French Communist Party to drop hammer and sickle in controversial decision
168 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Sobotnik;39531213]bakunin then, mr anarchist[/QUOTE]
bakunin hasn't been "disproven" because he hardly had a strict ideology or methodology to begin with. he was more interested in revolting then he was in theorizing about post revolutionary societies.
[QUOTE=Sobotnik;39531198][img]http://www.vdare.com/images/091607_povertyrates.jpg[/img]
[editline]9th February 2013[/editline]
no it didnt
it actively suppressed science[/QUOTE]
Because education, science and medicine were all doing better in the USSR than they were in Russia, mainly because of lack of guaranteed wage for every sector and the potential to make more money in another field when it comes to capitalism and its stupid class system.
[QUOTE=Sobotnik;39531198]i want source on the bold[/QUOTE]
[url]http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.2044-8309.1994.tb01008.x/abstract[/url]
[url]http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.2307/3791837?uid=3739808&uid=2&uid=4&uid=3739256&sid=21101658932121[/url]
Note that those are both psychological - not philosophical - studies.
It's highly prevalent within feminism and race through internalized misogyny and internalized racism. It's the inherent reason [i]why[/i] so many women refuse to support feminism - because they possess false consciousness.
[QUOTE=yawmwen;39531212]you know why poverty rates declined right? they lowered the poverty threshold in relation to the amount of money in the economy, and ignored cultural expectations(for example it's expected to have a cell phone or computer these days).[/QUOTE]
wow, how convenient it is for you!
[img]http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_otfwl2zc6Qc/SLWCRVSqwHI/AAAAAAAAFgs/aEXmkxBOraU/s1600/income1.bmp[/img]
[QUOTE=Sobotnik;39531257]wow, how convenient it is for you!
[IMG]http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_otfwl2zc6Qc/SLWCRVSqwHI/AAAAAAAAFgs/aEXmkxBOraU/s1600/income1.bmp[/IMG][/QUOTE]
again that's a drop in relative wealth.
[QUOTE=yawmwen;39531220]bakunin hasn't been "disproven" because he hardly had a strict ideology or methodology to begin with. he was more interested in revolting then he was in theorizing about post revolutionary societies.[/QUOTE]
so he was just doing a lot of thinking without actually going out to put his theories to the test?
[QUOTE=Reimu;39531071]It's the belief that the current power structure aids you in some form. It's usually applied to the proletariat who support capitalism, but it can also refer to other classes, and is always tied to some form of internalized oppression.
For instance, many women support "Men's Rights" groups or anti-feminist organizations because they possess false consciousness. They don't recognize that feminism will actually uplift their power within society, mostly because they possess internalized misogyny. In America, this often happens within the Republican party. Small-town Republicans support the party, without realizing that many GOP initiatives will actually promote big business and stifle small-town economies.[/QUOTE]
geez I don't know man, I kind of like how I get to choose what profession I'll take on in a capitalist society as opposed to being told what profession to work, where to do it, and for how long under a communist society
that definitely seems like a benefit to capitalism
no matter what numbers you use, wages have fallen in relationship to wealth in the system.
[QUOTE=laserguided;39531222]Because education, science and medicine were all doing better in the USSR than they were in Russia, mainly because of lack of guaranteed wage for every sector and the potential to make more money in another field when it comes to capitalism and its stupid class system.[/QUOTE]
no they werent
the USSR actively espoused bullshit medical thinking
they thought that women didn't need painkillers because pain from childbirth was a social construct
[QUOTE=Sobotnik;39531261]so he was just doing a lot of thinking without actually going out to put his theories to the test?[/QUOTE]
no he was doing a lot of revolting without actually really coming up with a cohesive ideology.
that's why there are no "bakuninists", he created a fairly vague ideology of anarcho-collectivism.
[QUOTE=Sobotnik;39531269]no they werent
the USSR actively espoused bullshit medical thinking
they thought that women didn't need painkillers because pain from childbirth was a social construct[/QUOTE]
What does the USSR have to do with the thoery that science does better under communism?
[QUOTE=yawmwen;39531259]again that's a drop in relative wealth.[/QUOTE]
[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moving_the_goalposts[/url]
[QUOTE=Sobotnik;39531293][url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moving_the_goalposts[/url][/QUOTE]
I like how you're bringing up this kind of shit when it has well been known you do the same kind of shit all the fucking time. Take a look at the gun debate thread awhile ago.
