Bernie Sanders and Ted Cruz to debate Obamacare at CNN town hall tonight at 9 PM ET - Polidicks

Is there a better stream? The CNN one seems to be cutting out every other second.

can't believe ted cruz is trying to kill the elderly when will his serial killer ways end

I like how laid back this debate seems. People are laughing and they seem to be making jokes but still get their views across in a professional manner.

Kudos to Bernie for keeping his cool under the hairdresser's question. I disagree with him on a lot of fundamental issues but I give him credit for standing by his policies even when presented with someone who would suffer under them.

[QUOTE=OvB;51792226]Is there a better stream? The CNN one seems to be cutting out every other second.[/QUOTE] [video=youtube;qyB2qO4Bhs0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qyB2qO4Bhs0[/video]

This is so civilized...Why weren't these two the candidates...THEYRE EVEN AGREEING

[QUOTE=Llamaguy;51792239]This is so civilized...Why weren't these two the candidates...THEYRE EVEN AGREEING[/QUOTE] Because the DNC destroyed Bernie, and Donald Trumps rhetoric and 24/7 news coverage destroyed the rest of the GOP Candidates.

[QUOTE=sgman91;51792221]That's one of the risks of having a public system. It's quality depends upon the temporary will of the government.[/QUOTE] That's one way of looking at it. I'd say this is more of a warning against electing shit, self serving, governments than against a public health system.

I actually thought Cruz early on did a better job actually providing some numbers to back up his claims They're both holding their own and having a very productive debate.. it's almost like this is what politics should be..

Bernie hitting the difference on ACCESS vs RIGHT

Cruz deflecting the question on whether or not healthcare is a right.

[QUOTE=TheFilmSlacker;51792257]Bernie's getting pissed, this is great.[/QUOTE] Pissed Bernie is ALWAYS best Bernie.

[QUOTE=Cows Rule;51792255]Cruz deflecting the question on whether or not healthcare is a right.[/QUOTE] No he isn't lol. Healthcare isn't a right because rights are protections from others not reasons to demand something from others.

[QUOTE=toaster468;51792266]No he isn't lol. Healthcare isn't a right because rights are protections from others not reasons to demand something from others.[/QUOTE] He absolutely deflected. The question was do Americans have the right to health care. He didn't answer.

[QUOTE=Llamaguy;51792269]He absolutely deflected. The question was do Americans have the right to health care. He didn't answer.[/QUOTE] If you would actually understand what he said then you would know it was answered. First off it was a leading question so bernie could get a cheap gotcha if cruz said "No its not a right". He said access to healthcare is a right because of the free market.

[QUOTE=toaster468;51792277]If you would actually understand what he said then you would know it was answered. First off it was a leading question so bernie could get a cheap gotcha if cruz said "No its not a right". He said access to healthcare is a right because of the free market.[/QUOTE] IF you can afford it! Literally the argument Bernie made with Access vs Right.

Cruz cites 2001 data, from the UK again.

[QUOTE=Llamaguy;51792288]IF you can afford it![/QUOTE] That isn't even a rebuttal of what he said. He literally said "access".

[QUOTE=toaster468;51792295]That isn't even a rebuttal of what he said. He literally said "access".[/QUOTE] Okay. Access != Right. I have access to purchase a Lamborghini. Can I afford it? No. What good does that serve me? How about if I have cancer? I have access to health care. But I can't afford my medication or insurance. That in no way helps me.

