[QUOTE=Advancedrock;43029501]No, it's no different from anything else, a person offers a service and sells said service at a price.[/QUOTE]
If that were true, you wouldn't expect [URL="http://economics.uchicago.edu/pdf/Prostitution%205.pdf"]the massive supply elasticity prostitutes have[/URL] as women move into or out of the field just as long as necessary or to get a short-term profit. Actual service professions don't have people just suddenly flop in with no training and perform perfectly well, you can't just up and decide to be a nurse or mechanic or hairstylist for a month. Whores don't behave like unskilled laborers because they're providing a service, it's because they are unskilled laborers in the majority of instances and simply providing a commodity of "pussy." The simplest counterargument here is the [URL="http://www.lse.ac.uk/geographyAndEnvironment/whosWho/profiles/neumayer/pdf/Article-for-World-Development-_prostitution_-anonymous-REVISED.pdf"]positive correlation between legal prostitution and inward human trafficking-[/URL] if you can actually use an economic argument to explain how trafficked humans are a natural consequence of a service industry demand increase, but only in a way that affects this one oddly specific industry, I'll eat a hat.
Of course, not all types of prostitute are equal, [URL="http://www.economist.com/news/britain/21578434-old-industry-deep-recession-sex-doesnt-sell"]which is why dominatrices and other people with a skill set actually behave as such[/URL], but going "oh well it's a service like any other!" is willfully ignoring actual economics.
[QUOTE=yawmwen;43029478]the problem with prostitution is that it treats women as a commodity to be bought and sold for money.[/QUOTE]
No.
Its like renting a clown for your 6 year olds birthday party, except you get to fuck the clown.
Its no different from ANY service you give, such as a limo driver, plumber, IT, caddy, etc...
This is not women specific in ANY way at all.
[QUOTE=hexpunK;43029879]I never said anything about the legality of it. Stop jumping to conclusions you fucking guy.[/QUOTE]
But if you are a model you are being chosen based on your looks or sexappeal. And you "use" their bodies to do something you want. So it should be illegal. It's your logic.
[QUOTE=hexpunK;43029879]You are paying for a person, not ownership of the person, but use of their body (sex). Which is significantly different to use of their time (doing other jobs).[/QUOTE]
Explain to me how is the service so different from lets say getting a massage instead of just saying it is.
[QUOTE=Silly Sil;43029882]If you are forced to do a job, call the cops. That's human trafficking or slavery. This has nothing to do with prostitution being legal. You might as well be captured and forced to tell jokes. Ban.[/QUOTE]
I don't get the last part but to the first: Many of the [I]legal[/I] prostitutes don't even speak German, they get their papers taken away as soon as they got married to some German pimp or are only here for the 3 months of stay they are allowed.
All of the women-help services are providing their brochures in a dozen different languages for exact that reason.
The legal status of prostitution didn't change their situtation at all.
[QUOTE=HoodedSniper;43029895]No.
Its like renting a clown for your 6 year olds birthday party, except you get to fuck the clown.
Its no different from ANY service you give, such as a limo driver, plumber, IT, caddy, etc...
This is not women specific in ANY way at all.[/QUOTE]
it's not woman specific but most prostitutes are women.
lol
[QUOTE=Advancedrock;43029875]Why is sex different from any other service? Why is sex special? I thought people like you wanted sex to be more acceptable, but here you guys are saying that sex is unique and different from every other activity ever.[/QUOTE]
You really don't see why sex is different from repairing a roof or changing a tire?
[QUOTE=HoodedSniper;43029895]No.
Its like renting a clown for your 6 year olds birthday party, except you get to fuck the clown.
[/QUOTE]
Worst birthday party ever.
Why, having it legalized and monitored is the best thing that could happen to such a market, why take it away?
Actually give them trade unions if they don't have them already.
[QUOTE=Killuah;43029930]I don't get the last part but to the first: Many of the [I]legal[/I] prostitutes don't even speak German, they get their papers taken away as soon as they got married to some German pimp or are only here for the 3 months of stay they are allowed.
All of the women-help services are providing their brochures in a dozen different languages for exact that reason.[/QUOTE]
Then it's human trafficking and it's illegal. It has nothing to do with our debate.
