Putin admits Russian forces were deployed to Crimea - Polidicks

[QUOTE=moffe;44570861]in a month he'll say : we had troops deployed in eastern ukraine to make sure it didn't develop into the situation now happening in Poland and all the other Baltic countries but we don't have anything to do with those.[/QUOTE] I don't think Poland and friends will be so easy to push over like Ukraine is, especially since most of them are in NATO now. [img]https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f6/Location_NATO_2009_blue.svg[/img]

[QUOTE=IGotWorms;44574711]Well, when you get thrown in prison for opposing Putin in a "free" election and when Russia has a law that to be eligible you must assemble in an officially recognized hall but suddenly NO ONE can let you use any officially recognized hall and the only reason you're still alive or not imprisoned in a labor camp for the rest of your life is because you got an iota of leniency for being a worldwide celebrity and national icon, then yeah...it's a complete dictatorship. [/QUOTE] What? What the fuck are you on about, thrown in prison for participating in elections, labor camps... No I mean, you want to see Russia as North Korea, by all means, you're welcome.

[QUOTE=gudman;44576707]What? What the fuck are you on about, thrown in prison for participating in elections, labor camps... No I mean, you want to see Russia as North Korea, by all means, you're welcome.[/QUOTE] Oh my bad...I guess Garry Kasparov didn't go to prison? I guess EVERYBODY must have misreported that one, including the actual Russian news...how strange. I guess you didn't hear about any of that either? Oh and so...Russia doesn't have labor camps anymore either? When exactly did that end? Because I have missed it. Was it yesterday? I didn't say anything about North Korea. Those are facts. If you think that makes Russia look like North Korea well...I'll take your word for it because you got a little flag under your avatar that says "Russian Federation." Hell, you should know all this already.

[QUOTE=IGotWorms;44576889]Oh my bad...I guess Garry Kasparov didn't go to prison? I guess EVERYBODY must have misreported that one, including the actual Russian news...how strange. I guess you didn't hear about any of that either? Oh and so...Russia doesn't have labor camps anymore either? When exactly did that end? Because I have missed it. Was it yesterday? I didn't say anything about North Korea. Those are facts. If you think that makes Russia look like North Korea well...I'll take your word for it because you got a little flag under your avatar that says "Russian Federation." Hell, you should know all this already.[/QUOTE] Kasparov was put in [b]jail[/b] a couple of times for participating in "illegal protest activity", including 2007 episode where he was jailed for five days for exactly the same reason. Along with 30 more people, including some others high profile opposition leader. How that translates into "for opposing Putin on elections" I don't know. And no, there're no labor camps in Russia. None. Unless you count penitentiary facilities where you are presented with a choice to work in quarries (for money and actual specialisation) that you can freely refuse and do something else instead. And you really should calm down with your tone, it is uncalled for and kinda makes you look defensive.

[QUOTE=gudman;44577694] And no, there're no labor camps in Russia. None. Unless you count penitentiary facilities where you are presented with a choice to work in quarries (for money and actual specialisation) that you can freely refuse and do something else instead. [/QUOTE] Actually North Korea has some labour camps in Russia, so technically there are labour camps in Russia, they're just not Russian.

[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;44577874]Actually North Korea has some labour camps in Russia, so technically there are labour camps in Russia, they're just not Russian.[/QUOTE] Yeah, I actually wanted to say that as well, that weird "outsourcing stuff", but then forgot for some reason.

[QUOTE=gudman;44577694]And no, there're no labor camps in Russia. None. Unless you count penitentiary facilities where you are presented with a choice to work in quarries (for money and actual specialisation) that you can freely refuse and do something else instead. [/QUOTE] So Mordovia is no longer a part of russia?

[QUOTE=gudman;44577909]Yeah, I actually wanted to say that as well, that weird "outsourcing stuff", but then forgot for some reason.[/QUOTE] The North Koreans love the Russian camp anyway, they can run away from it :v:

Russia did in Ukraine what the US did in the middle east. Secure resourch rich areas while creating a buffer zone to protect its territory against potential opposing forces. I also believe it's funny that everyone's pretending Ukraine's resources were not the main reason for all this nonsense in the first place. The west keeps insisting they were bringing them freedom, democracy and McDonalds, and Russia spins some retarded story about terrorists and corrupt governments. Then, the second Russia annexes Crimea, the resource rich area of Ukraine, the west just drops Ukraine like a brick telling them they're on their own. "[i]W-we totally didn't j-just care about you for your o-oil or anything, Ukraine![/i]"

[QUOTE=V12US;44577996]Russia did in Ukraine what the US did in the middle east. Secure resourch rich areas while creating a buffer zone to protect its territory against potential opposing forces.[/QUOTE] Yes I too remember when Iraq became the 51st State.

