• Minnesota Mom Hit With $1.5 Million Fine for Downloading 24 Songs
    122 replies, posted
[QUOTE=ChestyMcGee;25859097]How would that benefit them at all? OH NO a $1 fine for stealing - I am put off pirating forever! Like I said, this woman is a scapegoat. They have fucked her over in an effort to scare people.[/QUOTE] It would benefit them by them getting what they "lost" back [editline]4th November 2010[/editline] [QUOTE=ZekeTwo;25859114]Shouldn't it be blown [i]into[/i] oblivion? Being blown out of oblivion would be a really good thing assuming the explosion didn't hurt you that badly [editline]4th November 2010[/editline] That's not how justice works.[/QUOTE] overall I think it'd be better to be dead than in oblivion
[QUOTE=ZekeTwo;25859114]Shouldn't it be blown [i]into[/i] oblivion? Being blown out of oblivion would be a really good thing assuming the explosion didn't hurt you that badly[/quote] Thank you for correcting my grammar. [quote]That's not how justice works.[/QUOTE] Well no shit. I didn't say it's a good thing what's happened - I'm just stating what has happened. [editline]4th November 2010[/editline] [QUOTE=Tetracycline;25859123]It would benefit them by them getting what they "lost" back[/QUOTE] You're not understanding at all. This woman has been taught a lesson. A lot of stupid people will see this and think "oh shit, [b]pirating is just not worth it[/b]."
Would this fall under "cruel and unusual"? After all, "stealing" things that don't physically exist shouldn't equal a million dollars
Just to clarify, I'm not defending the court ruling, I'm simply explaining why it is that this has come about.
[QUOTE=ChestyMcGee;25859158] Well no shit. I didn't say it's a good thing what's happened - I'm just stating what has happened. [/QUOTE] No you're not, you're injecting your opinion into it. The article already explained what happened.
[QUOTE=ChestyMcGee;25859158]Thank you for correcting my grammar. Well no shit. I didn't say it's a good thing what's happened - I'm just stating what has happened. [editline]4th November 2010[/editline] You're not understanding at all. This woman has been taught a lesson. A lot of stupid people will see this and think "oh shit, [b]pirating is just not worth it[/b]."[/QUOTE] teaching "lessons" is not how you should do things in justice
[QUOTE=ZekeTwo;25859188]No you're not, you're injecting your opinion into it. The article already explained what happened.[/QUOTE] It's clear what's happened and the reasons behind it. Obviously the article can only report the straightest of facts, not the fine print of the reasons behind them (however obvious they might be). [editline]4th November 2010[/editline] [QUOTE=Tetracycline;25859192]teaching "lessons" is not how you should do things in justice[/QUOTE] [b]I DIDN'T SAY I AGREE WITH IT.[/b] God damn.
[QUOTE=ZekeTwo;25859114]That's not how justice works. Facepunch is so quick to advocate "an eye for an eye", but in this thread you're advocating "1.5 million coins for 24 coins".[/QUOTE] If you own a jewelry store and you catch a guy stealing a $400 watch, you can't punish him by [b]JUST[/b] making him pay the $400. In the end, by doing so, if he continues to steal (assuming he does not ALWAYS get caught) he makes a net profit still. Still, $1.5 million for those songs is bullshit.
[QUOTE=ChestyMcGee;25859221] [b]I DIDN'T SAY I AGREE WITH IT.[/b] God damn.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=ChestyMcGee;25859012]Yes how dare they try and defend themselves from getting blown out of fucking oblivion![/QUOTE] You're still injecting your opinion, as there is absolutely no evidence that piracy hurts the music industry. ("Blows them out of oblivion" as you'd say) [editline]4th November 2010[/editline] [QUOTE=Elecbullet;25859253]If you own a jewelry store and you catch a guy stealing a $400 watch, you can't punish him by [b]JUST[/b] making him pay the $400. In the end, by doing so, if he continues to steal (assuming he does not ALWAYS get caught) he makes a net profit still.[/QUOTE] What if he is copying your jewelry
[QUOTE=ZekeTwo;25859022]Defending piracy is different than defending fair use and the free exchange of information.[/QUOTE] Why do people always use the fair use argument? Claiming fair use on something like this is pretty much using a loophole.
