Police news conference update
Bodycount rises to 17
Only two shooters at this time, they don't believe a 3rd exists
[B]Female is Tashfeen Maliq, 27, unknown origin, believed to be his fiance/wife(The previous report Fox/CNN/Others made about Ardogan was fake, it's the Turkish PM's name with letters changed.)[/B]
Police went to Farooq's home in Redlands, encountered the suspects there, and that led to the police pursuit and shootout.
Farooq was an employee with the EPA. They are searching his office space currently.
Police aren't ruling out terrorism (FBI terrorism task force is on scene tho so go figure)
No motive, police don't even wanna talk about it.
I have a uncle who has like 6 M1 Carbines, 8 M1 Garands, 2 AR-15's, and a shit ton of random American musket to WW1 guns who lives in that area. And he ain't a crazy redneck, Hydro engineer for the City municipal who lives in a insanely nice house.
He told me he would arm his neighborhood when shit goes down so I am kinda interested on what he is doing right now. (Probably nothing)
[QUOTE=Cinnamonbun;49234025]The tight gun restrictions in California [I]really[/I] helped the situation today as well.[/QUOTE]
Just as much as the armed militia did as well.
[QUOTE=-nesto-;49234044]Police news conference update
Bodycount rises to 17
Only two shooters at this time, they don't believe a 3rd exists
[B]Female is Tashfeen Maliq, 27, unknown origin, believed to be his fiance/wife(The previous report Fox/CNN/Others made about Ardogan was fake, it's the Turkish PM's name with letters changed.)[/B]
Police went to Farooq's home in Redlands, encountered the suspects there, and that led to the police pursuit and shootout.
Farooq was an employee with the EPA. They are searching his office space currently.
Police aren't ruling out terrorism (FBI terrorism task force is on scene tho so go figure)
No motive, police don't even wanna talk about it.[/QUOTE]
[url=http://heavy.com/news/2015/12/tashfeen-malik-syed-farook-wife-suspect-inland-regional-center-san-bernardino-shooting-suspect-facebook-page/]They had a baby together so were definitely a couple[/url]
Third suspect likely not involved - it was probably just this guy and his wife/girlfriend/fiancee.
Also seems to be Malik with a K, in case anyone is trying to Google it.
[QUOTE=Tudd;49234050]I have a uncle who has like 6 M1 Carbines, 8 M1 Garands, 2 AR-15's, and a shit ton of random American musket to WW1 guns who lives in that area. And he ain't a crazy redneck, Hydro engineer for the City municipal who lives in a insanely nice house.
He told me he would arm his neighborhood when shit goes down so I am kinda interested on what he is doing right now. (Probably nothing)[/QUOTE]
Talked to a guy like that earlier. Granted your uncle sounds better. I have a similar plan with some of my rifles. Gun owners, especially those with lots of them or certain types are portrayed rather poorly. Funny, the stereotypes never fit the actual owners.
[QUOTE=Pilot1215;49234072]Talked to a guy like that earlier. Granted your uncle sounds better. I have a similar plan with some of my rifles. Gun owners, especially those with lots of them or certain types are portrayed rather poorly. Funny, the stereotypes never fit the actual owners.[/QUOTE]
I too keep an armory of firearms in the event that Red Dawn happens and I can arm the entire neighborhood, I'm not crazy though I swear.
[QUOTE=InvaderNouga;49234099]I too keep an armory of firearms in the event that Red Dawn happens and I can arm the entire neighborhood, I'm not crazy though I swear.[/QUOTE]
To be fair my Uncle was also living in some pretty bad parts during the LA riots.
[QUOTE=Cinnamonbun;49234025]The tight gun restrictions in California [I]really[/I] helped the situation today as well.[/QUOTE]
Yeah I mean a handgun against apparent body armor and ar-15 rifles would really be possible. You're delusional if you think that an untrained person could deal with that situation effectively, more so if that you think it would lead to less casualities, there would possibly be more because of the crossfire that could erupt.
Political Correctness has now killed people
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/eTu3Ilo.png[/IMG]
source: [url]http://edition.cnn.com/2015/12/03/us/san-bernardino-shooting/index.html[/url]
[QUOTE=Zeke129;49234070][url=http://heavy.com/news/2015/12/tashfeen-malik-syed-farook-wife-suspect-inland-regional-center-san-bernardino-shooting-suspect-facebook-page/]They had a baby together so were definitely a couple[/url]
Third suspect likely not involved - it was probably just this guy and his wife/girlfriend/fiancee.
