Flotilla's "weapon" photos were not taken in 2010 - Polidicks

[QUOTE=GunFox;22347984]They offered to distribute the supplies under the direct observation of the flotilla crew. And yes. They are attempting to prevent the influx of equipment which could be used to wage war against Israel. Their list about what is restricted is pretty ridiculous in a lot of places, and that should be fixed, but the blockade against arms is largely in the best interest of both countries.[/QUOTE] You do realize that at first the Israeli government didn't want to release the actual list of what was allowed and what was banned, and that it was only after international pressure that they had to? If the flotilla had taken Israel up on that offer, most of the supplies would never have reached Gaza, as they do not allow things as cement and other building materials, boxed fruit or educational material. Sorry to say, but the blockade being in place because of arms-dealing is just an excuse for Israel to have in effect a collective punishment on the people of Gaza. Even one of the Israeli officials have tried to justify the blockade by saying they "Wanted to put the people of Gaza on a diet.".

[QUOTE=starpluck;22347987]The blockade amounts to collective punishment, making it illegal regardless The [URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geneva_Conventions"]1977 amendment to the Geneva Conventions protocols[/URL] prohibits the use of collective measures that do not distinguish between civilians and military, the blockade doesn't. [IMG]http://media.economist.com/images/na/2010w23/201023NAC266B.jpg[/IMG] Or for the full list: [URL]http://gisha.org/UserFiles/File/HiddenMessages/ItemsGazaStrip060510.pdf[/URL] Clearly, this does not distinguish between military nor civilian, making this blockade, illegal.[/QUOTE] Yes. The list is ridiculous. This was covered. The Geneva conventions make everything illegal. If anyone ever fucking followed them, conflicts would never get resolved. I don't know of a single conflict where the conventions were actually followed. They are laws that cannot be enforced. Like all laws that cannot be enforced, it cheapens the point of rule by law. It is irresponsible and ignorant to think that the conventions do anything. I should however also point out that Gaza doesn't distinguish between military or civilian. They have little to no uniformed military. All kinds of Geneva conventions are broken when you adopt such a policy.

[QUOTE=Jugulum;22346373]Let me ask a question to any American citizen, do you think this will boost your relationship with the arab nations[/QUOTE] nope [QUOTE=Jugulum;22346373]or Europe for that sake?[/QUOTE] nope [QUOTE=Jugulum;22346373]Do you think the choice to cover for Israel yet again was in the American citizens best interests?[/QUOTE] nope [QUOTE=Jugulum;22346373]These kind of decisions is one of the reasons for why America is viewed as it is abroad, you should really think about that.[/QUOTE] Our elections consist of a Democrat zionist and a Republican zionist.

[QUOTE=GunFox;22348212]Yes. The list is ridiculous. This was covered. The Geneva conventions make everything illegal. If anyone ever fucking followed them, conflicts would never get resolved. I don't know of a single conflict where the conventions were actually followed. They are laws that cannot be enforced. Like all laws that cannot be enforced, it cheapens the point of rule by law. It is irresponsible and ignorant to think that the conventions do anything. I should however also point out that Gaza doesn't distinguish between military or civilian. They have little to no uniformed military. All kinds of Geneva conventions are broken when you adopt such a policy.[/QUOTE] I know the list is ridiculous, that wasn't my point, I was proving how it fails to distinguish between military and civilian. And disregarding the conventions saying "No one should follow them etc." still doesn't change the fact that Israel violated it. About your last statement, that is partly true but has nothing to do with a blockade pertaining to Geneva conventions.

[QUOTE=dangwarrior;22342949]Oh, wait, you might be wrong here:[/QUOTE] I don't know about you but if I was going to raid anything I'd make damn well sure that the time and date was set so there was no confusion about when the picture was taken.

[QUOTE=Glorbo;22345795]no i'm not. Im justifying self defence against them. After having rocks shot at you with a slingshot and being clubbed for a minute while only using paintball guns, you have the right to switch to live fire. It's not just one guy that charged at them so they called "self defense!" and shot the rest. If they did shoot innocent people before getting on the boat, i'm with you man, but untill I see the bulletholes I find it hard to believe.[/QUOTE] You do not, and should never, have the right to fire live rounds at civilians, regardless of whether they are attacking you or not. Don't like it? Don't board the goddamn boat.