[QUOTE=Llamaguy;51792288]IF you can afford it! Literally the argument Bernie made with Access vs Right.[/QUOTE] So you finally agree that he answered the question? [editline]7th February 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=Llamaguy;51792305]Okay. Access != Right. I have access to purchase a Lamborghini. Can I afford it? No. What good does that serve me? How about if I have cancer? I have access to health care. But I can't afford my medication or insurance. That in no way helps me.[/QUOTE] You don't have a right to a lamborghini. Just like you don't have a right to the internet. Because rights aren't about taking things, it's about protecting the individual. That's why you buy healthcare. I'm glad you said cancer because there were cheap plans with high deductibles which were affordable, before the ACA

[QUOTE=toaster468;51792306]So you finally agree that he answered the question?[/QUOTE] He did not say "Americans have the right" or "Americans do not have the right". So no. [editline]7th February 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=toaster468;51792306]So you finally agree that he answered the question? [editline]7th February 2017[/editline] That's why you buy healthcare. I'm glad you said cancer because there were cheap plans with high deductibles which were affordable, before the ACA[/QUOTE] If you cannot afford health care, you are fucked. That means that person does not have the right to health care.

Holy fuck watching this debate really makes me wish the 2016 election was Sanders vs Cruz.

[QUOTE=toaster468;51792266]No he isn't lol. Healthcare isn't a right because rights are protections from others not reasons to demand something from others.[/QUOTE] That's a hugely oversimplified definition of a "right." Human rights language goes way beyond that - a major part of the International Bill of Human Rights is the ICESCR, which outlines economic, social, and cultural rights - all of which are about [I]positive[/I] rights to certain things, like clean water, housing, healthcare, etc. Voting rights are a form of political rights. Is that "freedom of protection from others?" No, it's a service provided by the government. You have a right to vote, and it is the [I]government's responsibility[/I] to provide services to allow you to vote. If the government didn't establish polling stations, didn't do any kind of measurement of ballots, your right to vote would be threatened. Human rights go far beyond "protections from others." Do you have a right to clean water? That's a service that must be provided, not a protection from others.

Ted Cruz is the slimiest rat of the GOP. He represents everything wrong with the party.

[I]"Whats her name?"[/I]

Am I crazy or do I hear random whispers from time to time?

[QUOTE=toaster468;51792306]So you finally agree that he answered the question? [editline]7th February 2017[/editline] You don't have a right to a lamborghini. Just like you don't have a right to the internet. Because rights aren't about taking things, it's about protecting the individual. That's why you buy healthcare. I'm glad you said cancer because there were cheap plans with high deductibles which were affordable, before the ACA[/QUOTE] Is it fair that I have to pay hundreds a month that others don't have to because I was born with a mental illness that I can't help? Should a health insurance company be allowed to deny me coverage on that, forcing me to pay both premiums and for the medications myself?

[QUOTE=toaster468;51792306]So you finally agree that he answered the question? [editline]7th February 2017[/editline] You don't have a right to a lamborghini. Just like you don't have a right to the internet. Because rights aren't about taking things, it's about protecting the individual. That's why you buy healthcare. I'm glad you said cancer because there were cheap plans with high deductibles which were affordable, before the ACA[/QUOTE] So why shouldn't people be protected from health insurance companies being able to charge well beyond their means?

[QUOTE=OvB;51792323][I]"Whats her name?"[/I][/QUOTE] I thought I heard that! [editline]7th February 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=Aldawolf;51792327]Is it fair that I have to pay hundreds a month that others don't have to because I was born with a mental illness that I can't help?[/QUOTE] You have the right to pay more, obviously!

[QUOTE=toaster468;51792306] You don't have a right to a lamborghini. Just like you don't have a right to the internet. Because rights aren't about taking things, it's about protecting the individual. That's why you buy healthcare. I'm glad you said cancer because there were cheap plans with high deductibles which were affordable, before the ACA[/QUOTE] You're [URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_to_health"]patently incorrect[/URL]. It's a different subsection of human rights than we're used to seeing in America, but it's a major section of human rights dialogue. Just read the [URL="http://www.fmreview.org/sites/fmr/files/FMRdownloads/en/FMRpdfs/Human-Rights/udhr.pdf"]UDHR[/URL], basically the central pillar of human rights dialogue, and tell me that rights are just "protections from others." It explicitly brings up social services in Article 25. There's debate, sure, but you're presenting this as if rights are [I]exclusively[/I] "protections from others" when you couldn't be more wrong.