[QUOTE=Killuah;43029930]The legal status of prostitution didn't change their situtation at all.[/QUOTE]
Then how's that relevant?
[QUOTE=Silly Sil;43029929]But if you are a model you are being chosen based on your looks or sexappeal. And you "use" their bodies to do something you want. So it should be illegal. It's your logic.
Explain to me how is the service so different from lets say getting a massage instead of just saying it is.[/QUOTE]
Getting a massage, being a model, etc. are use of a skill. You can be 110% beautiful, but not have a single clue what you are doing, causing you to be a shit model. Prostitution doesn't have this, anyone can be walking pussy/ass, as you aren't paying that person for something that can do, more something they are.
This is not a hard concept to grasp at all, come on. I'm sure you can do it. It's a service yes, but you are treating the person as a commodity, that is the entire point of my posts.
[QUOTE=hexpunK;43029976]Getting a massage, being a model, etc. are use of a skill. You can be 110% beautiful, but not have a single clue what you are doing, causing you to be a shit model. Prostitution doesn't have this, anyone can be walking pussy/ass, as you aren't paying that person for something that can do, more something they are.
This is not a hard concept to grasp at all, come on. I'm sure you can do it. It's a service yes, but you are treating the person as a commodity, that is the entire point of my posts.[/QUOTE]
I don't know man, well known prostitutes in Nevada brothels can get paid 10grand an hour.
[QUOTE=yawmwen;43029934]it's not woman specific but most prostitutes are women.
lol[/QUOTE]I'd say this is tied to the stigma against prostitution and sex in general. If you remove that stigma and educate people on sex, you'd plausibly see the gap shrink. Just like in other industries that were previously consider as the domain of women. Education is starting to see men be more excepted in them. We both know this is a major point of feminism, that by working towards equality for women and changing how people view roles in society, it will also help out men in society as well. Correct?
[QUOTE=slapdown3;43029992]I don't know man, well known prostitutes in Nevada brothels can get paid 10grand an hour.[/QUOTE]
What's your point here? Some prostitutes happen to be desirable because they are pretty good? Awesome, that has nothing to do with my post though. There's still no requirement other than having certain sex organs to work as a prostitute.
[QUOTE=hexpunK;43030021]What's your point here? Some prostitutes happen to be desirable because they are pretty good? Awesome, that has nothing to do with my post though. There's still no requirement other than having certain sex organs to work as a prostitute.[/QUOTE]For basic work in many manual labor jobs the only requirement is "Be able to lift this heavy object." The only requirement there is being in shape.
[QUOTE=hexpunK;43029976]Getting a massage, being a model, etc. are use of a skill. You can be 110% beautiful, but not have a single clue what you are doing, causing you to be a shit model. Prostitution doesn't have this, anyone can be walking pussy/ass, as you aren't paying that person for something that can do, more something they are.
This is not a hard concept to grasp at all, come on. I'm sure you can do it. It's a service yes, but you are treating the person as a commodity, that is the entire point of my posts.[/QUOTE]
Is that your criteria? Not paying for a skill? Anyone can be the most basic physical worker then. They are not being paid for their skills. Ban.
Any other made up criteria that would involve other jobs?
[QUOTE=hexpunK;43030021]What's your point here? Some prostitutes happen to be desirable because they are pretty good? Awesome, that has nothing to do with my post though. There's still no requirement other than having certain sex organs to work as a prostitute.[/QUOTE]
Good prostitutes are paid better than bad ones? Anyone really could give a massage, it's not hard at all, but wouldn't being great be a skill?; Wouldn't people being good sexual partners be a skill too?
yawmwen aren't you supposed to be against government control? 'cause right now you're arguing for government control over whether people can fuck or not. Ignore the fact that money is involved, and that's exactly what you're doing.
[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;43030105]yawmwen aren't you supposed to be against government control? 'cause right now you're arguing for government control over whether people can fuck or not. Ignore the fact that money is involved, and that's exactly what you're doing.[/QUOTE]
i'm not doing anything of the sort.
[QUOTE=yawmwen;43030119]i'm not doing anything of the sort.[/QUOTE]
You are, and you're acting like as if women are incapable of accepting responsibilities for entering industries like these.
[QUOTE=Aphtonites;43030131]You are, and you're acting like as if women are incapable of accepting responsibilities for entering industries like these.[/QUOTE]
how am i advocating government control?
