Three-year-old girl beheaded with meat cleaver in 'random' attack - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Talishmar;50026885]There's also a difference between supporting death penalty and venting due to being upset.[/QUOTE] Well, [I]I guess[/I], but when you say stuff like, "Let 'em HANG" or "Feed 'em to the woodchipper" then what do you expect people to believe you think?

[QUOTE=Sleeves;50026409]Hang them too![/QUOTE] What are you, Joseph Stalin?

[QUOTE=Katska;50027047]Well, [I]I guess[/I], but when you say stuff like, "Let 'em HANG" or "Feed 'em to the woodchipper" then what do you expect people to believe you think?[/QUOTE] Well, I won't disagree that people react far too much to awful people in a way that is over the top. I'm quite tired of family making sure they vent about how truly disgusting people like this are as if it isn't obvious. Everyone's a politician trying to craft their image so that others don't accidentally confuse themselves for supporting people like this. It's stupid. I've always been interested in why people like this exist. I like figuring out why. Statistically speaking, people like this exist simply because they're already pushed to the fringes of society. There are definitely exceptions to the rule, but when you view the statistics for the mentally ill criminals, it's super depressing. Here are the factors I'm talking about: 1.) They're generally homeless or at most have terrible housing 2.) They can't find stable work because of their deteriorating health 3.) Because of their socioeconomic factors they're generally going to get mixed up with drugs or crime 4.) They are much more likely to find themselves in a jail cell instead of a hospital bed 5.) There's a severe lack of mental healthcare, and in that there is also a severe lack of [I]proper[/I] mental healthcare. I've heard horror stories of homeopathic therapist loonies or apathetic quick-to-prescribe-medication shrinks. 6.) The mentally ill are far more likely to be stigmatized by society and even by themselves because of the terrible perception of the mentally ill in media. Schizophrenia is quite often described as "psycho-stabby horror flick sickness" which is stupid. So then you end up in a situation where they either hate themselves or hate society. Now, here's the problem: 1.) This guy has already made it past the point of no return. I say "no return" specifically because we don't have the psychological resources to put this guy back together. Without attempting to appeal to emotion, [I]he beheaded a three-year old[/I]. He's fucked up. Even if he makes it back into society, society will never accept him, and there's no guarantee that he'll be fine. 2.) It's illegal to study him. It sucks, but that's the case. 3.) There's no guarantee that he's empathetic or cares about getting better. The Columbine shooters weren't the bullied outcasts as urban legends describe - they merely wanted to be famous. They wanted to outdo the bombers of the past with an actual bomb, but found it easier to take weapons for their massacre instead. 4.) People want to rehabilitate him after the fact, but most people don't give two shits about everything before the fact. People care enough to want this guy to stay alive, generally as a means to stroke their own ego and say they are principled, but they're not principled enough to donate to mental health charities, or study to be a psychologist, or really do anything. It's the activist equivalent to shopping at Whole Foods and revel in their purchases of free-range poultry. They want the story, but don't actually care about the reality or the consequences. It's veiled selfishness disguised as altruism, or a mindless appeal to human rights. [I]They just want this guy to live, maaaan.[/I] Let's not question whether it's fair to say that all humans are truly equal - let's not evaluate life on a qualitative basis but instead a quantitative basis. We aren't objects. We're people, and some of us really fucking suck and want to watch the world burn, and no matter how much you want them to get better they simply won't. They don't want to. For me, it's not about making them an example - that doesn't work. It's not about "justice", because it's not. It's about simply not caring. People like this are awful people and I don't care what happens to them. I'm not saying that with any extra venom or anything - it is what it is. The fact is, if you give a shit, you'd already be invested in making sure this stuff doesn't happen in the first place by doing anything for the state of mental health in America. Clinging on to this guy means nothing, as much as I'd love for it to be otherwise. And I really would - I love figuring out what's wrong and I'd love to fix what's broken. But I can't. And we can't - at least not for now. You don't attack the problem by pretending to ail the symptoms or blindly cling onto principles. I mean, let's say you do keep this guy alive? [I]Now what?[/I] What have you accomplished? [B]EDIT:[/B] To clear up any confusion that might ensue, I definitely mean to emphasize that I'm referring to "most" people. I think that there's rational-headed people on both sides of the argument, but there's definitely super angry violent pro-death penalty advocates, and definitely super idealized anti-death penalty advocates. I'm not suggesting that everyone in this thread fits into either of those.

