• The Democratic Party seems to have no earthly idea why it is so damn unpopular
    58 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;51950516]Taxation makes Democrats worse than constantly [B]trying to limit people's civil rights?[/B][/QUOTE] I'm going to need some specifics to respond. Also, again, remember that authoritarianism is the act of forcing people to do things. An extremely libertarian society might be horrible at protecting people's human rights, but it also wouldn't be authoritarian.
[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;51950528]Jesus Christ dude, don't be so dense, people have already listed it multiple times.[/QUOTE] I've also already responded to those. So I assume he's talking about something else.
Both parties should be trashed, and new ones made
So you would call an extremely libertarian society that borders on anarchism authoritarian because it doesn't do very much to protect personal freedoms? At most, it seems you could argue that it allows interpersonal authoritarianism to flourish, but I'm not sure how you could call the actual government authoritarian.
[QUOTE=Trebgarta;51950556]no Try reading the quote again[/QUOTE] So I'm not seeing where you're disagreeing with my basic definition. What's an authoritarian act that doesn't fit under the government forcing people to do things against their will (other than the protection of basic negative rights)? Or vice-versa, what act does force people to do something that isn't authoritarian?
[QUOTE=sgman91;51950523]I'm going to need some specifics to respond.[/QUOTE] Their Gerrymandering and Voter ID laws are designed to negate poor and minority votes. Anti-abortion and anti-contraceptive policies limit what people can do with their own bodies. Anti-LGBT legislation limits the opportunities LGBT people have in both business and their personal lives. Most recently the completely arbitrary "Travel Ban" puts a hard limit on where many Muslims living in the US can go, they cannot leave the country for fear they will not be allowed to return. And if we want to talk about taxes, historically Republicans lower taxes on the wealthy, leaving the poor with more of the burden. Under Reagan who has shaped Republican tax policy, taxes for the poor went up and taxes for the rich went down.
[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;51950560]What is your endgame for these pointless semantics?[/QUOTE] My endgame? I argued that the democrats are more authoritarian and am now responding to challenges. That specific point was to establish what authoritarianism even means. It's pretty important to the discussion.
[QUOTE=sgman91;51950363]High taxation is inherently authoritarian. It rests on the assumption that the government is entitled to your property. They are also extremely regulation heavy on private business. As far as I can tell, the GOP only wants more control when it comes to drugs.[/QUOTE] Economic freedom to do whatever I want, given I have the money, including destroying the global climate But god forbid I smoke some fucking weed
Americans tend more authoritarian in general I think. But haha at the democratic party being more authoritarian than the party that wants to build a wall along the mexican border.
[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;51950439]Lol this stupid war on the Democratic party is going to be the end of the Left in America if they keep it up.[/QUOTE]And the DNC will have no one to blame but itself. And those who would try to excuse it of course.
[QUOTE=Trebgarta;51950705]You have no alternative parties. Attacking DNC serves Trump and RNC.[/QUOTE] And letting the DNC turn to shit that doesn't actually represent the populous does the same job. But one is ultimately more likely to actually make the party improve. The other is just festering.
Might I bring up racial quotas and equal results as one example of how the democrats are authoritarian in their own way?
The Republican Party has blatantly gone to great lengths in order to attempt to limit civil rights and freedoms in the US. To say that they haven't is such an ignorance of the history in American politics that I'm starting to think you're too partisan to even debate, sgman91. Both parties are too full of corporate lobbying and influence, but the GOP is particularly rife with corruption and generally just shitty behavior. What happened to the "GOP resistance" to a Muslim ban? [t]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C3RHC41VUAAgEh-.jpg[/t] [url]http://www.npr.org/2016/06/14/482018791/paul-ryan-trumps-muslim-ban-not-reflective-of-gop-and-u-s-principles[/url] [QUOTE]Asked to respond Tuesday morning, Ryan said he stood by previous criticism of Trump's stance. "I do not think a Muslim ban is in our country's interest. I do not think it is reflective of our principles, not just as a party but as a country. I think the smarter way to go, in all respects, is to have a security test and not a religious test."[/QUOTE] Uh-oh, that went out the window! Anti-Muslim sentiments? Oh yeah, plenty to go around in the conservative side. [QUOTE]“I happen to side with the people in Murfreesboro,” [Herman] Cain said, after the residents of that Tennessee town tried to block the building of a mosque. Cain explained that while banning churches or synagogues constitutes religious discrimination, banning mosques does not. Because “Islam is both a religion and a set of laws, Sharia law,” Cain explained, “that’s not discriminating based upon religion.” When asked whether he would feel “comfortable appointing a Muslim, either in your cabinet or as a federal judge?” Cain replied, “No, I will not,” because “there is this creeping attempt, there is this attempt to gradually ease Sharia law and the Muslim faith into our government.”