Lindsey Graham reveals 4,700 killed in US drone strikes - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Keys;39669827]The fuck are you on about? I understand the difference Between Afghanistan and Iraq. The key difference is we failed to truly "Take over" Afghanistan, just like so many before us (Russians anyone?). You may not be talking about Iraq, but [u]I am[/u]. Because it is a perfect example of what is going on in the world. I didn't even quote your shit, calm the fuck down. What I am talking about here has solid evidence, and quite frankly.. isn't even really hushed-up by the people involved anymore. They realize anyone who does is easily labeled as a "Conspiracy Theorist" and tossed to the side. It's too easy to get away with shit today because of the twist on media and information. Too easy to fool the millions who believe the first words they hear. Our World is fucked up, yo. [b]edit:[/b] And if you still want to argue it, [b][u]Watch the fucking movie[/u][/b] and do your research instead of just blindly posting on forums as if you were in the President's personal cabinet. If you cannot even be bothered to do that, then you have no business arguing. End of Story.[/QUOTE] What the fuck are you on about? We are here discussing drones and whether Al-Qaeda exists. That has nothing to do with Iraq. No I am not watching you video. It worthless as a source on anything to do with this, if it had any value it would cite a study, hard evidence, Hell, even a new story that doesn't come from [I]Infowars[/I], a "news" website less valuable than the Onion. So, lets see your hard evidence for the topic at hand; Al-Qaeda and drones. The world being fucked up doesn't lead any validity to any claim and to say "fool the millions who believe the first words they hear." is ironic considering you're believing a wild theory with no substantial evidence to support it This is hardly "blind Posting". All I have done is ask for [I]reputable[/I] proof of your wild claims. I hardly support the President. I have not show any support for these actions, all I have done is discussed Al-Qaeda and drones

[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;39669455]If there's no formal structure to Al-Qaeda, I feel it makes it easier for the US government to deem anyone a part of it and thus a target.[/QUOTE] Exactly.

[QUOTE=Keys;39669710]On the contrary, it is pretty open mouthed about it if you really look. Iraq for example; We went into the country, fucked the shit up beyond their capabilities to repair it and sustain themselves. Then allowed our corporations to go over and offer to fix it all. We rebuilt cities and installed military bases to "help defend them" and help them become established. We did an absolutely piss-poor job at arming and training their "Security Forces" and when all was said and done... we served them a gigantic bill for all the "Help" we had given them. Without any legitimate means to pay the bill back to the WTO (World Trade Organization / World Bank) the WTO offered them a compromise; Privatize major sectors such as Water and Oil in order to pay back your debt. So they did. Now foreign companies hold control over their most valuable and influential resources. Allowing them to profit and benefit from the proceeds but without giving much of anything back to the original country the resources were taken from. Today, we no longer "Invade" countries under the presence that we want their land. No, now we economically devastate them and then coerce them into terms of our own liking. Terms that more often than not will spell even further economic destabilization for the victimized country. And that's when Walmart moves in. If you don't believe me, you should watch Documentaries on the value of Water and the lack of it in this world. ie [url=http://www.bluegold-worldwaterwars.com/]Blue Gold: World Water Wars[/url] All this shit in the Middle East has NOTHING to do with WMDs in the end. No one wants to die, and all those Dictatorships realize that when they have 5 nukes, we have 1,000 more. The real issue here is sovereignty of resources in the world. We, as a species, are quickly blowing through the most valuable treasures in this world; water, oil, arable land, and so forth. These are what we are really fighting over in this world. What the West (US/UK/GR/CA/etc) is doing to the world is pretty twisted, but it is a product of our system of living. Done so to continually bring in what the customer wants so that profits can continue to be made. So we wage false wars and stage false horrors to sway the public into believing what we are doing is justified. When in reality, we are just bullying the world for their peanut butter sandwiches at the lunch table. It's all well and good now, but soon no one will have any peanut butter sandwiches left... And when it has been us who has eaten them all, the rest of the world will quickly change their opinion of us. (something we see now)[/QUOTE] Which is why China is gaining the most from the Afghanistan/Iraq wars, why water is a renewable resource, water [B]management[/B] is a more critical issue than water supply (hello desalination/purification/dozens of other things), You know for beating the world into submission we sure are doing it wrong given that we've wracked up massive debt, tarnished our international image lately, blown any chance of a puppet govt in Iraq or Afghanistan, and are now busy tearing ourselves apart over domestic issues like the budget and healthcare.