Also seems to be Malik with a K, in case anyone is trying to Google it.[/QUOTE]
It's now 10:30 in Cali and the 3rd suspect is still in custody. If you aren't involved at this point you would have been released by now. There's the victim that gave her account to CNN. She worked in one of the offices they attacked and she said it was two men. During the pursuit one of the officers in the chase reported one of the suspects bailed on foot and not far from the SUV they detained an individual decked out in black in a parking lot. You can see this in the news copter footage at the start. It sounds like Tashfeen was just a driver, and Farooq and another individual were the trigger men.
On another note, they're now reporting that the suspects had GoPro's mounted on their bodies.
[QUOTE=sgman91;49229451]Wow, this isn't far at all from where I live. I've been to that area many many times before.[/QUOTE]
I'd honestly be scared to go places if I were you, I'd stay indoors as much as possible
[QUOTE=-nesto-;49234166]On another note, they're now reporting that the suspects had GoPro's mounted on their bodies.[/QUOTE]
Where are you getting that from? Is there still a decent live feed of information? The Reddit one stopped a while ago.
[QUOTE=InvaderNouga;49234099]I too keep an armory of firearms in the event that Red Dawn happens and I can arm the entire neighborhood, I'm not crazy though I swear.[/QUOTE]If something's threatening the community and you have like 15+ rifles why the hell wouldn't you pass some out?
I don't have any plans like that considering everyone here has at least [I]one[/I] gun but I've included myself in the local disaster plans, I don't really see a difference here. (besides the fact that I can't think of anything that could happen here that would need an armed mob, while there is a very real danger of floods, fires, and tornadoes every year)
[QUOTE=sgman91;49234212]Where are you getting that from? Is there still a decent live feed of information? The Reddit one stopped a while ago.[/QUOTE]
Bouncing back and forth between CNN/Fox
That would fit in with why they tried to get away rather than martyr them selves.
Can you imagine ISIS propaganda with that? It would be powerful imagery.
[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;49234223]If something's threatening the community and you have like 15+ rifles why the hell wouldn't you pass some out?
I don't have any plans like that considering everyone here has at least [I]one[/I] gun but I've included myself in the local disaster plans, I don't really see a difference here. (besides the fact that I can't think of anything that could happen here that would need an armed mob, while there is a very real danger of floods, fires, and tornadoes every year)[/QUOTE]
Is it even legal to just give weapons away to random neighbours? And is it even legal to then kill whatever is threatening the community? Surely there are some specific laws about self-defense?
[QUOTE=Flumbooze;49234273]Is it even legal to just give weapons away to random neighbours? And is it even legal to then kill whatever is threatening the community? Surely there are some specific laws about self-defense?[/QUOTE]
Probably not, but I would hope that no one would let the letter of the law get in the way of helping their neighbor stay safe.
[QUOTE=Flumbooze;49234273]Is it even legal to just give weapons away to random neighbours? And is it even legal to then kill whatever is threatening the community? Surely there are some specific laws about self-defense?[/QUOTE]
Well you wouldn't arm a neighborhood unless something royally fucked up is going on that the police couldn't handle.
Which in my Uncle's case something similar to the LA riots or worse in his opinion.
[QUOTE=Tudd;49234296]Well you wouldn't arm a neighborhood unless something royally fucked up is going on that the police couldn't handle.
Which in my Uncle's case something similar to the LA riots or worse in his opinion.[/QUOTE]
But I'v seen a lot of videos and pictures of the police in the US and... Well fuck, if there's something that they (and the army) can't handle, how do you even expect civilians to handle them? The police is a lot better equipped so I don't really see the sense in expecting civilians to do a better job than the police?
Also, the law is there for a reason. If it's not working, it should be changed but imo you can't just apply the law to x situation then turn a blind eye for Y situation. Maybe the law should be expanded for crisis situations, but please don't just give out guns to the next random person you see... Now THAT's dangerous.
[QUOTE=-nesto-;49234166]
On another note, they're now reporting that the suspects had GoPro's mounted on their bodies.[/QUOTE]
Wat
[QUOTE=Fort83;49234327]If it's something the police or military can't handle, civilians sure as shit won't be able to handle it either. Putting guns into random people's hands would just make matters worse.[/QUOTE]
The armed Korean store owners during the LA riots did just fine.