[QUOTE=Silly Sil;43029882]If you are forced to do a job, call the cops. That's human trafficking or slavery. This has nothing to do with prostitution being legal. You might as well be captured and forced to tell jokes. Ban.[/QUOTE]
I was kidnapped and forced to flip burgers. Burgers should be banned. This is basically the logic people are applying. Sex is taboo in western society so people have a bias towards it being accepted as a job. People will accept any justification for this bias.
[QUOTE=Silly Sil;43030067]Is that your criteria? Not paying for a skill? Anyone can be the most basic physical worker then. They are not being paid for their skills. Ban.
Any other made up criteria that would involve other jobs?[/QUOTE]
"Made up criteria" if you want to call it that, is what is going on. You are paying for the use of their body, end of discussion, not necessarily their skill (though some might charge more if they are good at bumping uglies), but the fact they have a certain set of sex organs.
You're like a fucking brick wall, seriously. My point is clear as fucking day. And I have never once argued the legality of the act, merely that thinking it isn't making their body a commodity is fucking retarded.
But please, do try posting more snark in hopes it will destroy my arguments, it's working so well so far.
[QUOTE=Rangergxi;43030152]I was kidnapped and forced to flip burgers. Burgers should be banned. This is basically the logic people are applying. Sex is taboo in western society so people have a bias towards it being accepted as a job. People will accept any justification for this bias.[/QUOTE]
Sex is different from all other services (doesn't matter if they are dependent on your looks or sexappeal or that you are not being paid for any skills) because it's this special magical thing. But most people here are virgins so they don't understand. Rate me zing. [/sarcasm]
[editline]1st December 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=hexpunK;43030160]"Made up criteria" if you want to call it that, is what is going on. You are paying for the use of their body, end of discussion, not necessarily their skill (though some might charge more if they are good at bumping uglies), but the fact they have a certain set of sex organs.
You're like a fucking brick wall, seriously. My point is clear as fucking day. And I have never once argued the legality of the act, merely that thinking it isn't making their body a commodity is fucking retarded.
But please, do try posting more snark in hopes it will destroy my arguments, it's working so well so far.[/QUOTE]
I understand your position completely, it's just bullshit. All you have posted were criteria that make a person a commodity that can be applied to other jobs as well. You pay masseuse for their physical service done to you. You pay models to use their bodies. You use basic physical workers without any skills. Even if someone would be hired to just stand somewhere in a corner and do absolutely nothing, it's still up to that person to do that. A person would only be as a commodity if it was done against the person's will, see slavery or human trafficking.
[QUOTE=Silly Sil;43030186]I understand your position completely, it's just bullshit. All you have posted were criteria that make a person a commodity that can be applied to other jobs as well. You pay masseuse for their physical service done to you. You pay models to use their bodies. You use basic physical workers without any skills. Even if someone would be hired to just stand somewhere in a corner and do absolutely nothing, it's still up to that person to do that. A person would only be as a commodity if it was done against the person's will, see slavery or human trafficking.[/QUOTE]
maybe one day we can look at all those jobs as being exploitive as well.
[QUOTE=yawmwen;43030137]how am i advocating government control?[/QUOTE]
How do you suggest restricting people from working as prostitutes without government control?
Your argument that they are a commodity is like saying lawyers, customer support and taxi drivers are commodities. It's just another service "industry".
[QUOTE=yawmwen;43030332]maybe one day we can look at all those jobs as being exploitive as well.[/QUOTE]
All work is exploitation?
[QUOTE=deadoon;43030338]How do you suggest restricting people from working as prostitutes without government control?[/QUOTE]
did any of my posts even use the word restrict?
[QUOTE=yawmwen;43030332]maybe one day we can look at all those jobs as being exploitive as well.[/QUOTE]
Why though? Why not let people do what they think is okay? Why do you think you are in a position to decide what other people should do with their own lives?
The best you can do is to create enough job opportunities in different branches so that people don't have to choose between a job they don't like and no job at all.
[QUOTE=yawmwen;43030332]maybe one day we can look at all those jobs as being exploitive as well.[/QUOTE]
Are you fucking serious?
[QUOTE=HoodedSniper;43030371]Are you fucking serious?[/QUOTE]Unfortunately, yes.
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