[QUOTE=melonmonkey;29767062]The date christmas is on is a government holiday, but the actual rituals surrounding it are religious.[/QUOTE]
The rituals are optional, the holiday isn't
what the fuck is wrong with my country
need to fix our shit
and by fix our shit I mean remove all these dumbasses from congress who don't know anything about what they're talking about
our navy needs more armor plating, and we need to get the old farts out of the house
[QUOTE=Habsburg;29762787]Enforcing the law isn't your job congressmen.[/QUOTE]
Especially since Don't Ask Don't Tell was repealed I believe.
I love how everyone throws their hands in the air and says "We should castrate conservatives because Im a liberal and im the only one that should breed". That makes you seem worse than the traditionalist christian majority conservatives that we have now.
I am a conservative, and I recognize humans to be free regardless of their religion, their color, size and sexual preference.
[QUOTE=Zeke129;29767087]The rituals are optional, the holiday isn't[/QUOTE]
But it's not "christmas" that is a holiday for the goverment, it is the date. The rituals make it christmas. Just as the rituals of marriage make it marriage. Which is why I stand by making marriage a variety of civil union for religious people.
[QUOTE=melonmonkey;29768498]But it's not "christmas" that is a holiday for the goverment, it is the date. The rituals make it christmas. Just as the rituals of marriage make it marriage. Which is why I stand by making marriage a variety of civil union for religious people.[/QUOTE]
um no, the rituals of marriage do not make it marriage
unless by "rituals" you mean legal proceedings
also, there are churches that are ok with same sex marriage, so this entire point is moot
[QUOTE=Lazor;29768560]um no, the rituals of marriage do not make it marriage
unless by "rituals" you mean legal proceedings
also, there are churches that are ok with same sex marriage, so this entire point is moot[/QUOTE]
What? The rituals do make it marriage, it was established by religion in the first place as a ritual to bond people. It had no actual meaning other than emotional and moral meaning, because there were no legally binding consequences.
The government is so tied in with religion that is uses marriage as an official status symbol, but I don't believe it should.
Also, the bible of christianity, which is where marriage is commonly accepted to come from, states that marriage is between a man and a woman. If they want to have that rule in their religion, they have every right to do so AS LONG AS IT HOLDS NO LEGAL VALUE.
[QUOTE=deathstarboot;29763375]Also marriage is not a religious institution.[/QUOTE]
I think it would be better to say Marriage is not a right which the Christian church alone has the ability to bestow. Marriage existed long before the birth of christ and it will exist long after the last Christian dies.
1 step forward 2 steps back
:smith:
[QUOTE=melonmonkey;29768616]What? The rituals do make it marriage, it was established by religion in the first place as a ritual to bond people.[/QUOTE]
The rituals don't make it a marriage, the paperwork you sign after the fact does.
[QUOTE=melonmonkey;29768616]What? The rituals do make it marriage, it was established by religion in the first place as a ritual to bond people. It had no actual meaning other than emotional and moral meaning, because there were no legally binding consequences.
The government is so tied in with religion that is uses marriage as an official status symbol, but I don't believe it should.
Also, the bible of christianity, which is where marriage is commonly accepted to come from, states that marriage is between a man and a woman. If they want to have that rule in their religion, they have every right to do so AS LONG AS IT HOLDS NO LEGAL VALUE.[/QUOTE]
um. marriage is a concept that existed before the bible
there's evidence of it in numerous cultures like the aztecs, greeks, etc
in fact, it was usually used for the purpose of producing true biological heirs, nothing more
regardless, it has become a civil institution, and thus the church should have no power or control over it.
I never got the concept of marriage, it seems like an empty sentiment, you're still together. The only thing that makes sense is on a legal standpoint, security. In that case though it makes marriage seem less of bonding closer and more 'when we eventually split up I don't want you getting my shit'.
[QUOTE=Richard Simmons;29767234]I am a conservative, and I recognize humans to be free regardless of their religion, their color, size and sexual preference.[/QUOTE]
why are you calling yourself a conservative then
conservatives don't support anyone who isn't rich, white, straight, christian, and male
[QUOTE=Lazor;29768760]um. marriage is a concept that existed before the bible
there's evidence of it in numerous cultures like the aztecs, greeks, etc
in fact, it was usually used for the purpose of producing true biological heirs, nothing more
regardless, it has become a civil institution, and thus the church should have no power or control over it.[/QUOTE]
You aren't understanding in the slightest what I'm trying to do. Marriage, the word and the rituals, are religious. And that's fine, let them have it. But civil unions should be the norm, and not require religious rituals, and marriage should be a subset of civil union.
[editline]12th May 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Zeke129;29768736]The rituals don't make it a marriage, the paperwork you sign after the fact does.[/QUOTE]
I don't understand what you're getting at. The liability waivers you sign to go on a carnival ride aren't the ride. How is this the same thing? Marriage is a ritualistic method of bonding people with origins in religion.
[QUOTE=melonmonkey;29769029]You aren't understanding in the slightest what I'm trying to do. Marriage, the word and the rituals, are religious. And that's fine, let them have it. But civil unions should be the norm, and not require religious rituals, and marriage should be a subset of civil union.
[editline]12th May 2011[/editline]
I don't understand what you're getting at. The liability waivers you sign to go on a carnival ride aren't the ride. How is this the same thing? Marriage is a ritualistic method of bonding people with origins in religion.[/QUOTE]
Marriage is about property.
[QUOTE=JDK721;29768987]why are you calling yourself a conservative then
conservatives don't support anyone who isn't rich, white, straight, christian, and male[/QUOTE]
this is why we can't get anything nice
[quote]The lawmakers asked Mabus to direct the Navy to defend the Constitution, adding that individuals should not be allowed to pick and choose the laws they will follow.[/quote]
then why do christians get to do this seeing as their laws come from god who they revere so much
hypocrisy
[QUOTE=Richard Simmons;29767234]I love how everyone throws their hands in the air and says "We should castrate conservatives because Im a liberal and im the only one that should breed". That makes you seem worse than the traditionalist christian majority conservatives that we have now.
I am a conservative, and I recognize humans to be free regardless of their religion, their color, size and sexual preference.[/QUOTE]
only like 2 people said that.
[QUOTE=The Baconator;29792350]only like 2 people said that.[/QUOTE]
There is more people that say something along those terms than what you perceive.
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