[QUOTE=Wizards Court;39669376]this is actually scary, when you remember during the fukushima tsunami, there were thousands of idiots in facebook actually mentioning pearl harbor(for some random reason) and how "the japanese deserved the tsunami", and some even saying they should be nuked again... who knows why, and it was pretty obvious they weren't trolling, some japanese were even horrified by the whole thing.[/QUOTE] twitter was a dark, dark place during that time, and it really shows how god forsakenly stupid portions of our country is. I don't care if a large portion of those posts were from kids who didn't pay much attention to wwii in history class past "america was attacked! nazis and japanese baaaad!", it takes maybe a shred of human decency and common sense to realize saying those things is probably ignorant to the point [url=godwins_law_sorry_I_know]nazis[/url] would ask what the hell you're doing

[QUOTE=daijitsu;39670047]twitter was a dark, dark place during that time, and it really shows how god forsakenly stupid portions of our country is. I don't care if a large portion of those posts were from kids who didn't pay much attention to wwii in history class past "america was attacked! nazis and japanese baaaad!", it takes maybe a shred of human decency and common sense to realize saying those things is probably ignorant to the point nazis would ask what the hell you're doing[/QUOTE] Well, to a certain extent that kind of response is unavoidable, as unfortunate as it may be.

[QUOTE=download;39669956]What the fuck are you on about? We are here discussing drones and whether Al-Qaeda exists. That has nothing to do with Iraq. No I am not watching you video. It worthless as a source on anything to do with this, if it had any value it would cite a study, hard evidence, Hell, even a new story that doesn't come from [I]Infowars[/I], a "news" website less valuable than the Onion. So, lets see your hard evidence for the topic at hand; Al-Qaeda and drones. The world being fucked up doesn't lead any validity to any claim and to say "fool the millions who believe the first words they hear." is ironic considering you're believing a wild theory with no substantial evidence to support it This is hardly "blind Posting". All I have done is ask for [I]reputable[/I] proof of your wild claims. I hardly support the President. I have not show any support for these actions, all I have done is discussed Al-Qaeda and drones[/QUOTE] Well if you genuinely do not understand when presented with the hard evidence as well as every other clues and laugh at infowars as a "crazy site" well then you're long from getting it, you are compromised but you can learn if you truly want, the problem is, your subconsciousness doesn't want you, so you press with your same kind of cheese to discredit our explanations, what I forgot to say is that obviously for a newcomer to truth and revelations, there is an effect called information shock, at which you may not agree or to respond becaue it's too much information all at once it's all solved so insead of the mind realizing the deal it objects it and doesn't want to believe it, there are several factors to information shock intensity, depression, level of programming, previous knowledge, etc, For example in the lower grade your avreage FOX watcher (no internet access, etc) is more likely to have much greater information shock than someone working in IT and being successful in life. But that doesn't mean for all people, some people have access to anything, but they are swayed by herd behavior (tendency to behave strictly like mainstream to not stand out), these are also TV personalities, celebrities, mtv kribs and crap like that ..etc Another thing is, that if you continute pressing with factoids which have no basis nor value of truth inside them, ignoring the hard evidence and countless explanations you have a great possibility to be identified as a shill or paid troll. it is too much to explain everything in this few forum posts, research takes months, years in the greater scale, alex jones is not making it up, he simply has 20+ years of research, the evidence has always been there, if you know how to find it in time before it gets destroyed Infowars is the only site linking to hard evidence, that's why i sourced it. There are others if I would searched for many mintues but it's unnecessary, Drudge Report would link back to it, the site analyses and covers stuff like this on a daily basis, And to answer your discussion point, we aren't discussing if al-quaeda exists as a physical organization, because It doesn't matter. And to correct you, yes it does have anything to do with IRAQ, it has to do with almost everything - it's just toooo much to explain the whole deal and being, so many linking to pull sources, I don't have more time today so ... Just a quick historical fact: Almost every war was artificially created.

