• Apple pissed about NSA backdoors in iOS, prepared to take steps to remove the "Malicious hacker's" s
    66 replies, posted
[QUOTE=elixwhitetail;43394462]I'm explicitly stating that Apple's shit being ultra-locked-down is partially marketing fluff, because at the end of the day the iPhone is a computer and computers do exactly what humans tell them to do, including execute exploits that take advantage of vulnerabilities in their code. The NSA has the ability (according to recent leaks) to exploit basically any major piece of hardware and software, through software and hardware means. They have hired some of the smartest people on the planet, their [I] entire job[/I] is doing this on anything that can yield useful information, and they have almost unlimited resources. Apple might be able to harden their devices now that they're publicly aware that the NSA is hostile to their products, but I don't think for a minute that they were hard at work behind the scenes facilitating this attack vector for the NSA. Those guys don't need Apple to help them.[/QUOTE] Another important thing to note, if Apple were assisting them it would not be an exploit. There would be some hidden backdoor in the software. The NSA would not have to hire the best hackers on the planet to get into things if this was the case.
[QUOTE=Itauske Roken;43394955]yes considering that it practically automatically claims you to be a criminal if it was done during childhood and no crime was ever committed during then.[/QUOTE] What? No one claims that. What are you talking about?
Weren't apple tracking people's locations a while back?
[QUOTE=itisjuly;43395011]What? No one claims that. What are you talking about?[/QUOTE] Americans have some major issue with the idea of finger prints of innocent people being stored. I have no idea what their issue actually is as no one has managed to explain it to me. Good luck.
"it's just a pr move to make them look good apple is still shit guys lolololo xDDDD" I dislike apple just as much as the other guy, and regardless how this is "just a pr move" or not it's still beneficial for you. the consumer.
[QUOTE=Scot;43395055]Weren't apple tracking people's locations a while back?[/QUOTE] They were just populating the Wifi Hotspot list, and it was caching it to the phone. They added a feature so it would turn off shortly after the whole controversy happened.
[QUOTE=Itauske Roken;43394815]it never leaves police records and you can be identified by your finger prints even if your face has changed in some way or another.[/QUOTE] wow well it's a shame touch id doesn't actually send your fingerprint to apple
[QUOTE=Itauske Roken;43394955]yes considering that it practically automatically claims you to be a criminal if it was done during childhood and no crime was ever committed during then.[/QUOTE] Uhhh...them having a tiny bit of biometric information on you doesn't implicate you in a crime (that never occurred). The only time it will be a problem is if you actually commit a crime and they check and found prints.
[QUOTE=Scot;43395055]Weren't apple tracking people's locations a while back?[/QUOTE] what major tech company doesn't do that
Damage Control, usual shit. Otoh, think about the cash!
Apple should use some of their dosh on fucking with the NSA.
Is the link broken for anybody else?
Well hopefully Apple's power can help put a serious dent in the NSA cyberterrorists. But we need more swords to duel with that many-armed beast.
[QUOTE=Jsm;43394990]Another important thing to note, if Apple were assisting them it would not be an exploit. There would be some hidden backdoor in the software. The NSA would not have to hire the best hackers on the planet to get into things if this was the case.[/QUOTE] Well, let's think about this for a moment. Let's abandon reality for just one moment and put on our wild conspiracy hats. If we assume that Apple [I]was[/I] working with the NSA (again, we've got our conspiracy hats on and are ignoring evidence), I see no reason why Apple would write a function called secretNSAiPhoneBackdoorTopSecretDoNotLeak(); that gave the NSA its access. They would work with the NSA to develop subtle, tiny, but devastatingly effective flaws in the code, things where nobody would look or notice. i.e., exactly what we see here: Exploits Apple can get mad about and claim ignorance of. The NSA's basically been accused of (via Snowden leaks/other leak methods) doing more or less exactly this with RSA and the other tampering they've allegedly done with crypto standards. Jsm, the rest of this is also addressed to you, but also, [QUOTE=RenegadeCop;43395177]I really want to believe they actually care, but there's really nothing supporting it.[/QUOTE] Apple is publicly hostile to the US govt intelligence community's efforts to get their tentacles into it and its products and services. More than any other major US consumer-oriented tech company (except for RIM/Blackberry, but we [I]know[/I] they've already capitulated to the Indian government, and they're a Canadian company that's dying anyway), Apple has built its entire reputation on being the best choice for consumers both in usability and in privacy and security. For like a decade, Apple's marketing made tons of hay by showing how Macs were more secure and private, while Windows was a leaky pile of shit with more viruses than lines of code. If Apple is seen as being basically a puppet for NSA data collection activities, this [B]destroys[/B] Apple's credibility in the consumer marketplace, and now they're selling expensive spyware-ridden luxury toys that already have a historical problem of being the domain of hipsters. The same goes for Google, as far as not wanting to seem like they're selling their customers out to the NSA and the massive damage this would cause them. And already has with the previous leaks.
