• Red vs. Blue Political Divide May Really Be About Young vs. Old
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[QUOTE=Duck M.;51904716]I think its a combination of a lack of education (I was much less informed in HS than I am now at just 20, a lot can change), a feverent outrage culture over political correctness and social justice, and corners of the internet growing more and more consolidated in their views. When I was growing up on the internet, youtube was in its infancy and while 4chan still had their nazi habbo hotel raids and such, it was mostly to be edgy with, looking back, very few single serious inklings behind it, as much as they horrified me as a young lad. There really has been a marked shift over the years, and I figure it has to do in part with isolated echo-chambers that reverberate talking points and spread them like viruses. Most of these guy's views are derived from reddit, 4chan, youtube, etc. I doubt there's a single Gen-Z'er that's even old enough to have taken college level social science and economics classes. Quite frankly, it is a bit odd, and I don't really have an answer, even as someone that's been exposed to over a decade of internet culture at every level. I suppose my view might be narrow minded in terms of scope as I'm only observing a very particular brand of people (which I'm sure some people know what I'm talking about), but you get the idea. pretty much what i wanted to say as well. I've noticed an increasing conservative pull in social issues more than anything else.[/QUOTE] Sounds legit, man. Like I said, my money is on them growing out of that shit and joining us on the left when they get into their 20s and have some more education/life experience. As a teen I was a shit-heel with barely formed, all over the place political views (nobody knows what the fuck they believe in HS). Then I realized I hated bush and became a libertarian for a little while (wanted Ron Paul in 2012), then I joined the Army and started my trek to the left until I got to where I am now, a socdem who flirts with true socialism.
If you're 'conservative' because some attention whore SJW left a bad taste then you're either horribly uneducated on politics or you didn't stand for the ideals in the first place. You don't just drop egalitarianism and equality for all because some freak on the internet supports it too. Grow up, do some reading, and stand for the real left instead of deferring to the complete moral opposite because of some glorified crusade on PC culture.
[QUOTE=HappyCompy;51904743]Sounds legit, man. Like I said, my money is on them growing out of that shit and joining us on the left when they get into their 20s and have some more education/life experience. As a teen I was a shit heel, anti-establishment fucktard who was pro-law and order and tough on crime stances. Generic rebellious dumb shit (nobody knows what the fuck they believe in HS). Then I realized I hated bush and became a libertarian for a little while (wanted Ron Paul in 2012), then I joined the Army and started my trek to the left until I got to where I am now, a socdem who flirts with true socialism.[/QUOTE] I wouldn't be surprised, either. What I'm learning more and more is that the "liberal brainwashing" that's occurring in college is actually newspeak for "education" and that, while brash as it may sound, facts, science, and evidence more often than not offer more credence to the left side of things. That and it being a massive leap in self-introspection, self-awareness, awareness of the world around you, and experience with thousands of new people lend credence to the idea that some of these Gen-Z conservatives could change their mind on certain topics if they pursue higher education. I realize that this totally sounds like some self-righteous holier-than-thou bourgeois bullshit that people hate LOL, but I don't want it to come off that way if at all possible. Stuff like climate change (and general scientific method for that matter), economic theory, education, welfare benefits, LGBT etc. are just not things that the right has grasped nor represented.
[QUOTE=Crumpet;51904753]Again, if you're 'conservative' because some attention whore SJW left a bad taste then you're either horribly uneducated on politics or you didn't stand for the ideals in the first place. You don't just drop egalitarianism and equality for all because some freak on the internet supports it too. [B]Grow up,[/B] do some reading, and stand for the real left instead of deferring to the complete moral opposite because of some glorified crusade on PC culture.[/QUOTE] Which is exactly what is going to happen with a lot of those "conservative" Gen Zers. They are not even 18 yet.
[QUOTE=Duck M.;51904758]I wouldn't be surprised, either. What I'm learning more and more is that the "liberal brainwashing" that's occurring in college is actually newspeak for "education" and that, while brash as it may sound, facts, science, and evidence more often than not offer more credence to the left side of things. That and it being a massive leap in self-introspection, self-awareness, awareness of the world around you, and experience with thousands of new people lend credence to the idea that some of these Gen-Z conservatives could change their mind on certain topics if they pursue higher education.[/QUOTE] I really hate the meme that colleges are liberal brainwashing centers. College educates people, and educated people tend to lean left. edit: looking back on it, in highschool I probably would have fit the GenZ "conservative" archetype.