[quote]"Sometimes you hit innocent people, and I hate that, but we're at war, and we've taken out some very senior members of al-Qaeda,"[/quote] Fucking bullshit. Only 2% of all drone strikes have resulted in taking out high-level members of al-Qaeda.

[QUOTE=Starpluck;39670774]Fucking bullshit. Only 2% of all drone strikes have resulted in taking out high-level members of al-Qaeda.[/QUOTE] out of 4700 alleged kills I'd presume there's a lot of collateral, but I'm curious where you got [i]that[/i] number if nobody even knew the rough total

[quote]"Sometimes you hit innocent people, and I hate that, but we're at war, and we've taken out some very senior members of al-Qaeda,"[/quote] i wonder how he would feel if it was his child or relative that got hit by a predator missile by accident

[QUOTE=Starpluck;39670774]Fucking bullshit. Only 2% of all drone strikes have resulted in taking out high-level members of al-Qaeda.[/QUOTE] Well yes there's not a lot of members the higher up an organization you go, such is most hierarchies

[QUOTE=daijitsu;39670852]out of 4700 alleged kills I'd presume there's a lot of collateral, but I'm curious where you got [i]that[/i] number if nobody even knew the rough total[/QUOTE] An academic study by [URL="http://livingunderdrones.org/"]Stanford and NYU[/URL] [url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-19893757[/url] [url]http://www.cnn.com/2012/09/25/world/asia/pakistan-us-drone-strikes[/url]

[QUOTE=Starpluck;39670774]Fucking bullshit. Only 2% of all drone strikes have resulted in taking out high-level members of al-Qaeda.[/QUOTE] Pakistan: [URL]http://counterterrorism.newamerica.net/about/militants[/URL] Yemen: [URL]http://yemendrones.newamerica.net/all-strikes[/URL] "Only one out of every seven drone strikes killed a militant leader, according to data collected as of the summer of 2011" that's still like 14% All of them take out militants either way.

[QUOTE=lolwutdude;39670863]i wonder how he would feel if it was his child or relative that got hit by a predator missile by accident[/QUOTE] we've already seen that lots of politicians will turn on a dime if an issue suddenly affects them directly. As generic of an example as it is, I remember an extremely anti-gay republican flipping to support equality when his daughter came out. Another one was Chris Christie and how he went from saying obama was a terrible leader to giving a little speach about how great obama is after he was being aided in the hurricane situation

