Court: Illegal immigrants can't have guns - Polidicks

[QUOTE=faze;36016674]Protecting myself in a SHTF moment, such as a total collapse of the US economy which will inevitably happen in our lifetimes.[/QUOTE] [URL="http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=2862314&userid=0&perpage=40&pagenumber=423#post403693174"]...[/URL] [QUOTE=Lankist;36015916]Also we've been over this before: The Supreme Court couldn't give two shits about firearms for self defense. That's what we have police for.[/QUOTE] Well, the Supreme Court also doesn't give two shits about the police protecting you from anything either. Really the Supreme Court doesn't give two shits about anything except sitting around and jacking off while eating doritos and pretending to work.

HK93: Fuck anybody kicking down my door without a warrant.

[QUOTE=Lankist;36016432]Yeah in the same states that say sodomists can't get married and regan was the greatest economist of all time. The rest of us recognize the duty to retreat. You're a civilian, not fucking Rambo. You pull a gun, best case is that you only get yourself killed. Worst case is your dumbass instigation of a firefight gets bystanders killed. Your "robbed at gunpoint" example is dumb as fuck. If you get robbed at gunpoint, you give him your fucking money.[/QUOTE] You don't always have the luxury of retreating, and the best case would actually be him neutralizing the threat. But, I'm not deathly afraid of my firearms so I'm clueless. Jokes aside I agree with you about the robbed at gunpoint issue. You don't draw if you're already at gunpoint, it's just guaranteed to make the situation fifty times worse.

[QUOTE=massn7;36022826]You don't always have the luxury of retreating, and the best case would actually be him neutralizing the threat. But, I'm not deathly afraid of my firearms so I'm clueless. Jokes aside I agree with you about the robbed at gunpoint issue. You don't draw if you're already at gunpoint, it's just guaranteed to make the situation fifty times worse.[/QUOTE] That's why you draw when they are walking away; provided you live in Texas that is...

[QUOTE=Lankist;36016690]Dude, if fucking Mad Max happens an AR15 isn't going to save you. Jesus Christ, dude, drop the survivalist shit or get off the computer and go live in a rickety shack in the woods. As long as you live in a society you live by fucking rules.[/QUOTE] You're against keeping a gun even 'just in case'? How is having a gun stored away in case something should happen not living by the 'rules'? When I lived in Tbilisi and Nairobi, a handgun was a constant part of my family's bug-out kit. There are many places outside the cushy comforts of the first-world where being armed or being able to arm yourself in a hurry are outright mandatory, and it's hardly ridiculous to be prepared for all eventualities even in someplace like the US. It doesn't require a complete governmental collapse for some measure of self-defense to be warranted- just look at New Orleans after Hurricane Katrina hit.

[QUOTE=Lankist;36016432]Yeah in the same states that say sodomists can't get married and regan was the greatest economist of all time.[/QUOTE] States like Illinois?

[QUOTE=Lankist;36016432]Yeah in the same states that say sodomists can't get married and regan was the greatest economist of all time.[/QUOTE] The Castle Doctrine, and Gay marriage are both legally recognized in Washington, New Hampshire, Iowa, Massachusetts, and Connecticut, as well as Maryland. Now what? [editline]20th May 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=catbarf;36023696]You're against keeping a gun even 'just in case'? How is having a gun stored away in case something should happen not living by the 'rules'? When I lived in Tbilisi and Nairobi, a handgun was a constant part of my family's bug-out kit. There are many places outside the cushy comforts of the first-world where being armed or being able to arm yourself in a hurry are outright mandatory, and it's hardly ridiculous to be prepared for all eventualities even in someplace like the US. It doesn't require a complete governmental collapse for some measure of self-defense to be warranted- just look at New Orleans after Hurricane Katrina hit.[/QUOTE] I didn't even know civilian gun ownership was even legal in Kenya and Georgia

[QUOTE=Broseph_;36024451]The Castle Doctrine, and Gay marriage are both legally recognized in Washington, New Hampshire, Iowa, Massachusetts, and Connecticut, as well as Maryland. Now what? [editline]20th May 2012[/editline] I didn't even know civilian gun ownership was even legal in Kenya and Georgia[/QUOTE] Legal or not, do you think they'd care? :v: [quote=Lankist]You said the AR15 was for protecting yourself. What the fuck are you expecting? You ever heard of a self-fulfilling prophecy?[/quote] In some situations the AR might be more appropriate or more easily reachable than his handgun. Sometimes just the sight of such a weapon will deter someone enough to bug out; he might not even need to fire a shot, just like racking a shotgun will send people flying out of whatever building they just broke into.