[QUOTE=yawmwen;39531274]no he was doing a lot of revolting without actually really coming up with a cohesive ideology.
that's why there are no "bakuninists", he created a fairly vague ideology of anarcho-collectivism.[/QUOTE]
so how would i go about doing things that were based on a scientific way of human nature
[editline]9th February 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=laserguided;39531289]What does the USSR have to do with the thoery that science does better under communism?[/QUOTE]
because the USSR was the only communist state for about 30 years
[editline]9th February 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=laserguided;39531299]I like how you're bringing up this kind of shit when it has well been known you do the same kind of shit all the fucking time. Take a look at the gun debate thread awhile ago.[/QUOTE]
[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tu_quoque[/url]
[QUOTE=Sobotnik;39531303]so how would i go about doing things that were based on a scientific way of human nature
[editline]9th February 2013[/editline]
because the USSR was the only communist state for about 30 years[/QUOTE]
So? AFAIK you're trying to use the USSR's policies against my theory. Which is pretty stupid, degrades your credibility.
[QUOTE=Reimu;39531234][url]http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.2044-8309.1994.tb01008.x/abstract[/url]
[url]http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.2307/3791837?uid=3739808&uid=2&uid=4&uid=3739256&sid=21101658932121[/url]
Note that those are both psychological - not philosophical - studies.
It's highly prevalent within feminism and race through internalized misogyny and internalized racism. It's the inherent reason [i]why[/i] so many women refuse to support feminism - because they possess false consciousness.[/QUOTE]
since i can't access either of those properly i'm going to go with the null hypothesis which is that it is pseudoscience
"but it's psychology!" isn't really a high bar, it's a field rife with ideological axes being ground and general academic laziness.
[editline]9th February 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=yawmwen;39531259]again that's a drop in relative wealth.[/QUOTE]
what
if i'm earning X amount of dollars and the person who previously earned 2X dollars now earns 3X dollars that hardly makes me worse off. since we're talking real wages my purchasing power has stayed the same by definition so there's a net utility increase
[QUOTE=Sobotnik;39531293][url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moving_the_goalposts[/url][/QUOTE]
thanks for posting an irrelevant link.
[QUOTE=laserguided;39531316]So? AFAIK you're trying to use the USSR's policies against my theory. Which is pretty stupid, degrades your credibility.[/QUOTE]
what is your "theory" ?
[QUOTE=Sobotnik;39531351]what is your "theory" ?[/QUOTE]
I guess you can't read either.
[QUOTE=yawmwen;39531343]thanks for posting an irrelevant link.[/QUOTE]
i showed you a graph of wages increasing and you conclude its a drop
does 2 + 2 = 5???
[QUOTE=Sobotnik;39531356]i showed you a graph of wages increasing and you conclude its a drop
does 2 + 2 = 5???[/QUOTE]
I want to know the where the graph originates.
[QUOTE=laserguided;39531353]I guess you can't read either.[/QUOTE]
no how would i actually go testing the theory that science does better under communism?
that's an untestable theory
[editline]9th February 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=laserguided;39531361]I want to know the credibility of the graph and its direct sources.[/QUOTE]
the united states census bureau
it says it right on the picture
here's a link to the census bureau
[url]http://www.census.gov[/url]
[QUOTE=Sobotnik;39531364]no how would i actually go testing the theory that science does better under communism?
that's an untestable theory[/QUOTE]
Because it makes sense, you wouldn't have as big of a gap between dying fields such as biology and medicine (here, that is the case).
[editline]9th February 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=Sobotnik;39531364]no how would i actually go testing the theory that science does better under communism?
that's an untestable theory
[editline]9th February 2013[/editline]
the united states census bureau
it says it right on the picture
here's a link to the census bureau
[url]http://www.census.gov[/url][/QUOTE]
Where does it originate though? And why should I take it as a credible second source?
They are doing so to ally themselves with a Left Wing Party coalition.
Nothing to see here.
[QUOTE=Sobotnik;39531356]i showed you a graph of wages increasing and you conclude its a drop
does 2 + 2 = 5???[/QUOTE]
because the wages are dropping as a proportion of wealth in the system.
[QUOTE=laserguided;39531391][B]Because it makes sense,[/B] you wouldn't have as big of a gap between dying fields such as biology and medicine (here, that is the case).[/QUOTE]You do understand that just going "Because it makes sense" is not support for your argument at all, correct? It's circular reasoning and not evidence. "Why is it right?" "Because it makes sense." "Why does it make sense?" "Because it is right." "Why is it right?" "Because it makes sense." etc.
[QUOTE=Milkdairy;39530032]The Hammer and sickle is a marxist symbol.[/QUOTE]
It's just one of many Marxist symbols. There are loads of Red movements that doesn't have the hammer and sickle. Reinventing yourself isn't really a bad idea.
Well as long as they keep their original intentions unchanged and their goals clear, it's all good.
[editline]9th February 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=redhaven;39531471]It's just one of many Marxist symbols. There are loads of Red movements that doesn't have the hammer and sickle. Reinventing yourself isn't really a bad idea.[/QUOTE]
Thiiiissss
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