[QUOTE=Elecbullet;25859253]If you own a jewelry store and you catch a guy stealing a $400 watch, you can't punish him by [b]JUST[/b] making him pay the $400. In the end, by doing so, if he continues to steal (assuming he does not ALWAYS get caught) he makes a net profit still. Still, $1.5 million for those songs is bullshit.[/QUOTE] Good thing she is not selling it for profit
[QUOTE=Elecbullet;25859253]If you own a jewelry store and you catch a guy stealing a $400 watch, you can't punish him by [b]JUST[/b] making him pay the $400. In the end, by doing so, if he continues to steal (assuming he does not ALWAYS get caught) he makes a net profit still. Still, $1.5 million for those songs is bullshit.[/QUOTE] With pirating you make a loss no matter what, if you even lose a penny you lost money, you cant profit off of illegally downloading music (unless you want to sell them I guess)
[QUOTE=ZekeTwo;25859262]You're still injecting your opinion, as there is absolutely no evidence that piracy hurts the music industry.[/QUOTE] Yes I'm sure stealing does not hurt the industry one bit. [quote] ("Blows them out of oblivion" as you'd say)[/quote] Hurr totally removed my argument by picking away at a small error in speech well done.
[QUOTE=ZekeTwo;25859262]What if he is copying your jewelry[/QUOTE] This argument pisses me off. Imagine if you owned a jewelry store. Now imagine that Mr. Magorium with his wonderful duplicator machine purchases one watch, then uses his duplicator to make 1,000 copies and starts giving them for FREE right outside your store. Is it still sharing?
[QUOTE=ChestyMcGee;25859328]Yes I'm sure stealing does not hurt the industry one bit. Hurr totally removed my argument by picking away at a small error in speech well done.[/QUOTE] Technically it doesn't, they probably wouldn't have bought that music anyway He was joking
[QUOTE=Luuper;25859303]Good thing she is not selling it for profit[/QUOTE] Net value of the items The watch analogy still works if you assume he's not selling them for profit. He can say "Oh well, if I'm just going to be fined $400 for stealing if I am caught, and I'm out $400 anyway if I buy it, I might as well TRY to steal it."
[QUOTE=Elecbullet;25859350]This argument pisses me off. Imagine if you owned a jewelry store. Now imagine that Mr. Magorium with his wonderful duplicator machine purchases one watch, then uses his duplicator to make 1,000 copies and starts giving them for FREE right outside your store. Is it still sharing?[/QUOTE] holy fuck matter replicator I'm amazed, the amount of money he can make from that is immense, no need for cloning jewelry
[QUOTE=Tetracycline;25859355]He was joking[/QUOTE] I understand that, but certain jokes are meant to demean.
[QUOTE=Tetracycline;25859370]holy fuck matter replicator I'm amazed, the amount of money he can make from that is immense, no need for cloning jewelry[/QUOTE] yes I know the silliness required to make physical objects be more like digital files
[QUOTE=Elecbullet;25859292]Why do people always use the fair use argument? Claiming fair use on something like this is pretty much using a loophole.[/QUOTE] A loophole that has been established by law. [QUOTE=ChestyMcGee;25859328]Yes I'm sure stealing does not hurt the industry one bit.[/QUOTE] Nope, it doesn't. The music industry has been breaking profit records every single year. [QUOTE=Elecbullet;25859350]This argument pisses me off. Imagine if you owned a jewelry store. Now imagine that Mr. Magorium with his wonderful duplicator machine purchases one watch, then uses his duplicator to make 1,000 copies and starts giving them for FREE right outside your store. Is it still sharing?[/QUOTE] Yeah, he is. As the store owner I had better adapt to these new market conditions or I'll surely fail. Mr. Magorium is just giving my jewelry out as-is, no heart. No service. I can beat him. Perhaps I'll personalize each item of jewelry for my customers, or make it easier for them to purchase it.