[QUOTE=massn7;36024865]Legal or not, do you think they'd care? :v: In some situations the AR might be more appropriate or more easily reachable than his handgun. Sometimes just the sight of such a weapon will deter someone enough to bug out; he might not even need to fire a shot, just like racking a shotgun will send people flying out of whatever building they just broke into.[/QUOTE] A guy tried breaking in to my house last week, all I did was show my face and he ran off.

[QUOTE=Broseph_;36024451]The Castle Doctrine, and Gay marriage are both legally recognized in Washington, New Hampshire, Iowa, Massachusetts, and Connecticut, as well as Maryland. Now what?[/QUOTE] They're also being put very much to the test as more and more people die over fucking stereos and televisions.

[QUOTE=Lankist;36016486]And you're going to fix that? You're a civilian. When you start blasting a fucking AR-15, you aren't saving the goddamn day. You're making the situation [I]worse.[/I] You'll get a bystander killed playing cowboy. I am a black belt in two martial arts and I've attended and assisted in teaching quite a number of gun safety courses. I know how to defend myself. I also know that you never throw the first punch. If someone puts a gun to your head and demands your wallet, you give them your wallet. It isn't worth a life--Neither yours nor theirs.[/QUOTE] I think if someone pulls a gun on you, it is worth taking their life if you can, its the risk they should be willing to take by pulling a gun on someone. Also you don't know that they will let you go after you give them your wallet/possesions in your house especially if you have seen there face. It can often be easier for them if they kill you. [editline]20th May 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=Lankist;36027096]They're also being put very much to the test as more and more people die over fucking stereos and televisions.[/QUOTE] Hey they're in your house robbing your stuff and you don't know what theyre gonna do, its the risk they should be willing to take.

[QUOTE=Stormcharger;36027136]I think if someone pulls a gun on you, it is worth taking their life if you can, its the risk they should be willing to take by pulling a gun on someone. Also you don't know that they will let you go after you give them your wallet/possesions in your house especially if you have seen there face. It can often be easier for them if they kill you. [editline]20th May 2012[/editline] Hey they're in your house robbing your stuff and you don't know what theyre gonna do, its the risk they should be willing to take.[/QUOTE] If someone is willing to take a life, they usually don't go after 200$ tv's. Deaths caused by burglars are usually accidental, or because the home owner tried to be a hero and forced their hand, not because they're cold blooded killers who kill people so they can't be ID'd.

I dunno man, for a lot of people life is cheap. People have been killed over less than $200 dollar tv's, when I was in south africa my family there told me how often burglars will just come in to peoples houses and kill them first because its easier.

[QUOTE=Stormcharger;36027136]I think if someone pulls a gun on you, it is worth taking their life if you can, its the risk they should be willing to take by pulling a gun on someone. Also you don't know that they will let you go after you give them your wallet/possesions in your house especially if you have seen there face. It can often be easier for them if they kill you. [editline]20th May 2012[/editline] Hey they're in your house robbing your stuff and you don't know what theyre gonna do, its the risk they should be willing to take.[/QUOTE] Stop watching movies. [editline]20th May 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=Stormcharger;36027277]I dunno man, for a lot of people life is cheap.[/QUOTE] Yes. Life is cheap for you, the self-defender who thinks it's better to shoot a man down just to be on the safe side.

[QUOTE=Lankist;36027472]Stop watching movies. [editline]20th May 2012[/editline] Yes. Life is cheap for you, the self-defender who thinks it's better to shoot a man down just to be on the safe side.[/QUOTE] Yea I didn't get these views from watching movies, being in south africa for a while opened my eyes to how cheap life is for some people, and I really don't think its a good idea to give people who have broken into your house the benefit of doubt. You don't know the person, they've broken into your property and they're stealing your stuff and could potentially be violent, why should you care about them?