[QUOTE=Skarr;43394373]What's the point of even putting out a message like this if it's blatantly obvious that nothing is going to change? Are there seriously people who will believe it?[/QUOTE] Why not? There are clearly people that believe it's worth paying $500-1000 for a piece of glass. [editline]2nd January 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=elixwhitetail;43396010]Well, let's think about this for a moment. Let's abandon reality for just one moment and put on our wild conspiracy hats. If we assume that Apple [I]was[/I] working with the NSA (again, we've got our conspiracy hats on and are ignoring evidence), I see no reason why Apple would write a function called secretNSAiPhoneBackdoorTopSecretDoNotLeak(); that gave the NSA its access. They would work with the NSA to develop subtle, tiny, but devastatingly effective flaws in the code, things where nobody would look or notice. i.e., exactly what we see here: Exploits Apple can get mad about and claim ignorance of. The NSA's basically been accused of (via Snowden leaks/other leak methods) doing more or less exactly this with RSA and the other tampering they've allegedly done with crypto standards. Jsm, the rest of this is also addressed to you, but also, Apple is publicly hostile to the US govt intelligence community's efforts to get their tentacles into it and its products and services. More than any other major US consumer-oriented tech company (except for RIM/Blackberry, but we [I]know[/I] they've already capitulated to the Indian government, and they're a Canadian company that's dying anyway), Apple has built its entire reputation on being the best choice for consumers both in usability and in privacy and security. For like a decade, Apple's marketing made tons of hay by showing how Macs were more secure and private, while Windows was a leaky pile of shit with more viruses than lines of code. If Apple is seen as being basically a puppet for NSA data collection activities, this [B]destroys[/B] Apple's credibility in the consumer marketplace, and now they're selling expensive spyware-ridden luxury toys that already have a historical problem of being the domain of hipsters. The same goes for Google, as far as not wanting to seem like they're selling their customers out to the NSA and the massive damage this would cause them. And already has with the previous leaks.[/QUOTE] It's not explicitly spyware if they're just taking advantage of flaws in the OEM software.
[QUOTE=Zero-Point;43396024]It's not explicitly spyware if they're just taking advantage of flaws in the OEM software.[/QUOTE] It's still something for them to be greatly concerned about. Vulnerabilities are still vulnerabilities and can be exploited by anyone, no matter who finds them. Suddenly learning that your software is full of security holes would be a real shocker for any company.
[QUOTE=catbarf;43396283]It's still something for them to be greatly concerned about. Vulnerabilities are still vulnerabilities and can be exploited by anyone, no matter who finds them. Suddenly learning that your software is full of security holes would be a real shocker for any company.[/QUOTE] I never said it was a good thing, it's just inaccurate to compare a software hole to malicious software installed by a 3rd party. Calling it spyware suggests that the NSA is going around behind Apple's back and installing malicious code into their products.
Hopefully if more companies publicly denounce and work against the NSA like this it'll eventually encourage the American people to get off their asses and do something about the state of this country too.
