Girl, 8, wants to be 1st patient at SickKids transgender clinic - Polidicks

[QUOTE=T-Sonar.0;42574761]Yes, I am. And if there are I'm sure that'll be a choice the person want to make. To transition or try to force themselves to be happy in their birth sex. Taking hormones is just taking natural synthetic hormones. That's it. It's not some weird combination of random shit to make an effect. You take E, you grow breasts, get softer skin, etc etc. At the same time, the psychological effects correct hormonal imbalances and you feel a lot better about yourself.[/QUOTE] Funny how people don't want their food injected with 'natural synthetic hormones'. [QUOTE]They do not permanently change your body. At least not for MtF. Every effect of HRT for a trans female can be reversed apart from sterility. There's more irreversible changes for FtM, but some can be altered with surgery and hair removal. But, you know, continue this passive-aggressive bullshit or whatever. Really makes you look mature.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE]Not at all, but it's still very small compared to those who stick with the decision. You can say I'm making a false claim all you like but it's true.[/QUOTE] I don't think there is anything stopping an adult who has made up their mind and there should be options available for them, but there will be kids who fall into the wrong decision they made when they were 8. [QUOTE]I haven't heard of that but just because 1 person killed themselves doesn't mean everyone else does.[/QUOTE] I don't know the source I just found it via a google search: [url]http://www.christianpost.com/news/nathan-verhelst-transgender-man-chooses-euthanasia-after-failed-sex-change-operation-106109/[/url] [QUOTE]What the actual fuck. LOL Wow you just proved to everyone that you have no idea what the fuck you're talking about. Holy shit that was too funny I'm still laughing.[/QUOTE] Good idea being sensitive to others issues by laughing. From my understanding genetics are still somewhat of a mystery, so it is entirely possible that things like these are genetic (however funny you think that is). Especially since everyone keeps arguing that children are "born this way".

[QUOTE=nigerianprince;42574796]Funny how people don't want their food injected with 'natural synthetic hormones'.[/quote] What kind of argument is this? This has nothing to do with transgender people or transitioning. People don't want hormones in food because there's possibility of health risks involving hormonally injected livestock. [quote]I don't think there is anything stopping an adult who has made up their mind and there should be options available for them, but there will be kids who fall into the wrong decision they made when they were 8.[/quote] Newsflash: When it comes to gender identity (and who you are as a person) we know. We all know. Very early. [quote]I don't know the source I just found it via a google search: [url]http://www.christianpost.com/news/nathan-verhelst-transgender-man-chooses-euthanasia-after-failed-sex-change-operation-106109/[/url][/quote] If you had read that article instead of skimming the title and a few words you'd realize he killed himself because the sex reassignment surgery was botched. Whoever did the surgery completely fucked it up. Not because he regretted it shortly after. Are you really this idiotic? [quote]Good idea being sensitive to others issues by laughing. From my understanding genetics are still somewhat of a mystery, so it is entirely possible that things like these are genetic (however funny you think that is).[/quote] I was not laughing at you being genetically predisposed to Alzheimer's disease. Hell, I am too. Probably moreso than you even because it's on both sides of my family. I was laughing at the fact you said you can be predisposed to Gender Identity Disorder. You can't. It's impossible. [quote]Especially since everyone keeps arguing that children are "born this way".[/QUOTE] Next you'll say you can be predisposed to being a homosexual. There's a reason people say we are, "born this way," because its true. You are born with a gender identity, aren't you? Everyone is.

[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;42574884]2 hours old yes, but if people who know nothing said nothing, how would we learn? Everyone's ignorant at some point until they ask questions. I have questions about transgenders but am suppressing them because it'll be batted away as "transphobic" when really I'm just curious. It's hard to word questions reguarding transgenders because everything is so damn offensive.[/QUOTE] There's a pretty large difference between asking something about it and outright stating something along the lines of "how can he choose to be a she at 8" (as this would imply that it's a choice) and then sticking to the opinion even after being corrected (and for some people even banned for it before). I'm sure if you word your questions friendly and say that you're only attempting to learn more about it, and accept being corrected occasionally, then most people on here will be pretty civil about it.

[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;42574884]2 hours old yes, but if people who know nothing said nothing, how would we learn? Everyone's ignorant at some point until they ask questions. I have questions about transgenders but am suppressing them because it'll be batted away as "transphobic" when really I'm just curious. It's hard to word questions reguarding transgenders because everything is so damn offensive.[/QUOTE] nothing wrong with asking questions. there's a lot wrong with being arrogant and acting like a know it all when you know nothing though.

