[QUOTE=Gekkosan;28940514]Believe all you want in the "every life is worth the same" bullshit and that no one deserves to be put to death no matter what trouble and suffering they cause.[/quote]
Yeah, because no one deserves to be put to death. Also, any arguments of "oh let him rot in prison and get raped" are equally as ridiculous as the ones suggesting they be put to death.
[QUOTE=Gekkosan;28940514]but in the end you and I both know very well people will never be quite equal, and most likely brutal assaults and killings will occur forever. with or without punishment, that in some cases should be death. a punishment, not a revenge per se.[/quote]
This might've been a relatively valid statement, except for the fact that it starts off incredibly condescending "you and I both really know I'm right" and finishes with the suggestion that prison [I]should be for[/I] punishment and not active rehabilitation. That notion being entirely false, of course.
[QUOTE=Gekkosan;28940514]they (offenders of serious sort) will end up in prison. in prison they will either die or spend their rest life in there, OR they might actually get free, and whether they will learn "their mistake" or get right back in, depends solely on the inmate. Maybe some other crime/gang related shit, who knows.[/quote]
I'm not even sure what you're trying to suggest here. Are you saying we should base our laws on [I]what might happen[/I] if they end up getting out of prison legally (whether by a shortened sentence, pardon, etc.). If so, that's a horrible idea.
[QUOTE=Gekkosan;28940514]Shit don't come in different flavors, shit is just shit. you just want to give these shits more chances until they are locked up in solitary, then you call yourself the one with true morals.[/QUOTE]
This one seems like it's saying two things at once. First, that context or circumstance doesn't matter in these kinds of cases, hence the "shit doesn't come in different flavors, shit is shit". Second, it seems to follow that up with the notion that if you oppose the death penalty or want prison to be for rehabilitation, then you're sympathizing with the criminals, which just isn't true.
Your entire post is a broken down mess of what could be valid points, but instead resorts to appeal to emotion arguments and extreme pessimism. Please try again.
[QUOTE=Megafanx13;28944663]Yeah, because no one deserves to be put to death. Also, any arguments of "oh let him rot in prison and get raped" are equally as ridiculous as the ones suggesting they be put to death.
[/QUOTE]
I would rather a person be put to death than have to suffer their entire life in a poorly run prison, if those were the only two options. In my opinion, assisted suicide should always be an option when being given a life sentence. No person can claim to have a moral high-ground if they disagree.
oh god.
time to get the brain juice.
[QUOTE=Megafanx13;28944663][B]MY[/B] entire post is a broken down mess of what could be valid points, but instead resorts to appeal to emotion arguments and extreme pessimism. Please try again.[/QUOTE]
Fixed. :smug:
[QUOTE=Motherfucker;28945955]Penis. :smug:[/QUOTE]
Yeah, I can edit quotes too. :smug:
Johnny i'm actually interested in how you would do with these rapists.
And please people stop with these depressing news they just make you feel like shit.
This thread is terribly ironic.
[QUOTE=Motherfucker;28945955]Fixed. :smug:[/QUOTE]
Clearly you must have no actual argument. Looks like you lose.
Oh Jesus, I read the numbers backwards in the thread title.
8 year old gang-raped by 11 men :barf:
[QUOTE=SNNS-SEAN;28952176]Oh Jesus, I read the numbers backwards in the thread title.
8 year old gang-raped by 11 men :barf:[/QUOTE]
that would of been much...much worse.
I think that JhonnyMo's notion that killing a murderer is just as bad as killing the victim is ludicrous. The murderer is the one that killed an innocent victim. It was due to his actions that the whole ordeal began. The one that kills the murderer wouldn't have killed him if the murderer didn't kill the victim. The murderer would have killed the victim either way. However, killing the perpetrator is rarely the only option, and when it isn't, it's almost never the preferable one. These people need to be at least attempted to be rehabilitated, and rehabilitation sometimes needs punishment (but hardly a life sentence or the death sentence). People like this often need to fear society before respecting it. Much like disobedient dogs need to fear their master before respecting them.
EDIT: Also aiding to eliminate the conditions that contributed to these people's actions.
Pissing in a sea of piss. :smith:
[QUOTE=Megafanx13;28944663]Yeah, because no one deserves to be put to death. Also, any arguments of "oh let him rot in prison and get raped" are equally as ridiculous as the ones suggesting they be put to death.
This might've been a relatively valid statement, except for the fact that it starts off incredibly condescending "you and I both really know I'm right" and finishes with the suggestion that prison [I]should be for[/I] punishment and not active rehabilitation. That notion being entirely false, of course.
