Scopes Weeps: Evolution Still Struggling in Public Schools - Polidicks

I learned alot more in the internet than at school about this stuff

[QUOTE=bravehat;27726545]What possible good points can be drawn from a creationist argument. No really, I've pulled up a chair and have a cup of chicken soup, I'm ready for a lengthy discussion so please, inform me as to which points of a creationist argument are actually remotely worthwhile.[/QUOTE] I would also like answers to this.

[QUOTE=bravehat;27726545]What possible good points can be drawn from a creationist argument. No really, I've pulled up a chair and have a cup of chicken soup, I'm ready for a lengthy discussion so please, inform me as to which points of a creationist argument are actually remotely worthwhile.[/QUOTE] Chicken? I'm thinking tomato is a better soup for intellectual discussion.

[QUOTE=Mingebox;27727607]Chicken? I'm thinking tomato is a better soup for intellectual discussion.[/QUOTE] Well now it's custard creams, moving up in the world man :v:

[QUOTE=bravehat;27726545] which points of a creationist argument are actually remotely worthwhile.[/QUOTE] Other than being too thick to understand evolution, none.

[QUOTE=Jewsus;27721074]Most public schools teach evolution and don't even touch creationism. It's just a relative few that get all the attention.[/QUOTE] Not only that, religion classes at my school seem to be either dead or near dead, as no one ever goes to them.

[QUOTE=Rubs10;27722059]I go to a private Catholic school and they teach us about evolution. Of course, the teacher probably believes in "God guided" evolution, but that's fine, as long as they aren't teaching some skeptical, creationism endorsing shit.[/QUOTE] It's like a physics teacher "believing" in gravity, but who actually thinks it's little angels pulling things together.

[QUOTE=POLOPOZOZO;27720824]Wow looking back on it all I'm so happy to have had teachers throughout all my years in school who weren't fucking idiots SO HAPPY.[/QUOTE] Even my religion teacher doesn't believe in creationism. :razz:

[QUOTE=Robber;27728614]Even my religion teacher doesn't believe in creationism. :razz:[/QUOTE] Why would religion teachers be more likely to believe in creationism?

[QUOTE=Ond kaja;27728838]Why would religion teachers be more likely to believe in creationism?[/QUOTE] Because Creationism is a religious belief. Religious people are more likely to believe in it than those who are not religious or ar more scientifically literate.

[QUOTE=bravehat;27728879]Because Creationism is a religious belief. Religious people are more likely to believe in it than those who are not religious or ar more scientifically literate.[/QUOTE] Religion teachers =/= religious people

They usually are though. It helps in some ways but makes them biased as hell when it comes to teaching about other religions or when somebody answers a question in a way which doesn't fit their own religious beliefs. The RE teachers are the only very clearly religious teachers at my school, apart from an old physics teacher who has a bible at the front of the room and when showing up deep field photographs taught us about how old the galaxies must be if we're seeing them from so far away with some quick calculations, but then said that it was a test of faith because the universe [B]obviously[/B] wasn't that old. :rolleyes: I feel sorry for the young kids who get him for general 'science' which includes biology.

this is pretty fucking pathetic

[QUOTE=Xolo;27720759]If they're not teaching it properly they should be fired.[/QUOTE] Then shouldn't they [I]all[/I] be fired? Most teachers I've ever had the chance to meet had no real qualifications to speak of (bringing into question whether they're reliable at what they're teaching) and all but a few were extremely incompetent people.

I say we teach both sides of the controversy, the myth and the scientific fact with so much evidence for it that there's no (scientific) debate at all whether it's correct. Religion seemed cool when we didn't know things, now it's blocking us from knowing things and making people dumb and ends up controlling people. It's not even funny anymore, the boy scouts of America is practically mormon-owned and discriminates against atheists and homosexuals, but still get public funding and ability to use schools and other public areas to do things.

At my High School, evolution is taught day 1 in essentially, in my first year biology class it became hilarious. Five people dropped it, all of them bible-thumpers. It's actually kind of sad, I live in a very, very religious community, there is, no joke, 1 church per 1000 people, and our population is 30000. Yet our school is relatively intelligent. Apparently,however, my best friend sat beside a girl who, during the Ancient history class, any time a date was mentioned Pre-4000 BC, would go "That's a lie", throughout the whole year. There are a lot of students like that, and our teachers, I swear, all of them are Atheists. It's such a bizarre contrast.

[QUOTE=Zeos;27731473]At my High School, evolution is taught day 1 in essentially, in my first year biology class it became hilarious. Five people dropped it, all of them bible-thumpers. It's actually kind of sad, I live in a very, very religious community, there is, no joke, 1 church per 1000 people, and our population is 30000. Yet our school is relatively intelligent. Apparently,however, my best friend sat beside a girl who, during the Ancient history class, any time a date was mentioned Pre-4000 BC, would go "That's a lie", throughout the whole year.[/QUOTE] Haha, most of my classmates did the exact same thing.