[QUOTE=Stormcharger;36027859]Yea I didn't get these views from watching movies, being in south africa for a while opened my eyes to how cheap life is for some people, and I really don't think its a good idea to give people who have broken into your house the benefit of doubt. You don't know the person, they've broken into your property and they're stealing your stuff and could potentially be violent, why should you care about them?[/QUOTE] Because they're human beings. Sorry, but if you think you're the good guy here, saying you should kill anyone who might be trouble for you contradicts that point. Your shit is not worth their life.

...I see nothing wrong with this ruling. If it's really a problem to some of my fellow left-wingers, then push for laws that make it easier for the illegals who are here with good intentions to gain citizenship.

[QUOTE=Lankist;36027472]Stop watching movies. Yes. Life is cheap for you, the self-defender who thinks it's better to shoot a man down just to be on the safe side.[/QUOTE] Wow, really? You're sounding like someone who's never left the cozy comforts of the first world. There are a lot of places on this planet where you can be killed over the contents of a wallet. If someone's invading your home, your life is immediately in danger. If you don't want to protect yourself, you can indulge your naivete that [I]surely[/I] the guy robbing you blind won't actually mean you any physical harm (because home invasions are [i]never[/i] done by murderers, right?), but imposing that on the rest of us and judging anyone willing to use force to protect themselves as a dangerous psychopath is stupid.

oh alright good i thought it said ALL immigrants cant have guns

[QUOTE=catbarf;36030167]Wow, really? You're sounding like someone who's never left the cozy comforts of the first world. There are a lot of places on this planet where you can be killed over the contents of a wallet. If someone's invading your home, your life is immediately in danger. If you don't want to protect yourself, you can indulge your naivete that [I]surely[/I] the guy robbing you blind won't actually mean you any physical harm (because home invasions are [i]never[/i] done by murderers, right?), but imposing that on the rest of us and judging anyone willing to use force to protect themselves as a dangerous psychopath is stupid.[/QUOTE] Thankfully we don't live in fucking Fallujah. We live in a society that has rules. One of those rules is that killing people is bad. Killing people for money is worse. And home invasions RARELY end in violence. Most people who break into homes are looking to steal, not to kill, you paranoid schizophrenic. You can replace your fucking stereo when they leave. You can't replace a life. If they come at you with a knife, you can fucking defend yourself. But you do not cowboy up and shoot anyone and everyone that you don't fucking know. That kind of stupid wild west bullshit is how dumbass parents end up shooting their own kids in the middle of the night (which happens at a frighteningly higher rate than an actual violent home invasion.)

[QUOTE=Lankist;36031161]If they come at you with a knife, you can fucking defend yourself. But you do not cowboy up and shoot anyone and everyone that you don't fucking know.[/QUOTE] Nice 180 there, considering you're the one ripping on Faze for owning an AR-15 and intending to defend himself if he's mugged. You're the one who said: [quote]The rest of us recognize the duty to retreat. You're a civilian, not fucking Rambo. You pull a gun, best case is that you only get yourself killed. Worst case is your dumbass instigation of a firefight gets bystanders killed.[/quote][quote]Whoever taught you to fight a mugger is trying to get you killed. [/quote][quote]If someone puts a gun to your head and demands your wallet, you give them your wallet.[/quote] So, if someone comes at me with a knife, what am I supposed to do according to you? Won't 'Fucking defend[ing] myself' as you put it just 'get [myself] killed'? Oh, am I supposed to analyze his behavior and determine whether he has a knife because he intends to kill me, or whether it's just a friendly mugging and I should hand over all my cash and hope he doesn't kill me? What the fuck kind of reasoning is that? Not a single person in this thread has advocated shooting anyone and everyone that we don't know, as you so hilariously mischaracterize. You're the one who was saying owning a firearm for self-defense is wrong, and yet you are now saying that defending oneself is okay and what you really meant was some nonsense that literally nobody was suggesting. Make up your mind already.