[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;44578011]Yes I too remember when Iraq became the 51st State.[/QUOTE] This argument is really semantic. Just because they didn't annex the region doesn't mean they didn't do loads of unethical damage to it. A better argument would be to dismiss it entirely because what the US did has no relation to this.

[QUOTE=gudman;44577694]Kasparov was put in [b]jail[/b] a couple of times for participating in "illegal protest activity", including 2007 episode where he was jailed for five days for exactly the same reason. Along with 30 more people, including some others high profile opposition leader. How that translates into "for opposing Putin on elections" I don't know.[/QUOTE] Here media says it's effectively impossible to get legal permit to anti-Putin demonstration in Russia, making all public expression against Putin an "illegal protest activity". Confirm/deny?

[QUOTE=Vlevs;44578113]Here media says it's effectively impossible to get legal permit to anti-Putin demonstration in Russia, making all public expression against Putin an "illegal protest activity". Confirm/deny?[/QUOTE] It's weird. Sometimes permits are issued, other times - denied. There seems to be no particular thing it would depend on. For example, latest anti-war march of the opposition was okay in Moscow and most of the country, but was denied in Petersburg and a couple of other places. That doesn't matter though, Constitution clearly says that government should not interfere with people protesting, exercising one's right to protest does not require official "permits".

[QUOTE=gudman;44578166] That doesn't matter though, Constitution clearly says that government should not interfere with people protesting, exercising one's right to protest does not require official "permits".[/QUOTE] Now I'm confused. How is it then possible to jail people for "illegal protest activity"?

-snip nvm-

[QUOTE=Vlevs;44578216]Now I'm confused. How is it then possible to jail people for "illegal protest activity"?[/QUOTE] There's this law that forces people to apply for approval from city powers when large groups of people (more that one, most of the times) intend to meet at a certain place to organize a protest or a meeting. By constitution you simply need to warn city administration about it and let them organize everything or suggest more suitable place where you won't inconvenience other people way too much. This law allows administration to simply deny your request altogether and then if you do it anyway - to disband the meeting and put organizers in jail or even possibly into prison. This law is unconstitutional, but that obviously doesn't prevent government from enforcing it.

[QUOTE=uber.;44577948]So Mordovia is no longer a part of russia?[/QUOTE] Don't forget Siberia too, which is part of Russia. They definitely have labor camps and that's not exactly a state secret.

[QUOTE=IGotWorms;44579353]Don't forget Siberia too, which is part of Russia. They definitely have labor camps and that's not exactly a state secret.[/QUOTE] I didn't realize it's 1939. There are no labor camps in modern-day Russia. If you think otherwise, feel free to provide sources.

[QUOTE=Melnek;44579428]I didn't realize it's 1939. There are no labor camps in modern-day Russia. If you think otherwise, feel free to provide sources.[/QUOTE] You realize that Russian's labor camps are common knowledge right? Especially the ones in Siberia. Seriously, are you just pretending to be stupid now? And it's not just Russia graciously hosting North Korean labor camps either. The fact that Russia happily hosts labor camps for North Korea, a haven for human rights abuses, should be telling enough on its own but they put their own citizens to work as well. [url]http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2337320/Sowing-seeds-watched-constantly-Russian-prisoners-serving-life-sentences-Siberian-labour-camp.html[/url] Now if you truly feel this is all just some western media conspiracy to make Russia look bad, I whole-hearted lay encourage you to volunteer for a stay in one of Siberia's "summer camps."

[QUOTE=IGotWorms;44579678]You realize that Russian's labor camps are common knowledge right? Especially the ones in Siberia. Seriously, are you just pretending to be stupid now? And it's not just Russia graciously hosting North Korean labor camps either. The fact that Russia happily hosts labor camps for North Korea, a haven for human rights abuses, should be telling enough on its own but they put their own citizens to work as well. [url]http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2337320/Sowing-seeds-watched-constantly-Russian-prisoners-serving-life-sentences-Siberian-labour-camp.html[/url] Now if you truly feel this is all just some western media conspiracy to make Russia look bad, I whole-hearted lay encourage you to volunteer for a stay in one of Siberia's "summer camps."[/QUOTE] How is this any different than what is done in America where prisoners are subjected to hard labor as a form of punishment? (i.e, rock breaking, tree cutting, etc.) That doesn't make them labor camps, there is a difference between labor camps and penal labor which is an acceptable form of punishment worldwide, including first-world countries. Also dailymail. As for North Korea, the North Korean prisoners that were exported to Russia received [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Korea%E2%80%93Russia_relations#Labor_trade]working visas[/url] along with working conditions. They aren't slaves nor are they treated as such. As for the reasoning of their imprisonment, that's an entirely different argument not concerning Russia but rather North Korea. Your common knowledge isn't very common, googling these imaginary 'labor camps' gives a load of sketchy and unverified reports that are often sourcing each other with no further documentation or evidence.

