Russian court bans Scientology literature, classifying it as ‘extremist’ - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Novistador;30809743]Putin is pretty clearly a dictator, he was the president for like ever, and then when he "stepped down" he appointed himself prime minister, and gave the prime minister more powers than the president. Sounds pretty dictatorial to me.[/QUOTE] while this is true you think that socialized medicine is "pretty dictatorial" iirc.

Russia bans Scientology while the U.S. bans internet streaming, Germany bans nuclear power, the U.K. bans anything that can be perceived as a weapon, and Australia bans everything. We may have won the Cold War, but they won the Sanity War.

[QUOTE=Novistador;30809743]Putin is pretty clearly a dictator, he was the president for like ever, and then when he "stepped down" he appointed himself prime minister, and gave the prime minister more powers than the president. Sounds pretty dictatorial to me.[/QUOTE] he was elected for president twice because people wanted him to continue his run. there weren't some "government conspiracies and dictatorial fascist powers" at work there. hell you could just go out to any part of russia and ask if people still support putin and they'd mostly say yes. and no not really he doesn't have more powers than the president, not at all, it's just that he gets more political spotlight and has more of a history to uphold more so than medvedev thus creating the illusion that he has more power.

[QUOTE=Melnek;30812093]he was elected for president twice because people wanted him to continue his run. there weren't some "government conspiracies and dictatorial fascist powers" at work there. hell you could just go out to any part of russia and ask if people still support putin and they'd mostly say yes. .[/QUOTE] I'm pretty sure you could have found a good many Soviet Russians that said they loved Stalin, Dictators tend to be on the real up and up with the whole propaganda thing.

[QUOTE=Rofl my Waff;30802686]So what the hell did he mean? Banning atheist literature? Banning literature that isn't religious???[/QUOTE] The USSR is well known for being a tolerant peaceful country. There is certainly no secret thought police, there's not a dictatorship firmly implanted, and there's no other bans on books.

I disagree with the banning, but Scientology is really just a money whoring scheme. Get famous celebrities to endorse it, and then you make average people pay an arm and a leg to try and get further ahead within the group.

[QUOTE=Strongbad;30812401]The USSR is well known for being a tolerant peaceful country. There is certainly no secret thought police, there's not a dictatorship firmly implanted, and there's no other bans on books.[/QUOTE] Is this a sarcastic post I can't really tell

[QUOTE=Edthefirst;30812591]I disagree with the banning, but Scientology is really just a money whoring scheme. Get famous celebrities to endorse it, and then you make average people pay an arm and a leg to try and get further ahead within the group.[/QUOTE] Also if your friends/family say anything bad about it there's a rule that states you have to completely disown them.

[QUOTE=GoldenDargon;30812720]Also if your friends/family say anything bad about it there's a rule that states you have to completely disown them.[/QUOTE] In Christianity there's a rule that says if a woman gets raped, she should marry the rapist [editline]30th June 2011[/editline] Also Islam has passages about killing non-belivers [editline]30th June 2011[/editline] I'm not trying to defend Scientology, or any religion for that matter, I think their all full of shit. I'm just trying to illustrate that while Scientology appears incredibly stupid due to its modernity, and its rather monolithic organizational structure, it's pretty similar to other religions.

[QUOTE=Novistador;30812763]In Christianity there's a rule that says if a woman gets raped, she should marry the rapist [editline]30th June 2011[/editline] Also Islam has passages about killing non-belivers[/QUOTE] Difference is that I don't know of any documented cases of the rapist marrying the person he raped because he raped him/her. The Islam thing I suppose that's true but only extremists would enforce that rule. Same goes for all other religions actually. Besides, there's a lot of things in the bible and quran that contradict themselves anyways.

[QUOTE=GoldenDargon;30812851]Difference is that I don't know of any documented cases of the rapist marrying the person he raped because he raped him/her. The Islam thing I suppose that's true but only extremists would enforce that rule. Same goes for all other religions actually. Besides, there's a lot of things in the bible and quran that contradict themselves anyways.[/QUOTE] How about families disowning their children for being gay, bi, athiests, having abortions, etc?