It's not a 180 when the duty to retreat is met and it's an actual life-or-death situation. "Somebody broke into my house" is not enough to meet those criteria. [editline]20th May 2012[/editline] Also good job on not telling the difference between a mugging and a home invasion. It's like you just think the solution to every problem is to whip out your gat. If somebody mugs you on the street, you give them your money. If somebody breaks into your house, you run. If they chase you, then you can defend yourself. [editline]20th May 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=catbarf;36032326]Not a single person in this thread has advocated shooting anyone and everyone that we don't know, as you so hilariously mischaracterize.[/QUOTE] Faze does and you do. Your solution to a home invasion is evidently to shoot first and ask questions later, because they [I]might[/I] be a serial killer out to get you. I'm not the one who fucking said that. I said that firearms are not a civil right for self defense, because they aren't. The self defense bullshit is irrelevant to the constitutionality of civilian-owned weapons.

[QUOTE=Lankist;36032597]Faze does and you do. Your solution to a home invasion is evidently to shoot first and ask questions later, because they [I]might[/I] be a serial killer out to get you.[/QUOTE] Yeah, clearly a willingness to defend oneself during a home invasion and a willingness to shoot anyone and everyone are the exact same thing. Self-defense, wanton mass-murder- if you can't tell the difference it may be for the best that you choose to be unarmed. In any case, if you think the proper response to a mugging should be to immediately hand over money without a fight, what deterrent is there to would-be criminals? Here's another idea: Someone has a knife. They want my money. I refuse. Now they can either attack me, in which case I will use force as I am now defending my life, or they can leave. What about that scenario do you take issue with?

[QUOTE=catbarf;36032787]If you think the proper response to a mugging should be to immediately hand over money without a fight, what deterrent is there to would-be criminals?[/QUOTE] Oh I don't know. Maybe [b]The Law[/b] This isn't a third world country, we have prisons and police officers here.

[QUOTE=Melkor;36032814]Oh I don't know. Maybe [B]The Law[/B][/QUOTE] The law itself means nothing to would-be criminals, obviously. The enforcement of said law has next to no chance of actually catching a random mugger based solely on the victim's description. There is little to fear for the criminal besides what the victim might do in defense.

[QUOTE=catbarf;36032834]The law itself means nothing to would-be criminals, obviously. The enforcement of said law has next to no chance of actually catching a random mugger based solely on the victim's description. There is little to fear for the criminal besides what the victim might do in defense.[/QUOTE] So you take it upon yourself to deliver vigilante justice based on what might happen.

[QUOTE=Melkor;36032878]So you take it upon yourself to deliver vigilante justice based on what might happen.[/QUOTE] Defending against being mugged is vigilantism? Really? Where do you draw that arbitrary distinction, would it be 'vigilante justice' to shoot someone coming at me with a gun 'based on what might happen'?

[QUOTE=catbarf;36032922]Defending against being mugged is vigilantism? Really? Where do you draw that arbitrary distinction, would it be 'vigilante justice' to shoot someone coming at me with a gun 'based on what might happen'?[/QUOTE] You're forcing a situation which could very well get both of you killed because you "want to put fear into potential criminals." What you're talking about isn't self defense.

[QUOTE=Melkor;36032955]You're forcing a situation which could very well get both of you killed because you "want to put fear into potential criminals."[/QUOTE] A lot of crimes go safer on everyone if nobody tries to stop it. That doesn't mean they're justified. Do you get annoyed when you see videos of store owners defending themselves against robbers instead of just hiding in a corner? [QUOTE=Melkor;36032955]What you're talking about isn't self defense.[/QUOTE] That's something of a stretch considering what I'm suggesting is literally [I]defending[/I] one's [I]self[/I].

[QUOTE=Lankist;36031161]Thankfully we don't live in fucking Fallujah. We live in a society that has rules. One of those rules is that killing people is bad.[/QUOTE] Another of those rules is "Don't break into another man's house." I highly doubt the guy who just broke in is going to say "oh well killing is against the rules so i wont do it!"