heard about this from my taiwanese family members and tbh im not that surprised there has been a pretty big problem of unemployed troubled and ill adults lately, and there's not much of a government institution to help them out culturally, the parents are also unwilling to admit that their children could have any mental problems, or unwilling to accept it. shits fucked up yo

Well, who decides what justice is? People can claim justice is objective but it was established based on a subjective stance, or alternatively many subjective stances.

[QUOTE=Trebgarta;50028579]That is getting into the field of Philosophy, but at least we can all agree personal opinions are not past of collective justice in our society.[/QUOTE] On an internet forum, however, I think it's fine to discuss our thoughts. I think we can all agree that refusing to talk about something because it can't exist in our justice system is silly, and I think we can all agree that taking our justice systems wholesale without disagreement is also silly. I'm a huge contrarian when it comes to most people's justice systems because it's "justice" only in name and according to people that aren't me.

I think it's a natural feeling to want to see a child muderer/molester put to death for their crimes but not the action of a civilized society.

[QUOTE=Trebgarta;50029083]Of course we can discuss. We can discuss incest's legality exhaustively, since there is no consensus about the topic. But I believe there is a consensus on this topic, I believe we can all agree that, the affected parties on the case, should not be responsible for deciding the judgement, or the sentence.[/quote] When there are a bunch of posts above you that are completely against your point, you can't then just say, "Welp, we're all in agreement!" I don't have to really venture far onto Facebook with people I don't know (friends of friends and friends of family) to find opposition to your idea too. Lots of people are for the death penalty. [QUOTE=Trebgarta;50029083]We are of course free to argue anything anytime. One might argue that the 3 year old was "asking for it" and the man shouldnt be punished. But I think we can all disagree with that, so I can call out and say, "Why are we even discussing this" or I think we can all agree...". In theory we can discuss anything since Justice, although we try to make it objective, as you said, is subjective at its core because it is man made, but in practice, we can surpass some topics without arguing them.[/quote] "We don't have to talk about this" sounds like a cop-out to me. Plus the people that think she deserved it are probably way, way smaller than the people that think the guy deserves death. [editline]29th March 2016[/editline] Here is an honest question for you guys: what if you put this guy into rehab and, after "successful" rehab, he goes out and kills someone else? Do you just put him back to rehab again? At what point do you say "enough is enough"? And what point is it not the murderer that needs the rehab, but instead the world that needs the rehab? Why are we focusing on the output of the machine and not the input? We're the input. We cause the shitty output. If you want this shit to stop, it starts by fixing poverty, shitty families, and other things. It doesn't start with the output, working your way backwards. I feel like so many people focus on the output without ever thinking of the real deal - the really hard stuff. In comparison between focusing on one person and the entire society, people view improving the entire society as utopian thinking, and fixing the murder as magnitudes easier or worthwhile. It's not. Don't get me wrong, we can look at the murderer and totally benefit from psychological understanding. But that benefit is running your thumb across the threads and finding your way back home to [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pedro_L%C3%B3pez_(serial_killer)]broken homes[/url], [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeffrey_Dahmer]discomfort with talking about progressively worsening problems[/url], [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeffrey_Dahmer]alcoholism[/url], [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Manson]cults[/url], [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Manson]the prison system[/url], [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ed_Gein]abuse of religion[/url], and [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ed_Gein]abusive parents[/url]. That is, of course, just a few of the threads, but they all point to a general direction.