[QUOTE=IGotWorms;44579678]You realize that Russian's labor camps are common knowledge right? Especially the ones in Siberia. Seriously, are you just pretending to be stupid now? And it's not just Russia graciously hosting North Korean labor camps either. The fact that Russia happily hosts labor camps for North Korea, a haven for human rights abuses, should be telling enough on its own but they put their own citizens to work as well. [url]http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2337320/Sowing-seeds-watched-constantly-Russian-prisoners-serving-life-sentences-Siberian-labour-camp.html[/url] Now if you truly feel this is all just some western media conspiracy to make Russia look bad, I whole-hearted lay encourage you to volunteer for a stay in one of Siberia's "summer camps."[/QUOTE] Yeah not surprised to see dailymail as your source. Not even a bit. "Common knowledge". I will tell you again, there're absolutely no "labor camps" in Russia. Nowhere in any one of our numerous penitentiary facilities prisoners are forced to work. If it turns out that happens, and it did a couple of times, facility administration is persecuted for this. The fact that in most penitentiary "colonies" people are given the choice to work in production or agriculture instead of doing nothing all their sentence doesn't automatically mean "labor camps", please educate yourself on the subject.

[QUOTE=Melnek;44579992] As for North Korea, the North Korean prisoners that were exported to Russia received [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Korea%E2%80%93Russia_relations#Labor_trade]working visas[/url] along with working conditions. They aren't slaves nor are they treated as such. As for the reasoning of their imprisonment, that's an entirely different argument not concerning Russia but rather North Korea. [/QUOTE] Hey, I see we have another Wikipedia professor here! The money that those North Korean prisoners make doing Russian labor...goes straight back to Pyongyang. They don't see "won" single cent. So...tell me...what would you call unpaid labor? [QUOTE=gudman;44580297]Yeah not surprised to see dailymail as your source. Not even a bit. "Common knowledge". I will tell you again, there're absolutely no "labor camps" in Russia. Nowhere in any one of our numerous penitentiary facilities prisoners are forced to work. If it turns out that happens, and it did a couple of times, facility administration is persecuted for this. The fact that in most penitentiary "colonies" people are given the choice to work in production or agriculture instead of doing nothing all their sentence doesn't automatically mean "labor camps", please educate yourself on the subject.[/QUOTE] Oh, "Huh huh, Dailymail." What an intelligent comeback. You said, "they're absolutely no "labor camps" in Russia." So you're saying they just completely made up that story and those photos depicting a state sponsored labor camp in Siberia...which they were given a tour of? Look here are some more "liberal" news sites talking about labor camps in Russia and more photos too! Probably shopped. Gosh, we need to let everyone know there's a massive media conspiracy going on here! There are no labor camps in Russia! Just day spas and summer camps! And I guess you couldn't be bothered to look at the source for the photos from that DailyMail article...Reuters genius. [url]http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2012/10/inside-russias-prison-system/263806/[/url] [url]http://www.washingtonpost.com/pb/world/life-in-a-siberian-prison/2013/06/19/c828f814-d8d1-11e2-a9f2-42ee3912ae0e_gallery.html#item0[/url] [url]http://uk.reuters.com/news/pictures/slideshow?articleId=UKRTR2PAB4[/url] [url]http://www.magnumphotos.com/C.aspx?VP3=SearchResult&ALID=2TYRYDY1Q8PD[/url] [url]http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/nov/05/pussy-riot-tolokonnikova-punished-siberian-prison-hunger-strike[/url] [url]http://www.humanrightsfirst.org/2013/11/13/russian-authorities-transfer-pussy-riot-rocker-to-siberian-prison-camp[/url] [url]http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-24848893[/url] [url]http://photoblog.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/06/19/19041384-life-inside-a-siberian-high-security-prison[/url] [url]http://www.wnol.info/pussy-riots-tolokonnikova-sent-to-siberian-labor-camp/[/url] [url]http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/world/how-unpaid-north-korean-labour-helped-russia-welcome-the-world/article4535529/[/url] Those are just a "few" links. But you're probably right. It's just some conspiracy by some leftist, liberal media outlets to make Russia look bad.