[/QUOTE] [url]https://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2015/02/anti-islam/385463/[/url] [url]http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/religion/sd-me-otay-board-20170223-story.html[/url] [url]http://www.businessinsider.com/r-muslim-students-asked-do-you-beat-your-wife-by-oklahoma-lawmaker-2017-3[/url] [url]http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/2017/0216/2016-witnessed-surge-in-anti-Muslim-hate-groups-SPLC-report-says[/url] It's also hilarious how some Republicans ramp up the issues of Sharia law, and how Muslims are against the [I]exalted[/I] Western mindset and culture, when in reality, those same Muslims share the exact same views as those conservatives. Anti-LGBT, anti-abortion, pro-religion (Jesus guides my law-deciding hand vs. Allah is what dictates law and order), pro free-market, traditionalist mindsets, etc, etc,. It's [I]also[/I] super funny that poorer Republicans, or those that are rural, come to clashes with liberal-minded policies and plans, when in reality, the legislation passed by the GOP tends to favor only the upper middle-class and wealthy. The two biggest economic downturns in the United States, even, were caused by de-regulation and conservative "pro-business" infatuation. It's a joke that some Republican officials dance around the issue of healthcare, and throw around plans that are just gutted Obamacare-lites, or even worse, result in even larger relief for the rich. Except, it's not funny anymore. Bush's stupid fucking tax-cuts got us into the debt mess, and the growing amount of de-regulation led to the 2008 Housing Crisis. When will Republicans learn that de-regulating everything they see fit will not fix the economy? What's your stance on Trump's attempt to repeal the Dodd-Frank legislation? Do you truly believe that a """[I]competitive[/I]""" healthcare will be better than the systems that Europe has? The notion of "access to healthcare" is so ridiculous, that I have to immediately let out a huge sigh whenever I even hear it mentioned. The vitality of health is not something that shouldn't be a right. It's the same argumentation that "access to water" is a right, not just fucking water. It's stupid. It's blatantly stupid. And yet, some of Republican voters (those who are in less-endowed financial backgrounds) gobble that up, and once they realize that their healthcare plans are axed, and now they've got nothing to their name but debt and humiliation, they [I]still[/I] despise the other side. How is it that Republicans can blast liberals for being too "partisan" and screamingly exclaim "THIS IS WHY TRUMP WON" whenever someone takes a point to reply how dumb and ultimately useless Trump's policies are? How is it that Republicans seem to point out rioters and dumb regressive-left people whenever they have the chance to disparage liberals, but God forbid someone mentions that the rise of anti-minority sentiments and racism could be attributed to Trump's statements and policies?
[QUOTE=Trebgarta;51950821]Not attacking doesnt mean not doing anything at all. Just because they resisted an attempt at a party hijacking platform doesnt mean they suddenly have become an unmovable, unmodifiable festering establishment. There are alternative methods that dont result in more power for Trump, which should be the priority, as the end goal in all of this is the well being of Americans. Improving your country should come before improving the party.[/QUOTE]They were an immovable establishment before, which is why they lost the election. No, Clinton having a few select locations that had high turnout in her favor doesn't offset the fact that the DNC was a failure on every level, losing across the board. There is a reason the DNC has less seats in the Senate, and its not because of a "hijacking" platform. Its because the DNC does not represent the populous any longer and has no desire to do so. The priority should be removing the cancerous elements and replacing them with people who actually care. The DNC is not going to improve the country if they are elected right now, and they won't get the opportunity because their support is waning. Just going, "BUT TRUMP!" didn't work at all in the election, so why keep trying it? Quit with the superficial scaremongering crap, give people a reason to vote for the DNC instead of a reason to not vote for the GOP. Because, as the election showed, instead of voting for the DNC people will instead just not vote at all. Lesser of two evils is still evil, and people are growing tired of voting like that.
[QUOTE=Arctic-Zone;51949440]This thread title isn't exactly the article headline. Anyway, unsurprising. Both the Republican and Democrat parties have an extreme disconnect from their bases, but I feel it's worse on the Dems' side.[/QUOTE] I feel it's more that the Republican base is too busy eating up every last morsel of shit the GOP flings them saying that it's chocolate while the Dems' are more noticeably disconnected to their own base from within their base because their base is less trusting of their party than the GOP seems to be.
people claiming that trying to criticize and change the democrats is going to destroy the party: the republican party has basically refused to be self-critical at all for decades, and now it's being taken over by the extreme right.
[QUOTE=Streecer;51949509]so unpopular they won the popular vote by 3 million[/QUOTE] When your choices are shit and [I]shit[/I] people are likely to pick the one that's not italicized.
[QUOTE=The mouse;51949439]I'll admit that I don't know that much about American politics, but it seems to me that the Democrat's problem is that they have no really well-known/talented figures, beyond their past presidents/candidates. Look at the GOP and they have a whole range of atleast well-known figures in both Congress and The Presidency (whether you like them or not), therefore the Democrats look really weak/divided by comparison.[/QUOTE] Really good insight It's like it's a brand thing. Hillary used to be mega popular but various events left her reputation in the gutter and the Democrats had nobody else with that 'universally recognisable' brand. Cept maybe Elizabeth Warren (who I think is great) but has been successfully branded as a radical. democrats wouldn't want to go with Sanders because he's not one of theirs and has no loyalty to the party or the people they serve (establishment Democrats, donors etc) sad that democracy (or at least the approximation practiced in US and UK) is a popularity contest and generally builds down to 2 parties being somewhat polar opposites who then strive, through gerrymandering and shifting the overton window, to further divide the voters; fearing if they gave ground or cooperated the otherside might not reciprocate or that they might lose voters. Sad the only people with the power to change it are the ones who stand to lose most from change.
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