[QUOTE=T-Sonar.0;42574862]What kind of argument is this? This has nothing to do with transgender people or transitioning. People don't want hormones in food because there's possibility of health risks involving hormonally injected livestock.[/QUOTE] I thought hormones didn't cause health issues. [QUOTE]Newsflash: When it comes to gender identity (and who you are as a person) we know. We all know. Very early.[/QUOTE] I don't argue that most people are sure, I am more concerned there are people who aren't sure. [QUOTE]If you had read that article instead of skimming the title and a few words you'd realize he killed himself because the sex reassignment surgery was botched. Whoever did the surgery completely fucked it up. Not because he regretted it shortly after. Are you really this idiotic?[/QUOTE] "However, when Nathan saw the results, he was left unsatisfied. "I was ready to celebrate my new birth. But when I looked in the mirror, I was disgusted with myself," he told Het Laatse Nieuws in Belgium. "My new breasts did not match my expectations and my new penis had symptoms of rejection. I do not want to be … a monster."" It more reads like the surgery didn't live up to his expectations. [QUOTE]I was not laughing at you being genetically predisposed to Alzheimer's disease. Hell, I am too. I was laughing at the fact you said you can be predisposed to Gender Identity Disorder. You can't. It's impossible.[/QUOTE] So if everyone keeps claiming that they are "born this way", how exactly does that remove the possibility that it is something that is in your genetics? If repeated arguments get made that gender identity cannot be conditioned, then where does it come from? [QUOTE]Next you'll say you can be predisposed to being a homosexual.[/QUOTE] I'm not sure. I went to a school which had no female contact. I knew a lot of guys who were 'conditionally' homosexual and grew out of it later in life. I think genetics might hold the key to a lot of things in life. To be clear: that doesn't mean I think people should be discriminated against because of the way they are. [QUOTE]There's a reason people say we are, "born this way," because its true. You are born with a gender identity, aren't you? Everyone is.[/QUOTE] Where does it come from then?

[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;42574884]2 hours old yes, but if people who know nothing said nothing, how would we learn? Everyone's ignorant at some point until they ask questions. I have questions about transgenders but am suppressing them because it'll be batted away as "transphobic" when really I'm just curious. It's hard to word questions reguarding transgenders because everything is so damn offensive.[/QUOTE] yo if you wanna pm me questions or anything ill try my best to answer them and dont worry about your wording because im pretty laid back about that if someone just wants to know something about us

lol nigerian prince Don't waste your time with him. You'll argue in circles for 20 pages. He's done this in the last like 3 transgender related threads. Also, again, to anyone who says that hormone blockers are too early and such or that the girl can't know shes trans yet: [quote=Me]But she's old enough to understand serious depression and has the want to kill herself? You don't have any idea what you're talking about. My life and many others would've been a lot better if I'd had the resources she's getting from this clinic when I was her age.[/quote]

[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;42574884]2 hours old yes, but if people who know nothing said nothing, how would we learn? Everyone's ignorant at some point until they ask questions. I have questions about transgenders but am suppressing them because it'll be batted away as "transphobic" when really I'm just curious. It's hard to word questions reguarding transgenders because everything is so damn offensive.[/QUOTE] unless you're on tumblr or something or what you want to say isn't a question but is "lol trannys are stupid!!" then you aren't really going to offend anyone by seeking knowledge the biggest thing is transgender people get tired of having to explain their existence over and over again and sometimes it makes people angry, but its a necessary thing.

[QUOTE=Paige;42574944]lol nigerian prince Don't waste your time with him. You'll argue in circles for 20 pages. He's done this in the last like 3 transgender related threads. Also, again, to anyone who says that hormone blockers are too early and such or that the girl can't know shes trans yet:[/QUOTE] Let me guess! Answer: because transgender! Don't bother fielding questions here with the aim of learning people here, transgender people are completely infallible. [highlight](User was banned for this post ("Endless threadshitting and strawmanning" - Megafan))[/highlight]

stop saying 'because transgender!' you're not fucking funny [editline]19th October 2013[/editline] it's quite evident that you're just perpeuating your own garbage to string out this thread even more. uuu

[QUOTE=nigerianprince;42574981]Let me guess! Answer: because transgender! Don't bother fielding questions here with the aim of learning people here, transgender people are completely infallible.[/QUOTE] im sorry, i forgot you have years of research and study into the human psyche. you obviously dont know what youre talking about and just blabber ignorance.