[QUOTE=Melnek;44579992]How is this any different than what is done in America where prisoners are subjected to hard labor as a form of punishment? (i.e, rock breaking, tree cutting, etc.) That doesn't make them labor camps, there is a difference between labor camps and penal labor which is an acceptable form of punishment worldwide, including first-world countries. Also dailymail. As for North Korea, the North Korean prisoners that were exported to Russia received [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Korea%E2%80%93Russia_relations#Labor_trade]working visas[/url] along with working conditions. They aren't slaves nor are they treated as such. As for the reasoning of their imprisonment, that's an entirely different argument not concerning Russia but rather North Korea. Your common knowledge isn't very common, googling these imaginary 'labor camps' gives a load of sketchy and unverified reports that are often sourcing each other with no further documentation or evidence.[/QUOTE] "Russia has no labor camps! You cant prove it!" <proved wrong> "Well, the US does it too!" "Also I dont like the way you proved it so it doesnt count!" you're a barrel of laughs

[QUOTE=IGotWorms;44580526] Oh, "Huh huh, Dailymail." What an intelligent comeback. You said, "they're absolutely no "labor camps" in Russia." So you're saying they just completely made up that story and those photos depicting a state sponsored labor camp in Siberia...which they were given a tour of? Look here are some more "liberal" news sites talking about labor camps in Russia and more photos too! Probably shopped. Gosh, we need to let everyone know there's a massive media conspiracy going on here! There are no labor camps in Russia! Just day spas and summer camps! And I guess you couldn't be bothered to look at the source for the photos from that DailyMail article...Reuters genius. [url]http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2012/10/inside-russias-prison-system/263806/[/url] [url]http://www.washingtonpost.com/pb/world/life-in-a-siberian-prison/2013/06/19/c828f814-d8d1-11e2-a9f2-42ee3912ae0e_gallery.html#item0[/url] [url]http://uk.reuters.com/news/pictures/slideshow?articleId=UKRTR2PAB4[/url] [url]http://www.magnumphotos.com/C.aspx?VP3=SearchResult&ALID=2TYRYDY1Q8PD[/url] [url]http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/nov/05/pussy-riot-tolokonnikova-punished-siberian-prison-hunger-strike[/url] [url]http://www.humanrightsfirst.org/2013/11/13/russian-authorities-transfer-pussy-riot-rocker-to-siberian-prison-camp[/url] [url]http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-24848893[/url] [url]http://photoblog.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/06/19/19041384-life-inside-a-siberian-high-security-prison[/url] [url]http://www.wnol.info/pussy-riots-tolokonnikova-sent-to-siberian-labor-camp/[/url] [url]http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/world/how-unpaid-north-korean-labour-helped-russia-welcome-the-world/article4535529/[/url] Those are just a "few" links. But you're probably right. It's just some conspiracy by some leftist, liberal media outlets to make Russia look bad.[/QUOTE] You are an idiot if you see photo of prisoners doing some labor and immediately point at it and scream "LABOR CAMPS", and goes to further prove that you do not know what labor camp means, how it works and what's the difference between prisoners having an opportunity to do work and get actually [b]paid[/b] for it and recieve qualification in specialised jobs to be resocialised. Your laughable attempts to discredit me with "oh lol probably photoshopped photos" do not change a single thing and do not combat any of my arguments. You are arguing against someone who doubts the legitimacy of the photos. I'm not that guy, please stop putting my quotes above your silly posts. And yes, "America does it too" is a legit arument. Because quite obviously you guys don't think labor camps exist in USA, do you? Or it wouldn't be "BAD RUSSIA HAS LABOR CAMPS". So yeah. Russian penitentiary system is not different from US one in that inmates have to work inside the facility itself, say, clean shit, do laundry in brigades, manufacture new robes for themselves and other prisoners, and other stuff. This is not labor camp. Sometimes inmates are presented with a choice to either work inside the facility to provide the workforce it needs to function or do work that is harder, but paid better or gives you qualification you can use for you job application after you are released. This is also not labor camp.