[QUOTE=Trebgarta;50029943]Well, I guess I kinda look upon some views in a condescending manner. I dont give much thought into countering the arguments of pro-death penalty people. The point was both views were stupid, not the share they were held. If he goes out of rehab and kills someone, that is a failure on rehab. Killing this man so that he never kills someone when he goes out of rehab, is like not doing anything Nuclear at all because it might be dine wrong and reault in deaths, I find. There are risks we need to take to advance our methodology and wisdom in these fields. And until we do that, failed rehabs will take place. It is not a problem that can be fixed in sbort term, or a problem that can be fixed with capital punishment. The big problems, you are entirely right. But those problems are not the problems that should surface when an ill person kills a toddler. Those problems should always be the topic, they should always be improved upon, anyway. I dont think we can fix those problems in this century, or maybe next. Meanwhile, we shouldn't sit on our asses about psychiatry either. Both can go on at the same time.[/QUOTE] No amount of psychiatry can help certain people. They are the way they are and sometimes you can't help that. I'm not for death penalty, but when you are consuming active members of the communities resources and have not learned how to be one yourself then i am all for it.

[QUOTE=Aphtonites;50026387]I think feeding him feet first into the world's slowest wood chipper is preferable[/QUOTE] What would be the purpose of that apart from some short-lived sadistic pleasure for the executioner?

So many of you turn into Saints. Acting like those of us who believe he should be killed are some horrible savages. Get off your high horses, he needs to die end of the story. Sure it'd be a short pleasure for us, but if it was my child who was beheaded, I'd think that I'd feel happier if I saw him slowly and painfully die, instead of him getting to live in a facility that I was paying for to care for him.

[QUOTE=Daddy-of-war;50030492]So many of you turn into Saints. Acting like those of us who believe he should be killed are some horrible savages. Get off your high horses, he needs to die end of the story. Sure it'd be a short pleasure for us, but if it was my child who was beheaded, I'd think that I'd feel happier if I saw him slowly and painfully die, instead of him getting to live in a facility that I was paying for to care for him.[/QUOTE] Just note that I'm not advocating for torturing them. Some people might see it as an opportunity for that, but I don't have it in me to do anything like that. [editline]29th March 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Trebgarta;50029943]Well, I guess I kinda look upon some views in a condescending manner. I dont give much thought into countering the arguments of pro-death penalty people. The point was both views were stupid, not the share they were held. If he goes out of rehab and kills someone, that is a failure on rehab. Killing this man so that he never kills someone when he goes out of rehab, is like not doing anything Nuclear at all because it might be dine wrong and reault in deaths, I find. There are risks we need to take to advance our methodology and wisdom in these fields. And until we do that, failed rehabs will take place. It is not a problem that can be fixed in sbort term, or a problem that can be fixed with capital punishment. [/QUOTE] And then what, you let them out again? At what point do you see a waste of time, resources, and willpower? At what point are you going to see your huge protection of life as futile and ironically costing of lives? Also, I'm gonna be straight up with you in that I have no idea about anything that has to do with nuclear power. But at the very least, nuclear power is something that can be scientifically validated with different approaches, different mathematical models, and ethic. It's not equivalent to just letting a murderer loose. [QUOTE=Trebgarta;50029943]The big problems, you are entirely right. But those problems are not the problems that should surface when an ill person kills a toddler. Those problems should always be the topic, they should always be improved upon, anyway. I dont think we can fix those problems in this century, or maybe next. Meanwhile, we shouldn't sit on our asses about psychiatry either. Both can go on at the same time.[/QUOTE] Sure, both should happen at the same time [I]before[/I] murders happen. Murderers are very often past the point of being able to live a normal life that contributes to society. At some point, they become far too risky and it's selfish to preserve them just because you want to preserve life.