[QUOTE=GoldenDargon;30812851]Difference is that I don't know of any documented cases of the rapist marrying the person he raped because he raped him/her. The Islam thing I suppose that's true but only extremists would enforce that rule. Same goes for all other religions actually. Besides, there's a lot of things in the bible and quran that contradict themselves anyways.[/QUOTE] I bet some Scientologists don't disown their entire familys if they criticize their Scientology. [editline]30th June 2011[/editline] The point is that every ideology, is a finite and definite set of statemented/beliefs, contradictory or otherwise, and prevents someone who says their a Christian, from being a hypocrite and cherry picking the statements/beliefs they want to abide by. The same goes for every other ideology in existence. What makes a person an "extremist" is following all the rules of an ideology consistently, and if you can't do that without contradicting yourself, slaughtering all non-believers, or stoning homosexuals then no matter how consistently you apply it, the ideology is probably terrible. There is no such thing as an extremist ideology, only consistent people.

[QUOTE=Novistador;30812319]I'm pretty sure you could have found a good many Soviet Russians that said they loved Stalin, Dictators tend to be on the real up and up with the whole propaganda thing.[/QUOTE] haha, not in the slightest. propaganda never works on anybody. especially russians as clearly shown during the first years of the soviet union. afterwards everyone was too busy focusing on WW2 and the germans than to be giving a fuck about stalins atrocities. another example is; the only reason north koreans still claim to support Kim is because he and his regime are still in power. if they'd be living right now in a unified democratic and liberal korea and were asked to comment on Kim's regime they would with certainty say that he was an idiot. stalin on the other hand was very much different than Kim. he did a lot of both good and bad things and enacted a lot of laws that really transformed russia from its rural shithole to an amazing industrial powerhouse with things like economy, quality of life and life expectancy among many other things miles better than it was in any point in russia's history.

[QUOTE=Melnek;30813102]haha, not in the slightest. propaganda never works on anybody. [/QUOTE] what

[QUOTE=Rofl my Waff;30813162]what[/QUOTE] when has it worked?

[QUOTE=Melnek;30813251]when has it worked?[/QUOTE] [img]http://www.holocaustresearchproject.org/holoprelude/images/nazsaprop.jpg[/img] Worked pretty well in Germany.

[QUOTE=Melnek;30813251]when has it worked?[/QUOTE] That answer is so broad you are best looking up the term propaganda and doing some reading. Despite what you think, propaganda is very effective. For instance, it's how my country entered the spanish american war. Fast forward the emancipation proclamation during the civil war guaranteed freedom only to slaves under the control of the south, clearly a move to deter france from giving economic aid to the confederacy. Fast forward even further and much of the anti german hatred during world war 1 was spurred on by "remember belgium" which was an embellished report by the british government that apparently provided evidence that germans had mutilated thousands of people, raped women, cut their breasts off, and killed their children. and oh yeah let's not forget NAZI GERMANY?!?!

[QUOTE=Metanar;30813325][img]http://www.holocaustresearchproject.org/holoprelude/images/nazsaprop.jpg[/img] Worked pretty well in Germany.[/QUOTE] Im pretty sure Hitler and a couple of others were the one that quite literally pulled Germany from another economic disaster, not some posters they hung up on walls on streets.

[QUOTE=Melnek;30813378]Im pretty sure Hitler and a couple of others were the one that quite literally pulled Germany from another economic disaster, not some posters they hung up on walls on streets.[/QUOTE] I don't think you understand the purpose of propaganda.

[QUOTE=Rofl my Waff;30813365]That answer is so broad you are best looking up the term propaganda and doing some reading. Despite what you think, propaganda is very effective. For instance, it's how my country entered the spanish american war. Fast foreward the emancipation proclamation during the civil war guaranteed freedom only to slaves under the control of the south, clearly a move to gain support from the central states and to deter france from giving economic aid to the confederacy. Fast forward even further and much of the anti german hatred during world war 1 was spurred on by "remember belgium" which was an embellished report by the british government that apparently provided evidence that germans had mutilated thousands of people, raped women, cut their breasts off, and killed their children. [/QUOTE] point taken, albeit I was regarding more to the propaganda that supports leaders and dictators rather than the type that dehumanizes enemies during war.