I'm not even sure what you're trying to suggest here. Are you saying we should base our laws on [I]what might happen[/I] if they end up getting out of prison legally (whether by a shortened sentence, pardon, etc.). If so, that's a horrible idea.
This one seems like it's saying two things at once. First, that context or circumstance doesn't matter in these kinds of cases, hence the "shit doesn't come in different flavors, shit is shit". Second, it seems to follow that up with the notion that if you oppose the death penalty or want prison to be for rehabilitation, then you're sympathizing with the criminals, which just isn't true.
Your entire post is a broken down mess of what could be valid points, but instead resorts to appeal to emotion arguments and extreme pessimism. Please try again.[/QUOTE]
Aren't you the answer man..
[editline]3rd April 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Bobv2;28959195]I think that JhonnyMo's notion that killing a murderer is just as bad as killing the victim is ludicrous. The murderer is the one that killed an innocent victim. It was due to his actions that the whole ordeal began. The one that kills the murderer wouldn't have killed him if the murderer didn't kill the victim. The murderer would have killed the victim either way. However, killing the perpetrator is rarely the only option, and when it isn't, it's almost never the preferable one. These people need to be at least attempted to be rehabilitated, and rehabilitation sometimes needs punishment (but hardly a life sentence or the death sentence). People like this often need to fear society before respecting it. Much like disobedient dogs need to fear their master before respecting them.
EDIT: Also aiding to eliminate the conditions that contributed to these people's actions.[/QUOTE]
Though this post basically is the truth, except for the fact that you can't quite eliminate all of the conditions that attributes to people killing people, like; "man to man" aggressions often about betrayal.. you know the deal.
Also attempting to rehab is good, if not mandatory. But on the other hand it all comes down to the inmates involvement in it. (Also, as a last resort if ever; religiousness, it can save these people, but it can't save people from killing people, neither can the death sentence or a sentence of 40 years)
Some don't feel remorse after all the horrible shit they've done, and the prison punishment only makes them more angry. Pretty sure this can be evaluated by a psychiatrist or something
And when and if the inmate then comes to his senses, feels the fire burning inside him, he needs love all the more, as in religious-type deal, only at this point it is likely they are sitting on deathrow already, or serving a life sentence, or getting out the next week, depending on the severity of the crime(s) he got convicted for..
Anyway..
In some cases, the perpetrator shouldn't even feel remorse, like when killing his daughters rapers in revenge, but yet he is sentenced for a looong time "because killing is all the same", which is wrong, because the man did what had to be done.
Brutally assaulting innocent children should NOT happen, and depending on the convicts behavior and all that, they are facing a sentence from 10 years up to death. Not to mention this case is about a gang-rape, some were probably more involved than others, some were probably the main-players in it, etc, etc. Also would like to add that neither should betrayal happen or other lesser crimes, but that's what people do, despite the consequences, which they are more or less aware of.
I'm just saying that the same law, for example about a murder, doesn't fit in two different type of killings, like robbery plus blindfolded hands tied execution, as opposed to a man-to-man fight till death, lacking for a better word..
I know that we got the murder degrees, but do they cover all of the cases accordingly? Probably not.
Megafanx13 feel free to check this post for flaws, idiocies and spelling mistakes :colbert:
[QUOTE=Gekkosan;28959508]
In some cases, the perpetrator shouldn't even feel remorse, like when killing his daughters rapers in revenge, but yet he is sentenced for a looong time "because killing is all the same", which is wrong, because the man did what had to be done.
[/QUOTE]
What do you mean by this? If a man kills another man, he should be fucking convicted, regardless of his motives.
[QUOTE=I Broke The Sun!;28959882]What do you mean by this? If a man kills another man, he should be fucking convicted, regardless of his motives.[/QUOTE]
Of course. If a man kills another man, he proves to be capable of such an act, and thus should be sent to prison for, about a 4 years.
Should be long enough time to evaluate if the person is actually dangerous or just a strong individual who stands up for himself and for what he holds the most dearest, like everyone should.
It also doesn't mean the man would otherwise kill, given this example case is an act on impulse, vengeance for his daugters murder or so.
[QUOTE=Gekkosan;28959508]In some cases, the perpetrator shouldn't even feel remorse, like when killing his daughters rapers in revenge, but yet he is sentenced for a looong time "because killing is all the same", which is wrong, because the man did what had to be done.