[QUOTE=Stewox;39670708]Well if you genuinely do not understand when presented with the hard evidence as well as every other clues and laugh at infowars as a "crazy site" well then you're long from getting it, you are compromised but you can learn if you truly want, the problem is, your subconsciousness doesn't want you, so you press with your same kind of cheese to discredit our explanations, what I forgot to say is that obviously for a newcomer to truth and revelations, there is an effect called information shock, at which you may not agree or to respond becaue it's too much information all at once it's all solved so insead of the mind realizing the deal it objects it and doesn't want to believe it, there are several factors to information shock intensity, depression, level of programming, previous knowledge, etc, For example in the lower grade your avreage FOX watcher (no internet access, etc) is more likely to have much greater information shock than someone working in IT and being successful in life. But that doesn't mean for all people, some people have access to anything, but they are swayed by herd behavior (tendency to behave strictly like mainstream to not stand out), these are also TV personalities, celebrities, mtv kribs and crap like that ..etc Another thing is, that if you continute pressing with factoids which have no basis nor value of truth inside them, ignoring the hard evidence and countless explanations you have a great possibility to be identified as a shill or paid troll. it is too much to explain everything in this few forum posts, research takes months, years in the greater scale, alex jones is not making it up, he simply has 20+ years of research, the evidence has always been there, if you know how to find it in time before it gets destroyed Infowars is the only site linking to hard evidence, that's why i sourced it. There are others if I would searched for many mintues but it's unnecessary, Drudge Report would link back to it, the site analyses and covers stuff like this on a daily basis, And to answer your discussion point, we aren't discussing if al-quaeda exists as a physical organization, because It doesn't matter. And to correct you, yes it does have anything to do with IRAQ, it has to do with almost everything - it's just toooo much to explain the whole deal and being, so many linking to pull sources, I don't have more time today so ... Just a quick historical fact: Almost every war was artificially created.[/QUOTE] You have to be a troll. Holding Alex Jones to high esteem is laughable, then turn around an accuse me of being a shill. What's next? I'm actually an agent of the NWO?

400-900 Civilians killed total according to the Bureau of Independent Journalism. The key difference between Bush Administration and the Obama Administration when is comes to drones was that Bush targeted mainly the leadership where Obama appears to target all militants including low level fighters and high value targets. [QUOTE]While Bush sought to decapitate the leadership ranks of al Qaeda, Obama seems to be aiming also to collapse the entire network of allied groups, such as the Pakistani Taliban.[/QUOTE] [URL="http://www.cnn.com/2012/09/05/opinion/bergen-obama-drone/index.html"]http://www.cnn.com/2012/09/05/opinion/bergen-obama-drone/index.html[/URL] Obama is trying to win the war with drones.

[QUOTE=download;39669956]What the fuck are you on about? We are here discussing drones and whether Al-Qaeda exists. That has nothing to do with Iraq. No I am not watching you video. It worthless as a source on anything to do with this, if it had any value it would cite a study, hard evidence, Hell, even a new story that doesn't come from [I]Infowars[/I], a "news" website less valuable than the Onion. So, lets see your hard evidence for the topic at hand; Al-Qaeda and drones. The world being fucked up doesn't lead any validity to any claim and to say "fool the millions who believe the first words they hear." is ironic considering you're believing a wild theory with no substantial evidence to support it This is hardly "blind Posting". All I have done is ask for [I]reputable[/I] proof of your wild claims. I hardly support the President. I have not show any support for these actions, all I have done is discussed Al-Qaeda and drones[/QUOTE] I commented on your ~Conspiracy Theory~ comment, which I consider to be "Blind Posting" because it offers no argument or evidence for or against, its just an empty-handed dismissal of an argument or statement. It's unfair and warrants an uneven playing field for a proper debate. Its only use is to crash an argument you are not qualified to debate. Admittedly I went off on a tangent there, which was not 100% to topic. You want to talk Predator Drones in Iraq. [url=http://lmgtfy.com/?q=US+Drones+in+Iraq]Here you go[/url]. It didn't take much effort to connect Predator drones to Iraq. Not just Afghanistan and Pakistan. We've been doing it for a while. You want this "Reputable Proof", but when I hand it to you- you refuse to even look at it. I didn't post another "9/11 The Real Truth", and no it isn't about Predator Drone strikes either. However it does help explain why such events like the Predator Drone strikes [u]have[/u] become so notorious, and why the United States and their allies have done the things they do. I'm not saying it is Aliens, i'm not saying Bush and Cheney are behind it all, I'm not even saying there's a NWO [i]Conspiracy[/i] going on. All I was trying to relay was the fact that the Gov't is becoming corrupt because of the control we have allowed Corporations to assume over our liberties. As such, with the world as it is, these events like Predator Drones killing 4,700 people overseas will only become more of an issue. In addition with recent changes to U.S. Laws regarding U.S. Civilian rights and their relation to Predator Drone monitoring/attacks; we [u]should[/u] have reason to worry and be concerned. Not blindly dismissing anything we don't like. You want proof for these, you need only look to areas such as the [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriot_Act]Patriot Act[/url], which no... hasn't gone away, it's still there. And still enables the U.S. Gov't to detain you for as long as they feel fit or so long as they can "deem" you a threat to the United States of America. But What is a threat to the United States of America? Physical? Financial? Well.... that's not really clear... Now we have talks about using Predator Drones on U.S. citizens and what that means legally. In short? Jack shit in my opinion. I know what you're thinking and you're right, No- Just because the Door is open doesn't mean they'll walk through it. Meaning just because they put in a clause about being a Terrorist and the option to blow you away with the push of a button, doesn't necessarily mean thats what it will be used for. [b]But it Can[/b] and that's what scares me. If there are Humans who have been as evil as Hitler, Stalin, and all the other leaders of great Genocides and violations of liberties in the past- What is to stop it from happening now? [b]Edit:[/b] Hell if you really want, I could even tie in Gun/Weapon control into this, but i'll spare us all for another thread. :P And to be fair, all of this (this debate between the two of us) should be in its own thread entirely as it encompasses about a 100 different topics in one.

