Anonymous taking on Big Red High School football team from Ohio who raped a blacked out girl, carryi - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Governor Goblin;38958993]What the fuck is the point of blaming the victim for rape if you're SO convinced you're a decent person and totally not a misogynist.[/QUOTE] this high-and-mighty post-style of yours is nearly present in any thread like this i've ever seen you in. it accomplishes nothing and it seems like you take all of this too personal. try stepping back for a moment.

[QUOTE=Bobie;38959168]the difference between russian roulette and statutory rape is, the woman brings it upon herself if she shoots herself in the head. a woman doesn't bring rape upon herself by being unconscious lol[/QUOTE] Okay, that is a difference A similarity is that if you play russian roulette or if you get pass-out drunk is that you're pretty damn stupid

[QUOTE=Governor Goblin;38959086]Okay, so explain to us HOW THE FUCK THIS MATTERS at all in any fucking facet of life?[/QUOTE] like this [editline]24th December 2012[/editline] it's annoying

[QUOTE=Mike42012;38959161]In a civilized country, when I get blackout drunk, I'm not expecting to get repeatedly gang-raped at different parties.[/QUOTE] [b]No one expects to get raped, you god damn tool.[/b]

[QUOTE=Bobie;38959014]stepping outside of your house contributes to a rape. being a woman contributes to rape. having a single fucking drink contributes to a rape, hell, even being alive contributes to rape whether or not she's a weightlifting self defense master or a vegetable it [i]DOESN'T FUCKING MATTER[/i] - the problem and responsibility lies with the rapist and not the woman who made the personal decision to effect herself and only herself.[/QUOTE] because walking outside of your house is the exactly same thing as getting blackout drunk the double standards of you moral martyrs is astounding and i'd hate to see you as parents

[QUOTE=Paramud;38959205][b]No one expects to get raped, you god damn tool.[/b][/QUOTE] That's literally the epitome of what I just said, take your stupidity somewhere else.

[QUOTE=Elecbullet;38959190]Okay, that is a difference A similarity is that if you play russian roulette or if you get pass-out drunk is that you're pretty damn stupid[/QUOTE] oh shut up. drinking alcohol is not like playing russian roulette; getting raped shouldn't be a consequence for getting drunk.

[QUOTE=Elecbullet;38959190]Okay, that is a difference A similarity is that if you play russian roulette or if you get pass-out drunk is that you're pretty damn stupid[/QUOTE] well i'm glad that's an entirely subjective viewpoint and has no place in a court of law

[QUOTE=SigmaLambda;38959226]oh shut up. drinking alcohol is not like playing russian roulette; getting raped shouldn't be a consequence for getting drunk.[/QUOTE] A problem I see with your faction here: you seem to have this idea that I am supportive of rape in some way, meaning I think it "should" be this way, or to quote Bobie, that "women shouldn't have choice over their own actions" Absolutely none of this is true; if I could make rape stop happening I would. However if it's going to happen we should at least be reasonable in how we discuss it.

[QUOTE=Mike42012;38959161]In a civilized country, when I get blackout drunk, I'm not expecting to get repeatedly gang-raped at different parties.[/QUOTE] We don't live in fairyland quite yet so it doesn't hurt to take precautions, and having something done to you while unconscious isn't that uncommon either. Remember the girl waking up with shit on her face ? that thread didn't spark a dumb argument when someone suggested that she should avoid drinking that much.

[QUOTE=SigmaLambda;38959173]He's an asshole for not realizing the ethical implications or social repercussions for saying that a woman can be partly responsible (and that IS what he's saying) for her own rape/not realizing how that differs from saying 'you shouldn't get in a car driven by a drunk guy'.[/QUOTE] Okay, so, with this particular example, what exactly is the difference? A passenger with a drunk driver who crashes the car doesn't cause their own injury any more than a girl who blacks out causes her own rape. Both make a poor choice that contributes to but does not [i]cause[/i] the result. I'm not flaming you, I'm genuinely curious as to what you believe the difference is.

[QUOTE=Bobie;38959235]well i'm glad that's an entirely subjective viewpoint and has no place in a court of law[/QUOTE] I wasn't discussing anything about the courts here, I would not sentence anyone differently for my philosophies you so strongly object to.

[QUOTE=FuzzyPoop;38959255]We don't live in fairyland quite yet so it doesn't hurt to take precautions, and having something done to you while unconscious isn't that uncommon either. Remember the girl waking up with shit on her face ? that thread didn't spark a dumb argument when someone suggested that she should avoid drinking that much.[/QUOTE] Yes, but the difference is that this is a major crime. Having someone scribble on your face with marker is 'expected', getting raped, having your limbs chopped off, or even getting shat on is not expected, generally, when you are around normal people.

[QUOTE=Bobie;38959014]stepping outside of your house contributes to a rape. being a woman contributes to rape. having a single fucking drink contributes to a rape, hell, even being alive contributes to rape whether or not she's a weightlifting self defense master or a vegetable it [i]DOESN'T FUCKING MATTER[/i] - the problem and responsibility lies with the rapist and not the woman who made the personal decision to effect herself and only herself.[/QUOTE] yea but when there are things you can control, shouldn't you try to control them to mitigate risk? saying that you can take action to mitigate the chance of you being victimized doesn't necessarily have to put responsibility on the victim for their rape. if someone is teaching women not to walk the streets at night alone as part of a safety workshop, is that victim blaming? of course not, it's teaching people to take whatever steps possible to avoid becoming a victim. i absolutely disagree with elecbullet's assertion that even 1% of the responsibility falls upon the victim, but if you don't acknowledge that there are choices in life that can increase or decrease your risk of danger, you are willfully ignorant. no one should be raped, but people should definitely be aware that they can possibly prevent rape by making certain choices.