[/QUOTE]
Killing is all the same. It's a crime. It is illegal to kill. Revenge and vigilantism aren't the key to balancing situations. No matter how much you HATE that person you should never kill that person. Death penalty should only be given to mass murderers.
[QUOTE=Gekkosan;28959508]Though this post basically is the truth, except for the fact that you can't quite eliminate all of the conditions that attributes to people killing people, like; "man to man" aggressions often about betrayal.. you know the deal.
Also attempting to rehab is good, if not mandatory. But on the other hand it all comes down to the inmates involvement in it. (Also, as a last resort if ever; religiousness, it can save these people, but it can't save people from killing people, neither can the death sentence or a sentence of 40 years)
Some don't feel remorse after all the horrible shit they've done, and the prison punishment only makes them more angry. Pretty sure this can be evaluated by a psychiatrist or something
And when and if the inmate then comes to his senses, feels the fire burning inside him, he needs love all the more, as in religious-type deal, only at this point it is likely they are sitting on deathrow already, or serving a life sentence, or getting out the next week, depending on the severity of the crime(s) he got convicted for..
Anyway..
In some cases, the perpetrator shouldn't even feel remorse, like when killing his daughters rapers in revenge, but yet he is sentenced for a looong time "because killing is all the same", which is wrong, because the man did what had to be done.
Brutally assaulting innocent children should NOT happen, and depending on the convicts behavior and all that, they are facing a sentence from 10 years up to death. Not to mention this case is about a gang-rape, some were probably more involved than others, some were probably the main-players in it, etc, etc. Also would like to add that neither should betrayal happen or other lesser crimes, but that's what people do, despite the consequences, which they are more or less aware of.
I'm just saying that the same law, for example about a murder, doesn't fit in two different type of killings, like robbery plus blindfolded hands tied execution, as opposed to a man-to-man fight till death, lacking for a better word..
I know that we got the murder degrees, but do they cover all of the cases accordingly? Probably not.
Megafanx13 feel free to check this post for flaws, idiocies and spelling mistakes :colbert:[/QUOTE]
Hey now, don't peg me as someone I'm not. If I see flaws in logic or reasoning I'll point them out, but don't think I'm going to start calling you out for spelling mistakes. I didn't in my first response, and I won't now. In response to what you're saying, I would agree that circumstance is very important when it comes to crimes like this, and it's true that "not all murders are the same", however that doesn't make someone taking the law into their own hands no matter what they do, legal. It's difficult to make laws based on situations like "the guy did what had to be done", because that can be interpreted to mean something else very easily. That and I wouldn't advocate or support being a vigilante and getting revenge on people by killing them.
[QUOTE=Bobv2;28959195]I think that JhonnyMo's notion that killing a murderer is just as bad as killing the victim is ludicrous. The murderer is the one that killed an innocent victim. It was due to his actions that the whole ordeal began.[/QUOTE]
Right here you run into an 8-year-old's "he started it" argument. The fact that they started doing bad shit doesn't justify your doing something equally wrong in retaliation.
Title is misleading. She wasn't raped by 8 men.
She was raped by 8 sorry sacks of shit.
The last.. roughly 100 posts were just two people having a pissing contest.
Is it bad that when I saw the title I thought this was gonna be an OFWGKTA thread?
[QUOTE=JohnnyMo1;28883020]Not on Facepunch, sociopathic internet vigilante central!
[editline]29th March 2011[/editline]
Uh, I would much rather be raped than killed.[/QUOTE]
:foxnews: [b]This just in, facepunch moderator JohnnyMo1 comes out of the closet as an socialistic satanist homosexual terrorist![/b] :foxnews:
This thread has been so horrifically derailed by trolls, pity.
[QUOTE=Megafanx13;28944663]
Your entire post is a broken down mess of what could be valid points, but instead resorts to appeal to emotion arguments and extreme pessimism. Please try again.[/QUOTE]
this is a good post. i applaud you.
[editline]4th April 2011[/editline]
and gekkosan stop rating people you disagree with dumb you fucktard
[QUOTE=LoLWaT?;28878146]It's a matter of personal opinion really.
I find wasting money on keeping people like these locked up until they rot away is just as equally stupid.[/QUOTE]
But its the worst punishment possible. Ive been to jail, and that was bad enough, life in prison is your whole life being stuck in those walls, and the small fenced in outside area, living with a bunch of other criminals, which really do not make good company for the rest of your days. I think we should be willing to spend the money to keep them locked up and miserable so that they have plenty of time to regret and reflect.
I say, eye for an eye..
Let's throw these men into the rapist/pedophile units..