[QUOTE=Daddy-of-war;50030492]So many of you turn into Saints. Acting like those of us who believe he should be killed are some horrible savages. Get off your high horses, he needs to die end of the story.[/QUOTE] Stop with this, please. If all you can say about this is "get off your high horse" then aren't you really just saying "I know this is probably wrong but I don't care, shut up"? If you're going to be so adamant that being for his death doesn't make you some sort of sadistic savage, then why not make an actual argument for that? The part where you said you'd be happy with him dying slowly and painfully if it was your child, and that you'd still take some pleasure in it anyways doesn't exactly drive your point forward, I believe.

Personally, execution should only be used when the person is unfit for society. Hypothetically speaking, if the people who flew the planes into the Twin Towers had survived, yes, they should be executed. Not "everyone drag his hogtied body in the street" but humanely. (how that would go down, I don't know.) But more on topic, what this guy did was fucking brutal and my heart goes out to the family. Losing a child of natural causes is horrible let alone to such a horrific murder makes me sick just thinking about it.

[QUOTE=Scot;50026576]Then most people you know are fucked in the head. Executing mentally handicapped people isn't okay in my books.[/QUOTE] Because you're sheltered. You don't have to take care of this guy. You don't have to clean up the mess he made here, you don't have to see and touch and sew up this little girl's body and put her head back on to make the body presentable to the family, you don't have to sit down with the father face-to-face the way law enforcement officers do in order to get a description of events from him, you don't have to go out and notify the family members that she's dead and what was done to her, you don't have to deal with their emotional trauma... and beyond that, none of this happened to you. It wasn't your child that was murdered, your life wasn't personally affected at all, you're not related to any of these people or are a friend of theirs, etc. You're sheltered is all. And people wonder why cops, servicemen, medical professionals, etc. feel differently. It's because they know better. They're [i]not[/i] sheltered. They know all the nitty-gritty details, they know what these kinds of people really are, and they know how dangerous these people are and why we'd all be better off without them. It's easy to preach about rehabilitation and all that bullshit after something abhorrent like this happens when you don't actually have any obligations on your end to be a part of the process/when you weren't personally affected or inconvenienced by it in any way. Ridiculous.

[QUOTE=Trebgarta;50029083]"Natural feeling" is an odd phrase there, in my opinion. We are not programmed to feel that way, since not everybody, even though a majority, feel that way. Expected is better, IMO.[/QUOTE] execution is the most naturalistic way to deal with a murderer. it is revenge at its basest form, an eye for an eye. for many cultures for the longest time, putting someone to death was a common way of dealing with criminals. only recently has that really changed. i would say it is more natural to punish with death than attempt to rehabilitate. of course, we now have the means and research to rehabilitate rather than execute, so it makes sense to try and fix people. [editline]29th March 2016[/editline] but execution is definitely the most natural punishment. animals don't rehabilitate or incarcerate.

[QUOTE=Nerts;50026533]"Wang had an arrest record for drug crimes and had been treated for mental illness", He definitely needs locked up, but not in a jail cell.[/QUOTE] 'had been treated for mental illness' yeah lets just do it again and deny that it didn't work!