[QUOTE=Keys;39671920]I commented on your ~Conspiracy Theory~ comment, which I consider to be "Blind Posting" because it offers no argument or evidence for or against, its just an empty-handed dismissal of an argument or statement. It's unfair and warrants an uneven playing field for a proper debate. Its only use is to crash an argument you are not qualified to debate. Admittedly I went off on a tangent there, which was not 100% to topic. You want to talk Predator Drones in Iraq. [url=http://lmgtfy.com/?q=US+Drones+in+Iraq]Here you go[/url]. It didn't take much effort to connect Predator drones to Iraq. Not just Afghanistan and Pakistan. We've been doing it for a while. You want this "Reputable Proof", but when I hand it to you- you refuse to even look at it. I didn't post another "9/11 The Real Truth", and no it isn't about Predator Drone strikes either. However it does help explain why such events like the Predator Drone strikes [u]have[/u] become so notorious, and why the United States and their allies have done the things they do. I'm not saying it is Aliens, i'm not saying Bush and Cheney are behind it all, I'm not even saying there's a NWO [i]Conspiracy[/i] going on. All I was trying to relay was the fact that the Gov't is becoming corrupt because of the control we have allowed Corporations to assume over our liberties. As such, with the world as it is, these events like Predator Drones killing 4,700 people overseas will only become more of an issue. In addition with recent changes to U.S. Laws regarding U.S. Civilian rights and their relation to Predator Drone monitoring/attacks; we [u]should[/u] have reason to worry and be concerned. Not blindly dismissing anything we don't like. You want proof for these, you need only look to areas such as the [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriot_Act]Patriot Act[/url], which no... hasn't gone away, it's still there. And still enables the U.S. Gov't to detain you for as long as they feel fit or so long as they can "deem" you a threat to the United States of America. But What is a threat to the United States of America? Physical? Financial? Well.... that's not really clear... Now we have talks about using Predator Drones on U.S. citizens and what that means legally. In short? Jack shit in my opinion. I know what you're thinking and you're right, No- Just because the Door is open doesn't mean they'll walk through it. Meaning just because they put in a clause about being a Terrorist and the option to blow you away with the push of a button, doesn't necessarily mean thats what it will be used for. [b]But it Can[/b] and that's what scares me. If there are Humans who have been as evil as Hitler, Stalin, and all the other leaders of great Genocides and violations of liberties in the past- What is to stop it from happening now? [b]Edit:[/b] Hell if you really want, I could even tie in Gun/Weapon control into this, but i'll spare us all for another thread. :P[/QUOTE] So, how does this relate again to my original comment? It was responding to our Alex Jones fan who said Al-Qaeda doesn't exist. You might not be saying NWO order, but the other guy certainly is in that bag [editline]22nd February 2013[/editline] But yea, lets take this to MD

Let's just drop this shall we? I feel like if I continue on we'll just end up running in circles eternally. I made my point (admittedly buried by a ton of Tangent rant) twice and it was missed. So let's just move on. [b]edit:[/b] And I am at fault for driving us into a mad flurry of mixed debate, I apologize for that Download. I can be confusing sometimes.