[QUOTE=FlubberNugget;42574996]stop saying 'because transgender!' you're not fucking funny [editline]19th October 2013[/editline] it's quite evident that you're just perpeuating your own garbage to string out this thread even more. uuu[/QUOTE] I wasn't aware that this thread was intended to be a comedy, sad that you see transgender issues as a comedy. And I think you're well antiquated with why I'm saying that; it seems to be the default excuse for anything. It was used multiple times in that thread about Eurogamer.

the only laughable thing in this thread is how you think you're oh so much better than everyone else because you disagree with them there's a reason nobody wants you here

[QUOTE=nigerianprince;42574981]Let me guess! Answer: because transgender! Don't bother fielding questions here with the aim of learning people here, transgender people are completely infallible.[/QUOTE] Actually i put the answer in the same post gg on reading lol like what even was that? that post was literally nothing more than "LOOK AT ME I HATE UR ARGUMENT SO MUCH >:'(((("

[QUOTE=nigerianprince;42574650]You mean I have concern that some 8 year old kid might unwittingly be filled with very serious medications and it might not always turn out all peachy and rosy and that there might be something wrong with that? Oh wait that's right! I forgot! Because: transgender people. Sorry for even considering ideas and ideals different to yours! Gee these forums are sure great, where everyone is mandated to have the same opinion.[/QUOTE] Whoops! Better not stand up! My legs might snap off at the knee and cartwheel around! I mean, it's a decision only I make, for myself, that will only affect me and consume my time, but I guess I'd better not take the chance.

actually i found the other post i made regarding it being too early that's better: [Quote=Paige] the only issue with this, and this goes doubly so for MtF's usually, going through that male puberty wrecks any chance you have of passing or incredibly diminishes it. Just makes life harder in general. Not to mention going through the wrong puberty has mentally devastating effects. Hormone Blockers until you know what you want really is the best idea.[/Quote]

[QUOTE=codemaster85;42575037]im sorry, i forgot you have years of research and study into the human psyche. you obviously dont know what youre talking about and just blabber ignorance.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE]The argument is kids can't decide at early ages. Contrary to popular belief kids aren't buttfuck retarded empty shells that just soak up whatever the world throws at them. You develop a sense of identity when you're 2-3 years old. Those who are aware of it early immediately can tell they don't feel right identifying as their birth sex. As they grow older and start understanding social norms (I.E. constructed gender roles) they begin to further see that they identify less as their birth sex. There was a case study a while back in where a little boy named David lost his dick to a circumcision incident. A dickhead doctor convinced the parents to convert his dick into a vagina and give him female hormones to raise him as a girl. He secretly intended to study transgenderism, but that's another story. They changed the kid's name to Brenda and raised him as a girl. Throughout her life Brenda exhibited growing behaviors that of a male, despite having her body replaced with E and T-Blockers. She was unhappy and felt wrong as a female. It wasn't until she was 14 years of age that they told her. Brenda immediately went back to identifying as male and going by David. David killed himself at about age 35. The experiment was downright cruel and inhumane, but it does help point evidence that gender identity can not be socially constructed. It highly supports that we all develop an identity at an early age. [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Reimer[/url][/QUOTE] newsflash: people with years of research and study do things that are "downright cruel and inhumane".

[QUOTE=nigerianprince;42574931]I thought hormones didn't cause health issues. I don't argue that most people are sure, I am more concerned there are people who aren't sure. "However, when Nathan saw the results, he was left unsatisfied. "I was ready to celebrate my new birth. But when I looked in the mirror, I was disgusted with myself," he told Het Laatse Nieuws in Belgium. "My new breasts did not match my expectations and my new penis had symptoms of rejection. I do not want to be … a monster."" It more reads like the surgery didn't live up to his expectations. So if everyone keeps claiming that they are "born this way", how exactly does that remove the possibility that it is something that is in your genetics? If repeated arguments get made that gender identity cannot be conditioned, then where does it come from? I'm not sure. I went to a school which had no female contact. I knew a lot of guys who were 'conditionally' homosexual and grew out of it later in life. I think genetics might hold the key to a lot of things in life. To be clear: that doesn't mean I think people should be discriminated against because of the way they are. Where does it come from then?[/QUOTE] STRAWMAN AS FUCK! Estrogen and Testosterone are fucking worlds apart from shit like Bovine Growth Hormone. Your arguments are fucking trash and so are you. [editline]19th October 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=nigerianprince;42575120]newsflash: people with years of research and study do things that are "downright cruel and inhumane".[/QUOTE] In other news: [quote]The experiment was downright cruel and inhumane, but it does help point evidence that gender identity can not be socially constructed. It highly supports that we all develop an identity at an early age.[/quote] You practically just shot every single one of your own arguments in the tits, congratulations.