[QUOTE=stupid10er;38959182]this high-and-mighty post-style of yours is nearly present in any thread like this i've ever seen you in. it accomplishes nothing and it seems like you take all of this too personal. try stepping back for a moment.[/QUOTE] You're right, I should start blaming rape victims to fit whatever fucked up anti-hero reality you think you live in.

[QUOTE=Mike42012;38959275]Yes, but the difference is that this is a major crime. Having someone scribble on your face with marker is 'expected', getting raped, having your limbs chopped off, or even getting shat on is not expected, generally, when you are around normal people.[/QUOTE] You seem to imply that the nastiness of the crime affects how 'expected' it is or not. Rather, some would think of it as "okay, if I drop dead drunk here on the floor, what's my chances of getting raped versus scribbled on?"

and most importantly someone shouldn't be blamed or ostracized for choosing to ignore that advice.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;38959291]yea but when there are things you can control, shouldn't you try to control them to mitigate risk? saying that you can take action to mitigate the chance of you being victimized doesn't necessarily have to put responsibility on the victim for their rape. if someone is teaching women not to walk the streets at night alone as part of a safety workshop, is that victim blaming? of course not, it's teaching people to take whatever steps possible to avoid becoming a victim. i absolutely disagree with elecbullet's assertion that even 1% of the responsibility falls upon the victim, but if you don't acknowledge that there are choices in life that can increase or decrease your risk of danger, you are willfully ignorant. no one should be raped, but people should definitely be aware that they can possibly prevent rape by making certain choices.[/QUOTE] lots of things can be prevented by making certain choices. it doesn't mean people should have to make those choices.

[QUOTE=Bobie;38959322]lots of things can be prevented by making certain choices. it doesn't mean people should have to make those choices.[/QUOTE] yea but part of education is acknowledging these choices exist, informing people about them, and then let them make their own choices. my point is essentially: just because you say that there are ways to mitigate risk doesn't mean you are putting responsibility on the victim.

[QUOTE=Governor Goblin;38959296]You're right, I should start blaming rape victims to fit whatever fucked up anti-hero reality you think you live in.[/QUOTE] goddamn you're doing it again. i hope one day you can learn the joys of civilized debate.

[QUOTE=stupid10er;38959346]goddamn you're doing it again. i hope one day you can learn the joys of civilized debate.[/QUOTE] Do you have a point or are you just going to continue crying?

[QUOTE=yawmwen;38959341]yea but part of education is acknowledging these choices exist, informing people about them, and then let them make their own choices. my point is essentially: just because you say that there are ways to mitigate risk doesn't mean you are putting responsibility on the victim.[/QUOTE] but that's not the point im making. sure, in this case, if she stayed at home she wouldn't have got raped. but that doesn't mean there is 1% of responsibility to her name for the fact she got raped.

[QUOTE=Bobie;38959369]but that's not the point im making. sure, in this case, if she stayed at home she wouldn't have got raped. but that doesn't mean there is 1% of responsibility to her name for the fact she got raped.[/QUOTE] didn't he explicitly say in the post you are quoting that he feels there is no responsibility on the victim

[QUOTE=Elecbullet;38959379]didn't he explicitly say in the post you are quoting that he feels there is no responsibility on the victim[/QUOTE] which is why i said 'but thats not the point im making' you, on the other hand...

[QUOTE=yawmwen;38959308]and most importantly someone shouldn't be blamed or ostracized for choosing to ignore that advice.[/QUOTE] That's the problem. That's what the people in this thread are doing when they say "she shouldn't have gotten drunk". They are REMOVING blame from the perpetrators by placing some of it on the victim. It doesn't matter if that's not what they're [i]trying[/i] to do; they're doing it anyway. Every time someone says "she shouldn't have gotten drunk" they are making it slightly more ok to rape someone by taking a little bit of the blame off of the rapists. Words mean things, they affect the world around us and shape our social attitudes which, in turn, affect and direct our actions. That's why anyone who comes into a thread like this to say "maybe she shouldn't have gotten drunk" needs to [i]shut the fuck up.[/i]

I think the difference between wearing a suit of money and getting black out drunk is that one of them is more reasonable than the other. At the very least, I don't think very many people have a desire to do that, and you can't accidentally wear a suit of money; you can drink too much without intending to though. I also think that for the sake of argument it's not worth bringing up things the victim could have done differently. What matters is getting across that what these people did was not ok, because on some level, they obviously thought it was.

[QUOTE=Bobie;38959369]but that's not the point im making. sure, in this case, if she stayed at home she wouldn't have got raped. but that doesn't mean there is 1% of responsibility to her name for the fact she got raped.[/QUOTE] it just seems a lot of people are taking a more absolutist approach to the issue since it's a very very fine line between blaming the victim and acknowledging risk mitigation.

[QUOTE=Bobie;38959392]which is why i said 'but thats not the point im making' you, on the other hand...[/QUOTE] "Blame" and "responsibility" are concepts with great big bad connotations. If you think it down to the core ideals, then yes, there is responsibility there, as bad as that naturally sounds.

[QUOTE=Bobie;38959369]but that's not the point im making. sure, in this case, if she stayed at home she wouldn't have got raped. but that doesn't mean there is 1% of responsibility to her name for the fact she got raped.[/QUOTE] No, the point you're making is that she shouldn't have to worry about things like possible risks, and should instead just make decisions without thinking at all about what might happen. [QUOTE=SigmaLambda;38959394]Every time someone says "she shouldn't have gotten drunk" they are making it slightly more ok to rape someone[/QUOTE] ha

i love u sensationalist headlines