It's to affect the way people think, their views, how they think things are happening in the world. Not to solve practical problems (thats for engineers)

[QUOTE=Melnek;30813251]when has it worked?[/QUOTE] [img]http://spaliuke.files.wordpress.com/2008/04/soviet_propaganda.jpg?w=600&h=900[/img] A lot of them still think we're out to get them.

[QUOTE=Novistador;30812924]I bet some Scientologists don't disown their entire familys if they criticize their Scientology. [editline]30th June 2011[/editline] The point is that every ideology, is a finite and definite set of statemented/beliefs, contradictory or otherwise, and prevents someone who says their a Christian, from being a hypocrite and cherry picking the statements/beliefs they want to abide by. The same goes for every other ideology in existence. What makes a person an "extremist" is following all the rules of an ideology consistently, and if you can't do that without contradicting yourself, slaughtering all non-believers, or stoning homosexuals then no matter how consistently you apply it, the ideology is probably terrible. There is no such thing as an extremist ideology, only consistent people.[/QUOTE] Right, right, but Scientology isn't an ideology it's a pyramid scheme. They promise of riches if you contribute to the church, but only a select few are in power. At least with the other religions, people believe in the shit. With Scientology only the idiots that buy into believe. All the leaders are doing is raking in millions of tax-free money for absolutely no work. They even get free advertising through famous celebrities.

[QUOTE=Satane;30813537]It's 2011 not fucking 1610 I can't believe people still fall for this shit. The time has come to ban all religions.[/QUOTE] I had no idea facepunch had such a thriving community of Stalinists.

[QUOTE=Edthefirst;30813569]Right, right, but Scientology isn't an ideology it's a pyramid scheme. They promise of riches if you contribute to the church, but only a select few are in power. At least with the other religions, people believe in the shit. With Scientology only the idiots that buy into believe. All the leaders are doing is raking in millions of tax-free money for absolutely no work. They even get free advertising through famous celebrities.[/QUOTE] Please explain how this is different from times when the bible was written only in latin, a language only interpretable by those in power, and the buying of "indulgences" along with "tithing" [editline]30th June 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=Satane;30813586] All religions are frauds[/QUOTE] That they are but that doesn't give you the right to police other peoples thoughts.

[QUOTE=Melnek;30813251]when has it worked?[/QUOTE] Ever seen a political campaign? That's propaganda, hell advertising is a form of propaganda.

[QUOTE=Melnek;30813378]Im pretty sure Hitler and a couple of others were the one that quite literally pulled Germany from another economic disaster, not some posters they hung up on walls on streets.[/QUOTE] Nope. They gained power because the wall street crash attracted people to extreme politics, and with the NSDAP's propaganda message that they wanted to make Germany independent and break the Treaty of Versailles they became a prime candidate. From there Von Papen and Von Schliecher (less extreme right wing politicians) convinced Hindenburg (Weimar President) to make Hitler chancellor because they believed that Hitler was a fool who they could extort to gain the real power. Unfortunately that didn't go to plan and Hitler used the burning down of the Reichstag as an excuse to pass the enabling act and pass any laws he wanted to, which let him combine the powers of chancellor and president in 1934 when Hindenburg died.

[QUOTE=Satane;30813711]People are getting scammed here on a daily basis. The easiest way to stop it is to simply ban religions. Who have them the fucking right to brain wash people. Again, we aren't in the dark ages here.[/QUOTE] Right, we aren't living in the dark ages here, most people on earth have fully functioning brains, you know that meaty thing in your head you use to think with, thats what you use to avoid being scammed. If people get scammed, at least by falling for a specific ideology and giving money to it, its nobodys problem but their own, and despite the fact that they are making a bad decision, its their right to make it. [editline]30th June 2011[/editline] If you want people to be protected from religion, then you need to educate them about how to think skeptically. You can't legislate people into being rational.