[QUOTE=Crumpet;51904753]Again, if you're 'conservative' because some attention whore SJW left a bad taste then you're either horribly uneducated on politics or you didn't stand for the ideals in the first place. You don't just drop egalitarianism and equality for all because some freak on the internet supports it too. Grow up, do some reading, and stand for the real left instead of deferring to the complete moral opposite because of some glorified crusade on PC culture.[/QUOTE] kids who grow up left but swing hard right because someone called them racist on the internet one time make really disgust me these kind of "moderates" are only for equality until any minor inconvenience to them makes them flip flop completely. they don't believe in anything and will just vote for whatever's easier for them at the time. even people who do bad things for misguided intentions can believe in something bigger than themselves mlk was right
I may be considered a young person, but I definitely believe Red vs Blue was better before all the wierd Halo fanfiction crap happened with all those people named after states.
[QUOTE=Jund;51904803]kids who grow up left but swing hard right because someone called them racist on the internet one time make realyl disgust me these kind of "moderates" are only for equality until any minor inconvenience to them make them flip flop completely. they don't believe in anything and will just vote for whatever's more convenient for them at the time. even people who do bad things for misguided intentions can believe in something bigger than themselves mlk was right[/QUOTE] Lol don't forget the classic "I'm an independent because both parties are equally shit" aka I have no idea what the fuck I believe. Moderates fucking suck man, I hate working with them (FUCKING CENTER-RIGHT/THIRD WAY DEMS! YOU DONT GET TO CALL YOURSELF A LEFTY JUST BECAUSE YOU THINK WEED SHOULD BE LEGAL AND GAYS SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO MARRY! *screams in class consciousness*). I do realize that this makes me the stereotypical hardlining, obnoxious leftist cunt, however. Now, repeat after me: profit has no place in healthcare. Health insurance companies are exploitative bourgeois middle men that increase the burden on the working class and should not be allowed to exist.
[QUOTE=Duck M.;51904758][B]I wouldn't be surprised, either. What I'm learning more and more is that the "liberal brainwashing" that's occurring in college is actually newspeak for "education" and that[/B], while brash as it may sound, facts, science, and evidence more often than not offer more credence to the left side of things. That and it being a massive leap in self-introspection, self-awareness, awareness of the world around you, and experience with thousands of new people lend credence to the idea that some of these Gen-Z conservatives could change their mind on certain topics if they pursue higher education.[/QUOTE] Not really... I mean in a very basic sense yes, but that's not the part of the myth that make people afraid for their own personal saftey. You see whenever a case of threats, intimidation, violence, or hate speech occurs on a college campus the school is the one whose reputation tends to suffer the most. Bad things tend to happen at colleges more frequently during hard times like these, and people prefer to blame the college when they happen. That's what brings people to the conspiracy theorists who show them stuff like Common Core and that one ex-KGB agent that conspiracy theorists practically worship and it starts to look really sinister.
[QUOTE=1239the;51904696]you know when us millennials were growing up, bashing christianity was the in-thing to do - everyone did it, we'd go on endlessly during our teen years about how much christians are wrong and bad and hateful and want to rule over us. it was the fucking overwhelming consensus everywhere - christians are bad, athiesm, satanism and agnosticism are in. and then we grew up.[/QUOTE] What do you grown up atheists think about Sharia Law? I notice a weird amount of "atheists" still hate fundamental Islam but then they turn around to suck fundamental Christian cock even though fundamental Christianity is still more damaging in America. Should hate both if they want to be grown up.
[QUOTE=HappyCompy;51904810]Lol don't forget the classic "I'm an independent because both parties are equally shit" aka I have no idea what the fuck I believe. Moderates fucking suck man, I hate working with them (FUCKING CENTER-RIGHT/THIRD WAY DEMS! YOU DONT GET TO CALL YOURSELF A LEFTY JUST BECAUSE YOU THINK WEED SHOULD BE LEGAL AND GAYS SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO MARRY! *screams in class consciousness*). I do realize that this makes me the stereotypical hardlining, obnoxious leftist cunt, however.[/QUOTE] i'm center left, but the difference between me and faux moderates is that i believe in what i say. for them it's simply an easy way to appear educated in politics without having to put any work into understanding the complexity of it, whether it be "mixing the two extremes must be the right answer" or "nothing really matters anyway who cares" it's better to be conservative through ignorance than because a homeless person asked you for a quarter and a blm protest made your commute home 5 minutes longer guess i'm just extra salty because this happened to someone i was acquainted with and now they never shut the fuck up about how sjws are ruining their lives (which never happened and never will happen)
[QUOTE=dillspears;51904846]What do you grown up atheists think about Sharia Law?[/QUOTE] did you know the word 'sharia' means 'law'. you're basically saying 'what do you think about law law'.