[QUOTE=Govna;50030692]Because you're sheltered. You don't have to take care of this guy. You don't have to clean up the mess he made here, you don't have to see and touch and sew up this little girl's body and put her head back on to make the body presentable to the family, you don't have to sit down with the father face-to-face the way law enforcement officers do in order to get a description of events from him, you don't have to go out and notify the family members that she's dead and what was done to her, you don't have to deal with their emotional trauma... and beyond that, none of this happened to you. It wasn't your child that was murdered, your life wasn't personally affected at all, you're not related to any of these people or are a friend of theirs, etc. You're sheltered is all. And people wonder why cops, servicemen, medical professionals, etc. feel differently. It's because they know better. They're [i]not[/i] sheltered. They know all the nitty-gritty details, they know what these kinds of people really are, and they know how dangerous these people are and why we'd all be better off without them. It's easy to preach about rehabilitation and all that bullshit after something abhorrent like this happens when you don't actually have any obligations on your end to be a part of the process/when you weren't personally affected or inconvenienced by it in any way. Ridiculous.[/QUOTE] This post, and all of it, hits the nail on the head. It's easy to want to be the "bigger" person, to think that one is infallible and will always be as sensible when they're not the ones exposed to extreme duress. You can see the video here, when people found out about what this person did, and followed the police to the station: [video=youtube;S9N8Es4Y3q8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9N8Es4Y3q8[/video] What the mob expresses(and myself, I must add), are very obvious and normal reactions to situations like these. It's extremely easy to despise the death penalty, vigilante justice, and capital punishment when you weren't there. It'd be more fucked up if people were extremely calm than extremely angry. [editline]30th March 2016[/editline] Also I should note there are still some people in the crowd saying, "Don't beat him", "Let the police handle him". Not everyone there is out to rip him in half(though quite a lot are)

[QUOTE=Scot;50026417]watch yourselves on that edge[/QUOTE] Oh cut the crap about who's edgy and who's not.. This guy cut the head off a fucking toddler, in the middle of the street, out of complete random! You wanna waste tax money on locking this guy up for life? To hell with that, they've alreaedy tried fixing him and wasted a ton of resources on him still being a complete wacko, might as well make a circus out of this clown's death.

[QUOTE=Katska;50030614]Stop with this, please. If all you can say about this is "get off your high horse" then aren't you really just saying "I know this is probably wrong but I don't care, shut up"? If you're going to be so adamant that being for his death doesn't make you some sort of sadistic savage, then why not make an actual argument for that? The part where you said you'd be happy with him dying slowly and painfully if it was your child, and that you'd still take some pleasure in it anyways doesn't exactly drive your point forward, I believe.[/QUOTE] Okay here, you know why I'm not a sadistic savage? Because I'm not running around grabbing three year old little girls and hacking their heads off in front of their parents. That's what sets me apart from him. He's the savage beast that needs to be put down. When a dog goes and bites someone, we put it down right? Why? Because it's proven to be a threat, and it can not operate in the world without harming or killing someone. Humans are animals, ya there's a HUGE difference between us and a wild dog, but to me that makes it all the worse. A human who has gone off the deep end can cause more damage than a dog would, but I'm the sadistic one right? Because what? I'll sleep better at night knowing this guy isn't breathing the same air as me? If we all adopted this policy of "Oh no, harming those who do harm to us only makes us like them" bullshit, this world would fall apart, and the folks that believe in this would be the first to go, because while you are going "I won't kill, because that would make me just like those savages out there" those savages are breaking in and killing you. But I do respect your opinion, honestly I do, if it's what you believe fine, I'm not gonna share the same belief, and I believe that I would stand a better chance in a survival situation than you would, but you can keep your beliefs, I hope you never have to come face to face with something like this.

[QUOTE=wauterboi;50026972]Well, here's another approach: could anyone provide a solid case why I should care about this guy or sparing his life? I used to be on the opposite side of the argument until a friend challenges me with that and I couldn't answer with anything other than baseless principles.[/QUOTE] Eh, best you'll get is that we are above such actions or that human life is somehow inherently valuable.