[QUOTE=starpluck;22348292]I know the list is ridiculous, that wasn't my point, I was proving how it fails to distinguish between military and civilian. And disregarding the conventions saying "No one should follow them etc." still doesn't change the fact that Israel violated it. About your last statement, that is partly true but has nothing to do with a blockade pertaining to Geneva conventions.[/QUOTE] Do we know what process spawned the list? Is there actually an appointed committee that is handling the addition or removal of items from the list? Or does this list just randomly grow based on what the soldiers doing the inspections decide? I'm actually curious, it's something I've wondered in the back of my head, but have yet to form it into a question. The list is just so odd that I feel like stuff is being added to it on the fly rather than through government process. Like "you spit on me, so now the entire contents of your cart are illegal" sorta mess from soldiers at checkpoints. I can't imagine that actually being the case though. Anyhow the lack of enforcement on the conventions directly pertains to my previous comment. If it isn't enforced, why follow it. By not following it you promote change through the creation of enforcement, or removal of the law. By intermittently following it, things will remain the same and people will still break the law at random intervals.

[QUOTE=Seppe;22344925]They kinda failed there, but seriously.. Slingshots? Yeah that's totally gonna work against fully automatic weapons.[/QUOTE] They were used in thailand. Maybe Israel got scared because of it?

[QUOTE=Ignhelper;22348535]They were used in thailand. Maybe Israel got scared because of it?[/QUOTE] Thailand is a country. They were on a ship. Unless they were facing an army of slingshots they wouldn't need to care.

Sling shots suck at penetrating armour anyway so if they were wearing their helmets like they should have been then this wouldn't have been an issue.

The only thing that this proves is that Israel's too stupid to set their cameras. A break amongst everything else that is still up in the air.

[QUOTE=GunFox;22347857]Oh okay, Israel will declare war on Gaza now so that they can blockade them legally. The point of the blockade is to AVOID a war. It isn't like Israel is actually threatened by the strip from a military standpoint. It could be turned, in its entirety, into a smoking crater withing hours. They take these steps in order to prevent that from occurring.[/QUOTE] The point of this blockade is to starve off Gaza.

No. The point of the blockade is to stop the Hamas from getting weapons. Starving Gaza is an unfortunate side effect which I think the government should work ASAP to fix, but those right wingers don't care about anything but themselves.

Watch out, humanitarian aid convoys hold weapons for hamas

[QUOTE=BurnEmDown;22348932]No. The point of the blockade is to stop the Hamas from getting weapons. Starving Gaza is an unfortunate side effect which I think the government should work ASAP to fix, but those right wingers don't care about anything but themselves.[/QUOTE] If the goal was not to the starve and deprive the Palestinians then the Israelites wouldn't have banned all that necessary shit.

[QUOTE=BurnEmDown;22348932]No. The point of the blockade is to stop the Hamas from getting weapons. Starving Gaza is an unfortunate side effect which I think the government should work ASAP to fix, but those right wingers don't care about anything but themselves.[/QUOTE] [I]No.[/I] The point of this illegal blockade is not to prevent weapons from entering Gaza, it is to force the residents to leave or die so Israel can steal some more land. It has nothing to do with enforcing righteousness against a terrorist group. Israel has decided to refuse aid into Gaza, can you not see clear their intentions? If you still cannot; You should really stop arguing that Israel is right, and instead should take a look at what they are doing for once.

Looking at this thread and how the topic creates so much disagreement and strong emotions amongst people who are hardly even concerned by the events, I suddenly realize that there'll never be peace in the Middle East

[QUOTE=Splurgy;22343140]To be fair, I'm more inclined to think that someone didn't set the clock than it's an Israeli conspiracy[/QUOTE]

I'd be fucking pissed off if some cunt smashed my fucking XH A- [editline]07:10PM[/editline] I'd be fucking pissed off if some cunt smashed my fucking camera

[QUOTE=codenamecueball;22349148]I'd be fucking pissed off if some cunt smashed my fucking XH A- [editline]07:10PM[/editline] I'd be fucking pissed off if some cunt smashed my fucking camera[/QUOTE] Lol you had a seizure XHA D -