I honestly wouldn't be surprised if a lot of the far-left crowd end up being the social conservatives of tomorrow. It seems that while people tend to drift around the left/right axis with age, people generally stay where they are on the authoritarian/libertarian axis.
[QUOTE=dillspears;51904846]What do you grown up atheists think about Sharia Law?[/QUOTE] Religion has no place in government. Egalitarianism takes precedence over religious beliefs every time. In my ideal society mainstream religion would naturally atrophy as people became more educated, but this is far the the case now (we meet again, Christian Right, my old nemesis). That said, I don't see religion as literally Hitler, either. I've dabbled in Christianity, Hinduism, Buddhism, and Zoroastrianism and found them all deeply interesting (Christianity the least so, tbh lol). Religion can definitely have a positive effect on people.
[QUOTE=Aredbomb;51904827]Not really... I mean in a very basic sense yes, but that's not the part of the myth that make people afraid for their own personal saftey. You see whenever a case of threats, intimidation, violence, or hate speech occurs on a college campus the school is the one whose reputation tends to suffer the most. Bad things tend to happen at colleges more frequently during hard times like these, and people prefer to blame the college when they happen. That's what brings people to the conspiracy theorists who show them stuff like Common Core and that one ex-KGB agent that conspiracy theorists practically worship and it starts to look really sinister.[/QUOTE] It's not really surprising that conspiracy theorists aren't the most rational bunch. Colleges are hotbeds of political conflict, true, but it really is overstated just how "frequent" these issues are.
[QUOTE=Jund;51904863]i'm center left, but the difference between me and faux moderates is that i believe in what i say. for them it's simply an easy way to appear educated in politics without having to put any work into understanding the complexity of it, whether it be "mixing the two extremes must be the right answer" or "nothing really matters anyway who cares" it's better to be conservative through ignorance than because a homeless person asked you for a quarter and a blm protest made your commute home 5 minutes longer guess i'm just extra salty because this happened to someone i was acquainted with and now they never shut the fuck up about how sjws are ruining their lives (which never happened and never will happen)[/QUOTE] "I hate people who fight for things that will indirectly or directly benefit me, like the fight for $15, universal healthcare, feminists, and SJWs fighting for an egalitarian society." "I make 30k a year and I'm exploited to hell and don't have health insurance, but I'm conservative because I hope to one day become the exploiter and exploit other people who are in my position. Fuck you, fight for $15! Lazy! SAD #MAGA" "I'm a """fiscal conservative""" but a $12Billion wall is k and I can't see that private insurance companies are inefficient and drive up healthcare costs vs a taxpayer funded system. As long as welfare wueeenz can't collect a check I'm happy."
[QUOTE=xagnu;51904869]I honestly wouldn't be surprised if a lot of the far-left crowd end up being the social conservatives of tomorrow. It seems that while people tend to drift around the left/right axis with age, people generally stay where they are on the authoritarian/libertarian axis.[/QUOTE] The far left crowd stands for egalitarianism and that covers pretty much the whole social base so I doubt that, if anything it'll be the socially-moderate-slightly-progressive 'gay marriage is alright I guess but weed, idk' crowd that end up the hardliner social conservatives. The times change too fast for these people to adapt their beliefs.
[QUOTE=Crumpet;51904898]The far left crowd stands for egalitarianism and that covers pretty much the whole social base so I doubt that, if anything it'll be the socially-moderate-slightly-progressive 'gay marriage is alright I guess but weed, idk' crowd that end up the hardliner social conservatives. The times hangs too fast for these people to adapt their beliefs.[/QUOTE] Fucking this! Guarantee you your last two sentences accurately describes many baby boomers in their youth!
[QUOTE=dillspears;51904846]What do you grown up atheists think about Sharia Law? I notice a weird amount of "atheists" still hate fundamental Islam but then they turn around to suck fundamental Christian cock even though fundamental Christianity is still more damaging in America. Should hate both if they want to be grown up.[/QUOTE] Idk how often I see atheists "sucking fundamental Christian cock" tbh. I'm against exploitative and hateful Christian tendencies as well, especially as an LGBT individual. However, growing up in the urban south I can recognize that Religion can teach a lot of good lessons and do a lot of good things if interpreted selectively. If nothing else, it's a way to bring the community together and many churches do good humanitarian work as well. Same goes for Islam. Some of my best friends were/are Muslims, and they were totally normal, loving and outright fantastic people to know. Just because I disagree with parts of their holy book (even if I disagree with and despise those parts to a GREAT degree) doesn't mean I have to despise them. Religion will never go away. It's too widespead and deeply ingrained and emblematic of our collective global culture. The best we can hope for is the moderation of those doctrines through selective interpretation. We've seen it in western nations and otherwise before.
