Saudi princess who ordered bodyguard to kill Paris decorator claims diplomatic immunity, flees Paris - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Kyle902;51157104]The problem is that the government has no incentive to do anything at all no matter what the people do. Saudi Arabia is a strategically vital location and this lets them get away with pretty much anything they want.[/QUOTE] Well, if the people protested and went on strike against the country's irresponsible foreign policy. The government would think twice, the problem is that people are too lazy, believe they are too insignificant, so it doesn't happen. A country should be more afraid of the people inside its border instead of dictators abroad waving around their importance, when they shouldn't matter. Saudi Arabia shouldn't be important, everyone would gain by stop giving a shit about them.

[QUOTE=RB33;51157212]Well, if the people protested and went on strike against the country's irresponsible foreign policy. The government would think twice, the problem is that people are too lazy, believe they are too insignificant, so it doesn't happen. A country should be more afraid of the people inside its border instead of dictators abroad waving around their importance, when they shouldn't matter. Saudi Arabia shouldn't be important, everyone would gain by stop giving a shit about them.[/QUOTE] It really isn't that simple. When money is flowing, a government won't just up and end a relationship just because of a protest.

[QUOTE=archangel125;51157222]It really isn't that simple. When money is flowing, a government won't just up and end a relationship just because of a protest.[/QUOTE] If more money is lost due to protest or if unrest happens, that's going to affect them. What money does the government gain from this? A government sets its own rules and make up its own mind, money or no money.

[QUOTE=RB33;51157231]If more money is lost due to protest or if unrest happens, that's going to affect them. What money does the government gain from this? A government sets its own rules and make up its own mind, money or no money.[/QUOTE] In what world do protesters cause enough damage that they supersede oil deals worth tens of billions of dollars? And why should protesters have to make a government do its damn job in the first place and punish criminals? No, vigilante justice really is the most efficient way to do things where diplomatic immunity is being abused. It's not like Saudi Arabia's going to punish her.

[QUOTE=RB33;51157231]If more money is lost due to protest or if unrest happens, that's going to affect them. What money does the government gain from this? A government sets its own rules and make up its own mind, money or no money.[/QUOTE] Its more then just simple money though. No country today is gonna break relations with another nation over something that small.

[QUOTE=RB33;51157231]If more money is lost due to protest or if unrest happens, that's going to affect them. What money does the government gain from this? A government sets its own rules and make up its own mind, money or no money.[/QUOTE] Will not happen. Should not even be necessary in the first place, but we've got the double-pronged issue here of both the government not doing its fucking job and looking out for its citizens like it's supposed to be whilst simultaneously bending over/shrugging off the transgressions of powerful, wealthy individuals. That's not right. You're taking what is a straightforward issue, what should be treated as a straightforward issue moreover, and you're making it overly-complicated for no reason. It's easier and more effective to impose vigilante justice on her, and it would be wholly deserved for what she did.

[QUOTE=archangel125;51157287]In what world do protesters cause enough damage that they supersede oil deals worth tens of billions of dollars? And why should protesters have to make a government do its damn job in the first place and punish criminals? No, vigilante justice really is the most efficient way to do things where diplomatic immunity is being abused. It's not like Saudi Arabia's going to punish her.[/QUOTE] Yeah, so every country's government have a personal oil deal with Saudi Arabia? If that's true, then it's understandable. So it's better to not put pressure, make the government better and just give up on it and let it continue act like it does instead? What you need here is to deal with diplomatic immunity with common sense, don't let criminals away, especially when they are just abusing the system, when they are obviously not diplomats. It was really weak of France to let her get away. [editline]5th October 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Kyle902;51157298]Its more then just simple money though. No country today is gonna break relations with another nation over something that small.[/QUOTE] Maybe, they should when the country in question isn't even worth having relations with to begin with. But without taking it that far, you don't have to break relations, just to tell someone off. The US still have an embassy in Russia despite Crimea, Syria and whatever else. [editline]5th October 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Govna;51157353]Will not happen. Should not even be necessary in the first place, but we've got the double-pronged issue here of both the government not doing its fucking job and looking out for its citizens like it's supposed to be whilst simultaneously bending over/shrugging off the transgressions of powerful, wealthy individuals. That's not right. You're taking what is a straightforward issue, what should be treated as a straightforward issue moreover, and you're making it overly-complicated for no reason. It's easier and more effective to impose vigilante justice on her, and it would be wholly deserved for what she did.[/QUOTE] I'm not going to support vigilante justice, since it is going put us one step closer to her than what we should be. No one has died over this, we should keep it like that.

