Michael Moore: They Voted For A Guy Named ‘Hussein’ Twice, Trump Voters Are Not Racist
51 replies, posted
The data does not match with what he's saying. Democratic turnout was 10 million less than in 2008, Republican turnout was actually lower than Romney's but higher than McCain's, and more importantly, third party turnouts went up, 3 million more for the Libertarian party and 1 million more for the Green Party. The lack of confidence in Hillary is what sank her, Republicans didn't steal any significant amount of votes from Democrats.
[QUOTE=Native Hunter;51362159]"If Trump is elected he's going to take away the rights of minorities"
That sort of pandering is the fearmongering currently supported by the Left[/QUOTE]
I'm not sure if it's fearmongering anymore when you consider the shit Mike Pence has done and wants to do.
[QUOTE=Mining Bill;51362166]I honestly can't think of too too much fearmongering from the dem's side, any examples?[/QUOTE]
I remember seeing campaign ads for Clinton that basically amounted to "Do YOU really want to give THIS GUY the NUCLEAR LAUNCH CODES?", so yeah, there is lefty fearmongering.
Calling the majority of Trump supporters racist is dumb. But it's really obvious that they were some of his strongest core and he HAS made attempts to appeal to them through dogwhistling, it's an old strategy and sadly it IS effective because you can directly appeal to racists but still being able to deny the charges and be believable. When you compose evidence of Trump being racist, what you find is a lot, and I do mean a LOT of evidence, but you can't actually find the sort of evidence to brand him with it beyond a shadow of a doubt. I conclude that he himself isn't racist personally, but is just willing to make appeals to those who are.
edit: also to be fair. This isn't just a republican thing. Clinton had that "superpredators" bullshit for example.
[QUOTE=Sir Whoopsalot;51363174]I'm not sure if it's fearmongering anymore when you consider the shit Mike Pence has done and wants to do.[/QUOTE]
To be fair most of what Pence has done is just publicly support stupid shit. His actual attempt to discriminate the LGBT community got shot down by his own party.
[editline]13th November 2016[/editline]
Honestly I'm really hoping someone does a poll asking people why they voted for Trump. I'm curious to see how many people actually voted for him because they agreed with his policies (and even then which policies they were most receptive to), and how many people just voted for him because he wasn't Hillary.
The better question to ask is how many people voted for Trump because of his economic policies and despite everything else.
I'm telling you, DNC and GOP stupidity and liberal "smugness" played a part in losing this election for sure, but I think the reason Trump won comes down to economics.
[QUOTE=BlackMageMari;51363306]The better question to ask is how many people voted for Trump because of his economic policies and despite everything else.
I'm telling you, DNC and GOP stupidity and liberal "smugness" played a part in losing this election for sure, but I think the reason Trump won comes down to economics.[/QUOTE]Because of the pipe dreams he offered*
[QUOTE=Anderan;51363221]To be fair most of what Pence has done is just publicly support stupid shit. His actual attempt to discriminate the LGBT community got shot down by his own party.
[editline]13th November 2016[/editline]
Honestly I'm really hoping someone does a poll asking people why they voted for Trump. I'm curious to see how many people actually voted for him because they agreed with his policies (and even then which policies they were most receptive to), and how many people just voted for him because he wasn't Hillary.[/QUOTE]
He was a hand grenade. A fuck you vote. The hope is he will be such a disaster, to screw things up so badly, that things will change and be forced to be fixed.
He is the black pill president.
A significant portion of Trump supporters [i]are[/i] racist, islamophobic, homophobic and whatever other negative words you can think of. You don't have to go further than /r/the_donald to know that much.
It's obviously nowhere near [i]all[/i] Trump supporters though. I don't think anyone knows what the exact ratio is.
[QUOTE=thelurker1234;51363321]Because of the pipe dreams he offered*[/QUOTE]
I mean I agree, but we have to face facts that Trump's economic arguments were more convincing than Clinton's to the average working class American. That doesn't mean they were good arguments; just that they were more convincing.
Ah okay I guess neo nazis aren't racist then, Michael Moore said so.
Depends what you mean by 'racist'. I don't think Trump supporters are racists in the traditional sense of viscerally loathing non-whites and believing themselves to be biologically superior in some way. However, I think that they have placed themselves as racial victims in a changing America, and voted for Trump as he offered an option against the decline of themselves both economically (a legitimate reason) and demographically (not a legitimate reason). From 2008 and at an accelerating pace, the Tea Party acclimatised people to far-right politics, and this has been shown in the Republican taking of the Senate and House alongside the dramatic shift to the right in the Republican Party. Although the Republicans were beaten for the presidency in 2012 again, this occurred because they offered a candidate who was a moderate and was against an exceptionally talented and charismatic politician. Although Obama's race didn't put them off voting for him (and wouldn't put them off voting for a black Republican either etc.), this doesn't mean that there isn't a kind of racism (a racism of victimhood, perhaps, where whites want to be restored to their 'natural' position, rather than a racism of supremacy) existent in these voters.
Whilst they may have voted for Obama before because neither candidate offered a complete shift in racial politics in favour of white America, and because he was the better and more charismatic candidate, this time they had an actual choice (and the Democrat was a flawed and uncharismatic campaigner) and went with him instead.
[QUOTE=Lambeth;51363871]Ah okay I guess neo nazis aren't racist then, Michael Moore said so.[/QUOTE]
I'm pretty sure not all Trump supporters are Neo-Nazis.
Either way: enough explaining that when people say that Hispanics or Muslims or Blacks are destroying America, they are actually really asking for a higher minimum wage or left-wing economic policy, as if they just can't find the words or something. If they wanted those, Trump's views on trade would have taken a much bigger place in the campaign instead of his comments about immigration or race or law and order. The reality is that the American economy is on the up and that their position has been improving in the last few years. American growth has been imperfect, but the best that you can expect if you look internationally.
Basically, Moore's analysis is 'here's something I have always wanted politically, in my excellent new analysis of Trump, here is my proof they all want what I have always wanted politically'. It's wishful thinking. We saw the same thing after Brexit: the assertion that actually, all those people in Sunderland would suddenly love the Poles, if only we gave them enough money (which coincidentally, the people arguing this analysis always wanted to do anyway). It pretends that most people are just economic ciphers who secretly support all your policies, which should be absurd, but it gains a surprising amount of acceptance among the left.
The problem is that people who see themselves as representing 'the people' find it exceptionally hard to accept that 'the people' might think some nasty or stupid things, or might actually really disagree with them, because it goes against their views ideologically. This occurs on the right as well (who have also become pro-populist in many ways as well) but they are on the up so aren't the ones complaining at the moment.
[QUOTE=CasualTR;51364632]I'm pretty sure not all Trump supporters are Neo-Nazis.[/QUOTE]
No but you can't ignore the fact that they are huge fans of trump.
That quote reminds me of "I have a black friend, I'm not racist.".
[QUOTE=Lambeth;51364836]No but you can't ignore the fact that they are huge fans of trump.[/QUOTE]
not any more so than any other conservative candidate.
[QUOTE=butre;51365021]not any more so than any other conservative candidate.[/QUOTE]
Have you been under a rock?
[QUOTE=Native Hunter;51362159]"If Trump is elected he's going to take away the rights of minorities"
That sort of pandering is the fearmongering currently supported by the Left[/QUOTE]
Using Trump's own words against him and calling out his concerning behavior is not "pandering" or "fearmongering".
[QUOTE=FlashMarsh;51365093]Have you been under a rock?[/QUOTE]
I mean maybe they're bigger fans of him than they are of for example mitt romney, but each one is still only one vote. one popular vote at that, which amounts to fuck all
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