[QUOTE=1239the;51904718][URL="http://www.pewforum.org/religious-landscape-study/age-distribution/"]no, not really[/URL] [IMG]https://puu.sh/us2vg/81c8a29262.png[/IMG][/QUOTE] I'm pretty sure that table doesn't (directly) answer the question whatsoever. You'd have to transform the table to get the total age distribution (not to mention that the age spans are of different sizes) and then examine 'religion percentage/age group' instead of 'age group percentage/religion'. [editline]3rd March 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=Duck M.;51904909][...] Religion will never go away. It's too widespead and deeply ingrained and emblematic of our collective global culture. The best we can hope for is the moderation of those doctrines through selective interpretation. We've seen it in western nations and otherwise before.[/QUOTE] I'd go so far as to say it's part of human nature (not for everyone but for some people at least). Personally I'm really not a fan of organised religion, but I recognise that it still leads certain people to do more good than otherwise. It probably helps that I don't care what someone believes in as long as they don't put that into action in a way that negatively impacts others, though.
[QUOTE=dillspears;51904846]What do you grown up atheists think about Sharia Law? I notice a weird amount of "atheists" still hate fundamental Islam but then they [B]turn around to suck fundamental Christian cock[/B] even though fundamental Christianity is still more damaging in America. Should hate both if they want to be grown up.[/QUOTE] What do you even mean by this, everyone I know that's critical of Islam is critical of Christianity too. What are some examples of Atheists hating fundamentalist Islam but sucking off fundamentalist Christianity.
[QUOTE=Anderan;51904991]What do you even mean by this, everyone I know that's critical of Islam is critical of Christianity too.[I] What are some examples of people hating fundamentalist Islam but sucking off fundamentalist Christianity.[/I][/QUOTE] Republicans?
[QUOTE=BlackMageMari;51905012]Republicans?[/QUOTE] Israel?
[QUOTE=BlackMageMari;51905012]Republicans?[/QUOTE] He was referring to atheists though.
[QUOTE=Liem;51904317]Stats like this make me wonder how we'll handle the issues of the future when our generation is older[/QUOTE] "well see son you have to live in bubble cities because the old fucks that ran things 50 yeaes ago didnt believe in global warming, antibiotic resistance or basic science so while we could have stopped total ecological collapse...they made money instead. you cant even go see eagles anymore because they were removed from the endangered species act due to economic concerns that they nested above oil and gas pockets that had to be exploited. sry not my fault really."
[QUOTE=Anderan;51905034]He was referring to atheists though.[/QUOTE] I know, that's part of the joke.
[QUOTE=Crumpet;51904753]Again, if you're 'conservative' because some attention whore SJW left a bad taste then you're either horribly uneducated on politics or you didn't stand for the ideals in the first place. You don't just drop egalitarianism and equality for all because some freak on the internet supports it too. Grow up, do some reading, and stand for the real left instead of deferring to the complete moral opposite because of some glorified crusade on PC culture.[/QUOTE] to play devils advocate, i think this kind of response only insults them further, like 'if you're not into our side of politics for this SJW calling you an idiot, you're an idiot'
[QUOTE=343N;51905483]to play devils advocate, i think this kind of response only insults them further, like 'if you're not into our side of politics for this SJW calling you an idiot, you're an idiot'[/QUOTE] if anyone's into any side of politics for getting their feelings hurt they are an idiot [editline]3rd March 2017[/editline] the alternative, of course, is selecting a political belief that aligns with logic instead of getting mad about something then saying the other guys are just whiny crybabies
[QUOTE=Liem;51904317]Stats like this make me wonder how we'll handle the issues of the future when our generation is older[/QUOTE] I can't really imagine what I will be wrong about when I will be old, this is weird :v:
[QUOTE=portalcrazy;51905576]the alternative, of course, is selecting a political belief that aligns with logic instead of getting mad about something then saying the other guys are just whiny crybabies[/QUOTE] sure, but logically i can say that they're not listening because they don't want to be insulted by whiny crybabies who think that their decisions reduces THEM whiny crybabies instead of actually trying to understand their beliefs
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