Netanyahu: Israel's government will fall if settlement freeze continues - Polidicks

[QUOTE=BurnEmDown;23775152]You just don't get it do you? They can't make peace, they'll lose their job way faster than the deal can be signed, and then they won't be in a position to sign the deal. Abbas has to try direct peace talks if he wants the Israeli government to have any chance of agreeing. Although, if he makes a "generous peace offer" indirectly as he allegedly did, the Israeli government might also be able to accept it without backlash.[/QUOTE] You're making a lot of generalised claims here. how do you know Netanyahu will lose his job? What peace offer can he make? Israel needs to fucking come to the table and view Abbas as an equal. Abbas cannot fucking do this shit on his own, he's no the fucking problem here.

[QUOTE=Warhol;23782810]You're making a lot of generalised claims here. how do you know Netanyahu will lose his job?[/QUOTE] I'm not 100% sure but as an Israeli citizen who is interested and knows enough about Israeli politics I'm pretty damn sure that this is what's going to happen. It's up to the left parties actually to save Netanyahu, because if the extreme right parties drop out the left can fill the void with him so that he can sign the peace deal, however, they are way too proud to join under him in a coalition. Again - politicians, what can you do? [quote]What peace offer can he make? Israel needs to fucking come to the table and view Abbas as an equal. Abbas cannot fucking do this shit on his own, he's no the fucking problem here.[/QUOTE] Israel wants to come to the table, the direct-peace-talks table, where the right-wing parties can actually see the progress by making some concessions and in return some of their wishes will be fulfilled as well. Abbas has made some very welcomed concessions, like agreeing to let Israel keep the most important places in East Jerusalem, and forsaking the "Palestinian right of return" into Israel proper, however, the right-wing parties care more about the West Bank and the settlements than East Jerusalem, where most of their voters are. They don't want to risk losing all their votes, and they believe that making concessions without direct talks is too risky.

[QUOTE=BurnEmDown;23783557]I'm not 100% sure but as an Israeli citizen who is interested and knows enough about Israeli politics I'm pretty damn sure that this is what's going to happen. It's up to the left parties actually to save Netanyahu, because if the extreme right parties drop out the left can fill the void with him so that he can sign the peace deal, however, they are way too proud to join under him in a coalition. Again - politicians, what can you do?[/quote] Netanyahu isn't really the most fucking liberal person out there. Again, politicians are fucking up peace. That was my original fucking point. pay attention. [quote]Israel wants to come to the table, the direct-peace-talks table, where the right-wing parties can actually see the progress by making some concessions and in return some of their wishes will be fulfilled as well.[/quote] EVERY single fucking time Israel comes "open" to the table about peace, they always present some bullshit peace offer and then whine when the Palestinians take it for what it is, an insult. The last offer with Clinton leading was a flat out fucking insult. The right-wing isn't going to get Israel anywhere. You can't have conservative Zionists leading peace talks, especially in the position Israel is in and their history. [quote]Abbas has made some very welcomed concessions, like agreeing to let Israel keep the most important places in East Jerusalem, and forsaking the "Palestinian right of return" into Israel proper, however, the right-wing parties care more about the West Bank and the settlements than East Jerusalem, where most of their voters are. They don't want to risk losing all their votes, and they believe that making concessions without direct talks is too risky.[/QUOTE] Again, you're delving into politics over peace. do you NOT see how crazy this is? [editline]09:01PM[/editline] As long as Right-wing Israelis lead Israel, there will be no peace. The Left wing can at least understand that oppressing people USUALLY pisses them off.

I'm not saying what I believe here or what I think should be done, I'm saying what the politicians believe. I'm all for peace, and I think that even if Netanyahu doesn't want peace (which is kind of stupid to think so), his ego won't let him pass the opportunity to be "the PM that brought peace to the conflict" together with Abbas. The right-wing in Israel is actually the liberal side. If we look at the "American" political compass: [IMG]http://www.politicalcompass.org/images/bothaxes.gif[/IMG] Then Israel's political compass is actually more of a line from the top-left corner to the bottom-right corner. As in, the more to the right you are, the more liberal you are too, but that is only usually, there are exceptions (my friend is extremely liberal, yet is more leftist than I am, for example). Once again, everything I've said earlier on this subject is how the politicians see it, not how I see it. I would be more than glad if Netanyahu made some outright concessions ASAP without direct peace talks, like declaring that most settlements in the West Bank will be cleared in a few months if a peace treaty will be accepted, or declare an aid program to help the to-be-created Palestinian state economically, however, I also realize the impossibility of this happening soon, and would like to know why won't Abbas simply give direct peace talks a chance.

[QUOTE=BurnEmDown;23785395] and would like to know why won't Abbas simply give direct peace talks a chance.[/QUOTE] Because he's trying to pressure Israel into not expanding illegal settlements. However, he is now after [quote]Barack Obama has threatened to downgrade Washington's relationship with the Palestinian Authority unless it agrees to join direct peace talks with Israel within weeks.[/quote] [quote]"Obama will regard any rejection of his proposal to move to direct talks as absolutely unacceptable," the letter read. "Such rejection will have consequences, in the form of a loss of trust in President Abbas and the Palestinian side. There will also be other effects on US-Palestinian relations." [/quote] See how harsh they are with the PA for not pursuing direct peace talks (They do proxy talks) even after all what Israel has done to the PA. It's sickening because President Pussy would never do that to Israel. [url]http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/usa/7921248/President-Barack-Obama-delivers-warning-to-Abbas-on-direct-talks.html[/url] [url]http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/palestinianauthority/7917350/Mahmoud-Abbas-preparing-to-hold-direct-talks-with-Israel-say-diplomats.html[/url]

[QUOTE=starpluck;23785579]Because he's trying to pressure Israel into not expanding illegal settlements. However, he is now after See how harsh they are with the PA for not pursuing direct peace talks (They do proxy talks) even after all what Israel has done to the PA. It's sickening because President Pussy would never do that to Israel. [URL]http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/usa/7921248/President-Barack-Obama-delivers-warning-to-Abbas-on-direct-talks.html[/URL] [URL]http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/palestinianauthority/7917350/Mahmoud-Abbas-preparing-to-hold-direct-talks-with-Israel-say-diplomats.html[/URL][/QUOTE] Starpluck why did you send me this: [img]http://dl.dropbox.com/u/5168294/uh.png/[/img]

lol I thought you'd get that I was joking

[QUOTE=BurnEmDown;23785395]would like to know why won't Abbas simply give direct peace talks a chance.[/QUOTE] did I NOT post a quote from him? [editline]10:00PM[/editline] He calls me a filthy jew all the time, he's just playing around.

[QUOTE=Warhol;23785888]did I NOT post a quote from him?[/quote] Well basically what I'm saying is that Netanyahu can't just promise pre-1967 borders unless it's in a signed peace treaty because then he'll commit political suicide and won't be able to start the peace talks. [quote]He calls me a filthy jew all the time, he's just playing around.[/QUOTE] What? Edit: Oh about starpluck, nevermind.

Again, this is not Abbas' fucking problem, it's Israels.

Well to me it seems like it's his problem, what's with everyone agreeing that direct peace talks must start soon and only him disagreeing.

what use is peace talks if it's going to end up him being daemonised and Israel, like every time before, putting dominance over Palestine. Of course Israel wants direct peace talks, it's the easier outlet to get what they want.