[QUOTE=nigerianprince;42574931]I thought hormones didn't cause health issues.[quote] I don't think it does in livestock either. And I posted that chart on page 3. Go look. [quote]"However, when Nathan saw the results, he was left unsatisfied. "I was ready to celebrate my new birth. But when I looked in the mirror, I was disgusted with myself," he told Het Laatse Nieuws in Belgium. "My new breasts did not match my expectations and my new penis had symptoms of rejection. I do not want to be … a monster."" It more reads like the surgery didn't live up to his expectations.[/quote] His dick showing symptoms of rejection sounds like being unsatisfied? I guess if I had a heart transplant and my body was rejecting my new heart I'm just "unsatisfied." [quote]So if everyone keeps claiming that they are "born this way", how exactly does that remove the possibility that it is something that is in your genetics?[/quote] Because you can't be predisposed to something mental. Just birth defects and other conditions that actually affect your health. [quote]If repeated arguments get made that gender identity cannot be conditioned, then where does it come from?[/quote] Primarily there's evidence to support that it's during pregnancy, where the fetus is fed the wrong hormones or an imbalance of the two. I've said this before. Don't mock me for having no reading comprehension when you can't even remember stuff I posted under an hour ago. [quote]I'm not sure. I went to a school which had no female contact. I knew a lot of guys who were 'conditionally' homosexual and grew out of it later in life.[/quote] Uh... ok. [quote]I think genetics might hold the key to a lot of things in life. To be clear: that doesn't mean I think people should be discriminated against because of the way they are.[/quote] Except for gender identity and sexuality. [quote]Where does it come from then?[/QUOTE] Read above.

[QUOTE=bravehat;42575149]STRAWMAN AS FUCK! Estrogen and Testosterone are fucking worlds apart from shit like Bovine Growth Hormone. Your arguments are fucking trash and so are you.[/QUOTE] I don't think there is any need to resort to offensive language thank you very much. [QUOTE]You practically just shot every single one of your own arguments in the tits, congratulations.[/QUOTE] Funny how I was asking that person who was implying that genetics had nothing to do with transgenderism or homosexuality where exactly these things would come from if they were not socially constructed. If they're not socially constructed and they're not genetic, then where do they come from? saying they 'develop' is a very vague statement. Good job at least trying to pay attention to the chain of discussion though.

[QUOTE=nigerianprince;42575120]newsflash: people with years of research and study do things that are "downright cruel and inhumane".[/QUOTE] Way to not read a damn thing. First of all, he forced someone who wasn't transgender to transition by decieving the parents from his true intentions. Secondly, he had David and his brother perform countless acts with each other that could be deemed sexual in nature.

[QUOTE]I don't think it does in livestock either. And I posted that chart on page 3. Go look.[/QUOTE] Hasn't the onset of early puberty in girls been linked to consumption of meat? [QUOTE]His dick showing symptoms of rejection sounds like being unsatisfied? I guess if I had a heart transplant and my body was rejecting my new heart I'm just "unsatisfied."[/QUOTE] I don't know, its just a story I had read on a news article; I can only surmise so much from such a vague statement. I do have to ask the question though that if he had not had the surgery or had left it until better techniques were available would he have committed suicide? [QUOTE]Because you can't be predisposed to something mental. Just birth defects and other conditions that actually affect your health.[/QUOTE] Aren't genetics really still in their infancy right now though? And I thought being transgendered would be something that affects your health (to the point that having life altering medication/surgery is a better option that not having it)? [QUOTE]Primarily there's evidence to support that it's during pregnancy, where the fetus is fed the wrong hormones or an imbalance of the two. I've said this before. Don't mock me for having no reading comprehension when you can't even remember stuff I posted under an hour ago.[/QUOTE] Interesting. [QUOTE]Except for gender identity and sexuality.[/QUOTE] Where exactly did I say that gender identity and sexuality should be discriminated against? All I've been saying is that I don't think 8 year olds should be able to make such huge decisions. I just abhor the constant use of LGBT / female gender as some sort of an excuse for all manner of things, that doesn't mean I discriminate against those people. [editline]20th October 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=T-Sonar.0;42575221]Way to not read a damn thing. First of all, he forced someone who wasn't transgender to transition by decieving the parents from his true intentions. Secondly, he had David and his brother perform countless acts with each other that could be deemed sexual in nature.[/QUOTE] Yes I did read what you had written. I was more using it as a point to counter this: [QUOTE]im sorry, i forgot you have years of research and study into the human psyche. you obviously dont know what youre talking about and just blabber ignorance.[/QUOTE] This poster presented the idea that if I were a doctor or similar I wouldn't be "blabbering"; this idea that psychologist and doctors are infallible and correct 100% of the time is flatly incorrect. You can gather this from the story that you posted.