[QUOTE=Disotrtion;39671846] Obama is trying to win the war with drones.[/QUOTE] Would it be a problem if "Obama is trying to win the war with aircraft"?

[QUOTE=scout1;39674674]Would it be a problem if "Obama is trying to win the war with aircraft"?[/QUOTE] Yes. Because launching attacks on accused insurgents and killing plenty of civilians in the process is not helping. This is in other countries, where the population does not support the US' attacks.

[QUOTE=laserguided;39674737]Yes. Because launching attacks on accused insurgents and killing plenty of civilians in the process is not helping. This is in other countries, where the population does not support the US' attacks.[/QUOTE] It's almost like you're talking about war as an armed conflict. Amazing.

[QUOTE=scout1;39674751]It's almost like you're talking about war as an armed conflict. Amazing.[/QUOTE] You realize Pakistani and Yemeni civilians aren't at war with the US? Are you trying to justify attacks on innocent civilians because Washington can't be bothered to do it without civilian casualty because they somehow think killing one insurgent is worth the life of 2 civilians? They don't sympathize for them because they aren't Americans, what if this was happening in your country? I'm sure you would be plenty pissed that civilians are dying. [editline]21st February 2013[/editline] People would be so fucking up in arms if just one Westerner died, yet nobody cares about the Pakistani or Yemeni civilians dying.

[QUOTE=laserguided;39674759]You realize Pakistani and Yemeni civilians aren't at war with the US? Are you trying to justify attacks on innocent civilians because Washington can't be bothered to do it without civilian casualty because they somehow think killing one insurgent is worth the life of 2 civilians? They don't sympathize for them because they aren't Americans, what if this was happening in your country? I'm sure you would be plenty pissed that civilians are dying.[/QUOTE] You say this like anybody intentionally bombs civilians. Or do you not understand how explosives work? Mistakes? Armed conflict as I said? I'd like to know how we [I]could[/I] do it without civilian casualties? Yes, civilians die in a war. It's almost a pre-requisite. [editline]21st February 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=laserguided;39674759] People would be so fucking up in arms if just one Westerner died, yet nobody cares about the Pakistani or Yemeni civilians dying.[/QUOTE] So are these people me, now?

[QUOTE=scout1;39674800]You say this like anybody intentionally bombs civilians. Or do you not understand how explosives work? Mistakes? Armed conflict as I said? I'd like to know how we [I]could[/I] do it without civilian casualties? Yes, civilians die in a war. It's almost a pre-requisite. [editline]21st February 2013[/editline] So are these people me, now?[/QUOTE] So you're trying to justify them bombing 'accused terrorists' in the middle towns and villages in countries they aren't at war with? If they didn't want to risk civilian casualties they wouldn't make such daring attacks.

[QUOTE=laserguided;39674823]So you're trying to justify them bombing 'accused terrorists' in the middle towns and villages in countries they aren't at war with? If they didn't want to risk civilian casualties they wouldn't make such daring attacks.[/QUOTE] Drone strikes happen for a lot of reasons. You can paint them all as "accused terrorists" which implies some sort of doubt as to identities or purpose, but I think that's rather disingenuous. And any sort of attack or conflict risks civilian casualties. Bullets miss, explosives miss, people are wrong and shit happens. Welcome to war.

