I was expecting this to be related to the mass faking of science papers in China.
Haven't the Chinese been constantly launching 'secret' attacks to steal shit via cybersecurity for the past few years?
Including the fact they've ripped off as much shit as possible.
Most western governments are even scared shitless to have HUAWEI devices in their offices because of this.
[QUOTE]"The Chinese utilize a large, well-organized network to facilitate collection of sensitive information and export-controlled technology from U.S. defense sources. Many of the organizations composing China's military-industrial complex have both military and civilian research and development functions. This network of government-affiliated companies and research institutes often enables the PLA to access sensitive and dual-use technologies or knowledgeable experts under the guise of civilian research and development. The enterprises and institutes accomplish this through technology conferences and symposia, legitimate contracts and joint commercial ventures, partnerships with foreign firms, and joint development of specific technologies. In the case of key national security technologies,
controlled equipment, and other materials not readily obtainable through commercial means or academia, China has utilized its intelligence services and employed other illicit approaches that involve violations of U.S. laws and export controls"[/QUOTE]
source (quoted from some pentagon report): [url]http://killerapps.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2013/05/09/the_technology_china_wants_in_order_to_catch_up_with_western_militaries[/url]
I love how people in western countries will call this "discrimination" or "racism", but when the Chinese do the same thing they won't say shit.
[QUOTE=theevilldeadII;42420525]at this point it's most likely China will get to Mars/Explore the Solar/Star System before USA[/QUOTE]
No different than if the USA does it in my eyes. As long as humankind does it, humankind does it.
its not NASA's fault... Congress barred them from working with China years ago, which is why china had to put up their own tiny can of a space station instead of working with the ISS, personally i think china has stolen enough space teck to cobble togather a space program on the cheap and thats wrong, but its about time we should start working to bring them into the space program, the only collaberation they have really had with NASA was in the design of their docking system, which is really so that if something did go wrong and we were in a position to help, we could
[editline]5th October 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=theevilldeadII;42420525]at this point it's most likely China will get to Mars/Explore the Solar/Star System before USA[/QUOTE]
no.....
to go anywhere besides LEO, you need to get a heavy launching vehicle, chances are they are going to use a copy of the Proton which isn't nearly as heavy as you need for a lunar launch. basically they can't copy any more of Russia's shit to get to the moon because nobody has a heavy launch vehicle big enough to get to the moon, which means they'll have to develop their own heavy booster which isn't impossible but it defiantly will take considerably more time compared to their previous designs which were copies of Russian launch systems. also their space station is tiny, very very tiny, its barely larger than their copy of the soyuz, at 15m^3 in volume. to compair, the salyut 1 had an internal volume of 99m^3, and skylab had 319m^3 of pressurized volume, to put it more into perspective, the tiangong station could fit easily into the shuttle's cargo bay with its solar arrays retracted
[QUOTE=Sableye;42426227]its not NASA's fault... Congress barred them from working with China years ago, which is why china had to put up their own tiny can of a space station instead of working with the ISS, personally i think china has stolen enough space teck to cobble togather a space program on the cheap and thats wrong, but its about time we should start working to bring them into the space program, the only collaberation they have really had with NASA was in the design of their docking system, which is really so that if something did go wrong and we were in a position to help, we could
[editline]5th October 2013[/editline]
no.....
to go anywhere besides LEO, you need to get a heavy launching vehicle, chances are they are going to use a copy of the Proton which isn't nearly as heavy as you need for a lunar launch. basically they can't copy any more of Russia's shit to get to the moon because nobody has a heavy launch vehicle big enough to get to the moon, which means they'll have to develop their own heavy booster which isn't impossible but it defiantly will take considerably more time compared to their previous designs which were copies of Russian launch systems. also their space station is tiny, very very tiny, its barely larger than their copy of the soyuz, at 15m^3 in volume. to compair, the salyut 1 had an internal volume of 99m^3, and skylab had 319m^3 of pressurized volume, to put it more into perspective, the tiangong station could fit easily into the shuttle's cargo bay with its solar arrays retracted[/QUOTE]
I just meant in terms of them giving a shit or more of a shit than USA not all the Science stuff
[QUOTE=Swebonny;42413588]I think it's pretty shameful that a country like the US in the year 2013, has laws that literally prohibits individuals with certain nationality from entering NASA building.
What's more preposterous is the fact that even scientists already hired by US institutions aren't allowed in either.
What the "national security" deal even?
Conferences exist, so that researchers can present and share their work to other researchers. Something is quite wrong when other scientists are prohibited from an otherwise open conference.
Guess this is what happens when politicians gets their gross fingers into things.[/QUOTE]
Sleepers, spies, have you ever heard of them?
[QUOTE=cucumber;42426376]Sleepers, spies, have you ever heard of them?[/QUOTE]
But spies can come in all nationalities - banning the Chinese to stop industrial espionage is like trying to stop water leaking out of a sieve.
Now, the Chinese will just turn another nationality that isn't blacklisted to get what they want and then this whole affair becomes pointless and nothing more than an awkward diplomatic incident.
[QUOTE=theevilldeadII;42426319]I just meant in terms of them giving a shit or more of a shit than USA not all the Science stuff[/QUOTE]
the problem is they are running on the same formula that worked 60 years ago, pure nationalism, we've seen with both our program and the russian program, that fades and fades hard when there is a demographic change to china's population, currently their economy is in transition from exporter to consumer and the goverment is talking about cutting back on stimulus and a possible slow down. we'll see at some point somebody in power will come along and axe their space program budget when things get bad
[QUOTE=snookypookums;42426475]But spies can come in all nationalities - banning the Chinese to stop industrial espionage is like trying to stop water leaking out of a sieve.[/QUOTE]
'Please report your findings to us, your home country/ethnicity' is a little easier to sell than 'Please report your findings to us, a chief rival to your home country and to whom you owe no allegiance'.
As for 'NASA is just science', I suggest anyone who thinks this do a little reading into NASA's history. Every American spy satellite and every GPS satellite (remember GPS was developed by the military) up there has NASA's involvement to some degree. Many civilian technologies even have strong military or industrial applications that we're loathe to give out freely. There's a lot of sensitive information that they want to keep hidden, and given China's efforts in hacking and spying, I'm not surprised they want to protect it.
[QUOTE=snookypookums;42426475]But spies can come in all nationalities - banning the Chinese to stop industrial espionage is like trying to stop water leaking out of a sieve.
Now, the Chinese will just turn another nationality that isn't blacklisted to get what they want and then this whole affair becomes pointless and nothing more than an awkward diplomatic incident.[/QUOTE]
other nationalities dont hack into government servers, steal top secret project files, and after a month make f-35 look alike.
Imagine a world where instead of going against each other, we worked together and accomplish many things.
[QUOTE=cucumber;42427059]other nationalities dont hack into government servers, steal top secret project files, and after a month make f-35 look alike.[/QUOTE]
[URL="http://www.hanford.gov/files.cfm/frenchesp.pdf"]France has been doing it.[/URL]
[URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Soviet_and_Russian_espionage_in_the_United_States#Post-Soviet_period"]The Russians were well known for doing industrial espionage.[/URL]
The Chinese might be more blatant about it, but other countries are also not above suspicion. Now with the rise of Iran's cyber warfare division (which was involved in an attack on US Navy computers) as well as the Saudi Aramco computers.
One cannot single out any nationality for this, considering hown many others are also doing it.
Sorry, you need to Log In to post a reply to this thread.