Congressman wants to curb the Military Surplus program with police agencies. - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Used Car Salesman;45722228]I'm totally on board with reigning in the "free military-grade weaponry for every cop" program, but it's a little too late to simply close the feeding trough. Every department that wants gear has already acquired plenty of it. Every cop has an AR-15 in the trunk and every hick town with more than 2,500 people has their own SWAT team complete with an armored vehicle to ride around in. The only way to change the situation is to actively take it away...and that is MUCH harder to do.[/QUOTE] Uhm, no it isn't. The PD's are composed of right-wing nutjobs who scream when someone tries to take their guns away.

[QUOTE=Itsjustguy;45738597]There is a massive difference between a few for the state police and having local police forces have APCs. Yes, every police force has a military purpose vehicle BUT in American local police ( cities with pop. of ~9000 ) can have these by making a request to protect their annual pumpkin festivals from terrorists.[/QUOTE] This is exactly the kind of stupid shit that people who don't live in the US/don't have any first-hand knowledge of American police and how they actually operate would say.

[QUOTE=Apache249;45739793]This is exactly the kind of stupid shit that people who don't live in the US/don't have any first-hand knowledge of American police and how they actually operate would say.[/QUOTE] He just doesn't have any context.

[QUOTE=Apache249;45739793]This is exactly the kind of stupid shit that people who don't live in the US/don't have any first-hand knowledge of American police and how they actually operate would say.[/QUOTE] There is a problem in the system already if you have a town of ~8500 have a PD which has a APC and a militarized police force. There is absolutely no requirement for them to have that kind of a armament. All i see in your post is a tool in the military industrial complex.

[QUOTE=Itsjustguy;45739959]There is a problem in the system already if you have a town of ~8500 have a PD which has a APC and a militarized police force. There is absolutely no requirement for them to have that kind of a armament. All i see in your post is a tool in the military industrial complex.[/QUOTE] "Militarized police force" aka a SWAT team with members drawn from normal units if a situation arises and an APC also if a situation calls for it.

[QUOTE=Itsjustguy;45739959]There is a problem in the system already if you have a town of ~8500 have a PD which has a APC and a militarized police force. There is absolutely no requirement for them to have that kind of a armament. All i see in your post is a tool in the military industrial complex.[/QUOTE] Buying a used APC so that you can approach a building without being killed by gunfire from inside isn't really a military industrial complex deal. It is just cheaper to buy an old APC than to armor plate a van.

[QUOTE=GunFox;45740217]Buying a used APC so that you can approach a building without being killed by gunfire from inside isn't really a military industrial complex deal. It is just cheaper to buy an old APC than to armor plate a van.[/QUOTE] The City of Dornville's argument to getting that APC and the gear was "to protect from terrorism...such as the annual pumpkin festival." Most of those damn gear grabs are not legitimate. A farce of the system.

[QUOTE=Itsjustguy;45740340]The City of Dornville's argument to getting that APC and the gear was "to protect from terrorism...such as the annual pumpkin festival." Most of those damn gear grabs are not legitimate. A farce of the system.[/QUOTE] [img]http://imageshack.com/a/img743/9821/hUeGEt.jpg[/img] Oh god now they are using it to rob tractor trailers on the freeway! THE APC HAS TURNED THEM INTO HIGHWAYMEN! They wait for you to get bogged down in the ice and snow and then pounce. [I]Bastards![/I]

If an APC is required ( Not talking about SWAT VANs ) then there is a bigger problem within the city. You're trying to tell me that gearing police up in very over-intimidating gear, weaponry and vehicles are not going to impact how we look at law enforcement and how willing we are to help them ? [video=youtube;ZXqbLzHd_oo]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXqbLzHd_oo[/video] An innocent elderly woman’s home was raided by SWAT when she was suspected of using the internet to trash-talk and post threats toward the local police. In response, gun-wielding assailants breached her doors and windows in a violent search for electronic evidence. The alleged “specific threats” were posted in a discussion on the topix.com website. One of the posts declared: “Cops beware! I’m proud of my country but I hate police of any kind. I have explosives… Made in America. Evansville will feel my pain.” In response, police packed their own guns and explosives and headed out to raid the owner of the IP address from which the posts had been made. That address belonged to the Milan family. Louise Milan, 68, and her granddaughter were marched in front of neighbors in handcuffs. (Source: YouTube) Louise Milan, 68, and her daughter were marched in front of neighbors in handcuffs. (Source: YouTube) Police confiscated Stephanie’s cell phone and laptop to see if they was related to the internet threats. They weren’t. In fact, it was determined that no one in the Milan household had been involved. The Milan family was wrongly targeted because their wireless internet signal had been had been discreetly used by an unauthorized remote user. A neighbor, Derrick Murray, had noticed that the Milans had not password-protected their wireless router, and accessed it without permission via his smartphone and used it to browse the internet from his parents’ house. He was later arrested by the FBI and plead guilty to related charges of using forbidden speech. [editline]19th August 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=GunFox;45740462][img]http://imageshack.com/a/img743/9821/hUeGEt.jpg[/img] Oh god now they are using it to rob tractor trailers on the freeway! THE APC HAS TURNED THEM INTO HIGHWAYMEN! They wait for you to get bogged down in the ice and snow and then pounce. [I]Bastards![/I][/QUOTE] There is a reason for tow services. You know to TOW stuff. They have a job also you know.