[QUOTE=scout1;39674862]Drone strikes happen for a lot of reasons. You can paint them all as "accused terrorists" which implies some sort of doubt as to identities or purpose, but I think that's rather disingenuous. And any sort of attack or conflict risks civilian casualties. Bullets miss, explosives miss, people are wrong and shit happens. Welcome to war.[/QUOTE] No. They intentionally risk the lives in innocent civilians by blowing up 'accused terrorists' in the middle of towns and villages. If they had sympathy for civilians they wouldn't be risking the strikes in such populated areas or with such uncertainty of their hostile status.

That`s a lot of Killstreaks

[QUOTE=laserguided;39674883]No. They intentionally risk the lives in innocent civilians by blowing up 'accused terrorists' in the middle of towns and villages. If they had sympathy for civilians they wouldn't be risking the strike if there is a risk.[/QUOTE] Yes obviously the US doesn't care at all that's why we embed lawyers into our military units and why the president has power to approve drone strikes. Of course we could put boots on the ground. And more people would die in the fighting. Or we could bomb it with a conventional aircraft. That puts 1 more person at risk and alleviates nothing. Or we could not strike them... and then we lose them. And then people are going to die in some other strike and in the meantime more people die from their activities.

[QUOTE=Keys;39669710]On the contrary, it is pretty open mouthed about it if you really look. Iraq for example; We went into the country, fucked the shit up beyond their capabilities to repair it and sustain themselves. Then allowed our corporations to go over and offer to fix it all. We rebuilt cities and installed military bases to "help defend them" and help them become established. We did an absolutely piss-poor job at arming and training their "Security Forces" and when all was said and done... we served them a gigantic bill for all the "Help" we had given them. Without any legitimate means to pay the bill back to the WTO (World Trade Organization / World Bank) the WTO offered them a compromise; Privatize major sectors such as Water and Oil in order to pay back your debt. So they did. Now foreign companies hold control over their most valuable and influential resources. Allowing them to profit and benefit from the proceeds but without giving much of anything back to the original country the resources were taken from. Today, we no longer "Invade" countries under the presence that we want their land. No, now we economically devastate them and then coerce them into terms of our own liking. Terms that more often than not will spell even further economic destabilization for the victimized country. And that's when Walmart moves in. If you don't believe me, you should watch Documentaries on the value of Water and the lack of it in this world. ie [url=http://www.bluegold-worldwaterwars.com/]Blue Gold: World Water Wars[/url] All this shit in the Middle East has NOTHING to do with WMDs in the end. No one wants to die, and all those Dictatorships realize that when they have 5 nukes, we have 1,000 more. The real issue here is sovereignty of resources in the world. We, as a species, are quickly blowing through the most valuable treasures in this world; water, oil, arable land, and so forth. These are what we are really fighting over in this world. What the West (US/UK/GR/CA/etc) is doing to the world is pretty twisted, but it is a product of our system of living. Done so to continually bring in what the customer wants so that profits can continue to be made. So we wage false wars and stage false horrors to sway the public into believing what we are doing is justified. When in reality, we are just bullying the world for their peanut butter sandwiches at the lunch table. It's all well and good now, but soon no one will have any peanut butter sandwiches left... And when it has been us who has eaten them all, the rest of the world will quickly change their opinion of us. (something we see now)[/QUOTE] So Bush orchestrated a massive conspiracy to make money for these nameless corporations you speak of to make invisible money we never see nor hear of. And he gets nothing.

[QUOTE=scout1;39674937]Yes obviously the US doesn't care at all that's why we embed lawyers into our military units and why the president has power to approve drone strikes. Of course we could put boots on the ground. And more people would die in the fighting. Or we could bomb it with a conventional aircraft. That puts 1 more person at risk and alleviates nothing. Or we could not strike them... and then we lose them. And then people are going to die in some other strike and in the meantime more people die from their activities.[/QUOTE] Or they could not risk innocent civilian lives. Instead of killing people with drones they could simply use the drones for recon, then send in a counter terrorism force. But I guess that would require too much money, and foreign civilians aren't worth much to the US.