[QUOTE=nigerianprince;42574650]You mean I have concern that some 8 year old kid might unwittingly be filled with very serious medications and it might not always turn out all peachy and rosy and that there might be something wrong with that? Oh wait that's right! I forgot! Because: transgender people. Sorry for even considering ideas and ideals different to yours! [B]Gee these forums are sure great, where everyone is mandated to have the same opinion.[/B][/QUOTE] its more like youre not allowed to spew false bullshit and be a bigot. if you dont like it go to another forum. [editline]19th October 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=nigerianprince;42575120]newsflash: people with years of research and study do things that are "downright cruel and inhumane".[/QUOTE] holy shit you just proved my fucking point that you have absolutely NO IDEA what youre talking about. are you just illiterate because it seems you cant even read your research. we already pointed out that forcing people's gender to their sex is detrimental and that guy was a crook. you are literally strawmanning one fucking report to thousands of others.

[QUOTE=codemaster85;42575304]its more like youre not allowed to spew false bullshit and be a bigot. if you dont like it go to another forum. [editline]19th October 2013[/editline] holy shit you just proved my fucking point that you have absolutely NO IDEA what youre talking about. are you just illiterate because it seems you cant even read your research.[/QUOTE] Oh wait you're that guy that thinks that doctors are infallible! Sure glad I spent $4000 USD on that painful surgical procedure that didn't fix the problem I was having. Good thing doctors are infallible and are never incorrect any of the time.

[QUOTE=nigerianprince;42575339]Oh wait you're that guy that thinks that doctors are infallible! [B]Sure glad I spent $4000 USD on that painful surgical procedure that didn't fix the problem I was having.[/B] Good thing doctors are infallible and are never incorrect any of the time.[/QUOTE] again not reading you dont get the surgery till AFTER 18.

Why are people so hung up on hating Transgendered people. They really cause no harm at all. The only suffering being trans causes is from the judgement of peers.

[QUOTE=nigerianprince;42575266]Hasn't the onset of early puberty in girls been linked to consumption of meat?[/quote] I... wouldn't know? [quote]I don't know, its just a story I had read on a news article; I can only surmise so much from such a vague statement. I do have to ask the question though that if he had not had the surgery or had left it until better techniques were available would he have committed suicide?[/quote] He probably would have committed suicide if he was really set on getting SRS but couldn't. And if the surgery had been a success he most likely wouldn't have killed himself. [quote]Aren't genetics really still in their infancy right now though? And I thought being transgendered would be something that affects your health (to the point that having life altering medication/surgery is a better option that not having it)?[/quote] GID affects mental health, not physical health. The only changes in physical health are caused by taking hormones. I'm more likely to get breast cancer now that I'm on hormones but that's only because I actually have the breasts to get breast cancer. I'm basically at more of a risk of getting diseases women are prone to getting because I am becoming a woman. [quote]Where exactly did I say that gender identity and sexuality should be discriminated against? All I've been saying is that I don't think 8 year olds should be able to make such huge decisions. I just abhor the constant use of LGBT / female gender as some sort of an excuse for all manner of things, that doesn't mean I discriminate against those people.[/quote] Hold your horses there pal. I was responding to this statement. [quote=You]I think genetics might hold the key to a lot of things in life.[/quote]

[QUOTE=codemaster85;42575304]its more like youre not allowed to spew false bullshit and be a bigot. if you dont like it go to another forum. [editline]19th October 2013[/editline] holy shit you just proved my fucking point that you have absolutely NO IDEA what youre talking about. are you just illiterate because it seems you cant even read your research.[/QUOTE] At least try to not be rude and respectfully explain it to him, look at how much you swear. But yeah, nigerianprince, we've debated this for like 5 threads already. If you're going to dismiss the legitimacy of transgendered people, at least come up with a viable argument already. You could, for instance, point out that the existence of psychological gender is debatable instead of just outright flaming every person that replies to you.

[QUOTE=codemaster85;42575348]again not reading you dont get the surgery till AFTER 18.[/QUOTE] Thanks Doogie Howser, M.D. ! I got that surgery when I was above the age of 18 and it still didn't fix my problem! Good thing doctors are correct all the time! Sure glad no one I know has ever died from medical issues before!

[QUOTE=nigerianprince;42575372]Thanks Doogie Howser, M.D. ! I got that surgery when I was above the age of 18 and it still didn't fix my problem! Good thing doctors are correct all the time! Sure glad no one I know has ever died from medical issues before![/QUOTE] You do realize whatever this childish shit you're doing doesn't help you get your point across, right?