[QUOTE=NassimO PotatO;51155665]Then tell me why Henry Kissinger signed an agreement with Fayçal so that oil can only be bought with dollars ?[/QUOTE] Because it was important during the 70s. As I understand it the oil we import from Canada is from oil sand which has only really become economically viable relatively recently.

[QUOTE=Maadz;51156115] Again, bullshit alarm, weewoo weewoo I am seriously doubting you ever lived in saudi arabia they dont cut off your hands for stealing food or some shit, only EXTREMELY VALUABLE ITEMS and if the thief was not poor/in need. Want to know another fun fact about saudi arabia? Death penalty is only done if the court agrees and every family member agrees. [/QUOTE] Oh so that's why you're chair of the UN human rights commission. Man over here we just execute people for walkin' funny. You guys know whats up

[QUOTE=Matthew0505;51158861]How is vigilante justice the same as ordering your bodyguard to kill people for no reason?[/QUOTE] I said closer, advocating for her death just to make a point, when she didn't even kill anyone herself is actually making us worse. We really shouldn't lower ourself to that level.

[QUOTE=RB33;51158945]I said closer, advocating for her death just to make a point, when she didn't even kill anyone herself is actually making us worse. We really shouldn't lower ourself to that level.[/QUOTE] No one can raise up to their level so they have to be dragged kicking and screaming to our level. You know, the one where crimes like the one this woman committed go punished. She won't and can't be by any government but her own who certainly won't

It would be kinda nice if all the oil got drained out and ceased to exist so that all these governments would stop being so obsessed with that shit to the point where this sort of thing happens.

I want to make one thing clear - provided there's a government that will make her and others like her pay for their crimes, I'm not interested in having any of these monsters killed. That's not what I care about - I'd like nothing more than for her to be extradited back to France so she can be tried and sentenced there, in full accordance with the law and in full recognition of her rights as an individual charged with a crime under the French legal system. No, I'm saying that when a government won't touch someone who commits such crimes because of diplomatic immunity, it is failing in its duty to protect its people. Only then does it fall to individuals to seek justice, and vigilantism doesn't have a lot of tools at its disposal beyond execution. It'd be better for all parties involved if the French government grew a pair, charged and tried her, but since it won't, I sure hope somebody sees justice done. And if that means she's got to die... then she's got to die.

[QUOTE=RB33;51158945]I said closer, advocating for her death just to make a point, when she didn't even kill anyone herself is actually making us worse. We really shouldn't lower ourself to that level.[/QUOTE] That's really sweet. You stay on the moral high ground while Saudis keep maiming their servants, I'm sure eventually the good vibes will cancel out the tragedy.

[QUOTE=Anderan;51157453]Because it was important during the 70s.[/QUOTE] Petrodollar is still a thing. Even if i had a mountain of gold i wouldn't be able to buy some.

[QUOTE=NassimO PotatO;51159541]Petrodollar is still a thing. Even if i had a mountain of gold i wouldn't be able to buy some.[/QUOTE] What exactly does that have to do with Saudi oil still being super important to the US? I never said the Saudi's don't still make a lot of money from their oil, the fact that they do still doesn't change the fact that their oil is literally only 11% of our total oil exports. Hell, the west isn't even Saudi Arabia's largest buyer of oil, over 60% of it goes to Asia. [url]http://atlas.media.mit.edu/en/visualize/tree_map/hs92/export/sau/show/all/2014/[/url] Again, the US relations with SA at this point are more about them being a friendly regional power in an area the US wants to project influence into than it is the oil we get from them. Also ApertureXS200's argument that I originally responded to was that the US would literally not be able to drive cars anymore without Saudi oil, which is still bunk.

[QUOTE=srobins;51159256]That's really sweet. You stay on the moral high ground while Saudis keep maiming their servants, I'm sure eventually the good vibes will cancel out the tragedy.[/QUOTE] I guess you missed the part, where I think we shouldn't give a shit about her diplomatic immunity and punish her like any other criminal. I'm not advocating for her death as long as it can be done the correct way.

[QUOTE=Kyle902;51149270]Diplomatic immunity shouldnt protect you if it's proven 100% that you engaged in willing and malicious criminal activity[/QUOTE] Protecting individuals against 'willing and malicious criminal activity' is precisely the point of diplomatic immunity. Because while that can be abused to protect against things like this, it's the same protection that keeps diplomats from getting executed because they insulted a head of state. Prosecuting people under diplomatic immunity completely misses the point- they should be declared persona non grata, and their government should be petitioned to extradite, but legally they can't be compelled to stand trial without the permission of their own government.

Now killing the princess/maiming her won't get us anywhere. It should be the law that needs changing, as a prevention. Powerful countries like the USA should spearhead this. Unless they still wanted the oil, then I guess ordinary people like us are out of luck.