers don't knock lol if they do and someone answers, they go away
[QUOTE=plunger435;50228414]You're going to run to your gun safe, open it up, grab the gun, shoot the robber before he can get a round of?[/QUOTE] Generally the idea is if you hear someone breaking in you grab your gun and hit him as soon as you see him if he's able to get in, has a gun and sees you first then you're fucked 9/10 times.
[QUOTE=AK'z;50228443]do you do this to everyone who knocks on your front door?[/QUOTE] I live in a one bedroom apartment. If someone broke into my house, I have no where to run. I live too high to jump to the ground, I have one door in and out of my apartment. If you break into my house, I either hide, fight, or face death. I've had people break into my home before. It's terrifying because it's your safe place, literally your home that's been violated. Your home is no longer safe for you. For a person in my situation, what should I do should I find myself being robbed? Hide and leave my life in their hands? Fight a person who may or may not be drugged up who may or may not have a weapon? Or do I just let them have their way with me, my stuff, my fiance? I cannot for the life of me understand this.
[QUOTE=plunger435;50228414]You're going to run to your gun safe, open it up, grab the gun, shoot the robber before he can get a round of?[/QUOTE] I keep a loaded 1911 under my pillow and an AR-15 behind my desk [QUOTE=AK'z;50228443]do you do this to everyone who knocks on your front door?[/QUOTE] Typically, yes.
[QUOTE=AK'z;50228443]do you do this to everyone who knocks on your front door?[/QUOTE] a break-in is not a knock on the door. in any case, i am always wary of anyone who knocks on my door as i live in the middle of nowhere and nobody should be knocking on my door. i don't go armed, though.
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