Well, rest assured that these events are statistical anomalies. Most people won't have to encounter this. But when they do, I certainly hope people aren't going to approach the dissenters saying, "Well, you guys are just blood-thirsty. Maybe [I]you[/I] should appreciate life a little more." Sure, emotional appeal, whatever. But there is some truth past that emotional appeal: trying to save this guy is indicating a value for a person who has no value for others. And as mentioned previously throughout the thread, most people don't understand the level of intense care required to bring this person back from that far down the spiral. It's easier to say, "Just keep him alive, we can fix them" than to realize the ugly truth that sometimes life isn't precious. [editline]29th March 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Cocacoladude;50031473]Eh, best you'll get is that we are above such actions or that human life is somehow inherently valuable.[/QUOTE] Right, but there is no intrinsic value for anything. We've got to come up with that value. And I don't value this guy. I don't understand why anyone would outside of a weird clinging to consistency, like killing this guy is such a terrible affront to human rights that the walls will crumble down and everyone will lose their freedom. And maybe on those terms I can agree - life shouldn't be caught up in bureaucracy. All I argue is that this guy isn't equal and that life shouldn't be quantitative. He isn't equal with your mom. He isn't equal with your teachers. He beheaded a child. He's broken. He probably won't be fixed. Accept it, and focus on the origin of these problems.

[QUOTE=aznz888;50030826]This post, and all of it, hits the nail on the head. It's easy to want to be the "bigger" person, to think that one is infallible and will always be as sensible when they're not the ones exposed to extreme duress. You can see the video here, when people found out about what this person did, and followed the police to the station: [video=youtube;S9N8Es4Y3q8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9N8Es4Y3q8[/video] What the mob expresses(and myself, I must add), are very obvious and normal reactions to situations like these. It's extremely easy to despise the death penalty, vigilante justice, and capital punishment when you weren't there. It'd be more fucked up if people were extremely calm than extremely angry. [editline]30th March 2016[/editline] Also I should note there are still some people in the crowd saying, "Don't beat him", "Let the police handle him". Not everyone there is out to rip him in half(though quite a lot are)[/QUOTE] I feel like you can understand why people often react the way they do in certain situations without resigning yourself to always doing the same. If someone had their kid murdered and they wanted the person who did it dead, then while I would disagree, I would still understand why this is happening and try not to judge them too harshly for it. However, looking at things like mob mentality or a thirst for revenge at a distance and saying "Well, it's in our nature as humans to do this when emotions run high, so we might as well not bother trying to do any better," is odd. I think people should be more aware of the ways in which our primitive minds often make mistakes so that we can better avoid making those mistakes. And yes, it's good to have humility and know that you are not infallible and you will still mistakes like this time and time again no matter how much you think you know yourself and how your mind works. But it's better to also be aware of these things and have a desire to be a better person so that, when you do start to make mistakes, you might be able to take a step back, look at yourself, and realize that you can do better and try to correct yourself. You will never be a perfect, totally rational person but it's very odd to use that as an excuse to allow yourself to become consumed by the id. In short, the fact that we often act irrationally doesn't mean we shouldn't try to not act irrationally.