I believe that whoever is getting prosecuted, if found guilty, should have to pay for the opposing lawyers fees.
[QUOTE=ZekeTwo;25859407]Nope, it doesn't. The music industry has been breaking profit records every single year.[/QUOTE] Perhaps consider all the other innumerable factors that contribute to that, like digital distribution and the sheer mass of music that is available now compared to even fifteen years ago. Now imagine if pirating didn't exist. How much higher would those profit records be if the only way to obtain licensed music was to legally pay for it?
[QUOTE=ZekeTwo;25859407]Yeah, he is. As the store owner I had better adapt to these new market conditions or I'll surely fail. Mr. Magorium is just giving my jewelry out as-is, no heart. No service. I can beat him. Perhaps I'll personalize each item of jewelry for my customers, or make it easier for them to purchase it.[/QUOTE] "Hmm lets see I can get my $400 watch for FREE or I can PERSONALIZE it a bit for ONLY $400"! Protip: It's hard to compete with free shit.
Reminds me of this: [media]http://cdn-www.cracked.com/articleimages/ob/piratebay_header.jpg[/media]
[QUOTE=ZekeTwo;25859022]Defending piracy is different than defending fair use and the free exchange of information.[/QUOTE] Copyright laws were created so that people can make money off of creative works like novels and the like and the same should apply to music. The music industry has gone a bit off the deep end in defending this and moved into greed territory, but free exchange of information is a bullshit excuse for downloading music. [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-LkWKvMCzqA[/media]
[QUOTE=JohnnyMo1;25859593]Copyright laws were created so that people can make money off of creative works like novels and the like and the same should apply to music. The music industry has gone a bit off the deep end in defending this and moved into greed territory, but free exchange of information is a bullshit excuse for downloading music. [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-LkWKvMCzqA[/media][/QUOTE] I love you Johnny, now how about those pics
[QUOTE=Elecbullet;25859640]I love you Johnny, now how about those pics[/QUOTE] Only if you pay, they are my intellectual property
they should charge her AT MOST the cost of the album the song came from, but even then it would be ludicrous.
[QUOTE=JohnnyMo1;25859593]Copyright laws were created so that people can make money off of creative works like novels and the like and the same should apply to music. The music industry has gone a bit off the deep end in defending this and moved into greed territory, but free exchange of information is a bullshit excuse for downloading music. [URL="http://www.facepunch.com/"]View YouTUBE video[/URL] [URL]http://youtube.com/watch?v=-LkWKvMCzqA[/URL] [/QUOTE] Let me get this through your head: Movies make money from people viewing them in the theaters and people buy them on Blu-Ray. Video games make money because pirated copies cannot play multiplayer servers or because fans think its something worth spending money on. Singers / Bands make their money when people go to their concerts (ticket sales) and from people buying music from places like iTunes (which even with piracy they still make tons of money). The music industry just posts projected sales loss but in reality it is far lower. If people like what they see then they are going to purchase it and money will be made.
[QUOTE=mrryanchisholm;25859687]they should charge her AT MOST the cost of the album the song came from, but even then it would be ludicrous.[/QUOTE] You people don't seem to understand what I am saying. Imagine we have a jewelry store selling $400 watches. Now imagine that it is well-known that if you are caught stealing one, you will ONLY be made to pay the price of the watch ("AT THE MOST hurr durr"). If someone goes to get a watch, and he's a good boy, he will purchase it, yes. But if the penalty for being caught is not higher than the purchase price, and there is a 100% chance you will pay if you BUY it, whereas there is only a smaller chance you will be caught, and then have to pay, if you STEAL it, there is no real benefit to buying. Therefore the less moral among the population would say "Well I might as well TRY to steal it", and there'd be no real non-moral reason not to. [editline]4th November 2010[/editline] [QUOTE=Agent_Wesker;25859713]The music industry just posts projected sales loss but in reality it is far lower. [b]If people like what they see then they are going to purchase it[/b] and money will be made.[/QUOTE] source that people actually do this, piracy-is-good.org is not a good source
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