[QUOTE=Killuah;43394970]Everyone who ever took a flight to or throught the US post 9/11 gave his prints to them.[/QUOTE] Get owned, travelers.
[QUOTE=Zero-Point;43396421]I never said it was a good thing, it's just inaccurate to compare a software hole to malicious software installed by a 3rd party. Calling it spyware suggests that the NSA is going around behind Apple's back and installing malicious code into their products.[/QUOTE] Don't forget to read the beginning of that sentence. [QUOTE=elixwhitetail;43396010]If Apple is seen as being basically a puppet for NSA data collection activities, this [B]destroys[/B] Apple's credibility in the consumer marketplace, and now they're selling expensive spyware-ridden luxury toys that already have a historical problem of being the domain of hipsters.[/QUOTE] That outcome is predicated on Apple being perceived to have grabbed its asscheeks and spread for the NSA when the boys in suits came knocking at the door. There's a fundamental difference between Apple complying with the NSA, and Apple having its shit exploited by the most powerful spy services on the planet. I'm not giving a single bit of credibility to the conspiracy theory that Apple engineered these exploits to give the NSA what they want while giving Apple plausible deniability. I was talking about a hypothetical situation in which Apple did cooperate, they wouldn't make the exploits obvious. I don't feel that it's at all in Apple's best interest to cooperate with the NSA in maiming its reputation, and the NSA doesn't need Apple's cooperation besides. They're not required to play fair, only quietly.
Every fucking thread where an organization that people don't like does something positive, it's "damage control." People were saying Pope Francis was just being nice as "damage control" or a "PR campaign" to distract from molestation scandals. It's unlikely that Apple knew about this until things were leaked. Just because you don't like Apple doesn't mean you can say all the good stuff they do is PR and all the bad stuff they do is bad. Stop being so biased and cynical and consider that people and groups of people can do both good things and bad things.
There's really nothing right now to suggest that Apple did cooperate with the NSA in making this happen. [url=http://www.spiegel.de/static/happ/netzwelt/2014/na/v1/pub/img/Handy/S3222_DROPOUTJEEP.jpg]The leak as it currently stands[/url] says that the NSA needs 'close access' to an iPhone to install the exploit, and it's been suggested that they may [url=http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/the-nsa-uses-powerful-toolbox-in-effort-to-spy-on-global-networks-a-940969-3.html]intercept some iPhone shipments[/url] in order to achieve this. The slides are from 2008 though.
[QUOTE=Scot;43395055]Weren't apple tracking people's locations a while back?[/QUOTE] All the phones you find today will track your location, along with a list of seen WiFi aps, etc. Google even provide [URL="https://maps.google.com/locationhistory/b/0/"]web access[/URL] to the data Android records.
Even though this about mac os's I think every OS should take steps to combat the nsa. Hell even antivirus companies should start fighting back.
"Prepares" but won't do shit. Cheap ass Apple, they don't care :D
If only those HB Gary emails didn't get leaked saying otherwise, over a year ago..
[QUOTE=itisjuly;43394319]Sounds like BS to me. How could NSA implant malicious software into iOS without apple? Isn't that shit very closed down?[/QUOTE] Yeah iOS does not get viruses!!!1
Apple is actually just as insecure as other os's, if not more due to most apple users not using an antivirus program.
[QUOTE=TheDecryptor;43421364]All the phones you find today will track your location, along with a list of seen WiFi aps, etc. Google even provide [URL="https://maps.google.com/locationhistory/b/0/"]web access[/URL] to the data Android records.[/QUOTE] Good think I keep GPS and cellular data turned off until absolutely necessary. Google's gonna be wrecked by the EU commision if they can still gather location data using those 2 methods, when they're supposedly set to being off.
[QUOTE=O Cheerios O;43395379]Apple should use some of their dosh on fucking with the NSA.[/QUOTE] Introduce a "bug" that causes device identities to occasionally be garbled or missing the NSA will assume Apple's quality is going down the shitter and stop bothering
Sorry, you need to Log In to post a reply to this thread.