Oh okay, I see. Is that why North Korea sends political prisoners to Siberia? Just to do laundry and general prison work? And no, they don't get paid. Russia pays Pyongyang. The prisoners get jack shit. But uh...sure...not labor camps. No torture, beatings, life-threatening prison conditions, restriction of freedom of speech as well as a long list of other basic human rights, no discrimination based on religion, gender, sexuality, murders, political kidnappings, none of that stuff either. The strangest thing though, there's this entire U.S. State Department report claiming Russia has actually done all that, under Putin's watch! But they probably just made all that stuff up too, right? [url]http://www.state.gov/documents/organization/220536.pdf[/url] You can also read the html (LIES!) version here: (Select Russia from the country/region dropdown) [url]http://www.state.gov/j/drl/rls/hrrpt/humanrightsreport/index.htm#wrapper[/url] Hey...wait a second what's this thread about? Oh yeah, Putin was like no we don't have any forces in Crimea. Now he's like, oh...yeah. We did. So what? So...I mean, we can definitely trust him right?

[QUOTE=Bazsil;44580696]"Russia has no labor camps! You cant prove it!" <proved wrong> "Well, the US does it too!" "Also I dont like the way you proved it so it doesnt count!" you're a barrel of laughs[/QUOTE] I wasn't proven wrong, I refuted IGotWorm's point by saying that by definition, prisoners working inside the prison does not constitute as slave-labor, and the same exact thing also happens in Britain, I'm sorry I used the US as an example and that got you upset for whatever reason.

[QUOTE=IGotWorms;44580526]Hey, I see we have another Wikipedia professor here! The money that those North Korean prisoners make doing Russian labor...goes straight back to Pyongyang. They don't see "won" single cent. So...tell me...what would you call unpaid labor? Oh, "Huh huh, Dailymail." What an intelligent comeback. You said, "they're absolutely no "labor camps" in Russia." So you're saying they just completely made up that story and those photos depicting a state sponsored labor camp in Siberia...which they were given a tour of? Look here are some more "liberal" news sites talking about labor camps in Russia and more photos too! Probably shopped. Gosh, we need to let everyone know there's a massive media conspiracy going on here! There are no labor camps in Russia! Just day spas and summer camps! And I guess you couldn't be bothered to look at the source for the photos from that DailyMail article...Reuters genius. [url]http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2012/10/inside-russias-prison-system/263806/[/url] [url]http://www.washingtonpost.com/pb/world/life-in-a-siberian-prison/2013/06/19/c828f814-d8d1-11e2-a9f2-42ee3912ae0e_gallery.html#item0[/url] [url]http://uk.reuters.com/news/pictures/slideshow?articleId=UKRTR2PAB4[/url] [url]http://www.magnumphotos.com/C.aspx?VP3=SearchResult&ALID=2TYRYDY1Q8PD[/url] [url]http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/nov/05/pussy-riot-tolokonnikova-punished-siberian-prison-hunger-strike[/url] [url]http://www.humanrightsfirst.org/2013/11/13/russian-authorities-transfer-pussy-riot-rocker-to-siberian-prison-camp[/url] [url]http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-24848893[/url] [url]http://photoblog.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/06/19/19041384-life-inside-a-siberian-high-security-prison[/url] [url]http://www.wnol.info/pussy-riots-tolokonnikova-sent-to-siberian-labor-camp/[/url] [url]http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/world/how-unpaid-north-korean-labour-helped-russia-welcome-the-world/article4535529/[/url] Those are just a "few" links. But you're probably right. It's just some conspiracy by some leftist, liberal media outlets to make Russia look bad.[/QUOTE] Seriously how can you get so upset over someone questioning your DailyMail source, it's fucking DailyMail. If DM used Reuters as its source for the story you should have used Reuters instead. I've read a lot of your posts IGotWorms and they're usually well articulated but saying [QUOTE=IGotWorms;44580526]"Huh huh, Dailymail." What an intelligent comeback.[/QUOTE] how about using a credible source in the first place. Consequently I actually did look at the Reuters source you provided and found nothing stating or suggesting that those prisoners were forced into working without pay. I think it's unfair to state it's common knowledge the fact Russia has labour camps, then provide an unreliable source, then provide a source that doesn't even substantiate your claims. Now to see if you're talking out of your arse or not I'm going to have to google this, I shall never forgive you for the extra calories I'll burn searching for sources you should have provided. Unless your argument is Russia is a terrible place because prison inmates can choose to work for pay or reduced time or free fags, etc. If that's the case than cry me a river.