[QUOTE=BurnEmDown;22348932]No. The point of the blockade is to stop the Hamas from getting weapons. Starving Gaza is an unfortunate side effect which I think the government should work ASAP to fix, but those right wingers don't care about anything but themselves.[/QUOTE] Yes - banning FOOD is linked to banning WEAPONS. You know you are wrong and yet you blindly defend your country. You are not a patriot. You are just a misguided dolt. [B]FEAR ME FOR NOW I WILL USE THIS PEANUT IN MY SUICIDE BOMB![/B]

[QUOTE=Stopper;22349262]Yes - banning FOOD is linked to banning WEAPONS. You know you are wrong and yet you blindly defend your country. You are not a patriot. You are just a misguided dolt. [B]FEAR ME FOR NOW I WILL USE THIS PEANUT IN MY SUICIDE BOMB![/B][/QUOTE] [B]HEY ASSHOLE DON'T YOU KNOW THE ISRAELI PRESIDENT IS ALLERGIC TO THAT? IM GOING TO BLOW UP YOUR AID FLOTILLAs! AHAHAHAHAH[/B]

[QUOTE=Sickle;22348993][I]No.[/I] The point of this illegal blockade is not to prevent weapons from entering Gaza, it is to force the residents to leave or die so Israel can steal some more land. It has nothing to do with enforcing righteousness against a terrorist group. Israel has decided to refuse aid into Gaza, can you not see clear their intentions? If you still cannot; You should really stop arguing that Israel is right, and instead should take a look at what they are doing for once.[/QUOTE] Israel has already controlled Gaza in the past and withdrew from it in 2005. We don't want Gaza and we don't need Gaza. Also how can you be so sure of Israel's intentions? Israel has stated that the blockade's goals were first to block Hamas's access from weapons and second to reduce the Hamas's influence in Gaza. The list of banned items are what they say would help increase Hamas's influence. However I agree that it is stupid and that Israel should just allow all those stuff through. [editline]09:20PM[/editline] [QUOTE=Stopper;22349262]Yes - banning FOOD is linked to banning WEAPONS. You know you are wrong and yet you blindly defend your country. You are not a patriot. You are just a misguided dolt. [B]FEAR ME FOR NOW I WILL USE THIS PEANUT IN MY SUICIDE BOMB![/B][/QUOTE] Wow I am being attacked over not agreeing with my government, OK talk about hypocrisy.

[QUOTE=BurnEmDown;22349286]Israel has already controlled Gaza in the past and withdrew from it in 2005. We don't want Gaza and we don't need Gaza. Also how can you be so sure of Israel's intentions? Israel has stated that the blockade's goals were first to block Hamas's access from weapons and second to reduce the Hamas's influence in Gaza. The list of banned items are what they say would help increase Hamas's influence. However I agree that it is stupid and that Israel should just allow all those stuff through. [editline]09:20PM[/editline] Wow I am being attacked over not agreeing with my government, OK talk about hypocrisy.[/QUOTE]So you disagree with the Israelite government?

On that matter, yes.

[QUOTE=BurnEmDown;22349388]On that matter, yes.[/QUOTE] Yet banning food is a side-effect of banning weapons. I guess [I]that's[/I] why food on airplanes sucks ass.

The Nikon camera used has a rechargable battery, so would be very unlikely that it was "replaced" And even so, im pretty sure it has a very long life watch battery inside that would easily last from 2006 to present. That said, i have a Nikon camera, pretty sure it's older than a D2Xs, and i dont recall having to re-set the time whenever i charge it

[QUOTE=BurnEmDown;22348932]No. The point of the blockade is to stop the Hamas from getting weapons. Starving Gaza is an unfortunate side effect which I think the government should work ASAP to fix, but those right wingers don't care about anything but themselves.[/QUOTE] Hamas is pretty damn smart making anything into a rocket. Also, watch the latest jon steward. He talks about hama using wheelchairs. :v:

[QUOTE=Thomo;22343048]Israel get[/quote] Don't keep me in suspense! [quote]fucked[/QUOTE] :saddowns:

Having Gaza as part of Israel is a waste of money for the government. Obviously it costs a shitload of money to hold the economy of 1.5 million people. Gaza was captured during a war, not sure why they hesitate to leave it for so long, was a huge waste of money.