[QUOTE=Fort83;49234327]If it's something the police or military can't handle, civilians sure as shit won't be able to handle it either. Putting guns into random people's hands would just make matters worse.[/QUOTE]
Not necessarily in every situation. Looters in a riot, were it bad enough, may respond to police presence with immediate violence (not even necessarily directed against just the police). If they had their eyes on a neighborhood or a section of town that was armed and intent on protecting itself, they'd likely stay away. Intimidation on the part of armed citizens could deter violence from rioters/looters.
Granted, I sincerely doubt the situation there is going to turn into a riot, but I can think of plenty in recent history where innocent bystanders had their properties torched juuust because, and the ability to defend themselves may have prevented it.
[QUOTE=InvaderNouga;49234052]Just as much as the armed militia did as well.[/QUOTE]
Open carry of firearms is illegal in CA. Concealed carry allowed with a permit, but you have to be a celebrity or know people in the government to get one.
[QUOTE=Flumbooze;49234309]But I'v seen a lot of videos and pictures of the police in the US and... Well fuck, if there's something that they (and the army) can't handle, how do you even expect civilians to handle them? The police is a lot better equipped so I don't really see the sense in expecting civilians to do a better job than the police?
Also, the law is there for a reason. If it's not working, it should be changed but imo you can't just apply the law to x situation then turn a blind eye for Y situation. Maybe the law should be expanded for crisis situations, but please don't just give out guns to the next random person you see... Now THAT's dangerous.[/QUOTE]I think you've got this weird scenario in your mind where people are just happily passing guns around and shooting at everything they see.
A good example is the already mentioned LA riots, the police were already busy and people were being pulled from cars and beaten by infuriated mobs. Koreans stood on top of their shops, many of which doubled as their homes, and held off looters with gunfire. In that situation yeah, I'd say that it would be appropriate to pass the guns out to my neighbors, hand them as much ammo as I could spare and wish them luck. Outside of that rare circumstance no, it really isn't legal or advised to do such a thing. Doesn't change the fact that it does cross our minds from time to time, but aside from the perpetually paranoid it has about as much weight as "well what if zombies happened..." does in our thoughts. Personally? I'm more concerned about a tornado than I am with an angry mob tearing up my town that has a grand total of 68 people in it.
[QUOTE=Flumbooze;49234309]But I'v seen a lot of videos and pictures of the police in the US and... Well fuck, if there's something that they (and the army) can't handle, how do you even expect civilians to handle them? The police is a lot better equipped so I don't really see the sense in expecting civilians to do a better job than the police?[/QUOTE]
The police cannot be everywhere, especially in highly rural areas. They do not have the manpower to project force over a very large area.
[QUOTE=-nesto-;49234338]The armed Korean store owners during the LA riots did just fine.[/QUOTE]
This is a good example of this. During the riots the police sort of quarantined areas. They couldn't project their force into those zones easily, but could surround them. The Koreans held their property when the police could/would not.
[QUOTE=TheDestroyerOfall;49234154]Yeah I mean a handgun against apparent body armor and ar-15 rifles would really be possible. You're delusional if you think that an untrained person could deal with that situation effectively, more so if that you think it would lead to less casualities, there would possibly be more because of the crossfire that could erupt.[/QUOTE]
Given there are 15 million CCW holders in the US and we're yet to see a trend (or any examples for that matter) of them shooting bystanders I'm going to call bullshit on that.
The shooters are said to have had a young baby. Poor mite, one day he or she may realise what their parents did and have to cope with all that.
so is there still no motive or what
[QUOTE=download;49234909]Given there are 15 million CCW holders in the US and we're yet to see a trend (or any examples for that matter) of them shooting bystanders I'm going to call bullshit on that.[/QUOTE]
Yeah except that entire idea is bullshit given stories like this
[url]http://fox13now.com/2015/10/31/sheriff-winder-individual-shot-by-police-in-midvale-was-a-bystander/[/url]
And the fact that police very often have unintended casualites when dealing with suspects in areas like that.
[url]http://www.vice.com/read/what-happens-when-the-police-shoot-bystanders[/url]
[url]http://nation.time.com/2013/09/16/ready-fire-aim-the-science-behind-police-shooting-bystanders/[/url]
[url]http://www.cnn.com/2012/08/24/justice/new-york-empire-state/[/url]
Long story short, if the police are trained and still shoot innocent bystanders on accident i'm pretty damn sure that a CCW will fair no better against an armed suspect.
In an active shooter scenario where you have no information beyond "there is a guy with a gun" how are you honestly going to know if the guy who just rounded the corner is the shooter or another concerned citizen?
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