[QUOTE=Katska;50031517]I feel like you can understand why people often react the way they do in certain situations without resigning yourself to always doing the same. If someone had their kid murdered and they wanted the person who did it dead, then while I would disagree, I would still understand why this is happening and try not to judge them too harshly for it. However, looking at things like mob mentality or a thirst for revenge at a distance and saying "Well, it's in our nature as humans to do this when emotions run high, so we might as well not bother trying to do any better," is odd. I think people should be more aware of the ways in which our primitive minds often make mistakes so that we can better avoid making those mistakes. And yes, it's good to have humility and know that you are not infallible and you will still mistakes like this time and time again no matter how much you think you know yourself and how your mind works. But it's better to also be aware of these things and have a desire to be a better person so that, when you do start to make mistakes, you might be able to take a step back, look at yourself, and realize that you can do better and try to correct yourself. You will never be a perfect, totally rational person but it's very odd to use that as an excuse to allow yourself to become consumed by the id. In short, the fact that we often act irrationally doesn't mean we shouldn't try to not act irrationally.[/QUOTE] I mention it a lot on these forums especially when the subject turns grim, but when my friend was murdered my first thought was, "What a coward to kill such a wonderful girl and escape the blame," and then my next thought was, "What can we do to fix the murderer?" And I've pondered for years about it, not so seriously - mainly as a passive question I could never answer. Three years later, I've come to the conclusion that there isn't really a fix - at least not for all of them. Some people do it without regret. Some people do it because of a mental illness that eats away at their ability to function properly. Some people do it out of honest fear and confusion that, hey, maybe is fixable. Who knows? But we're also asking them to somehow adjust back to society after murdering someone. And I wouldn't trust someone that has murdered someone to readjust back to society - not with our current state of psychology in the world. Even if we were able to study prisoners, I wouldn't feel comfortable with it. I think the fear I've had about the subject is specifically that I could stoop to his level and ask for him to die. My fear is that I wouldn't ask him for forgiveness. I spent a lot of time believing that I would genuinely forgive him if I met him. But now that I've reached a place where I am far more honest with myself all around, I think I just wouldn't care. I'd leave him to be a victim to the reactionary wrath of the friends and family that were destroyed by her death. I wouldn't have sympathy or care. It's not a matter of being a vile person. It's not a matter of being my own enemy. It's the natural next step in the discovery of myself and my understanding that life doesn't matter. As a firm believer that nothing has intrinsic value until I assign a value to it, his life literally means nothing to me - I don't know anything about him. All I know is he killed my friend, and that he left to escape from the public eye. Someone who carelessly treats another human being like that doesn't really deserve to be carefully treated, and if they are incapable of doing so for any reason perhaps it is in everyone's best interest (including theirs) to get rid of them as they probably won't be able to readjust. It's a lose-lose situation: either you did it and you don't care, or you're far too broken and therefore incompatible. I'm not suggesting throwing him into a woodchipper or whatever. Like I said, I don't care enough about it - I only care enough that my friend was killed and I won't see her again. I'm not very reactionary when it comes to these things, but I know that others are and I am not given a reason to save them.

[QUOTE=Michael haxz;50026455]What edge? This man committed one of the most heinous crimes that you can commit in the most despicable manner while the victim's family helplessly watched. He should be handed the heaviest punishment that the court can legally give him. Regardless of my opinion, I will stand by the court's decision.[/QUOTE] Why? How does that benefit anyone else besides getting your jimmies off to something you'll forget by next week?

[QUOTE=Rubs10;50031673]Why? How does that benefit anyone else besides getting your jimmies off to something you'll forget by next week?[/QUOTE] I could say the same thing about keeping the guy alive. You'd forget about him next week.

Also remember that every victim of a re-offending murderer, whether after release or while in prison, who would have gotten the death sentence is on the hands of the people who say that we are "above" killing people. As I've said countless times on this forum, I see the death penalty for clear and intentional murders as the ultimate pronouncement that the right to one's own life is the single most valuable thing to our society.

[QUOTE=wauterboi;50026972]Well, here's another approach: could anyone provide a solid case why I should care about this guy or sparing his life? I used to be on the opposite side of the argument until a friend challenges me with that and I couldn't answer with anything other than baseless principles.[/QUOTE] I means isis justifies killing people based on the same rationale you're going by. The only civilized choice is letting them live. It might not logically make sense but if you want to take the high ground in a war you have to be better than them.

[QUOTE=dark-vivec;50031815]I means isis justifies killing people based on the same rationale you're going by. The only civilized choice is letting them live. It might not logically make sense but if you want to take the high ground in a war you have to be better than them.[/QUOTE] Killing a person who's gone through a fair trial for unjustified murder is not morally equivilent to murdering an innocent person. The phrase "it's not civilized" is literally meaningless because you're just using your arbitrary definition of "civilized."

[QUOTE=dark-vivec;50031815]I means isis justifies killing people based on the same rationale you're going by. The only civilized choice is letting them live. It might not logically make sense but if you want to take the high ground in a war you have to be better than them.[/QUOTE] How exactly is it civilized to let them live? Surely if they are incapable of living in a traditional society, even after treatment, then they're incapable of living in general? So put them out of their unknowing misery and give the people a proper end to the nutjobs' career.