That incident was because of bad intel. It had nothing to do with how the SWAT officers were dressed or what vehicle dropped them off. From what they were told, they were stepping into a high risk situation, for which they outfitted appropriately. Yeah, someone fucked up, but it wasn't them. It wasn't their call. It was whomever did the investigating and then authorized the raid. [editline]19th August 2014[/editline] Also you keep saying things like "gearing police up in very over-intimidating gear, weaponry and vehicles." This isn't happening. You make it sound like officers on patrol are cruising around in armored vehicles and wearing full tactical garb. They're not. SWAT teams are for high-risk situations ONLY.

[QUOTE=Apache249;45740651]That incident was because of bad intel. It had nothing to do with how the SWAT officers were dressed or what vehicle dropped them off. From what they were told, they were stepping into a high risk situation, for which they outfitted appropriately. Yeah, someone fucked up, but it wasn't them. It wasn't their call. It was whomever did the investigating and then authorized the raid. [editline]19th August 2014[/editline] Also you keep saying things like "gearing police up in very over-intimidating gear, weaponry and vehicles." This isn't happening. You make it sound like officers on patrol are cruising around in armored vehicles and wearing full tactical garb. They're not. SWAT teams are for high-risk situations ONLY.[/QUOTE] "The era of George W. Bush also witnessed the rapid escalation of the militarization of domestic drug law enforcement. By the end of Bush's term, there were about 40,000 paramilitary-style SWAT raids on Americans every year – mostly for nonviolent drug law offenses, often misdemeanors. "

[QUOTE=Used Car Salesman;45722228]Every cop has an AR-15 in the trunk and every hick town with more than 2,500 people has their own SWAT team complete with an armored vehicle to ride around in.[/QUOTE] Now you're just exaggerating. My town has 2500 people in it and our police force has no more than a dozen officers, most of them being part-time, with some you'll never see outside of festivities. The heaviest truck they have is a 28 year old [url=http://images57.fotki.com/v496/photos/4/49373/202653/rnpca4407-vi.jpg]Chevy Blazer[/url], which for all we know did come from military surplus, since we're still retiring old [url=http://www.military-today.com/trucks/cucv_l2.jpg]CUCV's[/url] from the 80's.

[QUOTE=Itsjustguy;45738652]Uhm, no it isn't. The PD's are composed of right-wing nutjobs who scream when someone tries to take their guns away.[/QUOTE] Once again, you can have Armed Police and the 2nd Amendment, or Unarmed Police but No Guns. [QUOTE=Itsjustguy;45740525]If an APC is required ( Not talking about SWAT VANs ) then there is a bigger problem within the city. You're trying to tell me that gearing police up in very over-intimidating gear, weaponry and vehicles are not going to impact how we look at law enforcement and how willing we are to help them?[/QUOTE] APC's and SWAT Vans serve the exact same purpose, there is virtually no difference other than some APC's having more utility (a perk that comes with being a tracked vehicle). [QUOTE=Itsjustguy;45740525]The Milan family was wrongly targeted because their wireless internet signal had been had been discreetly used by an unauthorized remote user. A neighbor, Derrick Murray, had noticed that the Milans had not password-protected their wireless router, and accessed it without permission via his smartphone and used it to browse the internet from his parents’ house. He was later arrested by the FBI and plead guilty to related charges of using forbidden speech.[/QUOTE] If someone claims they're barricaded with arms and explosives and threatens to kill people, what kind of fucking response do you expect? If anything, that's what SWAT was [I]created[/I] for. The only danger here is a technologically inept justice system that doesn't understand how IP's work and sends people out after the wrong person. [editline]19th August 2014[/editline] automerge fail?

For the love of god, itsjustguy, can you stop pulling shit out of your ass? Its always easier to talk shit when you're not the ones facing these issues. Have you seen fucking Brazil? Or China? This is nothing compared to them. I bet even your own country's police has more than just simple police cars

[QUOTE=Ignhelper;45745796]For the love of god, itsjustguy, can you stop pulling shit out of your ass? Its always easier to talk shit when you're not the ones facing these issues. Have you seen fucking Brazil? Or China? This is nothing compared to them. I bet even your own country's police has more than just simple police cars[/QUOTE] We have, we just don't give them to anyone who wants to have a massive APC for no real purpose. Also what does Brazil have to do with this ? We're talking about America where violent crime is suppost to be at a low.

[QUOTE=Itsjustguy;45745873]We have, we just don't give them to anyone who wants to have a massive APC for no real purpose. Also what does Brazil have to do with this ? We're talking about America where violent crime is suppost to be at a low.[/QUOTE] Massive? It isn't actually much larger than their normal van. It is just much heavier due to the armor. In some cases the MRAPS are smaller.