[QUOTE=IGotWorms;44581059]Oh okay, I see. Is that why North Korea sends political prisoners to Siberia? Just to do laundry and general prison work? And no, they don't get paid. Russia pays Pyongyang. The prisoners get jack shit.[/quote] Oh so now you're talking about DPRK camps on our territory? That aren't governed by Russian administration and therefore are not "Russian labor camps"? [quote] But uh...sure...not labor camps. No torture, beatings, life-threatening prison conditions, restriction of freedom of speech as well as a long list of other basic human rights, no discrimination based on religion, gender, sexuality, murders, political kidnappings, none of that stuff either.[/quote] That's not what labor camp is, don't grasp at straws. Russian prison system has major issues, the country in general has a lot of issues, I have never denied that. Having "labor camps" is not one of them though. [quote] The strangest thing though, there's this entire U.S. State Department report claiming Russia has actually done all that, under Putin's watch! But they probably just made all that stuff up too, right? [url]http://www.state.gov/documents/organization/220536.pdf[/url] You can also read the html (LIES!) version here: (Select Russia from the country/region dropdown) [url]http://www.state.gov/j/drl/rls/hrrpt/humanrightsreport/index.htm#wrapper[/url] Hey...wait a second what's this thread about? Oh yeah, Putin was like no we don't have any forces in Crimea. Now he's like, oh...yeah. We did. So what? So...I mean, we can definitely trust him right?[/QUOTE] Oh just admit you were talking out of your arse about "labor camps" with no knowledge on the subject already and be done with it.

Sure, if you just go ahead and completely ignore all the stuff I already posted with sources then yeah...no labor camps. Again, that's if you go ahead and ignore all the news about Russia's actual labor camps, including the State Department report which goes into great detail on human rights abuses in Russia including conditions in their prisons. Then on top of that if you want to claim that the labor camps *in* Russia, that the Russian government directly pays Pyongyang for (not a single cent to the prisoners though...pretty sure that's slave labor) aren't really Russian because Russia is just hosting them for North Korea, then uh yeah...sure. Even though that doesn't make any sense lets go with that. Who cares how many leaps of logic you have to make as long as you can somehow convince yourself you're right no matter what. I applaud your Putin-esque logic! You know what...if it means that much to you then you just go ahead ignore all the information and facts I've already posted detailing numerous human rights abuses not only concerning Russia's prison system but more, claim they're all part of some western media conspiracy and you go ahead and pat yourself on the back and proclaim you're right about everything and you've proven me wrong...even though you didn't because it's obvious the only arguments you have are, "Nuh uh!" and "Well, that doesn't count!" I mean who can argue with proof like that? You can go ahead and get the last word in too to proclaim your victory because I simply can't argue with a master debater like yourself who can simply dispute a wealth of facts and cited sources with the simple argument of, "No, it's not." I mean how can I possibly debate such a peerless counterpoint? I tip my ushanka to you comrade.

[QUOTE=IGotWorms;44587620]Sure, if you just go ahead and completely ignore all the stuff I already posted with sources then yeah...no labor camps. Again, that's if you go ahead and ignore all the news about Russia's actual labor camps, including the State Department report which goes into great detail on human rights abuses in Russia including conditions in their prisons. Then on top of that if you want to claim that the labor camps *in* Russia, that the Russian government directly pays Pyongyang for (not a single cent to the prisoners though...pretty sure that's slave labor) aren't really Russian because Russia is just hosting them for North Korea, then uh yeah...sure. Even though that doesn't make any sense lets go with that. Who cares how many leaps of logic you have to make as long as you can somehow convince yourself you're right no matter what. I applaud your Putin-esque logic! You know what...if it means that much to you then you just go ahead ignore all the information and facts I've already posted detailing numerous human rights abuses not only concerning Russia's prison system but more, claim they're all part of some western media conspiracy and you go ahead and pat yourself on the back and proclaim you're right about everything and you've proven me wrong...even though you didn't because it's obvious the only arguments you have are, "Nuh uh!" and "Well, that doesn't count!" I mean who can argue with proof like that? You can go ahead and get the last word in too to proclaim your victory because I simply can't argue with a master debater like yourself who can simply dispute a wealth of facts and cited sources with the simple argument of, "No, it's not." I mean how can I possibly debate such a peerless counterpoint? I tip my ushanka to you comrade.[/QUOTE] You've used "western conspiracy" in your posts more than anyone else, you're posting both defensively and aggressively and generally coming off like an asshole. If you want to actually be taken seriously in a conversation, that's not how you communicate. You act as if Russia is literally the third Reich, while telling this to people living in Russia who clearly aren't fans of Putin, yet you address them as if they are sucking his dick. Way to represent the red white and blue comrade you show those commies