To be completely honest, I like to mix the ideas of both evolution and creationsim into a big pot and find out which makes most sense. For example, it makes sense that it took thousands of years to build the intricate designs of body systems themselves, but it seems somewhat strange to say that these intricate systems were created by accident. Perhaps I am missing a part of the big picture? If anything, I think that theres some association between intelligent design and evolution, we're just too busy arguing over who's right and who's wrong to even test for the existence of such correlation.

[QUOTE=Ond kaja;27728973]Religion teachers =/= religious people[/QUOTE] Teachers = people Religious + people = religious people Religious + teachers = religious teachers Religious teachers = religious people Lets break that down ---- Religious = A Teachers = X People = Y X=Y A=A AX=AY Dude, don't even make me pull out the dunce cap.

My school bribes you to go to an after school "club" called Bible Club with pizza.

[QUOTE=joes33431;27732479]To be completely honest, I like to mix the ideas of both evolution and creationsim into a big pot and find out which makes most sense. For example, it makes sense that it took thousands of years to build the intricate designs of body systems themselves, but it seems somewhat strange to say that these intricate systems were created by accident. Perhaps I am missing a part of the big picture? If anything, I think that theres some association between intelligent design and evolution, we're just too busy arguing over who's right and who's wrong to even test for the existence of such correlation.[/QUOTE] Evolution doesn't explain where life came from, it explains how life developed from single celled organisms to where it is now. Evolution says it's taken billions of years to get to where life is now, which is pretty quick. Creationism says that God created life. No explaining anything. No explaining how, what God is or why species change over time, etc. But the biggest nail in the coffin for creationism is that it's not scientific. In three ways. One, it doesn't advance our understanding of how the world works. Two, it's unfalsifiable. There's no way to say God didn't create life as the statement is so ambiguous, the goalposts can keep being moved even up to the point of saying that God created the Universe, thus everything, thus life. Three, it's supernatural. Evolution is easily falsified, though. You could do so in quite a few ways. For instance, if you found a modern animal (such as a rabbit or domesticated dog) back in the same geographic time as dinosaurs. Creationism has been rebranded as 'intelligent design', which isn't scientific for not only the same reasons as creationism, but it doesn't name the creator, even though the founders of the idea believe it to be God. It was also created as a response to not being able to teach Creationism in schools. In short, you can't test if Creationism is correct, you can test that Evolution is correct. You can't disprove Creationism, you can disprove Evolution. A sign that Evolution is correct is that there's no evidence to disprove it, and all evidence to prove it.

I went to a highly religious private school and to a religion/sport/music focused boarding school. BOTH OF WHICH taught us about evolution and scientific method as truths and religion as legends to be interpreted as how to explain life to people who lived uninformed lives back then and tales with morals. I'm surrounded by geniuses it seems. A teacher should always be able to defend and explain his own subjects relevance. As above guy states. It was pretty much how both my schools coped with it without raging conflicts in the halls. Incredibly, there were not a single person who was in insane denial about each subject. We were a very inquisitive bunch. Now that i think of them, i'm sad that i will never be among such a reasonable bunch of people. When people succeed in taking two subjects that most people insist must conflict and contradict and create harmony between them life just gets fucking amazingly simple and careless. The bible actually tells not of ONE creational myth, but two... Food for thought if you care.

Creationism isn't scientifically based or backed, so why should it be taught in science class?

[QUOTE=that1dude24;27737021]Creationism isn't scientifically based or backed, so why should it be taught in science class?[/QUOTE] because apparently if you just teach evolution then you're not giving those christian kids a chance to self delude.

[QUOTE=HeadshotDCS;27732534]Teachers = people Religious + people = religious people Religious + teachers = religious teachers Religious teachers = religious people Lets break that down ---- Religious = A Teachers = X People = Y X=Y A=A AX=AY Dude, don't even make me pull out the dunce cap.[/QUOTE] I see a fallacy here. You claim both religious + teachers AND religious * teachers equals religious teachers. I'll give you an F.

[QUOTE=Jookia;27731184]I say we teach both sides of the controversy, the myth and the scientific fact with so much evidence for it that there's no (scientific) debate at all whether it's correct. [/QUOTE] No, because that lends validity to an invalid idea.

burn creationism out. We can't have religious bullshit in our schools

You all do realize that the Scopes Incident was a huge scam right?

[QUOTE=joes33431;27732479]To be completely honest, I like to mix the ideas of both evolution and creationsim into a big pot and find out which makes most sense. For example, it makes sense that it took thousands of years to build the intricate designs of body systems themselves, but it seems somewhat strange to say that these intricate systems were created by accident. Perhaps I am missing a part of the big picture? If anything, I think that theres some association between intelligent design and evolution, we're just too busy arguing over who's right and who's wrong to even test for the existence of such correlation.[/QUOTE] It wasn't by "accident", it was simple trial and error.

[QUOTE=Zeke129;27737667]No, because that lends validity to an invalid idea.[/QUOTE] That's my exact point.